Official Rap/Hip Hop Thread IV

[IllmaticHandler]

This is how you know the game is rigged for BS. There is no way that Back to Back should be a Grammy Nominated song. This is super weak. If it was not Drake, it would have never happened. A diss record getting a Grammy nomination. Mind u Songs on the level of Ether never even was considered for such an award.

[Knicksfan1992]

This is how you know the game is rigged for BS. There is no way that Back to Back should be a Grammy Nominated song. This is super weak. If it was not Drake, it would have never happened. A diss record getting a Grammy nomination. Mind u Songs on the level of Ether never even was considered for such an award.

Bro your first mistake is taking anything the Grammy's says about Hip-Hop seriously. They don't even televise the Rap awards.

[kane2021]

I know some of you look at Drake or Asap rocky as the greatest MC to ever be in show business but has rap really gone down the toilet or is it just a generational bias. I have tried to listen to rap today but it just doesn't do anything for me. I get more thrill listening to Vanilla Ice than I do listening to any of these rappers that these young cats are listening to now.

It's a bit of both, really. Part of it is definitely a generational bias, but part is also just the nature of the music itself.

Hip Hop was always a music of the "now", especially with its storytelling or picture painting nature. Whether it was Grandmaster Flash's 'The Message' or NWA's 'Straight Outta Compton' or Nas' 'Illmatic', all the way up & down the list, Hip Hop has been about painting a picture of an MC's locality at that moment. So now, young rappers are painting pictures about what they experience, which is obviously far away from what older heads did.

Creatively, Hip Hop peaked in the late 90s, when sonic superiority (thanks to big budgets) blended with full-force street-level creativity. Albums like Dre's '2001' or even Monch's 'Internal Affairs' were loud, punchy, clean, and at the same time creative and complicated. Really, Hip Hop had nowhere else to go but to regress to simpler music. Anymore creative, and it would have gone into unintelligible territory (I'm looking at you Common).

So Cash Money & No Limit came along, made it simple and club-oriented, and the rest is history. I don't know that Hip Hop will ever get back to its creative peak in the mid-late 90s, because if it does get back to that level, well most of that stuff has already been done & it'll just be a rehash. In the meantime we still have Jay Electronica... if he ever drops his album.

I agree with what you're saying. Especially with the no where else to go comment. I think the nba dunk contest is a very good way to make a comparison. There just comes a point in time where there is nothing left to do. Everything has been done. Once in a blue moon a special person comes along. But it's mostly just showmanship in between. It's not about the dunks or the music, it's about the character. And that's really what it boils down to. Characters playing to a crowd.

I also would like to add something to your points. Rap music is immature. It's never grown-up. It's stayed a particular age. So the generations grow older but the music stays young. And a new generation comes into that age. While the last one ends up being out of date.

And I think that's the biggest factor in why older hip hop heads just don't like the music today. It's geared for teenagers and people in their 20's. That's raps age bracket. There's some exceptions to the rule from time to time. But in general, that's what it is.

I was a major hip hop head in the 80's and 90's. Wrote produced recorded. I made about two albums for myself. And maybe three or four others for other people. I never thought I would out grow it. Figured I be a rap fan forever.

It's not the case. From time to time I hear something I like. Nothing I love. Even my old school stuff gets played out after almost 40 years. I don't like rap music today. Honestly most of it makes my skin crawl. It's almost embarrassing. I just cannot relate to a 20 year old kids way of thinking anymore. Im so far beyond that now it's just not possible. The silly lines and word play. The stupid trends. The lies. The boasting.

I don't want to get into a rant about it out of respect for those who are enjoying the music today. The music has definitely changed over the years. But so have the listeners. They've grown up and passed that phase of life. Priorities and views change as you get older. So I think it's almost impossible to relate to something that's so much younger.

I tell allot of younger people. They sound just like I did 20 years ago. I had stacks of cassettes, records, magazines. I was up on the latest. Knew about everyone. Would argue about who's better. I say listen man. It's not going to last. You're going to mature and this music won't. This music has been 20 years old for almost 40 years now. It's a young mans game.

[Clyde_Style]

I know some of you look at Drake or Asap rocky as the greatest MC to ever be in show business but has rap really gone down the toilet or is it just a generational bias. I have tried to listen to rap today but it just doesn't do anything for me. I get more thrill listening to Vanilla Ice than I do listening to any of these rappers that these young cats are listening to now.

It's a bit of both, really. Part of it is definitely a generational bias, but part is also just the nature of the music itself.

Hip Hop was always a music of the "now", especially with its storytelling or picture painting nature. Whether it was Grandmaster Flash's 'The Message' or NWA's 'Straight Outta Compton' or Nas' 'Illmatic', all the way up & down the list, Hip Hop has been about painting a picture of an MC's locality at that moment. So now, young rappers are painting pictures about what they experience, which is obviously far away from what older heads did.

Creatively, Hip Hop peaked in the late 90s, when sonic superiority (thanks to big budgets) blended with full-force street-level creativity. Albums like Dre's '2001' or even Monch's 'Internal Affairs' were loud, punchy, clean, and at the same time creative and complicated. Really, Hip Hop had nowhere else to go but to regress to simpler music. Anymore creative, and it would have gone into unintelligible territory (I'm looking at you Common).

So Cash Money & No Limit came along, made it simple and club-oriented, and the rest is history. I don't know that Hip Hop will ever get back to its creative peak in the mid-late 90s, because if it does get back to that level, well most of that stuff has already been done & it'll just be a rehash. In the meantime we still have Jay Electronica... if he ever drops his album.

I agree with what you're saying. Especially with the no where else to go comment. I think the nba dunk contest is a very good way to make a comparison. There just comes a point in time where there is nothing left to do. Everything has been done. Once in a blue moon a special person comes along. But it's mostly just showmanship in between. It's not about the dunks or the music, it's about the character. And that's really what it boils down to. Characters playing to a crowd.

I also would like to add something to your points. Rap music is immature. It's never grown-up. It's stayed a particular age. So the generations grow older but the music stays young. And a new generation comes into that age. While the last one ends up being out of date.

And I think that's the biggest factor in why older hip hop heads just don't like the music today. It's geared for teenagers and people in their 20's. That's raps age bracket. There's some exceptions to the rule from time to time. But in general, that's what it is.

I was a major hip hop head in the 80's and 90's. Wrote produced recorded. I made about two albums for myself. And maybe three or four others for other people. I never thought I would out grow it. Figured I be a rap fan forever.

It's not the case. From time to time I hear something I like. Nothing I love. Even my old school stuff gets played out after almost 40 years. I don't like rap music today. Honestly most of it makes my skin crawl. It's almost embarrassing. I just cannot relate to a 20 year old kids way of thinking anymore. Im so far beyond that now it's just not possible. The silly lines and word play. The stupid trends. The lies. The boasting.

I don't want to get into a rant about it out of respect for those who are enjoying the music today. The music has definitely changed over the years. But so have the listeners. They've grown up and passed that phase of life. Priorities and views change as you get older. So I think it's almost impossible to relate to something that's so much younger.

I tell allot of younger people. They sound just like I did 20 years ago. I had stacks of cassettes, records, magazines. I was up on the latest. Knew about everyone. Would argue about who's better. I say listen man. It's not going to last. You're going to mature and this music won't. This music has been 20 years old for almost 40 years now. It's a young mans game.

That was really interesting to read man. What happens to you now musically? Have you just become less sonically oriented in your life or do other genres speak to you now that didn't before?

One thing about hip hop as the bedrock of a musical education that might hold some back in terms of checking out new realities is what I call being a slave to the beat. I'm not a rap connossieur, but I always ended up finding my way to stuff that broke the tempo apart so there could be a real musical conversation, not just statements on top of a steady rhythm, going back to De La Soul and Guru.

Growing up I was a rock/punk guy of the 80s which brushed shoulders with hip hop in the streets and the city, but it still was basically a different culture at first until things started to finally bleed all together by the 90's and that was when anything that could be called "underground" got scouted for cash potential and that applied to all kinds of music at that point. I was in Seattle in 1989 so I saw all that "grunge" stuff get flipped into money fast once things broke nationwide.

With the internet, relatively tiny niches feed small groups and some musicians end up finding a way to make a living serving that really specialized community and then no one else knows who the hell they are and it doesn't feed into the bigger conversation about what is art. Which is weird because we've got access to so many kinds of music now because of the web, but it feels all scattered like a splatter painting.

Anyway, I think really good music is being made all the time, but it usually has nothing to do with what is popular or making money. It is almost like the best and most creative people do it for the love of it now and sometimes with luck they break through. But some musical movements seemed to be born in specific cities like NYC or London or Seattle and I don't know if physical communities built around a physical area may build into musical whole new artistic movements again like they once did. Everything feels kind of the same even if the menu is actually kind of more diverse now.

Did you ever listen Dylan by the way? I think he is perfect for lots of hip hop lovers to get into, but I don't see that is the case too often. To me he is kind of like one of the Godfathers to the rap lyric and I'm surprised this hasn't been picked up on much. Listen to his album Highway 61 Revisited and it is like living inside his head full of word jazz, honky tonk and a dash of R&B and a whole ton of not giving a damn what people think. It was rebellious stuff at the time and it is still fresh. Kind of like great hip hop.

[E-Balla]

Only the ignorant hate on this generation. You have kdot, cole, absoul, wale, mick jenkins, bada$$, Vince staples, logic, Q, big Sean all producing WORK. open the mind up

Yep. There's bad commercial rappers of almost every generation (the golden era of the 80s being the exception) people just forget about them no matter how many hits they have. Say what you want about Thug but Silkk went platinum and Thug hasn't come close.

[IllmaticHandler]

This is how you know the game is rigged for BS. There is no way that Back to Back should be a Grammy Nominated song. This is super weak. If it was not Drake, it would have never happened. A diss record getting a Grammy nomination. Mind u Songs on the level of Ether never even was considered for such an award.

Bro your first mistake is taking anything the Grammy's says about Hip-Hop seriously. They don't even televise the Rap awards.

Im not making no mistake. I already know this. But the point remains...this is cheesy even for the Grammys. I dont think is even his best song for the year. A large portion of what I read online feels the same way about the song being nominated. This some privileged ****.

[kane2021]

It's a bit of both, really. Part of it is definitely a generational bias, but part is also just the nature of the music itself.

Hip Hop was always a music of the "now", especially with its storytelling or picture painting nature. Whether it was Grandmaster Flash's 'The Message' or NWA's 'Straight Outta Compton' or Nas' 'Illmatic', all the way up & down the list, Hip Hop has been about painting a picture of an MC's locality at that moment. So now, young rappers are painting pictures about what they experience, which is obviously far away from what older heads did.

Creatively, Hip Hop peaked in the late 90s, when sonic superiority (thanks to big budgets) blended with full-force street-level creativity. Albums like Dre's '2001' or even Monch's 'Internal Affairs' were loud, punchy, clean, and at the same time creative and complicated. Really, Hip Hop had nowhere else to go but to regress to simpler music. Anymore creative, and it would have gone into unintelligible territory (I'm looking at you Common).

So Cash Money & No Limit came along, made it simple and club-oriented, and the rest is history. I don't know that Hip Hop will ever get back to its creative peak in the mid-late 90s, because if it does get back to that level, well most of that stuff has already been done & it'll just be a rehash. In the meantime we still have Jay Electronica... if he ever drops his album.

I agree with what you're saying. Especially with the no where else to go comment. I think the nba dunk contest is a very good way to make a comparison. There just comes a point in time where there is nothing left to do. Everything has been done. Once in a blue moon a special person comes along. But it's mostly just showmanship in between. It's not about the dunks or the music, it's about the character. And that's really what it boils down to. Characters playing to a crowd.

I also would like to add something to your points. Rap music is immature. It's never grown-up. It's stayed a particular age. So the generations grow older but the music stays young. And a new generation comes into that age. While the last one ends up being out of date.

And I think that's the biggest factor in why older hip hop heads just don't like the music today. It's geared for teenagers and people in their 20's. That's raps age bracket. There's some exceptions to the rule from time to time. But in general, that's what it is.

I was a major hip hop head in the 80's and 90's. Wrote produced recorded. I made about two albums for myself. And maybe three or four others for other people. I never thought I would out grow it. Figured I be a rap fan forever.

It's not the case. From time to time I hear something I like. Nothing I love. Even my old school stuff gets played out after almost 40 years. I don't like rap music today. Honestly most of it makes my skin crawl. It's almost embarrassing. I just cannot relate to a 20 year old kids way of thinking anymore. Im so far beyond that now it's just not possible. The silly lines and word play. The stupid trends. The lies. The boasting.

I don't want to get into a rant about it out of respect for those who are enjoying the music today. The music has definitely changed over the years. But so have the listeners. They've grown up and passed that phase of life. Priorities and views change as you get older. So I think it's almost impossible to relate to something that's so much younger.

I tell allot of younger people. They sound just like I did 20 years ago. I had stacks of cassettes, records, magazines. I was up on the latest. Knew about everyone. Would argue about who's better. I say listen man. It's not going to last. You're going to mature and this music won't. This music has been 20 years old for almost 40 years now. It's a young mans game.

That was really interesting to read man. What happens to you now musically? Have you just become less sonically oriented in your life or do other genres speak to you now that didn't before?

One thing about hip hop as the bedrock of a musical education that might hold some back in terms of checking out new realities is what I call being a slave to the beat. I'm not a rap connossieur, but I always ended up finding my way to stuff that broke the tempo apart so there could be a real musical conversation, not just statements on top of a steady rhythm, going back to De La Soul and Guru.

Growing up I was a rock/punk guy of the 80s which brushed shoulders with hip hop in the streets and the city, but it still was basically a different culture at first until things started to finally bleed all together by the 90's and that was when anything that could be called "underground" got scouted for cash potential and that applied to all kinds of music at that point. I was in Seattle in 1989 so I saw all that "grunge" stuff get flipped into money fast once things broke nationwide.

With the internet, relatively tiny niches feed small groups and some musicians end up finding a way to make a living serving that really specialized community and then no one else knows who the hell they are and it doesn't feed into the bigger conversation about what is art. Which is weird because we've got access to so many kinds of music now because of the web, but it feels all scattered like a splatter painting.

Anyway, I think really good music is being made all the time, but it usually has nothing to do with what is popular or making money. It is almost like the best and most creative people do it for the love of it now and sometimes with luck they break through. But some musical movements seemed to be born in specific cities like NYC or London or Seattle and I don't know if physical communities built around a physical area may build into musical whole new artistic movements again like they once did. Everything feels kind of the same even if the menu is actually kind of more diverse now.

Did you ever listen Dylan by the way? I think he is perfect for lots of hip hop lovers to get into, but I don't see that is the case too often. To me he is kind of like one of the Godfathers to the rap lyric and I'm surprised this hasn't been picked up on much. Listen to his album Highway 61 Revisited and it is like living inside his head full of word jazz, honky tonk and a dash of R&B and a whole ton of not giving a damn what people think. It was rebellious stuff at the time and it is still fresh. Kind of like great hip hop.

Music just don't do it for me like it used to. When I want something on in the background I'll just put on the old-school station. Or old salsa. And I can enjoy that. When I want to go somewhere mentally and spiritually, like I used to when I was younger, I find instrumentals. I like stuff that's orchestral. Strings and horns. Big timpani drums. The instrumentals change up. So it's that same roller coaster ride. Depending on my mood or where I want to go. I let my thoughts be the vocals and ride the waves. It gives me that same stimulation I used to get from songs.
Music is what taught me vocabulary. I was a bad kid so I didn't pay attention in school. But I'd learn words that way. I'd hear the word and the context it's used and be able to figure out the definition.

For example when I heard

Party people, in the place
Embrace the bass
as I commence to pick up the pace
That makes you motivate
And accelerate
Cause like tony the tiger im great

I learned all those words. Knew what they ment and how to use them just from the song. So my vocabulary would get bigger each time I jam.

But the music seemed so much more intelligent back then. In the 80's the attitude was we in the hood. But we not stupid. We got something to say and we can articulate it in an intellectual manner that's artistic and unique.

We made beats out of turntables. You got two and a mixer. Take two records. Find the breaks. Open the fader one way closes it the other. Let that break play. Let the break from the other record play while you rewind the record. Then you can scratch it in.

Moe dee changed the way people rap. The emphasis became the emcee. And to be a good one you really had to know your ****.

Over time the emphasis has gone back to the beat. I won't get into a long thing about the evolution of electronic instruments from the tr 808 to the mpc. But that's what it is. A beat a hook and that's all you need. I used to do music I got the ear. I can tell the difference in volume. How the verses are placed behind the beat and heavily effected. And the hook is up on top and less compressed. Adlibs are used as a way to cover weak rhymes to make it sound more exciting. It's different. Technology and recording techniques are used to cover up weakness. So they can bring you the character that is the performer.

I read allot now. More than I ever did. Thanks to the internet. I read way more than I listen.

[Clyde_Style]

I agree with what you're saying. Especially with the no where else to go comment. I think the nba dunk contest is a very good way to make a comparison. There just comes a point in time where there is nothing left to do. Everything has been done. Once in a blue moon a special person comes along. But it's mostly just showmanship in between. It's not about the dunks or the music, it's about the character. And that's really what it boils down to. Characters playing to a crowd.

I also would like to add something to your points. Rap music is immature. It's never grown-up. It's stayed a particular age. So the generations grow older but the music stays young. And a new generation comes into that age. While the last one ends up being out of date.

And I think that's the biggest factor in why older hip hop heads just don't like the music today. It's geared for teenagers and people in their 20's. That's raps age bracket. There's some exceptions to the rule from time to time. But in general, that's what it is.

I was a major hip hop head in the 80's and 90's. Wrote produced recorded. I made about two albums for myself. And maybe three or four others for other people. I never thought I would out grow it. Figured I be a rap fan forever.

It's not the case. From time to time I hear something I like. Nothing I love. Even my old school stuff gets played out after almost 40 years. I don't like rap music today. Honestly most of it makes my skin crawl. It's almost embarrassing. I just cannot relate to a 20 year old kids way of thinking anymore. Im so far beyond that now it's just not possible. The silly lines and word play. The stupid trends. The lies. The boasting.

I don't want to get into a rant about it out of respect for those who are enjoying the music today. The music has definitely changed over the years. But so have the listeners. They've grown up and passed that phase of life. Priorities and views change as you get older. So I think it's almost impossible to relate to something that's so much younger.

I tell allot of younger people. They sound just like I did 20 years ago. I had stacks of cassettes, records, magazines. I was up on the latest. Knew about everyone. Would argue about who's better. I say listen man. It's not going to last. You're going to mature and this music won't. This music has been 20 years old for almost 40 years now. It's a young mans game.

That was really interesting to read man. What happens to you now musically? Have you just become less sonically oriented in your life or do other genres speak to you now that didn't before?

One thing about hip hop as the bedrock of a musical education that might hold some back in terms of checking out new realities is what I call being a slave to the beat. I'm not a rap connossieur, but I always ended up finding my way to stuff that broke the tempo apart so there could be a real musical conversation, not just statements on top of a steady rhythm, going back to De La Soul and Guru.

Growing up I was a rock/punk guy of the 80s which brushed shoulders with hip hop in the streets and the city, but it still was basically a different culture at first until things started to finally bleed all together by the 90's and that was when anything that could be called "underground" got scouted for cash potential and that applied to all kinds of music at that point. I was in Seattle in 1989 so I saw all that "grunge" stuff get flipped into money fast once things broke nationwide.

With the internet, relatively tiny niches feed small groups and some musicians end up finding a way to make a living serving that really specialized community and then no one else knows who the hell they are and it doesn't feed into the bigger conversation about what is art. Which is weird because we've got access to so many kinds of music now because of the web, but it feels all scattered like a splatter painting.

Anyway, I think really good music is being made all the time, but it usually has nothing to do with what is popular or making money. It is almost like the best and most creative people do it for the love of it now and sometimes with luck they break through. But some musical movements seemed to be born in specific cities like NYC or London or Seattle and I don't know if physical communities built around a physical area may build into musical whole new artistic movements again like they once did. Everything feels kind of the same even if the menu is actually kind of more diverse now.

Did you ever listen Dylan by the way? I think he is perfect for lots of hip hop lovers to get into, but I don't see that is the case too often. To me he is kind of like one of the Godfathers to the rap lyric and I'm surprised this hasn't been picked up on much. Listen to his album Highway 61 Revisited and it is like living inside his head full of word jazz, honky tonk and a dash of R&B and a whole ton of not giving a damn what people think. It was rebellious stuff at the time and it is still fresh. Kind of like great hip hop.

Music just don't do it for me like it used to. When I want something on in the background I'll just put on the old-school station. Or old salsa. And I can enjoy that. When I want to go somewhere mentally and spiritually, like I used to when I was younger, I find instrumentals. I like stuff that's orchestral. Strings and horns. Big timpani drums. The instrumentals change up. So it's that same roller coaster ride. Depending on my mood or where I want to go. I let my thoughts be the vocals and ride the waves. It gives me that same stimulation I used to get from songs.
Music is what taught me vocabulary. I was a bad kid so I didn't pay attention in school. But I'd learn words that way. I'd hear the word and the context it's used and be able to figure out the definition.

For example when I heard

Party people, in the place
Embrace the bass
as I commence to pick up the pace
That makes you motivate
And accelerate
Cause like tony the tiger im great

I learned all those words. Knew what they ment and how to use them just from the song. So my vocabulary would get bigger each time I jam.

But the music seemed so much more intelligent back then. In the 80's the attitude was we in the hood. But we not stupid. We got something to say and we can articulate it in an intellectual manner that's artistic and unique.

We made beats out of turntables. You got two and a mixer. Take two records. Find the breaks. Open the fader one way closes it the other. Let that break play. Let the break from the other record play while you rewind the record. Then you can scratch it in.

Moe dee changed the way people rap. The emphasis became the emcee. And to be a good one you really had to know your ****.

Over time the emphasis has gone back to the beat. I won't get into a long thing about the evolution of electronic instruments from the tr 808 to the mpc. But that's what it is. A beat a hook and that's all you need. I used to do music I got the ear. I can tell the difference in volume. How the verses are placed behind the beat and heavily effected. And the hook is up on top and less compressed. Adlibs are used as a way to cover weak rhymes to make it sound more exciting. It's different. Technology and recording techniques are used to cover up weakness. So they can bring you the character that is the performer.

I read allot now. More than I ever did. Thanks to the internet. I read way more than I listen.

Yeah, I had a Kool Moe Dee tape on my box for about the year. Follow the Leader. See what you're saying about the delivery on the beat. I don't know enough on a genre level, but I'd guess the idea things are less intelligent now probably has lots to do with the bigger picture and not only hip hop or demographics. And the bigger picture is the world knows more facts now, but it is producing many shallow minds and souls. Not everyone, but consumerism is at the heart of what most people want and it really is what people are singing about even if they don't think they are.

30-50 years ago when you were born in a big city like NYC or you moved here looking to get into stuff as a young buck you could figure something out and get by while doing your thing. Maybe you make a career move on the art stuff or not, but either way you could do it because you want to. I can live now in Florida on what I could live in NYC 30 years ago. Now you either got to have funds or think about yourself as a product early. We're in a world full of costs and it changes people and why they do things.

It can squeeze out the space in the head for looking for your own self and making your own conclusions and talking about your surroundings which is what lots of good lyrics come from. This lack of wiggle room induces lots of talent to sound like it is making music, but are they? And now they are are either super micro (me, me, my, my) and macro (me X world, fame, fortune) in how they talk about stuff. So lyric is like performer lots of time more than before, slapped on top of a mix. Not everyone, but often enough.

People get so used to consuming sounds they become competent at producing sounds and it can actually be the opposite of creative. Like the last 15 years probably has more crap ballads than ever because half of the people making stuff pro or amateur sound emotionally the same and it shows up in their melodies. There is no real impulse in some of it. It is pretending sincerity lots of the time. Sounds and images. It's a river. You can't drink it. It drowns people and they don't know it. That's why I said I went to hip hop that broke the beat because I like music that finds the spaces in between.

Reading more would be the best thing for most people, but that's not the direction we're heading. I just build a 16 foot wide by 8 foot high bookcase. 7 shelves 16 feet wide. I can unpack thousands of books now. Looking at my library in one big wall is what is fly to me now. That's my rock and roll but I'm getting older.

Anyway, I was mostly curious about what else folks who came up through hip hop listen to because there really is so much to check out like Manu Chao, Thelonious Monk, Dylan or Ethiopian music. I've liked very little mainstream stuff for a pretty long time now.

[Clyde_Style]

just had a memory check and realized that was Eric B. & Rakim. also had Kool Moe Dee in the rotation though

[KnickswiththeKnack]

Only the ignorant hate on this generation. You have kdot, cole, absoul, wale, mick jenkins, bada$$, Vince staples, logic, Q, big Sean all producing WORK. open the mind up

yepp, people have to stop trying to compare each era to the 90s. That being said, this generation is a lot better than the 00s imo.

I'll stop comparing modern Hip Hop to the 90s when people stop comparing modern basketball players to Michael Jordan.

[KnickswiththeKnack]

I know some of you look at Drake or Asap rocky as the greatest MC to ever be in show business but has rap really gone down the toilet or is it just a generational bias. I have tried to listen to rap today but it just doesn't do anything for me. I get more thrill listening to Vanilla Ice than I do listening to any of these rappers that these young cats are listening to now.

It's a bit of both, really. Part of it is definitely a generational bias, but part is also just the nature of the music itself.

Hip Hop was always a music of the "now", especially with its storytelling or picture painting nature. Whether it was Grandmaster Flash's 'The Message' or NWA's 'Straight Outta Compton' or Nas' 'Illmatic', all the way up & down the list, Hip Hop has been about painting a picture of an MC's locality at that moment. So now, young rappers are painting pictures about what they experience, which is obviously far away from what older heads did.

Creatively, Hip Hop peaked in the late 90s, when sonic superiority (thanks to big budgets) blended with full-force street-level creativity. Albums like Dre's '2001' or even Monch's 'Internal Affairs' were loud, punchy, clean, and at the same time creative and complicated. Really, Hip Hop had nowhere else to go but to regress to simpler music. Anymore creative, and it would have gone into unintelligible territory (I'm looking at you Common).

So Cash Money & No Limit came along, made it simple and club-oriented, and the rest is history. I don't know that Hip Hop will ever get back to its creative peak in the mid-late 90s, because if it does get back to that level, well most of that stuff has already been done & it'll just be a rehash. In the meantime we still have Jay Electronica... if he ever drops his album.

I agree with what you're saying. Especially with the no where else to go comment. I think the nba dunk contest is a very good way to make a comparison. There just comes a point in time where there is nothing left to do. Everything has been done. Once in a blue moon a special person comes along. But it's mostly just showmanship in between. It's not about the dunks or the music, it's about the character. And that's really what it boils down to. Characters playing to a crowd.

I also would like to add something to your points. Rap music is immature. It's never grown-up. It's stayed a particular age. So the generations grow older but the music stays young. And a new generation comes into that age. While the last one ends up being out of date.

And I think that's the biggest factor in why older hip hop heads just don't like the music today. It's geared for teenagers and people in their 20's. That's raps age bracket. There's some exceptions to the rule from time to time. But in general, that's what it is.

I was a major hip hop head in the 80's and 90's. Wrote produced recorded. I made about two albums for myself. And maybe three or four others for other people. I never thought I would out grow it. Figured I be a rap fan forever.

It's not the case. From time to time I hear something I like. Nothing I love. Even my old school stuff gets played out after almost 40 years. I don't like rap music today. Honestly most of it makes my skin crawl. It's almost embarrassing. I just cannot relate to a 20 year old kids way of thinking anymore. Im so far beyond that now it's just not possible. The silly lines and word play. The stupid trends. The lies. The boasting.

I don't want to get into a rant about it out of respect for those who are enjoying the music today. The music has definitely changed over the years. But so have the listeners. They've grown up and passed that phase of life. Priorities and views change as you get older. So I think it's almost impossible to relate to something that's so much younger.

I tell allot of younger people. They sound just like I did 20 years ago. I had stacks of cassettes, records, magazines. I was up on the latest. Knew about everyone. Would argue about who's better. I say listen man. It's not going to last. You're going to mature and this music won't. This music has been 20 years old for almost 40 years now. It's a young mans game.

Great analogy on the dunk contest thing man, I think that breaks it down exactly.

And also great points on the maturity thing, you're absolutely right. But it's kinda sad to me tho, it doesn't have to be that way. Especially these days, older rappers don't need to pander to the young generation, they can find their old audience who have grown as well & sell music to them. Probably make more money too, the 35+ are the ones spending the most money on things like music & entertainment.

I actually had a similar conversation years ago with a friend of mine. It was around the time Raekwon dropped a new video or something cuz we were watching it, and we both noticed how he was basically saying the same things, wearing the same clothes, still shooting videos in the projects with the crew, everything the same from 15 years ago. It's like, how can you still be rapping about the same things? You can't still have the same outlook on life that you did when you were 25.

Maybe older rappers just wanna play it safe & make music they think people wanna hear.

I picked on Raekwon earlier but I think Ghostface Killah has managed to mature with his audience while keeping things fresh & creative. Also guys like Talib Kweli and The Roots have managed to mature with their audience. But what the majority of people know or consider cool is most definitely for teenagers.

[IllmaticHandler]

Never heard of him before yesterday, but this is fire. Might be my favorite song of the year, and I heard mad ill songs.


[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nm7zqEEAP9M[/youtube]

[Zappa012]

please i need help.

Does anyone know the name of the song in the following Vine? I'm trapped.



Don't care if is good or bad, i need to listen the full song to free mysekf from it.

[el13adnino]

albee al making noise in the streets

[kane2021]

Anyone heard of a rapper called donkey cartel?

There is a mall shooting here in nc. Police killed the shooter and they saying it's that rapper.

[IllmaticHandler]

Anyone heard of a rapper called donkey cartel?

There is a mall shooting here in nc. Police killed the shooter and they saying it's that rapper.

prob some local NC rapper. I dont think he making waves that he left that region yet. Never heard of him.

[IllmaticHandler]

when the east is in the house....

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KQdHcoYe74[/youtube]

[IllmaticHandler]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gob-xm9EMLM&list=LL7Dic9kjt-4IZwo-0jCKDSA&index=21[/youtube]

[Manhattan Project]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1k2r62OCQE[/youtube]

Only a matter of time now...

[Greenie]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1k2r62OCQE[/youtube]

Only a matter of time now...

for what?