Is Kieff dogging it?

[JohnVancouver]

Speaking of ex-Suns, matt Janning is invited to Nugs camp. Really hope it works put for him, love that guy's game. We should have kept him to study under Steve.

Ha, I posted the news about Matt in the other thread, and attached your name to it.

Hahaha - well, you gotta admit, when I like a guy, I stick with him. Really surprised he hasn
t caught on prior to this. Such a good, smart player

[JohnVancouver]

Frye is the most loathsome non-criminal to ever wear a Suns uniform in my lifetime. I truly despise him, and what he represents as a player. I would prefer to suspend Markieff with pay and just pretend he doesn't exist as an alternative to paying Channing.

lolwut?

What exactly does he represent to you? Because to me, he was a great pick n roll big who could step back and hit the 3. He was inconsistent at times, but I don't see how you can hate him the most when in recent years we had players like Turk, Beasley, and Warrick on the team

It's fine if you don't want to trade for him (I don't either), but to say you despise him is such a weird opinion

From watching him all the time he was here, he outworked a lot of guys. Played tougher D than you'd expect given his thin body, plenty of effort. Head-scratching people didn't admire his game here

[JohnVancouver]

I was just about to post that - good analysis. Kieff needs to be making the bog effort to broaden his game, add the things that will elevate him him out of the pack of average-level PFs. Instead, he's in a pissing match with t e boss. D-U-M-B, to quote the Ramones

[Frank Lee]

or 'I don't want to grow up'

[Lindecision]

In retrospect it looks like McD made another bad decision in trading Marcus before Kieff. Now the more valuable asset has tanked. If he could have a do-over he trades Kieff first 100 times out of 100. I hope McD didn't actually hold out that Kieff would be willing to play for the Suns again, even if it was just to shop himself before the deadline. That would be incredibly naive.

My guess is McD wasn't going to trade Keef unless we got LMA. But he should have saw this mess coming.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

Yeh. If McD wasn't going to trade Kieff unless he got LMA, then don't trade Marcus at all. They're both young and dumb. I'd take the chance that the twins mature a little, rather than trade one of them and create this mess. Or at least trade Kieff first if you know its going to create a mess. He's the much more valuable asset. Was the much more valuable asset.

In retrospect it looks like McD made another bad decision in trading Marcus before Kieff. Now the more valuable asset has tanked. If he could have a do-over he trades Kieff first 100 times out of 100. I hope McD didn't actually hold out that Kieff would be willing to play for the Suns again, even if it was just to shop himself before the deadline. That would be incredibly naive.

And if he had done that everyone would be saying what a stupid thing it was to trade Kieff before LMA was locked up. Second guessing is still just guessing.

LMA has nothing to do with what I said. I'm simply saying trade Kieff before Marcus because he's more valuable. Or don't trade either and take the chance they mature a little.

[lilfishi22]

Yeh. If McD wasn't going to trade Kieff unless he got LMA, then don't trade Marcus at all. They're both young and dumb. I'd take the chance that the twins mature a little, rather than trade one of them and create this mess. Or at least trade Kieff first if you know its going to create a mess. He's the much more valuable asset. Was the much more valuable asset.
.
.
.

LMA has nothing to do with what I said. I'm simply saying trade Kieff before Marcus because he's more valuable. Or don't trade either and take the chance they mature a little.

We couldn't trade Kieff first because he was suppose to be the more valuable asset and was part of the package for LMA. Marcus was moved so we would have space to take on Tyson Chandler, who in turn was signed partly because he was important in the LMA courting process.

[letsgosuns]

Forget getting rid of Marcus for cap space. He was never going to play another day for the Suns because of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaG7B8vXD5o

[sunsfever68]

Sorry Kieff

You are on a solid contract and your loser brother is gone. You will do better with us so we're not trading you. You're the perfect scoring big man off the bench we'll need when we get a star PF eventually through the draft or FA or trade.


So suck it up buttercup you ain't going anywhere unless we get equal value in return. You don't call the shots here.

And if you try anything cute to ruin chemistry Tyson Chandler will kick your ass

[Lindecision]

Yeh. If McD wasn't going to trade Kieff unless he got LMA, then don't trade Marcus at all. They're both young and dumb. I'd take the chance that the twins mature a little, rather than trade one of them and create this mess. Or at least trade Kieff first if you know its going to create a mess. He's the much more valuable asset. Was the much more valuable asset.
.
.
.

LMA has nothing to do with what I said. I'm simply saying trade Kieff before Marcus because he's more valuable. Or don't trade either and take the chance they mature a little.

We couldn't trade Kieff first because he was suppose to be the more valuable asset and was part of the package for LMA. Marcus was moved so we would have space to take on Tyson Chandler, who in turn was signed partly because he was important in the LMA courting process.

Except you never had a realistic shot at LMA. No one did, apart from the Spurs. To base your offseason moves off of that wasn't smart. The meetings he had with other teams were just out of courtesy. I can rationalize McD's actions, as you have laid out the process. But I don't agree with the premise it was based off at all.

[lilfishi22]

Except you never had a realistic shot at LMA. No one did, apart from the Spurs. To base your offseason moves off of that wasn't smart. The meetings he had with other teams were just out of courtesy. I can rationalize McD's actions, as you have laid out the process. But I don't agree with the premise it was based off at all.

If you don't agree with the premise then you're not looking at the facts then. It was widely reported (not just by Suns media) that Suns were a legit contender from the beginning and it took a last ditch effort by Spurs assistant Udoka to convince LMA to choose Spurs in the end.

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/7/1/8880971/lamarcus-aldridge-phoenix-suns-free-agency-rumors

But while Phoenix is feeling optimistic at the moment, signing Aldridge is going to take some swift cap mechanics. The Suns entered free agency with about $12 million in cap room.

http://www.blazersedge.com/2015/7/1/8880905/phoenix-suns-lamarcus-aldridge-nba-free-agent-news

http://www.inquisitr.com/2218556/lamarcus-aldridge-to-phoenix-suns-nba-analaysts-say-its-a-real-possibility/

https://twitter.com/wojyahoonba/status/616400386765619200

And to show just how close it got
http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/8/24/9198393/lamarcus-aldridge-Ime-Udoka-san-antonio-spurs-signing

So please if you're going to post about this, at least do some research.

[JacobHoward]

Yeh. If McD wasn't going to trade Kieff unless he got LMA, then don't trade Marcus at all. They're both young and dumb. I'd take the chance that the twins mature a little, rather than trade one of them and create this mess. Or at least trade Kieff first if you know its going to create a mess. He's the much more valuable asset. Was the much more valuable asset.
.
.
.

LMA has nothing to do with what I said. I'm simply saying trade Kieff before Marcus because he's more valuable. Or don't trade either and take the chance they mature a little.

We couldn't trade Kieff first because he was suppose to be the more valuable asset and was part of the package for LMA. Marcus was moved so we would have space to take on Tyson Chandler, who in turn was signed partly because he was important in the LMA courting process.

Except you never had a realistic shot at LMA. No one did, apart from the Spurs. To base your offseason moves off of that wasn't smart. The meetings he had with other teams were just out of courtesy. I can rationalize McD's actions, as you have laid out the process. But I don't agree with the premise it was based off at all.

The Suns actually had an excellent chance of sign LMA. A few weeks ago, LMA said he was on the fence between Phoenix and San Antonio when Ime Udoka, who is an assistant in San Antonio and a close friend of his, talked to him and convinced him to choose the Spurs. There's no denying that the Suns had as good of a chance as anyone to sign LMA.

[Mr Puddles]

We couldn't trade Kieff first because he was suppose to be the more valuable asset and was part of the package for LMA. Marcus was moved so we would have space to take on Tyson Chandler, who in turn was signed partly because he was important in the LMA courting process.

Except you never had a realistic shot at LMA. No one did, apart from the Spurs. To base your offseason moves off of that wasn't smart. The meetings he had with other teams were just out of courtesy. I can rationalize McD's actions, as you have laid out the process. But I don't agree with the premise it was based off at all.

The Suns actually had an excellent chance of sign LMA. A few weeks ago, LMA said he was on the fence between Phoenix and San Antonio when Ime Udoka, who is an assistant in San Antonio and a close friend of his, talked to him and convinced him to choose the Spurs. There's no denying that the Suns had as good of a chance as anyone to sign LMA.

Moreover, if a 100% chance of losing the Morris brothers means you have just a 30% chance of landing a player of LMA's caliber - you take it. Aldridge was 2nd team all NBA last season, ahead of guys like Blake Griffin. Markeiff Morris is decent player, and a good 6th man, but you look at any given draft and there will be two hands full of guys with Keiff's talent. Marcus Morris should have been 3rd in our SF rotation, dumbing him was addition by subtraction because it opens up more minutes for Warren. LMA on the other hand is #1 pick good.

[garrick]

Forget getting rid of Marcus for cap space. He was never going to play another day for the Suns because of this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SaG7B8vXD5o

The problem that I see with this clip is none of the players are really making an effort to pull Marcus away from the coach.
You can see Dragic saying something I assume to Marcus but on a team with veterans you would find some players that would step in and tell a player like Marcus to calm down either with words or by physically getting in his face.

While I am confident that Chandler will be the veteran presence in the locker room one of the younger stars like either Bledsoe or Knight need to be that vocal leader of the team.

[bwgood77]

Except you never had a realistic shot at LMA. No one did, apart from the Spurs. To base your offseason moves off of that wasn't smart. The meetings he had with other teams were just out of courtesy. I can rationalize McD's actions, as you have laid out the process. But I don't agree with the premise it was based off at all.

If you don't agree with the premise then you're not looking at the facts then. It was widely reported (not just by Suns media) that Suns were a legit contender from the beginning and it took a last ditch effort by Spurs assistant Udoka to convince LMA to choose Spurs in the end.

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/7/1/8880971/lamarcus-aldridge-phoenix-suns-free-agency-rumors

But while Phoenix is feeling optimistic at the moment, signing Aldridge is going to take some swift cap mechanics. The Suns entered free agency with about $12 million in cap room.

http://www.blazersedge.com/2015/7/1/8880905/phoenix-suns-lamarcus-aldridge-nba-free-agent-news

http://www.inquisitr.com/2218556/lamarcus-aldridge-to-phoenix-suns-nba-analaysts-say-its-a-real-possibility/

https://twitter.com/wojyahoonba/status/616400386765619200

And to show just how close it got
http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/8/24/9198393/lamarcus-aldridge-Ime-Udoka-san-antonio-spurs-signing

So please if you're going to post about this, at least do some research.

Yeah, anyone who says the Suns never had a chance clearly didn't follow the situation closely. Of course getting close only matters in horseshoes and hand grenades, but it's amazing so many people are clueless about this situation. I live in Austin where there are a ton of Spurs fans and people were legitimately concerned after reading all the news and reports.

[NavLDO]

Except you never had a realistic shot at LMA. No one did, apart from the Spurs. To base your offseason moves off of that wasn't smart. The meetings he had with other teams were just out of courtesy. I can rationalize McD's actions, as you have laid out the process. But I don't agree with the premise it was based off at all.

If you don't agree with the premise then you're not looking at the facts then. It was widely reported (not just by Suns media) that Suns were a legit contender from the beginning and it took a last ditch effort by Spurs assistant Udoka to convince LMA to choose Spurs in the end.

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/7/1/8880971/lamarcus-aldridge-phoenix-suns-free-agency-rumors

But while Phoenix is feeling optimistic at the moment, signing Aldridge is going to take some swift cap mechanics. The Suns entered free agency with about $12 million in cap room.

http://www.blazersedge.com/2015/7/1/8880905/phoenix-suns-lamarcus-aldridge-nba-free-agent-news

http://www.inquisitr.com/2218556/lamarcus-aldridge-to-phoenix-suns-nba-analaysts-say-its-a-real-possibility/

https://twitter.com/wojyahoonba/status/616400386765619200

And to show just how close it got
http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2015/8/24/9198393/lamarcus-aldridge-Ime-Udoka-san-antonio-spurs-signing

So please if you're going to post about this, at least do some research.

Yeah, anyone who says the Suns never had a chance clearly didn't follow the situation closely. Of course getting close only matters in horseshoes and hand grenades, but it's amazing so many people are clueless about this situation. I live in Austin where there are a ton of Spurs fans and people were legitimately concerned after reading all the news and reports.

Yes, I've seen this a lot on both the General Board and the Trades/Transactions Forum--and heck, certain Suns fans on this forum believe this as well. Most think that LMA had decided from the get go, and was only placating Phoenix. It's entirely possibly he went into the process with thought that San Antonio was where he wanted to go; but I sure as heck also believe that once he met with the Suns, that 'decision' wavered quite a bit, and he seriously considered coming to PHX. It was only after that final meeting with the Spurs did he finally decide upon the Spurs.

But in no way, shape, or form can anyone with any clue honestly believe that his visit to the Suns was just 'nicety' and that he didn't seriously consider coming here. And this is one reason I have, dare I say it, 'hope' that McD/Horny has this team headed in the right direction. Sure, the Kieff/Dragic situations are troubling, but Kieff brought this all on himself. The 'Kieff' at this point in time last year vs the 'Kieff' that is now, are on two opposite sides of the spectrum of 'value', 'worthiness', and 'maturity'--that's not on McD, or the Suns FO as a whole.

[batsmasher]

We got so close to signing LMA that I genuinely considered what it would be like not having the Kieff on this team.

LMA's signing would have at least justified us sending Kieff on his way.

[bwgood77]

We got so close to signing LMA that I genuinely considered what it would be like not having the Kieff on this team.

LMA's signing would have at least justified us sending Kieff on his way.

It's so tough because it was so close but it didn't happen. I guess that Udoka guy (or whatever his name was) wouldn't leave, much like the McDyess and I guess DeAndre Jordan deals.

It would almost be better if we didn't get all these twitter reports about how he is thinking about the Suns. I don't think anyone here thought there was a remote possibility we would land Aldridge before FA started. And then when we don't there are some who complain that we didn't do anything, which is ludicrous.

It would be better for everyone's sanity if rumors were not reported and deals were only talked about until they were agreed to with a signature.

I think our FO was about as impressive when it comes down to efforts and targets as they could be. Of course when we fall short people will complain about them and give them nicknames insinuating they don't know what they are doing, but they give a good effort. They certainly have weaknesses in player management, but in FA and scouting, I don't really think so.

[denial]

Whether LMA was serious about us or not is irrelevant. Marcus had to go either which way. I honestly think separating the twins will make Markieff a better player (and maybe help him grow up a little bit). So trading Marcus was addition by subtraction in my book. No more iso 3 chucking. Markeiff gets better. Other guys get minutes. All good. The only thing I wish we did different is that the FO should have spoken to the twins up front and treated them like men and colleagues and not only as assets and let them hear of trade via third party. but I have no problem at all getting rid of Marcus. And Zoran. NO MORE BROTHERS. Don't you know that working with family or lovers is always a bad idea?

[jcsunsfan]

Whether LMA was serious about us or not is irrelevant. Marcus had to go either which way. I honestly think separating the twins will make Markieff a better player (and maybe help him grow up a little bit). So trading Marcus was addition by subtraction in my book. No more iso 3 chucking. Markeiff gets better. Other guys get minutes. All good. The only thing I wish we did different is that the FO should have spoken to the twins up front and treated them like men and colleagues and not only as assets and let them hear of trade via third party. but I have no problem at all getting rid of Marcus. And Zoran. NO MORE BROTHERS. Don't you know that working with family or lovers is always a bad idea?

You do not include inform players of trade discussions before the fact. Discussions go everywhere and include lots of players that never end up being included in the trade. It would be impossible to keep discussions confidential and you would offend multiple players unnecessarily.

Players are informed about trades in person immediately customarily but during the off season when players are out of town on vacation etc that can be impossible. That was the case with the Morris twins. Besides they say they are upset about how they were informed but that is not really the issue or they would be over it by now. They are just still butt hurt because they could not control the situation and stay together.

[aewyatt7]

Bennet being bought out.... di we pursue?