GT: We're going to Miami Wed. 10/28 7:30 PM EST

[Joest2003]

That was a disaster. Lamb needs to hurry up and come back im not sure I can handle watching another game with PJ as the starter

wtf

Only thing Lamb would do is take Brian Roberts minutes from last night. And Roberts played a really good game. PJ's entire job in the starting unit was to keep defenders honest and unable to double down on Al, which got Al off to a great start, and guard Wade, which he did better than most expected. Lamb's presence wouldn't have changed anything most likely.

I'm still waiting for people here to acknowledge how bad Kemba was for 3 quarters on both sides of the ball. Or at least how he was completely passive while the early lead evaporated.

If you think the only thing lamb would do is take Roberts minutes than your just lost. He is by far the best SG we have and its not even close. PJ can't do anything other than shoot. And I would argue he can't even do that. Look at his fg%.

[Liver_Pooty]

I may have been a little irrational last night, but not by much. Been watching Walker shoot like piss for years and im sick of it.

[yosemiteben]

Defensively I would say PJ did fine. By no means did he stop Wade, but he also did not lose him or make bone headed defensive plays. I'll say I'm more optimistic about his potential defensively after that game. If I tracked it right, DWade had 9 points (3-5 FG, 3-4 FT) while PJ was on the floor. Not lockdown, but not awful.

PJ also forced two TOs defensively - charge on Wade, then Emmy-nomination worthy hip check by Haslem.

I like how Cliff is using him. Perimeter defender that doesn't need the ball to be effective with the starters for 15-20 mpg, more if he's actually making shots, then close out with Lin in that SG slot.

I think Lamb would have been a difference maker last night though, would have given us another viable perimeter shooter, lengthy defender to stick on Green and maybe he could have got us going.

[DY_nasty]

Yeah, I think that Lamb on Green would've saved Lin the headache of that mismatch. Not a game changer or anything though.

Only "we should've" thing we really could've done better rotation wise was to get Zeller out there more and sooner.

That was a disaster. Lamb needs to hurry up and come back im not sure I can handle watching another game with PJ as the starter

wtf

Only thing Lamb would do is take Brian Roberts minutes from last night. And Roberts played a really good game. PJ's entire job in the starting unit was to keep defenders honest and unable to double down on Al, which got Al off to a great start, and guard Wade, which he did better than most expected. Lamb's presence wouldn't have changed anything most likely.

I'm still waiting for people here to acknowledge how bad Kemba was for 3 quarters on both sides of the ball. Or at least how he was completely passive while the early lead evaporated.

If you think the only thing lamb would do is take Roberts minutes than your just lost. He is by far the best SG we have and its not even close. PJ can't do anything other than shoot. And I would argue he can't even do that. Look at his fg%.

Based on what?

He's not even better than Lin part-timing at SG lol

[Joest2003]

I may have been a little irrational last night, but not by much. Been watching Walker shoot like piss for years and im sick of it.

Only him huh? No mention of batum shooting 3-12 or PJ shooting 1-5? Shocking coming from you... news check if the other guys could hit a shot the PG wouldn't have to shoot 16 times. I don't even think walker attempted a shot the whole first quarter. they all need to shoot better it's not just him.

[Liver_Pooty]

I think Lin might honestly be the best overall guard we have. Has the size to play both positions and actually knows how to shoot a basketball l.

[Liver_Pooty]

I may have been a little irrational last night, but not by much. Been watching Walker shoot like piss for years and im sick of it.

Only him huh? No mention of batum shooting 3-12 or PJ shooting 1-5? Shocking coming from you... news check if the other guys could hit a shot the PG wouldn't have to shoot 16 times. I don't even think walker attempted a shot the whole first quarter. they all need to shoot better it's not just him.

I've already said multiple times they didn't play that well either. I can't wait to hear your excuses for Kemba all season long.

Guy could play with Lebron and still shoot terribly with even worse shot selection. Maddening to watch

[Joest2003]

Yeah, I think that Lamb on Green would've saved Lin the headache of that mismatch. Not a game changer or anything though.

Only "we should've" thing we really could've done better rotation wise was to get Zeller out there more and sooner.

wtf

Only thing Lamb would do is take Brian Roberts minutes from last night. And Roberts played a really good game. PJ's entire job in the starting unit was to keep defenders honest and unable to double down on Al, which got Al off to a great start, and guard Wade, which he did better than most expected. Lamb's presence wouldn't have changed anything most likely.

I'm still waiting for people here to acknowledge how bad Kemba was for 3 quarters on both sides of the ball. Or at least how he was completely passive while the early lead evaporated.

If you think the only thing lamb would do is take Roberts minutes than your just lost. He is by far the best SG we have and its not even close. PJ can't do anything other than shoot. And I would argue he can't even do that. Look at his fg%.

Based on what?

He's not even better than Lin part-timing at SG lol

Based on what?? Well you see there are these things called stats that keep track of ppg, fg% rebounds, assists ect. Take a look sometime...

Do you really think Jeremy Lin can guard a starting caliber SG in the nba??

You have a brain, use it.

[EwingSweatsALot]

Defensively I would say PJ did fine. By no means did he stop Wade, but he also did not lose him or make bone headed defensive plays. I'll say I'm more optimistic about his potential defensively after that game. If I tracked it right, DWade had 9 points (3-5 FG, 3-4 FT) while PJ was on the floor. Not lockdown, but not awful.

PJ also forced two TOs defensively - charge on Wade, then Emmy-nomination worthy hip check by Haslem.

I like how Cliff is using him. Perimeter defender that doesn't need the ball to be effective with the starters for 15-20 mpg, more if he's actually making shots, then close out with Lin in that SG slot.

I think Lamb would have been a difference maker last night though, would have given us another viable perimeter shooter, lengthy defender to stick on Green and maybe he could have got us going.

PJs D was good.

He did seem more enthused and into it when guarding Wade than others. Wasn't as impactful on other guys. Could have been just a challenge to him, but would like to see him guard everyone that way.

He also switched and rotated when he shouldn't have. He did it being very active, but it still let guys out to dry. It happened once in the 1st quarter where he switched onto Als guy off a PnR and Al threw up his hands at him. He had some issues like that where we seemed to be switching on everything that involved small guys and didn't switch with bugs, just soft hedges and he switched on everything at times.

Defense was good though. It was nice to see him take that challenge on with Wade.

[EwingSweatsALot]

I think Lin might honestly be the best overall guard we have. Has the size to play both positions and actually knows how to shoot a basketball l.

He dribbles too much, but that can be corrected. Was easily our best guard last night.

[EwingSweatsALot]

That was a disaster. Lamb needs to hurry up and come back im not sure I can handle watching another game with PJ as the starter

wtf

Only thing Lamb would do is take Brian Roberts minutes from last night. And Roberts played a really good game. PJ's entire job in the starting unit was to keep defenders honest and unable to double down on Al, which got Al off to a great start, and guard Wade, which he did better than most expected. Lamb's presence wouldn't have changed anything most likely.

I'm still waiting for people here to acknowledge how bad Kemba was for 3 quarters on both sides of the ball. Or at least how he was completely passive while the early lead evaporated.

Kemba was absolute ****. Passive at the beginning and then when he actually cared to insert himself it was the same thing all over again.

Two years ago he could at least keep his man in front of him, but now he's a matador on D. Same with last year. Dragic took him to the cleaners last night constantly. Was pathetic to watch.

[Joest2003]

I may have been a little irrational last night, but not by much. Been watching Walker shoot like piss for years and im sick of it.

Only him huh? No mention of batum shooting 3-12 or PJ shooting 1-5? Shocking coming from you... news check if the other guys could hit a shot the PG wouldn't have to shoot 16 times. I don't even think walker attempted a shot the whole first quarter. they all need to shoot better it's not just him.

I've already said multiple times they didn't play that well either. I can't wait to hear your excuses for Kemba all season long.

Guy could play with Lebron and still shoot terribly with even worse shot selection. Maddening to watch

There was 2 guys who shots worse but you single him out. Just gets old.

[DY_nasty]

Walker didn't just shoot poorly, he took hilariously crap shots. Its a lot easier to forgive a guy who misses a good open look than it is to forgive a guy who dribbles right into a blocked shot again and again.

Based on what?? Well you see there are these things called stats that keep track of ppg, fg% rebounds, assists ect. Take a look sometime...

Do you really think Jeremy Lin can guard a starting caliber SG in the nba??

You have a brain, use it.

Lamb's never been a good defender in any capacity though. Like... ever. Even PJ had flashes here or there, but Lamb's been sleepwalking his entire career. Years. Lin's actually a pretty decent defender when you check his numbers too. Also, its really easy putting up numbers back on a team that's loaded with offensive talent compared to one that isn't. Him being a guy that needs the ball in his hands means that here he's got a lot more on his plate than he's ever had.

Lamb's just a hope. If he surprises people, it'll be exactly that - a surprise. Only thing I have faith in him doing is being better than Brian Roberts and offering decent minutes off the bench.

Blaming a loss on him not being on the court is ridiculous.

Insult me more

[yosemiteben]

I actually thought Kemba was ok on defense. Dragic finished the game with 8 points on 4-8 shooting, so let's pump the brakes a bit on talking about how successful he was against Kemba.

I definitely noticed his lack of assertiveness on offense in the first half, but I think that was more due to the way we were feeding Al. If we're going to Al that steadily and we also want Batum to be a primary ball handler, that pretty much inevitably will lead to Kemba taking a step back. Honestly I was pretty ok with that while Al had it going in 1Q.

I actually thought through three quarters Kemba outplayed Lin even though his shot wasn't falling (though that pass to Hawes to end the first quarter was a thing of beauty). Lin looked completely out of control in the third quarter, I haven't seem him try to go iso so much and honestly he reminded me more of last year's Kemba than Kemba did in this game.

I'm not really worried about either of them though. MIA had some nice defense and we looked visibly out of sorts trying to run our sets. PNRs were virtually non-existent.

[DY_nasty]

I actually thought Kemba was ok on defense. Dragic finished the game with 8 points on 4-8 shooting, so let's pump the brakes a bit on talking about how successful he was against Kemba.

I definitely noticed his lack of assertiveness on offense in the first half, but I think that was more due to the way we were feeding Al. If we're going to Al that steadily and we also want Batum to be a primary ball handler, that pretty much inevitably will lead to Kemba taking a step back. Honestly I was pretty ok with that while Al had it going in 1Q.

I actually thought through three quarters Kemba outplayed Lin even though his shot wasn't falling (though that pass to Hawes to end the first quarter was a thing of beauty). Lin looked completely out of control in the third quarter, I haven't seem him try to go iso so much and honestly he reminded me more of last year's Kemba than Kemba did in this game.

I'm not really worried about either of them though. MIA had some nice defense and we looked visibly out of sorts trying to run our sets. PNRs were virtually non-existent.

It wasn't the points. Dragic, and even Chalmers, got into the paint and forced the defense to collapse whenever they wanted. That was the issue. Kemba wasn't even forcing guys to change direction, his denial of the drive was pathetic the entire night.

And the thing with Al being fed or Lin overdribbling... look at what Kemba was doing while that was going on. Literally nothing. Dude started doing the same thing he did when sharing the court with Mo last year where he just kinda idles and waits for an opening to magically appear. He's not assertive at all off-ball. When he has the ball, he's ready to make an And 1 highlight first chance he gets, but when he's not directly involved in a play then he's sitting on his hands.

I'll admit Lin got out of control, but at least he was getting people involved and moving across the entire court while doing so. When Kemba does that, he stays at the top of the lane and the ball doesn't move. Lin actually hits baselines, moves corner to corner, will ask for screens, direct traffic, etc - so I really don't mind it as much. That's okay with me. That says that everyone is lost lol. Kemba doesn't do that.

[Braggins]

I think Kemba is getting unfairly blamed for our lack of ball movement. The ball moved fine when he was in and Al was out. Al did his same old trick all game where all he did was call for post isos and refuse to do anything else. When he was in the game our offense was almost exclusively post isos with no movement from anyone else, not just Kemba. When the post isos stopped working the offense completely stagnated and when the offense stagnates like that the only shots anyone on our team is going to get are bad shots out of isolation. I don't know why anyone is surprised that someone who isn't a great shooter struggles to be efficient in a situation where the only shots he can get are semi contested mid range jumpers out of an isolation. Lin couldn't get anything going either when he was in with Al. We need our PG's to be driving with space and dishing to shooters, not standing around waiting to shoot a bad jump shot after Al's post iso gets shut down. I'm really not sure how there is any question at this point as to who is to blame for our offense stagnating.

One of the most discouraging things for me from last nights game was how Batum plays when he shares the court with Al. There were long stretches where literally every single time Batum got the ball he would immediately look to pass it into Al who was predictably always calling for a post iso. I guess its better than how Kemba responds (trying to iso himself), but still, it was really depressing to see Batum just completely take himself out of the game like that.

Before everyone starts accusing me of making excuses for Kemba, my excuse isn't for Kemba, it is for everyone. EVERYONE looked bad and NO ONE was moving the ball when Al was on the court, but obviously there are a few people who want to act like it was only Kemba.

[Braggins]

I'll admit Lin got out of control, but at least he was getting people involved

I guess thats why he had half as many assists as Kemba, because he was doing so much better at getting people involved...

[yosemiteben]

Before everyone starts accusing me of making excuses for Kemba, my excuse isn't for Kemba, it is for everyone. EVERYONE looked bad and NO ONE was moving the ball when Al was on the court, but obviously there are a few people who want to act like it was only Kemba.

The ball movement was terrible in the second and third quarters without Al. You're kind of doing the same thing, you're just blaming Al instead of Kemba.

[Braggins]

Before everyone starts accusing me of making excuses for Kemba, my excuse isn't for Kemba, it is for everyone. EVERYONE looked bad and NO ONE was moving the ball when Al was on the court, but obviously there are a few people who want to act like it was only Kemba.

The ball movement was terrible in the second and third quarters without Al. You're kind of doing the same thing, you're just blaming Al instead of Kemba.

Not really. There was some stagnation at the end of the 3rd, but it still wasn't nearly as bad as when we were going straight Alfense and the ball started moving in the 4th. I thought the ball moved ok in the 2nd quarter without Al, but admittedly not as much as we needed it to. It was still much better than when we were going straight Alfense and there was literally no movement at all.

I really don't see how you could possibly deny the very stark difference between how we were playing with as opposed to without Al. We were literally post iso'ing Al sometimes 4 to 5 possessions in a row and no one was moving when we were doing that. If you really saw that and thought it was the same as how we were playing without Al then I really don't know what to else to say.

I'm focusing on Al because he is obviously directly causing the lack of ball movement way more so than anyone else and its been going on for three seasons now. I'm beyond sick of it. I just want to see our guys actually get out and play basketball like we've seen they are capable of instead of standing around watching Al.

[Roy Tarpley]

I'm gonna watch that second quarter again to see what the hell happened. I saw the game from start to finish and the Heat did a 15 point swing in like 5 minutes in the second quarter!