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GT #7: Thunder @ Wizards 7 PM (CSN/NBATV/99.1 FM) [11/10/2015]

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Re: GT #7: Thunder @ Wizards 7 PM (CSN/NBATV/99.1 FM) [11/10/2015] 

Post#161 » by stevemcqueen1 » Thu Nov 12, 2015 4:53 am

Ruzious wrote:
stevemcqueen1 wrote:Rebounding is about team-wide effort as much as anything. The Warriors rebound well as a team even when they play Draymond Green at C because they all box out and go after boards aggressively. Curry and Thompson and Barnes and Iggy all average a ton of boards for their position. Their bigs play the shot and everyone boxes out.

There is no reason that Wall and Beal and Porter can't average a ton of rebounds for their position too. The team just isn't **** playing defense of boxing out.

Because everyone wants to run nowadaze, you usually see teams not let more than 1 or 2 players go for offensive boards - everyone else sprints back on D. So, it's awfully hard for PGs, SGs, or 3's to get any offensive rebounds. And getting defensive rebounds is limited by how much you want your 1, 2 & 3 to leak out on the break. 1, 2 & 3 can help, but today's game generally puts more of an onus on your 5 and 4 to dominate the boards. When Gortat got 1 in 27 minutes, that's a bit of a shock for Wittman.


Our defenders are leaking out too early and they're ball watching and reacting passively instead of boxing out and, to quote Clark Kellogg, persistently pursuing the pumpkin.

Golden State is proof that you can play tight D and have your bigs aggressively close out on shooters, box out, let your guards and wings scoop up tons of boards, and still lead the league in pace. Bogut is a good rebounder, but not really better than Gortat. Their team as a whole just puts in a whole lot more work on D and on the glass.

And that shouldn't be the case. You can't convince me that Steph Curry, Harrison Barnes, and Klay Thompson are more naturally gifted defenders than Wall, Beal, and Porter. They just work harder night in and night out.
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Re: GT #7: Thunder @ Wizards 7 PM (CSN/NBATV/99.1 FM) [11/10/2015] 

Post#162 » by Ruzious » Thu Nov 12, 2015 10:35 am

stevemcqueen1 wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
stevemcqueen1 wrote:Rebounding is about team-wide effort as much as anything. The Warriors rebound well as a team even when they play Draymond Green at C because they all box out and go after boards aggressively. Curry and Thompson and Barnes and Iggy all average a ton of boards for their position. Their bigs play the shot and everyone boxes out.

There is no reason that Wall and Beal and Porter can't average a ton of rebounds for their position too. The team just isn't **** playing defense of boxing out.

Because everyone wants to run nowadaze, you usually see teams not let more than 1 or 2 players go for offensive boards - everyone else sprints back on D. So, it's awfully hard for PGs, SGs, or 3's to get any offensive rebounds. And getting defensive rebounds is limited by how much you want your 1, 2 & 3 to leak out on the break. 1, 2 & 3 can help, but today's game generally puts more of an onus on your 5 and 4 to dominate the boards. When Gortat got 1 in 27 minutes, that's a bit of a shock for Wittman.


Our defenders are leaking out too early and they're ball watching and reacting passively instead of boxing out and, to quote Clark Kellogg, persistently pursuing the pumpkin.

Golden State is proof that you can play tight D and have your bigs aggressively close out on shooters, box out, let your guards and wings scoop up tons of boards, and still lead the league in pace. Bogut is a good rebounder, but not really better than Gortat. Their team as a whole just puts in a whole lot more work on D and on the glass.

And that shouldn't be the case. You can't convince me that Steph Curry, Harrison Barnes, and Klay Thompson are more naturally gifted defenders than Wall, Beal, and Porter. They just work harder night in and night out.

Fwiw, the Wiz had a better rebound differential than GS last season: +2.99 vs +0.15. This season so far, GS has been far superior: +4.32 vs -4.70.
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Re: GT #7: Thunder @ Wizards 7 PM (CSN/NBATV/99.1 FM) [11/10/2015] 

Post#163 » by long suffrin' boulez fan » Fri Nov 13, 2015 1:22 pm

GS also has Green and Iguodala.

Plus, I do think there must be a correlation between the crazy efficiency of their offense and their ability to play D.

You all get it, right? You've played ball and had those games when you're matched up against someone who just has game. You spend your mental and physical energy focusing and getting abused on defense, then you rush or panic or just don't have the same focus on the offensive end.
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Re: GT #7: Thunder @ Wizards 7 PM (CSN/NBATV/99.1 FM) [11/10/2015] 

Post#164 » by payitforward » Fri Nov 13, 2015 3:02 pm

Ruzious wrote:Fwiw, the Wiz had a better rebound differential than GS last season: +2.99 vs +0.15. This season so far, GS has been far superior: +4.32 vs -4.70.

We are losing, because we consistently give our opponent more shots than we get. For example, we lost to Atlanta by 15 points -- yet we shot slightly *better* than they did! We made 84 pts on 78 shots. They made 99 points on 92 shots.

We also rebounded as effectively as they did on the offensive end. We missed 40 shots and got 8 back w/ offensive boards. They missed 49 shots and got 10 back w/ offensive boards.

But, we didn't *defensive* rebound as effectively -- we missed 40 shots, got 8 back w/ offensive boards, and they got 29 of the 32 other misses off the glass. But, they missed 49 shots, got 10 back on O boards: yet we only got 33 of those 39 other misses.

The big problem, however, was turnovers: that's how they got almost all those extra shots! 24 Wizards TOs to their 10.

The Boston game was similar: we gave them 9 extra shots, because we had 7 more TOs than they did and we didn't rebound on the defensive end.

We squeezed out a 1-point win in Orlando -- but we were lucky; they put us on the FT line 13 more times than they got there. But we gave them 16 more shots than we took.

In Milwaukee, we had one of the most efficient offensive games I could imagine: 68 shots and 44 FTs got us 118 points. Yet we only won by 5 points. More turnovers than Milwaukee and poor defensive rebounding.

Only the NY loss, where we shot unbelievably badly, and the OKC loss where we mailed it in don't reflect this problem.

The Spurs game actually illustrates the same issue, except in the opposite direction: we won by 3 points. Why? Because we turned it over 10 times less than SA.

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