Official Draft Thread 2015-16

[peachbucket]

You keep saying that, but Odom was a good defender. With his mediocre wingspan, unspectacular hops and Charmin-level toughness defensively, he's just never going to contribute like Odom did on that end. At his peak, Odom was an awesome two-way player, if a bit of a headcase. Simmons IMO is far more likely to develop into a Dirk-like player if his jumper improves than anything else - a truly great passing/scoring PF who is good on the glass and just passable enough defensively.

Simmons has great hops for a 6'10 guy.

I would definitely not call them great hops. Blake Griffin has great hops. Ben Simmons ain't Blake Griffin.

Clearly, I have a divisive view on the kid. He's the #1 prospect, so many love the guy. Just because I disagree does not mean I cannot possibly be right. The beauty is we will get to enjoy watching the kid play the next 4-5 years to see how he does pan out ultimately.

The Kyle Anderson comp was clearly too harsh - he's not that bad of an athlete. I just don't put him in the Towns, Davis, Griffin category of recent top pick big men. He's a good enough athlete, and he's incredibly skilled, but the modern NBA PF needs to be more than just skilled. It's probably the most demanding position in the NBA today.

Comps for him are really tough because his skill set is so unique for his size. Obviously he is not quite Lebron athletically but I think that really is his best comp. He has legitimate NBA point forward play making abilities with his ball handling, speed, vision, and passing which you just don't see on 6'10 240 lb guys.

If you want a comp that's not Bron then how about a bigger, stronger, more athletic, better passing, smarter and non compulsive gambling version of Antoine Walker...and that is a multi-year all star at the very least.

[165bows]

Wait. So what you guys are telling me -- there's a white center that's supposed to go top 10?

#Fate #Destiny

Not just one but potentially three: Ellenson, Poeltl and Bender.

Poeltl/Bender could actually be amazing in more ways than one lol.

Poeltl video posted today. The more I think about it the more I actually like that front line combo.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/draftexpress/status/639123584523309056[/tweet]

[Slartibartfast]

I wish Turner would have reupped at Texas for another year.

[Gomes3PC]

Simmons has great hops for a 6'10 guy.

I would definitely not call them great hops. Blake Griffin has great hops. Ben Simmons ain't Blake Griffin.

Clearly, I have a divisive view on the kid. He's the #1 prospect, so many love the guy. Just because I disagree does not mean I cannot possibly be right. The beauty is we will get to enjoy watching the kid play the next 4-5 years to see how he does pan out ultimately.

The Kyle Anderson comp was clearly too harsh - he's not that bad of an athlete. I just don't put him in the Towns, Davis, Griffin category of recent top pick big men. He's a good enough athlete, and he's incredibly skilled, but the modern NBA PF needs to be more than just skilled. It's probably the most demanding position in the NBA today.

Comps for him are really tough because his skill set is so unique for his size. Obviously he is not quite Lebron athletically but I think that really is his best comp. He has legitimate NBA point forward play making abilities with his ball handling, speed, vision, and passing which you just don't see on 6'10 240 lb guys.

If you want a comp that's not Bron then how about a bigger, stronger, more athletic, better passing, smarter and non compulsive gambling version of Antoine Walker...and that is a multi-year all star at the very least.

'Toine is an interesting comp. Wiggles had similar issues as he thought he could shoot but really couldn't, and was a subpar defender most of his career. However, he was a beast in the paint and on the glass & a deft passer.

[peachbucket]

Not just one but potentially three: Ellenson, Poeltl and Bender.

Poeltl/Bender could actually be amazing in more ways than one lol.

Poeltl video posted today. The more I think about it the more I actually like that front line combo.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/draftexpress/status/639123584523309056[/tweet]

To me Poeltl looks like a mediocre role player at best...Ellenson and especially BENDER are a different story alltogether.

[ConstableGeneva]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/EricPincus/status/639298781431726081[/tweet]
Mark your calendars! Already wrapping my token of thanks for King and Cuban.

[ddb]

Simmons screams superstar future. It's not like Harden or Curry or even Cousins are dominant two way players.

and the Lamar Odom comp is insufficient because Simmons is much more aggressive offensively, and will put up much higher scoring numbers, even if he never develops a good jump shot. His combination of size, strength, shooting/dribbling/passing skills, and scoring mentality is just about unmatched in the NBA.

Just to be clear, I said Odom was his floor. I think Simmons will be a superstar top 10 player during his prime years

[ddb]

You keep saying that, but Odom was a good defender. With his mediocre wingspan, unspectacular hops and Charmin-level toughness defensively, he's just never going to contribute like Odom did on that end. At his peak, Odom was an awesome two-way player, if a bit of a headcase. Simmons IMO is far more likely to develop into a Dirk-like player if his jumper improves than anything else - a truly great passing/scoring PF who is good on the glass and just passable enough defensively.

Simmons has great hops for a 6'10 guy.

I would definitely not call them great hops. Blake Griffin has great hops. Ben Simmons ain't Blake Griffin.

Clearly, I have a divisive view on the kid. He's the #1 prospect, so many love the guy. Just because I disagree does not mean I cannot possibly be right. The beauty is we will get to enjoy watching the kid play the next 4-5 years to see how he does pan out ultimately.

The Kyle Anderson comp was clearly too harsh - he's not that bad of an athlete. I just don't put him in the Towns, Davis, Griffin category of recent top pick big men. He's a good enough athlete, and he's incredibly skilled, but the modern NBA PF needs to be more than just skilled. It's probably the most demanding position in the NBA today.

Simmons is a 3 in the NBA imo, but is ideal for "positionless" lineups. Can play multiple positions and cause matchup nightmares for coaches

[165bows]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3ctx6mtlnA[/youtube]

[165bows]

Code: Select all

Season    G   MP  2P  2PA  2P%  3P 3PA  3P%  FT FTA  FT% TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS  ORtg DRtg
Career   73 1959 6.8 15.3 .447 2.6 7.8 .331 5.4 7.0 .772 9.6 5.4 3.4 0.2 3.1 3.5 26.7 111.1 90.1

Code: Select all

Season    G   MP  2P  2PA  2P%  3P 3PA  3P%  FT FTA  FT% TRB  AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS  ORtg DRtg
Career   62 1909 6.7 14.0 .476 1.0 3.0 .333 5.1 7.4 .691 9.9 11.0 4.0 0.6 6.4 6.0 21.4 102.2 95.8

Comparing two guys' (college) production per-100 possessions (to make it a little less obvious). As shown, they had very close minutes and games played. Any takers?

Edit - Almost identical ages, if that helps.
And some 'advanced' stats too if people prefer:

Code: Select all

Season    G   MP  PER  TS% eFG% 3PAr  FTr ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG%
Career   73 1959 20.6 .507 .463 .337 .303  4.0 13.9  8.9 18.6  3.4  0.4 10.5 24.7

Code: Select all

Season    G   MP  PER  TS% eFG% 3PAr  FTr ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG%
Career   62 1909 19.2 .523 .480 .175 .438  4.1 14.7  9.4 39.5  4.0  1.1 23.6 22.6

[165bows]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/mike_schmitz/status/642135235270840320[/tweet]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/mike_schmitz/status/642030855162978304[/tweet]

Draft express videos for Kris Dunn and Henry Ellenson.

[KGboss]

You should sticky this 165

[165bows]

You should sticky this 165

I would but my sticky function only works on other boards for some reason. I'd sticky this and the pick watch thread and cut loose the SL thread.

[165bows]

Been looking at the various potential guys in this draft and it looks a little light defensively, anyone else feel like that? Seems primarily offense first types mixed with some solid two-way guys. Don't really see who that great defensive player is.

[No-Man]

Been looking at the various potential guys in this draft and it looks a little light defensively, anyone else feel like that? Seems primarily offense first types mixed with some solid two-way guys. Don't really see who that great defensive player is.

Well maybe not a dominant defender, like Justise Winslow or Hollis-Jefferson, but Bender, JBrown, Rabb, Poeltl, DJones, JJackson, DJackson, Diallo, DRobinson, NHayes, Sabonis, Guven or TWilliams are all two-way quality players.

[165bows]

Been looking at the various potential guys in this draft and it looks a little light defensively, anyone else feel like that? Seems primarily offense first types mixed with some solid two-way guys. Don't really see who that great defensive player is.

Well maybe not a dominant defender, like Justise Winslow or Hollis-Jefferson, but Bender, JBrown, Rabb, Poeltl, DJones, JJackson, DJackson, Diallo, DRobinson, NHayes, Sabonis, Guven or TWilliams are all two-way quality players.

What about Skal on the defensive end, what's your opinion there? You like the quality of this draft so far or no?

[pfm]

What about Skal on the defensive end, what's your opinion there? You like the quality of this draft so far or no?

When I saw your original post I was going to mention Skal. I think he's got really nice potential there (and on both ends). He's currently my #1 prospect.

[brackdan70]

Code: Select all

Season    G   MP  2P  2PA  2P%  3P 3PA  3P%  FT FTA  FT% TRB AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS  ORtg DRtg
Career   73 1959 6.8 15.3 .447 2.6 7.8 .331 5.4 7.0 .772 9.6 5.4 3.4 0.2 3.1 3.5 26.7 111.1 90.1

Code: Select all

Season    G   MP  2P  2PA  2P%  3P 3PA  3P%  FT FTA  FT% TRB  AST STL BLK TOV  PF  PTS  ORtg DRtg
Career   62 1909 6.7 14.0 .476 1.0 3.0 .333 5.1 7.4 .691 9.9 11.0 4.0 0.6 6.4 6.0 21.4 102.2 95.8

Comparing two guys' (college) production per-100 possessions (to make it a little less obvious). As shown, they had very close minutes and games played. Any takers?

Edit - Almost identical ages, if that helps.
And some 'advanced' stats too if people prefer:

Code: Select all

Season    G   MP  PER  TS% eFG% 3PAr  FTr ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG%
Career   73 1959 20.6 .507 .463 .337 .303  4.0 13.9  8.9 18.6  3.4  0.4 10.5 24.7

Code: Select all

Season    G   MP  PER  TS% eFG% 3PAr  FTr ORB% DRB% TRB% AST% STL% BLK% TOV% USG%
Career   62 1909 19.2 .523 .480 .175 .438  4.1 14.7  9.4 39.5  4.0  1.1 23.6 22.6

not really spectacular stats for college. not top 10 picks for sure.....I hope . 2nd guy looks like a prolific passer though. first guy has a nice Ortg / Drtg. oh oh oh I know the first guy. its Rozier.

[brackdan70]

Ah...2nd guy is Kris Dunn...projected #8 by Draft express. will see how this year goes for him.

[165bows]

Ah...2nd guy is Kris Dunn...projected #8 by Draft express. will see how this year goes for him.

Nicely done my friend, all the and-1s for you. Thought it was interesting they compare pretty well, considering they are exactly the same age and Dunn is (at least for now) projected top-10 by one outlet. Dunn has a few advantages statistically such as assist volume, but my guess is Rozier is actually a little more polished , esp. on the defensive end.

Not sure if it means much, but it did leave me feeling a little better about the Rozier pick at any rate.