Hassan Whiteside: Road To The Max

[RexBoyWonder]

Q: I'm sure you're being bombarded by questions regarding the Chris Sheridan article and I know you've explained the Heat's cap situation in the past, but I think it might be best to refresh your readers on next summer's situation. The Sheridan article claims that if the Heat don't renounce Dwyane Wade's rights then we can't sign Whiteside for more than $8 million. While this is true, we would more than likely renounce Wade's rights to get more cap space correct? This would leave us with something along the lines of $42 million in cap space to re-sign Whiteside, Wade and whoever else? -- Andrew, Miami.

A: You don't have to renounce anyone. You could simply sign Wade to a new deal first, thereby eliminating his cap hold. My math is a bit lower than yours than when it comes to what the Heat would have for free agents, with that number around $37 million. But I don't think there is anything near a definitive read on Hassan's market price at this stage, nor do we know how low Wade would go in exchange for more years and the possibility to play alongside an outside free agent that he finds appealing. I still believe that if Wade and Whiteside are re-signed, there will be nothing close to ample funds for a top-tier free agent, let alone a max-level talent. But, who knows, maybe someone takes Josh McRoberts for a draft pick. To refresh (I think this is what you were looking for): Bosh, Dragic, McRoberts, Winslow and the Tyler Johnson cap hold put the Heat at about $50 million against a 2016-17 cap projected at about $89 million. Then there are cap holds that you have to figure in. So even if you put Wade at a 50-percent cut to $10 million and Whiteside at a bargain $15 million (highly unlikely), that still leaves only about $12 million to finish off the rest of the roster. Wade does not have to be "renounced," but rather simply re-signed first to make the math work. If that is the math the Heat choose. People, it's still early. And there are so many other permutations possible, including the aforementioned McRoberts trade option or even moving Dragic

Trade Mcbob

Whiteside 17
Wade 12 (3/4 years)
Batum 15
Win

[QUIZ]

Q: I'm sure you're being bombarded by questions regarding the Chris Sheridan article and I know you've explained the Heat's cap situation in the past, but I think it might be best to refresh your readers on next summer's situation. The Sheridan article claims that if the Heat don't renounce Dwyane Wade's rights then we can't sign Whiteside for more than $8 million. While this is true, we would more than likely renounce Wade's rights to get more cap space correct? This would leave us with something along the lines of $42 million in cap space to re-sign Whiteside, Wade and whoever else? -- Andrew, Miami.

A: You don't have to renounce anyone. You could simply sign Wade to a new deal first, thereby eliminating his cap hold. My math is a bit lower than yours than when it comes to what the Heat would have for free agents, with that number around $37 million. But I don't think there is anything near a definitive read on Hassan's market price at this stage, nor do we know how low Wade would go in exchange for more years and the possibility to play alongside an outside free agent that he finds appealing. I still believe that if Wade and Whiteside are re-signed, there will be nothing close to ample funds for a top-tier free agent, let alone a max-level talent. But, who knows, maybe someone takes Josh McRoberts for a draft pick. To refresh (I think this is what you were looking for): Bosh, Dragic, McRoberts, Winslow and the Tyler Johnson cap hold put the Heat at about $50 million against a 2016-17 cap projected at about $89 million. Then there are cap holds that you have to figure in. So even if you put Wade at a 50-percent cut to $10 million and Whiteside at a bargain $15 million (highly unlikely), that still leaves only about $12 million to finish off the rest of the roster. Wade does not have to be "renounced," but rather simply re-signed first to make the math work. If that is the math the Heat choose. People, it's still early. And there are so many other permutations possible, including the aforementioned McRoberts trade option or even moving Dragic

Trade Mcbob

Whiteside 17
Wade 12 (3/4 years)
Batum 15
Win

Thats a treadmill. Riley doesn't build treadmills Rex you know this. Its like the Mercedes commercial "the best or nothing".

[RexBoyWonder]

Q: I'm sure you're being bombarded by questions regarding the Chris Sheridan article and I know you've explained the Heat's cap situation in the past, but I think it might be best to refresh your readers on next summer's situation. The Sheridan article claims that if the Heat don't renounce Dwyane Wade's rights then we can't sign Whiteside for more than $8 million. While this is true, we would more than likely renounce Wade's rights to get more cap space correct? This would leave us with something along the lines of $42 million in cap space to re-sign Whiteside, Wade and whoever else? -- Andrew, Miami.

A: You don't have to renounce anyone. You could simply sign Wade to a new deal first, thereby eliminating his cap hold. My math is a bit lower than yours than when it comes to what the Heat would have for free agents, with that number around $37 million. But I don't think there is anything near a definitive read on Hassan's market price at this stage, nor do we know how low Wade would go in exchange for more years and the possibility to play alongside an outside free agent that he finds appealing. I still believe that if Wade and Whiteside are re-signed, there will be nothing close to ample funds for a top-tier free agent, let alone a max-level talent. But, who knows, maybe someone takes Josh McRoberts for a draft pick. To refresh (I think this is what you were looking for): Bosh, Dragic, McRoberts, Winslow and the Tyler Johnson cap hold put the Heat at about $50 million against a 2016-17 cap projected at about $89 million. Then there are cap holds that you have to figure in. So even if you put Wade at a 50-percent cut to $10 million and Whiteside at a bargain $15 million (highly unlikely), that still leaves only about $12 million to finish off the rest of the roster. Wade does not have to be "renounced," but rather simply re-signed first to make the math work. If that is the math the Heat choose. People, it's still early. And there are so many other permutations possible, including the aforementioned McRoberts trade option or even moving Dragic

Trade Mcbob

Whiteside 17
Wade 12 (3/4 years)
Batum 15
Win

Thats a treadmill. Riley doesn't build treadmills Rex you know this. Its like the Mercedes commercial "the best or nothing".

What are you talking about. How is this :

Dragic
Wade
Batum
Bosh
Whiteside

With TJ, J-Rich, Stokes, and maybe Green off the bench.

Whiteside, TJ and Winslow improving rapidly, Batum nailing 3's, and more chemistry in year 2 of this core.

Treadmill? That's the favorite to win the east next year.

[QUIZ]

Trade Mcbob

Whiteside 17
Wade 12 (3/4 years)
Batum 15
Win

Thats a treadmill. Riley doesn't build treadmills Rex you know this. Its like the Mercedes commercial "the best or nothing".

What are you talking about. How is this :

Dragic
Wade
Batum
Bosh
Whiteside

With TJ, J-Rich, Stokes, and maybe Green.

Whiteside, TJ and Winslow improving, Batum nailing 3's, and more chemistry.

Treadmill? That's the favorite to win the east next year.

With Wade 34 turning 35? Could that team take down LeBron and win the East? Yeah. But the finals? Winning titles takes a lot of luck in the form of health and match ups.

Even if we agree that, that team looks good on paper the window for it to win is incredibly small, about 1-2 years depending on how Wade's health goes as well as how far Whiteside and Dragic progress.

Now I'm not saying that I wouldn't be happy with that team, I'm saying that it doesn't have the look of something Riley would be content with putting together especially at the tail end of his career. You've been following the Heat long enough I'm sure you know what I'm talking about. Look at all the crazy trade talks we're already hearing.

[RexBoyWonder]

Thats a treadmill. Riley doesn't build treadmills Rex you know this. Its like the Mercedes commercial "the best or nothing".

What are you talking about. How is this :

Dragic
Wade
Batum
Bosh
Whiteside

With TJ, J-Rich, Stokes, and maybe Green.

Whiteside, TJ and Winslow improving, Batum nailing 3's, and more chemistry.

Treadmill? That's the favorite to win the east next year.

With Wade 34 turning 35? Could that team take down LeBron and win the East? Yeah. But the finals? Winning titles takes a lot of luck in the form of health and match ups.

Even if we agree that, that team looks good on paper the window for it to win is incredibly small, about 1-2 years depending on how Wade's health goes as well as how far Whiteside and Dragic progress.

Now I'm not saying that I wouldn't be happy with that team, I'm saying that it doesn't have the look of something Riley would be content with putting together especially at the tail end of his career. You've been following the Heat long enough I'm sure you know what I'm talking about. Look at all the crazy trade talks we're already hearing.

Talk about Cousins and Durant is fine and dandy, but my scenario is X100 more likely IMO.

it's a 1-2 window with Wade and then we have to retool the wing (Unless Justise really takes off as a scorer) but we'll have a bunch of great young pieces (Batum just turned 27, game will age well) and Bosh's game ageing well too like Dirk's. We're not killing our future here.

You said it yourself, winning it all takes luck. And you said it yourself, this team can beat the Cavs in ECF. You can't pass that potential up for some grandiose dream about a new super stacked superteam led by the next MVP.

No, you go to ECF, get pass the Cavs, and then hope for the best. Anything can happen in a 7 game series. This team can be 1 Curry's flu away from a championship.

ECF team = good enough to go for it.

[GameTime_3]

Dream;

Trade; Chris Bosh-Winslow-Josh R for Cousins
Sign Hassan for 14 million
Resign Wade for 2-3yr 12 million
Sign Durant for MAX

Hassan
Cousins
Durant
Wade
Goran

Green-Ty Johnson-Bird(Resign minimum)-McBob

[RexBoyWonder]

Dream;

Trade; Chris Bosh-Winslow-Josh R for Cousins
Sign Hassan for 14 million
Resign Wade for 2-3yr 12 million
Sign Durant for MAX

Hassan
Cousins
Durant
Wade
Goran

Green-Ty Johnson-Bird(Resign minimum)-McBob

Bosh is much better fit with this team then Cousins

[Rock Hardy]

I'm not sure why Durant seems so implausible. He's on a team that has a closed window in the West, and his hometown team is tangibly worse than ours. He wants a championship, and Riley can convince Durant that he improves our chances of getting one.

I don't see KD going to Washington at all. That's as dead end a move as any. I can see him sticking it out with OKC though. Still, it's not a long shot by any means, IMO.

[Hoops23]

How about a trade of Cousin. Rondo & Caron for Hassan, Dragic, Birdman & McBob?

with the Heat's cap space for next summer, they can add a PG like Conley or sign back Rondo, Wade, a max free agent like KD or maybe DeRozan...

[GameTime_3]

Dream;

Trade; Chris Bosh-Winslow-Josh R for Cousins
Sign Hassan for 14 million
Resign Wade for 2-3yr 12 million
Sign Durant for MAX

Hassan
Cousins
Durant
Wade
Goran

Green-Ty Johnson-Bird(Resign minimum)-McBob

Bosh is much better fit with this team then Cousins

I would agree but Bosh isn't worth his contract at this point and Cousin is 8 million cheaper than an inconsistent Bosh. To often, Bosh isnt one of the best players on the court. Cousins on most nights shows he is...I'll take my chances with younger and cheaper option. I loved BOSH during big 3. I thought he was huge fur us but as the man, he has taken several steps back. At this point, I would take Hassan 12-14 million over Bosh 23-25 million.

[Hoops23]

Dream;

Trade; Chris Bosh-Winslow-Josh R for Cousins
Sign Hassan for 14 million
Resign Wade for 2-3yr 12 million
Sign Durant for MAX

Hassan
Cousins
Durant
Wade
Goran

Green-Ty Johnson-Bird(Resign minimum)-McBob

Cousin and Whiteside are both center, I doubt the chemistry both playing together. Both are character guy..

[gom]

Dream;

Trade; Chris Bosh-Winslow-Josh R for Cousins
Sign Hassan for 14 million
Resign Wade for 2-3yr 12 million
Sign Durant for MAX

Hassan
Cousins
Durant
Wade
Goran

Green-Ty Johnson-Bird(Resign minimum)-McBob

Where do I start?

1. Offering 12 million to Wade is insulting.

2. Whiteside's Max is $20.9M, so why will he sign for 14? Here is a list of the available free agents next off seasons. Teams have about a billion dollars in money to spend:

http://www.basketballinsiders.com/projecting-2015-2016-max-salary-tiers/

3. Also your salaries don't match in the Sacramento trade. You have to bring salary back too because aside from Rondo and Eric Moreland, Sacramento doesn't have expirings.

4. Also you're trading Winslow. Are you high?

5. You also won't have cap space to sign Durant. 37-26 = 11. Unless you think he'll play for 11M.

How about a trade of Cousin. Rondo & Caron for Hassan, Dragic, Birdman & McBob?

with the Heat's cap space for next summer, they can add a PG like Conley or sign back Rondo, Wade, a max free agent like KD or maybe DeRozan...

You won't have bird rights for Rondo. Caron is guaranteed next year so he counts against cap. Conley is a free agent. His max is 25 million and he's 29 years old. I think he'll want a pretty decent salary. Where will you find the cap space? Rondo (after a successful half season in Sacramento) will also get a decent contract.

Essentially you are giving up Dragic (who we signed to a very decent contract and spent 2 first round picks to secure) & Hassan for Cousins. That's not very good strategy.

Some of these ideas are not very well thought out.

Also:

I would agree but Bosh isn't worth his contract at this point and Cousin is 8 million cheaper than an inconsistent Bosh. To often, Bosh isnt one of the best players on the court. Cousins on most nights shows he is...I'll take my chances with younger and cheaper option. I loved BOSH during big 3. I thought he was huge fur us but as the man, he has taken several steps back. At this point, I would take Hassan 12-14 million over Bosh 23-25 million.

Chris Bosh: PER 21.9, 1.4 DWS, 2.1 OWS, .576 TS
Cousins: PER 22.5, 0.6 DWS, 0.9 OWS, .526 TS

Cousins has more ppg because he is one of Sacramento's only scoring threats. It's him or Rudy Gay usually that has to make the play. We have many more options and it reduces Bosh's numbers. That's a good thing. Bosh is better for us.

Also, Bosh's maximum as of next year is $29,339,763, so his contract is already reflecting a discount of nearly 6 million dollars less than the new max. Also note that if he were to sign in 2017-8 when the salary cap is $108,000,000, the max salary would be $35603000.

All max contracts are not equal. Bosh's salary for the next few years:

$23,741,060 $25,289,390 $26,837,720

[Prince Ali]

Batum is Deng 3 years younger. Don't understand the fascination with him and QUIZ is right, if the prize FA of the summer is Nicolas Batum welcome to the treadmill.

[goodboy]

I swear gom recently turned super saiyan 3. Can't wait for the ape version.

[gom]

I swear gom recently turned super saiyan 3. Can't wait for the ape version.

I have a decidedly unconventional love of numbers, HWR.

[Hoops23]

You won't have bird rights for Rondo. Caron is guaranteed next year so he counts against cap. Conley is a free agent. His max is 25 million and he's 29 years old. I think he'll want a pretty decent salary. Where will you find the cap space? Rondo (after a successful half season in Sacramento) will also get a decent contract.

You dont need the bird rights on Rondo if Miami wants to resign him. They will use their cap space.
Caron has a player option for next season. And if he opt in (which I doubt if he doesn't get playing time), its not a big money to absorb if compared to McBob salary. Heat still add to their cap space.. Dragic and Cousin's salary for next year are almost the same, and cancel each other out. My trade creates additional $3m, at least.

Absolutely no way Conley received $25m, even with his current team. I think he's worth similar to the salary of Bledsoe or Knight, but a better fit with Miami than Dragic. Signing Conley for a starting salary at $13m and a max player for $23m (KD) and the remaining cap space be used for Wade is a good off-season for Miami next yr.

Essentially you are giving up Dragic (who we signed to a very decent contract and spent 2 first round picks to secure) & Hassan for Cousins. That's not very good strategy.

Cousin is the best player in the deal. He's worth more than Whiteside.
Essentially, the trade is like Cousin for Whiteside and two future 1st rounder plus the chance to get a better fit at PG next year's off-season while not worrying about Whiteside leaving for nothing or hampering the chance to add Durant and Wade back.

[gom]

You won't have bird rights for Rondo. Caron is guaranteed next year so he counts against cap. Conley is a free agent. His max is 25 million and he's 29 years old. I think he'll want a pretty decent salary. Where will you find the cap space? Rondo (after a successful half season in Sacramento) will also get a decent contract.

You dont need the bird rights on Rondo if Miami wants to resign him. They will use their cap space.
Caron has a player option for next season. And if he opt in (which I doubt if he doesn't get playing time), its not a big money to absorb if compared to McBob salary. Heat still add to their cap space.. Dragic and Cousin's salary for next year are almost the same, and cancel each other out. My trade creates additional $3m, at least.

Absolutely no way Conley received $25m, even with his current team. I think he's worth similar to the salary of Bledsoe or Knight, but a better fit with Miami than Dragic. Signing Conley for a starting salary at $13m and a max player for $23m (KD) and the remaining cap space be used for Wade is a good off-season for Miami next yr.

Essentially you are giving up Dragic (who we signed to a very decent contract and spent 2 first round picks to secure) & Hassan for Cousins. That's not very good strategy.

Cousin is the best player in the deal. He's worth more than Whiteside.
Essentially, the trade is like Cousin for Whiteside and two future 1st rounder plus the chance to get a better fit at PG next year's off-season while not worrying about Whiteside leaving for nothing or hampering the chance to add Durant and Wade back.

Here is the math: (I've ignored Rondo and Butler because Rondo is a UFA and Butler - if he takes the player option (which he might) will only screw us up worse)

PG: Josh Richardson (874,636)
SG: Tyler Johnson (cap hold = 1,180,431)
SF: Winslow (2,593,440)
PF: Bosh (23,741,060), McRoberts (5,782,450)
C: Cousins (15,851,950)
+ 7 placeholders of 543,471

= 55,139,144

Cap = 89M

Cap Space = 33,860,856

From which you must sign Wade and a Point Guard as well as 5 other players.

You are very optimistic if you think you get Conley for 15M in this NBA economy. If you look at what is being paid to Tristan Thompson and others, you will probably change your mind. Conley is a top notch point guard. In this article he is ranked right beside Goran:

http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/149746896/nba-point-guard-rankings-curry-paul-westbrook

Here Conley is ranked 5th:

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/12563832/nba-espn-nba-forecast-ranks-nba-starting-point-guards-no-1-chris-paul-no-30-dante-exum

I know it seems incredible, but Goran actually gave us a deal by signing 5/85. In the new NBA economy that is a bargain. Conley is not having a great year at Memphis. He might not get max of 25M. Maybe he'll get 20.

I don't think Wade settles for the difference.

Another thing:

Everyone views the Whiteside contract at 20.9M as a high-risk negative. Suppose it goes well. What kind of a trade asset would it be in a couple years? We would have basically created a max player from a D-league contract. We should not allow another team to benefit from us giving him a chance and teaching him to survive in the NBA. Teams without picks need to *create* value. We did it with Whiteside and TJ. We cannot give these assets up.

[Hoops23]

Here is the math: (I've ignored Rondo and Butler because Rondo is a UFA and Butler - if he takes the player option (which he might) will only screw us up worse)

PG: Josh Richardson (874,636)
SG: Tyler Johnson (cap hold = 1,180,431)
SF: Winslow (2,593,440)
PF: Bosh (23,741,060), McRoberts (5,782,450)
C: Cousins (15,851,950)
+ 7 placeholders of 543,471

= 55,139,144

Cap = 89M

Cap Space = 33,860,856

From which you must sign Wade and a Point Guard as well as 5 other players.

Why is McRoberts included? He's in my trade proposal that's why I said it adds another cap space. Check above.
How did you come up with 7 place holders?? The minimum roster is at 9 players, so it should be 4 place holders only.

PG: Josh Richardson (874,636)
SG: Tyler Johnson (cap hold = 1,180,431)
SF: Winslow (2,593,440)
PF: Bosh (23,741,060)
C: Cousins (15,756,438)
+ 4 placeholders of 543,471

= $46.319
@89m cap, thats $42.68m of cap space

BTW, example if you signed KD, then it leaves to 3 place holder and then add the $543,471 to the cap space after signing KD. Example if you have $42.68m of cap space minus $23m to a max player (KD maybe), that leaves you $19.68 (42.68-23) plus adding the place holder of $543,471 since the roster becomes 6 players after signing KD, so its $20.22m (19.68+.543,471) left to sign a PG and Wade

You are very optimistic if you think you get Conley for 15M in this NBA economy. If you look at what is being paid to Tristan Thompson and others, you will probably change your mind. Conley is a top notch point guard. In this article he is ranked right beside Goran:

http://www.sportsonearth.com/article/149746896/nba-point-guard-rankings-curry-paul-westbrook

Here Conley is ranked 5th:

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/12563832/nba-espn-nba-forecast-ranks-nba-starting-point-guards-no-1-chris-paul-no-30-dante-exum

I know it seems incredible, but Goran actually gave us a deal by signing 5/85. In the new NBA economy that is a bargain. Conley is not having a great year at Memphis. He might not get max of 25M. Maybe he'll get 20.

What!? Conley gets 20m.. Are you kidding me!!! You probably think that he'worth that much coz the cap space goes up... If ever he demands that much, the Heat will pass on him. By doing my deal, at least they let an over paid Dragic dealt for Cousins while making the two future picks dealt to Phoenix worth.

I doubt the credibility of those article coz I dont think Dragic is better than Lowry, Bledsoe, Lillard, D-Rose, Reggie Jackson. Besides, what to be consider is how a PG fits with the Heat system which I dont see at this point with Dragic and still hoping he does soon.

I don't think Wade settles for the difference.

That remains to be seen. History says, he did it in the past. And he did it during his prime, much more now he's on the decline.

Another thing:

Everyone views the Whiteside contract at 20.9M as a high-risk negative. Suppose it goes well. What kind of a trade asset would it be in a couple years? We would have basically created a max player from a D-league contract. We should not allow another team to benefit from us giving him a chance and teaching him to survive in the NBA. Teams without picks need to *create* value. We did it with Whiteside and TJ. We cannot give these assets up.

Whiteside will be overpaid at $20m, that is why if the market says that figure, much more the Heat needs to trade him. Not just that he's not worth that price but he hinder the Heat chance to add a max player plus Wade.

I believe and trust Pat Riley. He was able to convince Wade, Bosh & LBJ in the past.
So if he has enough cap space, I do believe he can convince a max player, Conley & Wade to sign. My optimistic came from my belief about Riley convincing power.

[3ballbomber]

Dream;

Trade; Chris Bosh-Winslow-Josh R for Cousins
Sign Hassan for 14 million
Resign Wade for 2-3yr 12 million
Sign Durant for MAX

Hassan
Cousins
Durant
Wade
Goran

Green-Ty Johnson-Bird(Resign minimum)-McBob

Hassan off the bench? Is he not a starting caliber player? Either you trade him for Cousins or we keep him as our starting center. Either way we don't give up on a player like Hassan and getting him to come off the bench would kill his spirit.

Bosh is a big part of this team. You can't merely trade vital pieces away just because of inconsistencies this early into the season. We may as well trade everybody since no one on this team has been consistent.

[QUIZ]

Dream;

Trade; Chris Bosh-Winslow-Josh R for Cousins
Sign Hassan for 14 million
Resign Wade for 2-3yr 12 million
Sign Durant for MAX

Hassan
Cousins
Durant
Wade
Goran

Green-Ty Johnson-Bird(Resign minimum)-McBob

Bosh is much better fit with this team then Cousins

I would agree but Bosh isn't worth his contract at this point and Cousin is 8 million cheaper than an inconsistent Bosh. To often, Bosh isnt one of the best players on the court. Cousins on most nights shows he is...I'll take my chances with younger and cheaper option. I loved BOSH during big 3. I thought he was huge fur us but as the man, he has taken several steps back. At this point, I would take Hassan 12-14 million over Bosh 23-25 million.

You shouldn't get too caught up in his salary. Yeah Bosh has a tendency to drift and disappear in certain games but he's having a really good year overall. His defense has been fantastic, his rebounding numbers are up even though his minutes are down and he's shooting a career high 38% from 3 while taking 4 of them a game. He has a PER of 21.4 and a TS% of 57.6% and I'd expect that to get even higher as his mid range shots start falling more consistently.

Bosh is a top 3 player at his position. Blake and AD are better than him but you could make a legitimate argument that he's better than LaMarcus Aldridge who's averaging 16pts 9rebs with a TS% of 51.6% and Kevin Love who's averaging 18pts 11rebs with a TS% of 56.6%. If you look at it that way he really isn't overpaid in todays market I think we just need to reassess what a contract like that nets you in todays NBA.

Damian Lillard and Carmelo Anthony both have the same contract that Bosh has and this time next year and even more so the year after that we'll start to see a bunch of average players getting paid more and more money. His contract will look fine in the grand scheme of things.