Official Draft Thread 2015-16

[BfB]

Ingrim will never have two key things: Weight or explosiveness

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnMrZyQFEjY[/youtube]

I said explosiveness. He's long, his hand can get high above the rim - thats why his body control and touch give him the ability to finish shots in the lane so well.

Explosiveness is about the speed of your first step and the speed at which you get off the ground. That video actually outlines those two weaknesses quite well. Ingrim has pretty slow feet and does not get off the ground quickly - doesn't really have a great vert either, but his length pretty much negates that.

Look at all the great slashers in the league - they "explode" to the rim, blowing past their defender with their first step and/or beating them in the race up to the rim.

The rim is always 10 feet high, no matter how high you jump. Getting to 10 feet first is what counts. If you want to use a 12 foot reach you have to "turn the corner", keep your line to the basket with balance while under heavy contact, and then elevate for the jam.

Ingrim has insanely large strides, so he has a wierd/crazy compensation method to get around people instead of blowing by them - but this will take more time to develop as he'll have to use his body to knock the other guy off of him as he forces his way into the lane.

He's going to take a patient approach with the right team.

[peachbucket]

Ingrim will never have two key things: Weight or explosiveness

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnMrZyQFEjY[/youtube]

I said explosiveness. He's long, his hand can get high above the rim - thats why his body control and touch give him the ability to finish shots in the lane so well.

Explosiveness is about the speed of your first step and the speed at which you get off the ground. That video actually outlines those two weaknesses quite well. Ingrim has pretty slow feet and does not get off the ground quickly - doesn't really have a great vert either, but his length pretty much negates that.

Look at all the great slashers in the league - they "explode" to the rim, blowing past their defender with their first step and/or beating them in the race up to the rim.

The rim is always 10 feet high, no matter how high you jump. Getting to 10 feet first is what counts. If you want to use a 12 foot reach you have to "turn the corner", keep your line to the basket with balance while under heavy contact, and then elevate for the jam.

Ingrim has insanely large strides, so he has a wierd/crazy compensation method to get around people instead of blowing by them - but this will take more time to develop as he'll have to use his body to knock the other guy off of him as he forces his way into the lane.

He's going to take a patient approach with the right team.

It doesn't take a mathematician to know his max vertical is well over 40 inches from that video. If that's not a great vert then you must be living on the moon

[Kenhov]

Ingram has a smoothness reminiscent of Pierce.

He just needs to bulk and then he will likely be unstoppable once he develops.

[brackdan70]

Wayne Selden Jr. destroyed my Beavers, no pun intended.
on the season FG% 0.560, 3pt% 0.595 on 5.3 attempts. That is not a typo!!! this guy is really coming around.

[BfB]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnMrZyQFEjY[/youtube]

I said explosiveness. He's long, his hand can get high above the rim - thats why his body control and touch give him the ability to finish shots in the lane so well.

Explosiveness is about the speed of your first step and the speed at which you get off the ground. That video actually outlines those two weaknesses quite well. Ingrim has pretty slow feet and does not get off the ground quickly - doesn't really have a great vert either, but his length pretty much negates that.

Look at all the great slashers in the league - they "explode" to the rim, blowing past their defender with their first step and/or beating them in the race up to the rim.

The rim is always 10 feet high, no matter how high you jump. Getting to 10 feet first is what counts. If you want to use a 12 foot reach you have to "turn the corner", keep your line to the basket with balance while under heavy contact, and then elevate for the jam.

Ingrim has insanely large strides, so he has a wierd/crazy compensation method to get around people instead of blowing by them - but this will take more time to develop as he'll have to use his body to knock the other guy off of him as he forces his way into the lane.

He's going to take a patient approach with the right team.

It doesn't take a mathematician to know his max vertical is well over 40 inches from that video. If that's not a great vert then you must be living on the moon

Ughh...this is what is so frustrating - stop looking at his hand. I doubt his feet are even 30 inches off the ground there - you can't put a yard stick between the soles of his feet and the ground - your vert is measured from your arm raised flat footer to where you can touch on the jump - he's long, he can get 12 feet up, but thats not his vert.

Aside from that I was talking about explosiveness, which is "burst" not vert or reach. Terminology counts boys and girls.

[BfB]

Wayne Selden Jr. destroyed my Beavers, no pun intended.
on the season FG% 0.560, 3pt% 0.595 on 5.3 attempts. That is not a typo!!! this guy is really coming around.

No way you get away with this without comment! Would you say he violated your Beavers?

[peachbucket]

I said explosiveness. He's long, his hand can get high above the rim - thats why his body control and touch give him the ability to finish shots in the lane so well.

Explosiveness is about the speed of your first step and the speed at which you get off the ground. That video actually outlines those two weaknesses quite well. Ingrim has pretty slow feet and does not get off the ground quickly - doesn't really have a great vert either, but his length pretty much negates that.

Look at all the great slashers in the league - they "explode" to the rim, blowing past their defender with their first step and/or beating them in the race up to the rim.

The rim is always 10 feet high, no matter how high you jump. Getting to 10 feet first is what counts. If you want to use a 12 foot reach you have to "turn the corner", keep your line to the basket with balance while under heavy contact, and then elevate for the jam.

Ingrim has insanely large strides, so he has a wierd/crazy compensation method to get around people instead of blowing by them - but this will take more time to develop as he'll have to use his body to knock the other guy off of him as he forces his way into the lane.

He's going to take a patient approach with the right team.

It doesn't take a mathematician to know his max vertical is well over 40 inches from that video. If that's not a great vert then you must be living on the moon

Ughh...this is what is so frustrating - stop looking at his hand. I doubt his feet are even 30 inches off the ground there - you can't put a yard stick between the soles of his feet and the ground - your vert is measured from your arm raised flat footer to where you can touch on the jump - he's long, he can get 12 feet up, but thats not his vert.

Aside from that I was talking about explosiveness, which is "burst" not vert or reach. Terminology counts boys and girls.

Ok, maybe you do have to be a mathematician. His standing reach is 9"2". That means he needs a 46" vertical to touch the top of the backboard which he looks damn close to doing in that video.

[165bows]

Any insight on Luwawu from our European posters (or otherwise)?

If he is what draft express says he is, he should probably be top ten and likely ahead of Murray, who looks like he won't be anything on D.

[No-Man]

He is still jacking up too many shots and he plays in a farming type of team (owned by an agent who brings young players and try to pump their value) but yeah, the kid looks good, athletic, good size, can shot, pass, defend, long, really intriguing.

I really like Dedric Lawson by the way.

[Murta]

Any insight on Luwawu from our European posters (or otherwise)?

If he is what draft express says he is, he should probably be top ten and likely ahead of Murray, who looks like he won't be anything on D.

Lemme quote myself:

Luwawu (turning heads right now, athletic with skill, could end up top 8, reminds me of Bradley Beal lite)

Told ya about Luwawu 2 weeks ago, if he keeps this up, he's going to be a top 8 pick. That combo of shooting, court vision and athleticism is rare.
The 2 questions about him are if his shooting is a fluke (before this season his rep was one of a bad-mediocre shooter) and whether he can improve his handle because it's kinda stiff now.

Except his ball handling which is bad, his shooting, court vision, athleticism, physique and defensive ability are all above average and he can be a well-rounded player. Luwawu reminds me of Alec Burks from Utah.

[165bows]

Any insight on Luwawu from our European posters (or otherwise)?

If he is what draft express says he is, he should probably be top ten and likely ahead of Murray, who looks like he won't be anything on D.

Lemme quote myself:

Luwawu (turning heads right now, athletic with skill, could end up top 8, reminds me of Bradley Beal lite)

Told ya about Luwawu 2 weeks ago, if he keeps this up, he's going to be a top 8 pick. That combo of shooting, court vision and athleticism is rare.
The 2 questions about him are if his shooting is a fluke (before this season his rep was one of a bad-mediocre shooter) and whether he can improve his handle because it's kinda stiff now.

Except his ball handling which is bad, his shooting, court vision, athleticism, physique and defensive ability are all above average and he can be a well-rounded player. Luwawu reminds me of Alec Burks from Utah.

Looks very similar to a bigger Shumpert to me. Same look physically, decent outside shooters, weak inside the arc scorer, good value on D. Just from what little I've seen.

[165bows]

He is still jacking up too many shots and he plays in a farming type of team (owned by an agent who brings young players and try to pump their value) but yeah, the kid looks good, athletic, good size, can shot, pass, defend, long, really intriguing.

I really like Dedric Lawson by the way.

I will keep an eye out, not familiar with him. How is he on defense?
Edit- will definitely check him out. Basically a HS senior doing impressive things in D1 on really high usage. Nice sleeper.

[No-Man]

I dont know if he will declare, but he is long, super young, efficient, and has a good moves, he is cut by the Tobias Harris and TJ Warren mold.

[165bows]

I dont know if he will declare, but he is long, super young, efficient, and has a good moves, he is cut by the Tobias Harris and TJ Warren mold.

Watched a few videos of him, those sound like good comps from what I could see. First thing that popped into my head was Joe Johnson but Harris is better. Almost a little Eric Williams with better length vibe to his build, too.

[Pacino62]

While your watching Kris Dunn keep your eye out for Ben Bentil he's coming on strong and has an NBA body now.His inside outside skills are improving at a quantum rate

I'll say this about Bentil. Follow PC closely and have gone to 3 games so far this season. Everyone always says Dunn this and Dunn that. I love Dunn as much as anyone. However, Bentil is no slouch. Yesterday, they looked lost without Dunn and Bentil (illness and ankle). They were down by 10-13 the entire first half. However, Bentil decided to suit up with 3-4 minutes let in the first half. They erased the deficit and in the second half, built a double digit lead of their own. He's a game changer defensively at the collegiate level. His presence changed every aspect of that game. He's also ferocious. Now, I have no idea how his game would translate in the pros. I'll leave that to others on this board.

[Duke4life831]

Ingram has the frame to put on weight.

He has a Durant vibe about him with the smoothness of Paul Pierce. Very odd mix but thats what I see. He plays at a very controlled pace.

Whilst all eyes on Simmons I wouldnt be surprised if Ainge is really tracking Ingram the most. Unlike Simmons he canty come in from day one and contribute but I think he will feature the most development as a NBA player.

Ya he does have the body to put weight on. Also his dad is a big dude, I know that doesnt mean everything, but its nice to see people in his family that are thick and muscular.

[Duke4life831]

Tatum is really skilled, but nowhere near George in terms of raw athletic ability.
not so high on him honestly.

Completely different players at this stage of their careers. Tatum is the most skilled 17 year old I have ever seen at his height. I think he is going to dominate college ball. When it comes to NBA, not to sure. He isnt the greatest athlete and especially at the 3, you need to be pretty damn athletic. But maybe he will be skilled enough where he can make up for it

[BfB]

Tatum is really skilled, but nowhere near George in terms of raw athletic ability.
not so high on him honestly.

Completely different players at this stage of their careers. Tatum is the most skilled 17 year old I have ever seen at his height. I think he is going to dominate college ball. When it comes to NBA, not to sure. He isnt the greatest athlete and especially at the 3, you need to be pretty damn athletic. But maybe he will be skilled enough where he can make up for it

Man, we are in a strange place here with Ingrim and Tatum...

I've watched Tatum in person at least a dozen times, front and center. The kid personifies "smooth athlete". He's plenty explosive when he wants/needs to be. That's the way Paul George played most of the time before really becoming agressive - he used his skill much more than his power early on.

Tatum may lack the max vert of George, but to me their total packages are negligibly different - their scoring prowess comes from their ability to shoot, intelligence/instincts settingmup their moves, and the body control/balance necessary to get off great shots on tough set ups.

Ingrim has ungodly length and I certainly need to watch him more as I am way more familiar with Tatum's game, but I see Tatum as having superior basketball skills/athleticism package at this point and an easily projectable 235 frame, which would make him a terror as a 3.

Ingrim is still a money J away from being that uber-player, I have no such concerns with Tatum...that's just me though.

[Duke4life831]

Tatum is really skilled, but nowhere near George in terms of raw athletic ability.
not so high on him honestly.

Completely different players at this stage of their careers. Tatum is the most skilled 17 year old I have ever seen at his height. I think he is going to dominate college ball. When it comes to NBA, not to sure. He isnt the greatest athlete and especially at the 3, you need to be pretty damn athletic. But maybe he will be skilled enough where he can make up for it

Man, we are in a strange place here with Ingrim and Tatum...

I've watched Tatum in person at least a dozen times, front and center. The kid personifies "smooth athlete". He's plenty explosive when he wants/needs to be. That's the way Paul George played most of the time before really becoming agressive - he used his skill much more than his power early on.

Tatum may lack the max vert of George, but to me their total packages are negligibly different - their scoring prowess comes from their ability to shoot, intelligence/instincts settingmup their moves, and the body control/balance necessary to get off great shots on tough set ups.

Ingrim has ungodly length and I certainly need to watch him more as I am way more familiar with Tatum's game, but I see Tatum as having superior basketball skills/athleticism package at this point and an easily projectable 235 frame, which would make him a terror as a 3.

Ingrim is still a money J away from being that uber-player, I have no such concerns with Tatum...that's just me though.

I should've worded it a little different. I think Tatum moves extremely well for his size, so I agree with the smoothness part, I do question his explosion though. Now this is from watching games on TV and online. So if in person you think different, I'd side with your opinion. You can definitely get a better feel for that stuff in person. As a Duke fan, I've been a massive Tatum fan for a long time, he was the most wanted recruit for me ever. I think his skill level is just off the charts, so I won't be disappointed if I an wrong about his explosiveness.

When it comes to Ingram he's a sneaky athlete. I think cause his frame it doesn't look as impressive, I don't know. But the kid has a surprisingly quick first step for his size and in the open floor the kid can run. His handles are good for his size but gets caught dribbling to high sometimes. And I agree if he gets his jumper down he has scary potential. He has great touch around the rim. I do question if his jumper ever does become consistent (around 60% FT shooter). If I was a GM and I was picking between Tatum and Ingram, I'm choosing Tatum with no hesitation.

[jmr07019]

I said explosiveness. He's long, his hand can get high above the rim - thats why his body control and touch give him the ability to finish shots in the lane so well.

Explosiveness is about the speed of your first step and the speed at which you get off the ground. That video actually outlines those two weaknesses quite well. Ingrim has pretty slow feet and does not get off the ground quickly - doesn't really have a great vert either, but his length pretty much negates that.

Look at all the great slashers in the league - they "explode" to the rim, blowing past their defender with their first step and/or beating them in the race up to the rim.

The rim is always 10 feet high, no matter how high you jump. Getting to 10 feet first is what counts. If you want to use a 12 foot reach you have to "turn the corner", keep your line to the basket with balance while under heavy contact, and then elevate for the jam.

Ingrim has insanely large strides, so he has a wierd/crazy compensation method to get around people instead of blowing by them - but this will take more time to develop as he'll have to use his body to knock the other guy off of him as he forces his way into the lane.

He's going to take a patient approach with the right team.

It doesn't take a mathematician to know his max vertical is well over 40 inches from that video. If that's not a great vert then you must be living on the moon

Ughh...this is what is so frustrating - stop looking at his hand. I doubt his feet are even 30 inches off the ground there - you can't put a yard stick between the soles of his feet and the ground - your vert is measured from your arm raised flat footer to where you can touch on the jump - he's long, he can get 12 feet up, but thats not his vert.

Aside from that I was talking about explosiveness, which is "burst" not vert or reach. Terminology counts boys and girls.

You're wrong accept it and move on. His standing reach is 9'2''. The top of the backboard is 13'. His vert is above 40" and vertical is ALWAYS associated with explosion.