Dragan Bender - 97 born Croatian prospect

Johnny Firpo · Post #81 » by **Johnny Firpo** » Wed Sep 9, 2015 8:59 am

Von Bismarck wrote:But 480p streams of Euroleague are watchable, nothing wrong with it.

Oh yeah, I'm watching the US Open now in 480p (Eurosport Player) and it's night and day compared to those Chinese streams from 2005. They were really, really bad, but hey, it was the NBA.

doordoor123 · Post #82 » by **doordoor123** » Wed Sep 9, 2015 11:55 am

Do you guys notice how many similar 6'10 guys with high upside will be in the league?
Bender, Ben Simmons, Dario Saric, Nikola Mirotic, Giannis Antetokounmpo. Looks like the age of 6-10 guys.

Von Bismarck · Post #83 » by **Von Bismarck** » Wed Sep 9, 2015 12:33 pm

doordoor123 wrote:Do you guys notice how many similar 6'10 guys with high upside will be in the league?
Bender, Ben Simmons, Dario Saric, Nikola Mirotic, Giannis Antetokounmpo. Looks like the age of 6-10 guys.

Bender is 7,0 though. (213cm without shoes)

No-Man · Post #84 » by **No-Man** » Wed Sep 9, 2015 6:23 pm

doordoor123 wrote:Do you guys notice how many similar 6'10 guys with high upside will be in the league?
Bender, Ben Simmons, Dario Saric, Nikola Mirotic, Giannis Antetokounmpo. Looks like the age of 6-10 guys.

Bender is 7'1, the rest are not really similar at all.

doordoor123 · Post #85 » by **doordoor123** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 11:41 am

Fischella wrote:
doordoor123 wrote:Do you guys notice how many similar 6'10 guys with high upside will be in the league?
Bender, Ben Simmons, Dario Saric, Nikola Mirotic, Giannis Antetokounmpo. Looks like the age of 6-10 guys.

Bender is 7'1, the rest are not really similar at all.

Similar in the sense of having a ton of upside and being 6'10. If Bender is 7'1, then he is. All of them have the ability to be multi-dimensional in their career. Players that can be potential shot-blocking fours, can pass, rebound and score are rare in the league and they're a hot-commodity. The fact that so many are coming to the league right now will be a big deal a couple years.

No-Man · Post #86 » by **No-Man** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 12:35 pm

The thing is, Simmons, Saric and Mirotic are not potentially shot-blocking fours, like at all, Bender is a good defender but he is not known to make those type of explosive plays either.

Mattya · Post #87 » by **Mattya** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 4:02 pm

Does anyone know how his contract will impact when he can come to the NBA?

pohani komarac · Post #88 » by **pohani komarac** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 8:26 pm

Bender potentialy can become force on defense and is alredy good defender. Only weaknes in D for him is strenght. He alredy showed he can switch on guards to make denial or stay with them, and can alert shoots outside or inside with his lenght.

doordoor123 · Post #89 » by **doordoor123** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:48 am

Fischella wrote:The thing is, Simmons, Saric and Mirotic are not potentially shot-blocking fours, like at all, Bender is a good defender but he is not known to make those type of explosive plays either.

They're all long enough arms to clog shooters. A lot of fours have shorter arms. I'm sure you're thinking shot blocking as in DeAndre Jordan or LeBron James. I'm thinking more like Pau Gasol. Guys that can stand in the paint, put their arms up and deflect shots. Or long enough to confuse smaller threes and fours into thinking they're farther away as they shoot jumpers. Guys like Patrick Patterson and Terrence Jones can't do that. And yes, Simmons, Saric and Mirotic have been known to do just those things on occasion.

No-Man · Post #90 » by **No-Man** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:54 am

doordoor123 wrote:
Fischella wrote:The thing is, Simmons, Saric and Mirotic are not potentially shot-blocking fours, like at all, Bender is a good defender but he is not known to make those type of explosive plays either.

They're all long enough arms to clog shooters. A lot of fours have shorter arms. I'm sure you're thinking shot blocking as in DeAndre Jordan or LeBron James. I'm thinking more like Pau Gasol. Guys that can stand in the paint, put their arms up and deflect shots. Or long enough to confuse smaller threes and fours into thinking they're farther away as they shoot jumpers.

Again, they are not, Simmons, Saric and Mirotic actually have average or below average wingspans, Bender is bigger and longer but he is still not the athlete that Gasol was, vertically (before he got old) nor as long as Pau.
They are more situational defenders, Saric is smart and plays hard, but he is going to struggle size wise, he is pretty much at his peak physically, he wont add much mass and he is still thin, Simmons is strong but not so explosive and he lacks length as a four, he is another smart big that can make some plays, but not really a shot blocker.
Mirotic is the worst of the bunch defensively, he is just soft.

doordoor123 · Post #91 » by **doordoor123** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 11:05 am

Fischella wrote:
doordoor123 wrote:
Fischella wrote:The thing is, Simmons, Saric and Mirotic are not potentially shot-blocking fours, like at all, Bender is a good defender but he is not known to make those type of explosive plays either.

They're all long enough arms to clog shooters. A lot of fours have shorter arms. I'm sure you're thinking shot blocking as in DeAndre Jordan or LeBron James. I'm thinking more like Pau Gasol. Guys that can stand in the paint, put their arms up and deflect shots. Or long enough to confuse smaller threes and fours into thinking they're farther away as they shoot jumpers.

Again, they are not, Simmons, Saric and Mirotic actually have average or below average wingspans, Bender is bigger and longer but he is still not the athlete that Gasol was, vertically (before he got old) nor as long as Pau.
They are more situational defenders, Saric is smart and plays hard, but he is going to struggle size wise, he is pretty much at his peak physically, he wont add much mass and he is still thin, Simmons is strong but not so explosive and he lacks length as a four, he is another smart big that can make some plays, but not really a shot blocker.
Mirotic is the worst of the bunch defensively, he is just soft.

Below average wingspan doesn't say much when you're playing 3/4. They're 6'10 and above playing against guys that are likely smaller. They're also not unathletic and can come in from the weak side. As someone who watches every Bulls game I can tell you Mirotic does that pretty well. And I completely disagree he's "soft." He fights for balls and fights for position, but he isn't strong enough against bigger guys and doesn't have any defensive awareness yet. He doesn't move well laterally, but is disruptive in the paint. I've seen Simmons do the same at a lesser level of competition and I've seen Saric do it (not as well I admit).

Von Bismarck · Post #92 » by **Von Bismarck** » Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:41 pm

Bender played his first competitive match for Maccabi Tel Aviv in Israeli league cup;

18min -> 11p 5r 2a (3PT 3/4)

Impressed in his debut. Played some great D, both team and 1on1. Showed he can guard opponents SF's without a problem, his footwork and lateral quickness are astonishing for a guy that's 213cm tall. Also showed some good D on opponents centers but he lacks weight for something more. His court vision is amazing and had some flashy passes. What's even better, his ball control is as if he's a SG and can easily be second creator.

His game is Toni Kukoc like, he's basically above average in every aspect of the game. I don't know what could possible happen this guy doesn't go TOP 3-4 in the draft and becomes a factor in the NBA. Brilliant young guy!

flipwise · Post #93 » by **flipwise** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 10:20 pm

Analysis and Q&A article: http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2573742-meet-17-year-old-european-dragan-bender-who-could-be-2016s-kristaps-porzingis

No-Man · Post #94 » by **No-Man** » Wed Sep 30, 2015 10:34 pm

He is nothing, playing wise like Porzingis, who is longer, more explosive, a better shooter, but less fluid and skilled.
Bender is also a better defender and has a higher ceiling, right now I have him ranked as the top prospect for 2016.

Thespianoid · Post #95 » by **Thespianoid** » Thu Oct 1, 2015 1:12 am

I'm really not a fan of how Bender was represented in that article. Especially how he'll be received by the masses.

Like Fischella says above me, people are gonna focus on the Porzingis/Dirk/Mirotic "names" and imagine he plays like them (and stupidly label him a soft jump-shooting Euro, because for some stupid reason they can't get over that bias). He plays nothing like them.

Case in point, a search of Dragan Bender on twitter will yield multiple mentions of that article, all with blurbs like "projected as next Kristaps Porzingis" and "Kid mimics Dirk & Mirotic" (written by David Pick himself).

I guess intelligent people will know to make their own judgements, but others in positions to shape perceptions should really do a better job.

pohani komarac · Post #96 » by **pohani komarac** » Fri Oct 2, 2015 4:47 pm

Nikola Vujcic says Bender will enter 2016. draft only if he gets top 3 garentee

Played prep game with Maccabi in United Center

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_gKIJ9vSYI[/youtube]

No-Man · Post #97 » by **No-Man** » Fri Oct 2, 2015 4:52 pm

He said top3-top5, he will get that, at least top6 99%

Skin · Post #98 » by **Skin** » Fri Oct 2, 2015 6:03 pm

Better player? Bender or Porzingis

Thespianoid · Post #99 » by **Thespianoid** » Sat Oct 3, 2015 12:47 am

Watched the game yesterday. Kid reminds me so much of Kirilenko. Lanky, mobile, contributes in so many ways. Shot blocking, court vision, off-ball movement, on-ball defense.

Hate how yet another high-profile article describes him like this:

From a scouting perspective, Bender fits the European archetype almost perfectly. He spent of the night floating around the three-point line despite often being clearly the tallest player on court. His length resulted in two impressive blocks but he didn't do much rebounding. It's all par for the course.

Floating around the 3PT line was due to his small role in the Maccabi offense and the spacing they needed. Plus his strength as a 17 yr old means he won't be effective trying to fight with the grown men. Same goes for rebounding.

What is it with American writers and their insistence on perpetuating one view of European players? No wonder so many American basketball fans are so uneducated about European basketball... :nonono:

Von Bismarck · Post #100 » by **Von Bismarck** » Sat Oct 3, 2015 5:24 pm

Skin wrote:Better player? Bender or Porzingis

As of now, Porzingis for sure but not by a big margin. Considering Zinger is '95 and Bender is late '97, it's logical.

Higher ceiling? Bender.

Imagine what would Bender do in high school right now if he played there considering he's able to put 10pts against good Euroleague team which Milano is. He would massacre opponents there.

Bender can play SF and PF, he will also be able to play C when he gains some weight. He almost exclusively played at 3 yesterday and defensively destroyed Gentile who is above average Euroleague player.

p.s Nikola Vujcic (ex Croatian/Maccabi/Euroleague star, current Maccabi team manager) said Bender is legit 216cm.

p.p.s Toni Kukoc closely follows Bender, that could mean something. I think Bulls might go for him via trading up if this season appears to be another fail. Who knows.

p.p.p.s Heard Raptors GM is also high on Bender. Him and Valanciunas would do magic.