Tom Lost appeal-4 game suspension upheld

[therealbig3]

Brady is ACCUSED, not even found guilty, and literally no direct evidence has ever existed to implicate him, and in fact all of the objective evidence has always pointed to his innocence...but the kangaroo court of public opinion on this board and elsewhere finds him unmistakably guilty. The Wells Report and the league's punishment of Brady and their unwillingness to settle was the "proof" that showed that Brady was guilty.

But then Brady appeals and a federal judge, the first objective person to actually examine the facts, completely trashes the Wells report and the findings of the league and reverses the punishment handed out to Brady...yet the kangaroo court of public opinion on this board and elsewhere still clings to the fairy tale that he's guilty.

Nice.

[Sedale Threatt]

For what it's worth, I also think O.J. and George Zimmerman are guilty as sin.

[LAKESHOW]

Well that seems to be the situation here. Without proofs. Without evidence. OJ is in fact innocent. By that line of reasoning, both tom and OJ are innocent.

[ElGee]

There's just a giant gulf between how I see this and how you do.

I'm even more baffled that you can write "the spirit of rules in a game are critical..." and then basically shrug your shoulders at arguably the most concerted, systematic effort in NFL history to sh*t on said spirit....Trying to draw a parallel to slathering your jersey with some lube to a seven- or eight-year effort to systematically steal and decipher signals...I mean, I hate to resort to this, but LOL is about all I have at this point.

You completely inverted my point. And this is where I think you've basically been swindled by the media. You're categorization of these events is just so far off from the facts I'm aware of. Here is the rule the NFL claim the Patriots broke:

[No member shall:] "Use at any time, from the start to the finish of any game in which a club is a participant, any communications or information gathering equipment, other than Polaroid-type cameras or field telephones, including without limitation videotape machines, telephone tapping or bugging devices, or any other form of electronic devices that might aid a team during the playing of a game.”

Every team video tapes the game -- you just can't use the footage in the game. That's why you see QBs analyzing still pictures on the sidelines. Not every team necessarily videotapes from the sideline/tapes the signals directly from a side-visible angle. Belichick claimed he wasn't using the footage during the same game to adhere to this rule. He claimed -- rightfully -- the rule was ambiguous or does not outlaw taping. Many people -- myself included, especially given Roger Goodell's history over the last 8 years -- believe Goodell's punishment at the time was a harsh eff-you to Belichick for not adhering to Anderson's memo, which extended language in this rule that the Patriots smugly ignored.

Let me re-clarify my stance: the NFL does not frown upon signal stealing, which is why I mentioned the spirit of the rules -- it was to clarify the NFL as a whole is only being hypocritical on this issue if they treat NE differently. Otherwise, much like poker, misinformation and signal stealing is what you sign up for. They do not have rules preventing lip-readers from using binoculars in the booth to steal information. They had no clear, formal rule preventing videotaping of signals before 2006. They never have, nor currently do, to my knowledge, preventing the stealing of signals. Players can and do switch teams and just tell the new team inside information and signals. That information is at the crux of my opinion.

"Was (SpyGate) on the up-and-up? Doesn't seem like it..."

I mean...you think?!? They were caught with a small library of illegally-obtained game footage, at least 40 games worth, and a corresponding data base. And that's just what the NFL found, and then in extremely suspicious circumstances proceeded to destroy.

Only this week, in a story by a company that has an incredible history of bias and misinformation on this particular issue (e.g. still falsely reporting the Patriots taped the Rams walkthrough in 2001), named by an unnamed "source," was the discussion of turning a shirt inside out or claiming that they worked for "Kraft films" publicly discussed. I'm very careful about parsing ESPN anonymous stories. They make stuff up. They misinform. They publish select info and hide others. They were the only major news outlet not to even link to AEI. But every negative Patriot soundbite from Sally or Joe for the last 7 months has been at the very top of their news feed.

The Patriots supposedly cooperated with the investigation (volunteering the tapes they had and that it was a 7-year old practice), never denied anything, and have claimed the league destroyed scouting libraries not related to filming (because, as I've said, they overlap heavily). Goodell's destruction of the evidence is consistent with his intellect -- that if he destroyed tapes but then found other tapes, then he would know all the tapes weren't handed over. (Cooperate or else!) Brilliant logic! It's only some nefarious inference and a strong bias that suddenly makes one think Goodell destroyed the tapes because there was something beyond filmed signals on them. (What would that be exactly?? Jay Glazer has one of the tapes -- is he in on it too?)

I am, quite frankly, baffled that you can draw the conclusion that victims viewed that as mere gamesmanship. The entire point of this latest round of media -- or "propaganda," or whatever you want to call it -- was that the victims are still absolutely pissed about this, and wanted the commissioner to come down ridiculously hard on this latest incident, which absolutely was gamesmanship. Indeed, the ESPN piece described the NFL ownership as "palpably angry and frustrated" when initially informed of what the Patriots were doing via spying, and don't seem to have cooled much.

Because the "victims" are billionaires who act like babies at times. The same dudes who pipe crowd noise, tamper, cook the books, etc. are the ones crying "foul" about the Patriots -- amazingly, billionaires are not above hypocrisy if it is self serving.

And again, to be 100% clear, this is in response to the categorization of this as the most concerted, systematic effort in NFL history to violate rules/spirit of rules. The very point is, it is not, (a) precisely because the NFL has a culture of pushing into the gray area when it comes to espionage and the like and (b) those violations are rarely, if ever, a big deal. (Except when the scandalous, lying, manipulative commissioner levies the biggest punishment in history to really make a point. I would say it's a cousin to the witch hunt of deflate gate but at least in spy gate the Patriots did something wrong.) I'm simply not ignoring that in my evaluation of the severity and intention of this taping violation.

Let's not even go back to the 50's New York football Giants to discuss how ingrained this is, let's just go to the last few years. Jets practicing the same thing as the Patriots. Dolphins purchasing films. Teams signing taxi squad players for info. This is in the culture of the league and none of these things are really different than the others to me ITO of intention and ITO of competitive advantage, or even violation of fast-and-hard rules. (I think PEDs are a larger advantage but, again, everyone does them. I think violating the hard cap deliberately is something I'd call cheating and possibly a massive competitive advantage against clearly defined rules.)

[Headsets didn't work...]

It wasn't the rain, the weather, the NFL or some other coincidence that the Steelers and Patriots headsets had problems. Or that this happens all the time. (Especially in Miami, apparently). It's that the Patriots, after their 7 months of fun, thought "let's hack into the headsets of the other team during a primetime game. Heck, we went through all the trouble of developing the system, might as well use it."

That's a QED to me that people are 100% riding the wave to slander them freely, when logic and information are thrown out the window, willful ignorance is embraced and you can say stuff that sticks even when it makes 0.00% sense. It's the genesis of this discussion, the same one in which completely legal and *brilliant* football formations are used as "evidence" of a culture of "cheating." Or the non-deflated footballs become "deflate gate." (In which, legitimately, the NFL seems to have lied, covered up and broken laws.) Or the imaginary filming of a walkthrough becomes "spy gate." Or some amateur wrongly claims the Patriots fumbling rates "are impossible." Or the Patriots "beat up the receivers too much" (in a perfectly legal manner, but let's change the rules there because the Colts asked for it).

And PS: New England is one of, if not the only team thatI'm aware of who has been deeply investigated by the NFL. It's quite plausible this was to placate the owners. Phones and the like were turned over by non-player employees. And you know what that investigation found? Nothing.

[Yoshun]

For what it's worth, I also think O.J. and George Zimmerman are guilty as sin.

The difference there being there was actual evidence against those two.

[LAKESHOW]

NOPE. If it doesn't fit, you must aquit. Tom and OJ are both innocent

[LAKESHOW]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7jLzLJyF4_s[/youtube]

Without a doubt, the most definitive answer. Thank you Ms. America

[El Turco]

wow what a brave, smart and graceful lady. our country needs more women like this

[Froob]

That answer should have sent her back to 5th grade.

[truth18]

Hot

[Froob]

I'm still waiting for the NFL to investigate the Patriots for the alleged secret moonbase on the darkside of the moon. According to rumors, they have a massive telescope they steal signals with and beam them into Brady's helmet. If they can't prove that the moonbase doesn't exist, I'd say steal the rest of their draft picks from them from now until the end of time.