Kawhi Leonard vs. other top tier SF's this year

Fico92 · Post #1 » by **Fico92** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:45 am

After Kawhi completely dismantled Paul George tonight (held him to 1-14 shooting, 7 pts, while dominating the offensive end), I decided to look up some stats of Kawhi vs. other top tier SF's from this year and last. Kawhi has been dominating matchups this year vs. other top tier SF's.

Melo/Durant/PG/Butler Head2Head vs. Kawhi:
Pts/Reb/Ast/Stl/Blk/TO

Durant: 22/6/0/0/0/0/1 on 6/19 shooting
Melo: 19/7/2/1/0/1 on 4/17 shooting
Butler: 14/3/3/1/2/5 on 5/9 shooting
George: 7/7/6/1/2/6 on 1/14 shooting
Melo: 20/12/3/2/0/0 on 5/15 shooting
LeBron: 22/7/5/0/1/4 on 9/17 shooting
Combined: 17.3 PPG /7 Reb /3.1 Ast /.8 Stl/.8 Blk with 2.8 TO per game on 37% shooting.

Meanwhile, Kawhi has stepped up in these games significantly, putting up the following numbers vs. these players

32/8/0/3/2/3 on 13/22 shooting
18/14/1/2/4/2 on 8/16 shooting
25/8/3/2/2/2 on 9/21 shooting
24/6/5/3/0/0 on 10/19 shooting
19/12/0/2/2/1 on 8/19 shooting
20/10/5/1/2/4 on 6/14 shooting

23 PPG / 9.6 Reb / 2.3 Ast / 2 Stl / 2 blk with 2 TO per game on 49% shooting

This "system player" (as Durant said) has outplayed 4 of the premier SFs in the league so far this season, and led his team to the 2nd best record behind only a historic start by the Warriors.

thamadkant · Post #2 » by **thamadkant** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:57 am

Leonard is the modern day Pippen...

Pippen is one of my all time favorites and the way they play the game is similar. Pippen is the better play maker and dribbler, but scoring, rebounding, defense etc. Is spot on. Leonard's turn around and mid range is also slightly better than Pippen's and improving...

Paul George is also someone that resembles Pippen a bit, but Leonard's movement, motion etc. Pippen like.... Pippen is the better athlete though, freak 6'8 with 7'3 wingspan and elite athleticism/defense and play making skills.

jimbojones8 · Post #3 » by **jimbojones8** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:58 am

2.7 assists per game, lol he's a horrendous playmaker. He plays within an established system, doesn't have nearly as much responsibility as other elite SFs.

Slava · Post #4 » by **Slava** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 8:58 am

Disclaimer: Being a little nit picky

He's still struggling as the preliminary ballhandler in high screen situations and turning the ball over pretty frequently when given the ball at the top of the key but he has progressed so much in terms of his individual offense. He still gets a lot of his offense in catch and shoot situations from the Spurs offense which makes him seem very efficient but in the end he is a legit post up threat and has an array of moves like step backs, shot fakes and spins to get his jumper off or get a floater or hook shot in the lane.

Couple years ago I thought his ceiling would be as a high level 3 & D player but I didn't imagine this kind of offensive evolution from him.

yoyoboy · Post #5 » by **yoyoboy** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:10 am

I watched the Spurs-Pacers game, and while Kawhi did great against George individually, I don't think it can be understated how fantastic the Spurs' help defense on George was last night.

stitches · Post #6 » by **stitches** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:18 am

He guarded Hayward to his worst game of the season too - 4 pts (1/5 FG)... he's dominating everybody defensively. What a beast!

Prince12 · Post #7 » by **Prince12** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:32 am

Purely defensively what he is doing is amazing let alone getting it done on the other end. The spurs are an amazing 'team' but this guy is putting on a clinic so far. Pretty scary stuff..

Fico92 · Post #8 » by **Fico92** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:39 am

jimbojones8 wrote:2.7 assists per game, lol he's a horrendous playmaker. He plays within an established system, doesn't have nearly as much responsibility as other elite SFs.

Yet he significantly shuts down these other SF's and their playmaking ability, keeping them well below their season averages, while putting up at least, or better, numbers. That's what being a 2-way player will do for you...

picc · Post #9 » by **picc** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:39 am

With all due respect for Kawhi, he was not the reason PG shot so badly.

Fico92 · Post #10 » by **Fico92** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:04 am

picc wrote:With all due respect for Kawhi, he was not the reason PG shot so badly.

George (when guarded by Kawhi) was 1-11.
Excluding their first matchup in Kawhi's rookie year, Kawhi has held George to 37% shooting, while shooting over 50% from the field himself.

What was the reason for George shooting so badly in the past vs. Kawhi? I get if it's a one-time thing, but Kawhi consistently holds him to below his averages..

Phreak50 · Post #11 » by **Phreak50** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:09 am

jimbojones8 wrote:2.7 assists per game, lol he's a horrendous playmaker. He plays within an established system, doesn't have nearly as much responsibility as other elite SFs.

And yet if he didn't have the system and players around him and the green light to fire at will like PG (40% fg lol) he could be leading the league in scoring.

He isn't even that polished a scorer, isn't a great dribble and still very raw yet is doing what he is doing.

The guy is a beast on both ends.

RaptorsLife · Post #12 » by **RaptorsLife** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:18 am

Asts = Playmaking lol worst logic if you have a huge usage like hardan, MJ or Kobe you can get a assists. Kawhi is good plays in the system with passing. Elite in everything else

Prez · Post #13 » by **Prez** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:22 am

Fico92 wrote:This "system player" (as Durant said)

Kawhi is a beast right now, but just to point out...Durant's statement that Kawhi was a system player was from 2 years ago..right after the 2013-14 season. At the time that statement was a little sour and uncalled for....but somewhat accurate. The Kawhi of today is not at all the Kawhi of the 2013-14 season. Right now he's significantly better offensive weapon (brutally effective post game, automatic jumper, much sharper decision making, crisper movement on and off the ball, etc) than he was a couple years ago, when he absolutely benefited a lot from San Antonio's motion offense and plethora of ball handlers and high IQ playmakers. He flat out didn't have the huge burden offensively that other star wings had. He could fit into the box of San Antonio's offense and look damn good doing it, but he was just not some dynamic offensive weapon then. He has improved dramatically in the past couple seasons and has become a dynamic offensive weapon, but bringing up a criticism from when he was not nearly that is a bit disingenuous.

SOUL · Post #14 » by **SOUL** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:27 am

Pacers could've had both

Kabookalu · Post #15 » by **Kabookalu** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 10:57 am

SOUL wrote:Pacers could've had both

I don't think Leonard would be anywhere near as good with any other team than the Spurs.

Not to feed into the stigma that they can develop any player into a star, which I think is overstated, but they believed in him so much and did a magnificent job of mapping out his development. I don't think any other team would have taken Leonard as seriously as the Spurs did.

E-Balla · Post #16 » by **E-Balla** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 11:00 am

George didn't shoot bad because of Kawhi and if we're being honest he hacked both KD and Melo all game. Still nice numbers but in context of actually watching the games its kinda dishonest to say he's locked allnof them down.

picc · Post #17 » by **picc** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:01 pm

Fico92 wrote:George (when guarded by Kawhi) was 1-11.
Excluding their first matchup in Kawhi's rookie year, Kawhi has held George to 37% shooting, while shooting over 50% from the field himself.

I'm sure Kawhi has had some stellar defensive games against PG in the past. And I'm not saying he's not a great defender, its just I watched the game tonight and your statement that he "dismantled" him on defense isn't really true. The Spurs entire defense did a good job of collapsing on him, and he missed shots he normally makes. Kawhi was getting screened a lot anyway, so PG was more playing against the Spurs as a whole than against Leonard.

Kawhi contested some shots well, but no better than others that PG has scored on. I saw the Spurs games vs Durant and Melo, and those were times Kawhi definitely put the clamps on.

Tonight just wasn't one of them.

What was the reason for George shooting so badly in the past vs. Kawhi? I get if it's a one-time thing, but Kawhi consistently holds him to below his averages..

Like I said, I'm sure he's defended him excellently in the past. I really don't care about either of these players. Just giving my observations from tonight vis a vis your statement in the OP, which I felt was inaccurate.

Cuban_Linx · Post #18 » by **Cuban_Linx** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:33 pm

Phreak50 wrote:
jimbojones8 wrote:2.7 assists per game, lol he's a horrendous playmaker. He plays within an established system, doesn't have nearly as much responsibility as other elite SFs.

And yet if he didn't have the system and players around him and the green light to fire at will like PG (40% fg lol) he could be leading the league in scoring.

You just had to go over the top like this :crazy:

Kawhi is a great player, but c'mon let's not go overboard on his offense. His D is every bit as great as his reputation tho. Incredible defender.

Side beard · Post #19 » by **Side beard** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:53 pm

jimbojones8 wrote:2.7 assists per game, lol he's a horrendous playmaker. He plays within an established system, doesn't have nearly as much responsibility as other elite SFs.

Did you know Kawhi plays for the Spurs and Pop? Or are you flat out trolling and acting stupid?

franktony · Post #20 » by **franktony** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 12:56 pm

As a Spurs fan, I'd rather stay under the radar. I hate when one of our players get too much hype, even when deserve it.