Game 30: Phoenix Suns (12-17) @ Utah Jazz (11-14)

[Revived]

99% of a coaches job is communication. If they can't get their message across and make sure they players follow it it's their problem.

Whether you like it or not these players needs Thibs. They've gotten away with coasting for too long and Jeff is too nice.

For Thibs to come here, Sarver would need to sell the team (and that would be absolutely the best thing to probably ever happen to this franchise) but that's not going to happen.

[AtheJ415]

99% of a coaches job is communication. If they can't get their message across and make sure they players follow it it's their problem.

Whether you like it or not these players needs Thibs. They've gotten away with coasting for too long and Jeff is too nice.

For Thibs to come here, Sarver would need to sell the team (and that would be absolutely the best thing to probably ever happen to this franchise) but that's not going to happen.

Why is that? Does Thibs hate Sarver or something?

I'm pretty torn on Thibs. He's probably the disciplinarian coach we need, and our defense would certainly improve under him, but he plays guys insane minutes and there are better offensive coaches out there.

[Revived]

99% of a coaches job is communication. If they can't get their message across and make sure they players follow it it's their problem.

Whether you like it or not these players needs Thibs. They've gotten away with coasting for too long and Jeff is too nice.

For Thibs to come here, Sarver would need to sell the team (and that would be absolutely the best thing to probably ever happen to this franchise) but that's not going to happen.

Why is that? Does Thibs hate Sarver or something?

I'm pretty torn on Thibs. He's probably the disciplinarian coach we need, and our defense would certainly improve under him, but he plays guys insane minutes and there are better offensive coaches out there.

No but I personally don't think Sarver would hire a defensive guy like that. I bet he hates all coaches without the fast break offense philosophy because of the one horrible Terry Porter experience.

I think getting Thibs along with a good offensive assistant like Gentry who may be canned soon would be smart thing to do.

[bwgood77]

Agree with Matt and Nav..... No excuses. It is always the coaches fault. I am a coach and a teacher. I can't tell my AD and principal "well I tell them over and over, they just don't listen, so please give me players and students that listen." No, they will say you have to get this population of students and players to listen to you, if not, you are fired; or I could go to a school were the population listens no matter what......those are called gravy train schools and or players.

No excuses for Horny, he is teribble.

I hardly thing your hs coaching experience equates to a good comparison to the nba where you are playing against the best and smartest players in the world. Nobody has been able to coach the talented Kings squad to a winning record, even Karl who has taken the Sonics to the finals, the Bucks to the EC finals, coached a Nuggets team to far better records than their talent indicated, surprisingly getting the 3 seed not to long ago, etc

[bwgood77]

99% of a coaches job is communication. If they can't get their message across and make sure they players follow it it's their problem.

Whether you like it or not these players needs Thibs. They've gotten away with coasting for too long and Jeff is too nice.

For Thibs to come here, Sarver would need to sell the team (and that would be absolutely the best thing to probably ever happen to this franchise) but that's not going to happen.

Why is that? Does Thibs hate Sarver or something?

I'm pretty torn on Thibs. He's probably the disciplinarian coach we need, and our defense would certainly improve under him, but he plays guys insane minutes and there are better offensive coaches out there.

I wouldn't mind Thibs as an assistant, which is probably what he is best cut out to be. I don't think he should be deciding player's minutes and he isn't a good offensive play caller, but if he can come in, even under Horny and work on defensive principles with these guys that would be nice.

[NavLDO]

That's not entirely clear. From what I can tell he is a fairly good communicator. I have worked with people that you can tell them the same thing repeatedly that they need to do and they just are not good listeners or just forget when stressed or whatever the case may be. Being mean doesn't make you a better communicator imo.

But again, we have so many moving parts all the time, that chemistry is always going to be tough to build instantly.

Well, that's great that Horny's COMMUNICATING the right aspects, but unfortunately, he's not MOTIVATING the team to actually act/play based upon what he's coaching, and if he's failing in this area, then he's unfortunately, failing as a coach.

If you or others want to 'pin' our problems on the players, well, yes, you are correct if the 'teacher', in this case the coach, is providing the correct instruction, and the 'students', in this case, the players, are not responding appropriately by not effectively implementing the coach's instruction on the court, then the worst offenders need to be sat, or in extreme cases traded...OR, the coach needs to be changed to one that might be able to properly motivate the players to play how they are instructed to.

Either way, what's happening now is unacceptable. And if Horny is to be the 'scapegoat', then fine, but good luck in expecting any great miracle changes to happen unless about 3-4 players are also replaced. I personally, would get rid of these non-compliant players first and give Horny a chance to turn it around; and if not replacing Horny turns out to be the wrong choice, then replace Horny.

Sounds easy, right? Well, no, I get that it's not that easy, but for goodness sakes, do SOMETHING!

Agree with Matt and Nav..... No excuses. It is always the coaches fault. I am a coach and a teacher. I can't tell my AD and principal "well I tell them over and over, they just don't listen, so please give me players and students that listen." No, they will say you have to get this population of students and players to listen to you, if not, you are fired; or I could go to a school were the population listens no matter what......those are called gravy train schools and or players.

No excuses for Horny, he is teribble.

I agree with all but the last 4 words; Horny has proven to be a good coach. He didn't accidently win 48 games a couple of years ago, but that was with an up-and-coming PF in Morris; now he has 'disgruntled' and 'disinterested' Morris, with two other nice complimentary PFs in Leuer and Teletovic, but not a solid starting PF. I honestly believe that is the biggest factor.

[bwgood77]

I agree with all but the last 4 words; Horny has proven to be a good coach. He didn't accidently win 48 games a couple of years ago, but that was with an up-and-coming PF in Morris; now he has 'disgruntled' and 'disinterested' Morris, with two other nice complimentary PFs in Leuer and Teletovic, but not a solid starting PF. I honestly believe that is the biggest factor.

That and what is said in the article posted in one of the threads about the difference between Knight and Bledsoe in wins and losses, like a net rating difference of 25, which is crazy.

I think it's in the trade thread in the last couple of pages.

[JMac1]

Agree with Matt and Nav..... No excuses. It is always the coaches fault. I am a coach and a teacher. I can't tell my AD and principal "well I tell them over and over, they just don't listen, so please give me players and students that listen." No, they will say you have to get this population of students and players to listen to you, if not, you are fired; or I could go to a school were the population listens no matter what......those are called gravy train schools and or players.

No excuses for Horny, he is teribble.

I hardly thing your hs coaching experience equates to a good comparison to the nba where you are playing against the best and smartest players in the world. Nobody has been able to coach the talented Kings squad to a winning record, even Karl who has taken the Sonics to the finals, the Bucks to the EC finals, coached a Nuggets team to far better records than their talent indicated, surprisingly getting the 3 seed not to long ago, etc

I disagree and SF88 disagree.....so there's that.