Should Ryan Mcdonough be fired?

[RunDogGun]

Many seem to forget that both Beldsoe and Goran were extremely inconsistent, which caused the need for more playing time for Thomas. To me, it seemed like an attempt to force the competitive spirit from the two starters. Unfortunately it didn't have that result. However, when they were all on the court at the same time, they did a good job.

You have a chance to nab a 20/6 guy for that contract....you go for it.

[Scutt]

Many seem to forget that both Beldsoe and Goran were extremely inconsistent, which caused the need for more playing time for Thomas. To me, it seemed like an attempt to force the competitive spirit from the two starters. Unfortunately it didn't have that result. However, when they were all on the court at the same time, they did a good job.

You have a chance to nab a 20/6 guy for that contract....you go for it.

Not when you have 2 other point guards on the roster, who both want to start and need the ball in their hands to be effective. Having 3 starting caliber combo point guards is just asking for locker room and chemistry issues. Was having all that turmoil last year before the trade deadline, and wasting another season, really worth having IT as a trade asset? It is not exactly like we got a whole lot for him. Ryan Mcdonough seems to forget that a teams best players shouldn't all play the same position. Its way too redundant, and when you are doing it with combo guards, who cant run an offense, you get the mess the Suns are in.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Has a touch of Anakin Skywalker, being seduced by the Emperor with the power of the 8th seed.

[RaisingArizona]

McDonough on radio saying he thinks we can make 8th seed, only 3 games back in striking distance.

Says Teletovic told a team meeting as inspiration, that he lost 13 games in a row and still made the playoffs in Brooklyn.

That makes me wonder what on earth is going on in the FO, the mentality seems delusional.

Interview was post-Bledsoe injury as well.

No mentions of Booker, Warren, Len or Goodwin.

Most fans want hope of some kind. I just think it's the general PR spin. I doubt McD believes what he's actually been instructed to say. Most likely the spin is coming from Sarver himself.

[bwgood77]

Hmmm... is it trolling to use journalists as the bait ? Mwahhaha

from Gambo

The Phoenix Suns have issues, major issues — that is the understatement of the year.

At 12-20 this season is a train wreck and with Eric Bledsoe now out for the season it is likely going to get worse. The Suns have a lot of work to do to win back the fans and become respectable once again, but that is easier said than done.

What Phoenix first needs to do is to identify what is the cause of the problems? What are the real issues? Why are the Suns one of the worst teams in the NBA and headed to the draft lottery again? Why are they such a dysfunctional organization?

It’s not an easy thing to figure out, but a necessity in order to get this thing headed in the right direction. When last season ended, the Suns’ management and ownership identified the problem as a lack of leadership. Too many young guys on the roster and not enough veteran leadership to guide the younger players through the grind of 82 games.

So Phoenix addressed that issue by bringing in Tyson Chandler, Ronnie Price, Sonny Weems, Mirza Teletovic and Jon Leuer. And what did the effect of having veterans in the clubhouse do for this team?

NOTHING.

After losing to lowly Philadelphia, the Suns decided that the answer to fixing things is ridding themselves of some of their assistant coaches. They fired two respected coaches who both have championship rings. Jerry Sichting and Mike Longabardi are out in a bench shakeup. I guess it was their fault that the Suns weren’t winning. But you have to blame someone for this season, so let’s start with those two guys. Longabardi was a coach on the Celtics 2008 NBA Championship team and Sichting was a player on the Celtics 1985-86 title team. Both had tons of experience and success in the coaching ranks.

Maybe these moves were made to give Earl Watson a chance to be at the front of the bench. OK, I can live with that as Watson has a lot of potential to be a good coach. Maybe rumblings I had heard that both assistant coaches were positioning themselves to replace head coach Jeff Hornacek if the axe were to fall and didn’t have his best interests at heart were true. I can live with that if that is the case.

But let’s make one thing certain here, the Phoenix Suns are losing games this year because they don’t have enough talent. Yes, it is that simple. No, it’s not the coaching nor is it the leadership in the clubhouse. That was so overrated it was ridiculous. And while Markieff Morris continues to be a problem, they are not 12-20 because of him. Yes Suns management made a huge mistake when they elected not to trade him in the offseason despite all the information I was providing to the public and the Suns about how this was going to go down. All of that information has proven true.

Morris doesn’t want to be here and the Suns are actively shopping him and P.J. Tucker in an effort to create more opportunities for other players. But there is so little value for Morris that all I am hearing they can do is get off the contract. Some teams don’t want Markieff for FREE. You read that correctly. They would rather preserve cap space and not add three years of salary. Most teams have similar players as Morris is nothing special — just an average basketball player when he is on his game.

The Suns have made lot of mistakes lately. Trading the Lakers’ first-round draft pick in the deal for Brandon Knight and then paying Knight close to max money. If we are being perfectly honest, Isaiah Thomas is a better player than Knight and he comes at a fraction of the price. Speaking of Thomas, signing him and trying to keep three point guards happy was a huge mistake that resulted in Goran Dragic demanding a trade.

Signing Tyson Chandler to a four-year, $52 million contract when he is nothing more than a bench/role player at this point in his career was a mistake especially considering Alex Len was a better player at the time of the signing. Getting Chandler only made sense if they had gotten LaMarcus Aldridge. Keeping Markieff Morris in the summer, fall and now winter. Jerry Colangelo traded Robert Horry a few days after he threw a towel at then head coach Danny Ainge. The Suns suspended Morris two games for the same infraction. Those are just a few. And let’s not forget that the Suns followed up the loss of Amar’e Stoudemire a few years back with Hedo Turkoglu, Hakim Warrick and Josh Childress. Mistake, mistake, mistake. Getting rid of Stoudemire wasn’t wrong, but adding those three was.

The draft picks recently have been good — Len, T.J. Warren and Devin Booker were good picks by general manager Ryan McDonough. Those three guys are solid young players to build with, so McDonough has an eye for talent in the draft. It has been his strong point in what he brings to the table. Managing media, owners, coaches and players is what he needs to work on but he is young, and it will be up to owner Robert Sarver to determine if he is the right guy going forward to fix this. Jeff Hornacek has made his share of mistakes but he is not the problem here. Hornacek had no chance with this mess. He was almost Coach of the Year two years ago and now he can’t coach? Please. Hornacek knows what it takes to win, but he doesn’t have the tools in the toolbox.

The Suns need players. Better players than what they have. How they go about getting those players is up to them to figure out. But the Suns need to stop overvaluing their own players. The vast majority of them are nothing special and not worth the money they are being paid. Some of them have taken the money and decided they don’t want to roll up their sleeves anymore, especially on the defensive end. And please stop with all the analytic stuff — it doesn’t reflect heart and attitude.

There is a time and place to make changes. But no matter how many changes the Suns organization makes, they won’t win consistently until they get more talent on the court.

Yes, Frank, and in doing so, I've banned you from my heart, and my

--Fo-Ev-uh!!

Naw, but I do find it interesting that Gambo fully supports McD (well, at least his eye for talent), and Horny, but is pretty much taking Sarver to task in that article. Aren't they supposed to be buddy-buddy?

It is interesting that he quotes this when Gambo is supporting McD yet when he creates the perception in his mind that others are being McD apologists he personally attacks them saying they are crawling up someone's ass, hamstering, or whatever.

[bwgood77]

McDonough on radio saying he thinks we can make 8th seed, only 3 games back in striking distance.

Says Teletovic told a team meeting as inspiration, that he lost 13 games in a row and still made the playoffs in Brooklyn.

That makes me wonder what on earth is going on in the FO, the mentality seems delusional.

Interview was post-Bledsoe injury as well.

No mentions of Booker, Warren, Len or Goodwin.

Most fans want hope of some kind. I just think it's the general PR spin. I doubt McD believes what he's actually been instructed to say. Most likely the spin is coming from Sarver himself.

Yeah, I think he almost has to say this and believe it, particularly if his job is on the line. I mean how would the team respond if he said "there is almost zero chance we make the playoffs" after our young guys went toe to toe with Cleveland and OKC, the second on a b2b after losing our best player and team leader?

[RunDogGun]

McDonough on radio saying he thinks we can make 8th seed, only 3 games back in striking distance.

Says Teletovic told a team meeting as inspiration, that he lost 13 games in a row and still made the playoffs in Brooklyn.

That makes me wonder what on earth is going on in the FO, the mentality seems delusional.

Interview was post-Bledsoe injury as well.

No mentions of Booker, Warren, Len or Goodwin.

Most fans want hope of some kind. I just think it's the general PR spin. I doubt McD believes what he's actually been instructed to say. Most likely the spin is coming from Sarver himself.

Yeah, I think he almost has to say this and believe it, particularly if his job is on the line. I mean how would the team respond if he said "there is almost zero chance we make the playoffs" after our young guys went toe to toe with Cleveland and OKC, the second on a b2b after losing our best player and team leader?

I think he is just pointing out that players still believe in each other. They should, we need better chemistry even if the result is a losing season and missing the playoffs. The team has to care for the 15 individuals that encompass the current team, weed out the cancers and move on from there. It will be quite difficult without Bledsoe, but with how teams have been playing, still a possibility. As a competitive sport, you have to try and compete.

We are playing the young guys, so I really don't understand what so many are b**ching about.

[AtheJ415]

The reality is, I don't think most players are as consistent as our fans think, or as talented, league-wide. There's constant overvaluation of a team's own players when things go well, and constant undervaluation when **** hits the fan. This team is better talent-wise than many are giving it credit for, but we suck for a ton of reasons, with the main one being youth, which takes time to develop.

McD has done his job damn well. This thread shouldn't even be a discussion.

[Frank Lee]

http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1420598#start_here

here... may be one of you experts can go over to the main board and explain whats up with McDoh!. Its only fair since I gave em mytwo cents. We wouldn't want them to get the wrong impression would we.

Next up perhaps we will discuss the true value of Brandon Knight over there. Might be interesting to hear the thoughts of BBfans who don't wear purple jammies.


I can tell you guys missed me

[Frank Lee]

McDonough on radio saying he thinks we can make 8th seed, only 3 games back in striking distance.

Says Teletovic told a team meeting as inspiration, that he lost 13 games in a row and still made the playoffs in Brooklyn.

That makes me wonder what on earth is going on in the FO, the mentality seems delusional.

Interview was post-Bledsoe injury as well.

No mentions of Booker, Warren, Len or Goodwin.

Most fans want hope of some kind. I just think it's the general PR spin. I doubt McD believes what he's actually been instructed to say. Most likely the spin is coming from Sarver himself.

Yeah, I think he almost has to say this and believe it, particularly if his job is on the line. I mean how would the team respond if he said "there is almost zero chance we make the playoffs" after our young guys went toe to toe with Cleveland and OKC, the second on a b2b after losing our best player and team leader?

There is nothing wrong with stating the truth... but wise to not mention 'make the eight seed so we can play Golden State'

However, I feel it is important to make the play offs. Having never been a big fan of drafting our way to contending, the playoff experience ... just to taste it, only makes the next appearance that much easier. So what we housed 4-0... it is a reward to the players for the season's hard work and is much needed for the fan base. It also can help in free agent attraction, and good lord, we sure need that.

You only get playoff experience... by playing in the playoffs. Y'all can quote me on that one.

[bwgood77]

Most fans want hope of some kind. I just think it's the general PR spin. I doubt McD believes what he's actually been instructed to say. Most likely the spin is coming from Sarver himself.

Yeah, I think he almost has to say this and believe it, particularly if his job is on the line. I mean how would the team respond if he said "there is almost zero chance we make the playoffs" after our young guys went toe to toe with Cleveland and OKC, the second on a b2b after losing our best player and team leader?

There is nothing wrong with stating the truth... but wise to not mention 'make the eight seed so we can play Golden State'

However, I feel it is important to make the play offs. Having never been a big fan of drafting our way to contending, the playoff experience ... just to taste it, only makes the next appearance that much easier. So what we housed 4-0... it is a reward to the players for the season's hard work and is much needed for the fan base. It also can help in free agent attraction, and good lord, we sure need that.

You only get playoff experience... by playing in the playoffs. Y'all can quote me on that one.

I agree, that I'd rather get to the playoffs, though it seems unlikely, and since the west is so bad this year, getting to the playoffs at the 8th seed will net you the 15th pick, close to our annual norm, and McD seems to make good picks in that area. And there are certainly no assurances that, particularly in this draft, that the 5th or 6th pick will be that much better than the 15th. The main thing we would lose is the chance of jumping into the top 3 and getting a real difference maker, but we all know how much luck the Suns have had with that.

[Lillard2LA]

http://valleyofthesuns.com/2016/01/02/ryan-mcdonough-believes-suns-can-make-playoffs/

[AtheJ415]

http://valleyofthesuns.com/2016/01/02/ryan-mcdonough-believes-suns-can-make-playoffs/

Already been discussed, and again, what's he supposed to say? I have no idea why this is news.

[NavLDO]

Haha... a Dragic apologist ? I'll buy in. But that era is over. sure, I'd rather us kept him as our path to this point would have been drastically different. We'd still have Booker, Warren, and Len too. But likely no Knight. Nobody knows what the Dragon would be making now, nor if his play would have fallen off. -- It already had, BEFORE we traded him; that's part of the reason we traded him. The other part was his whining. If we didn't trade him, we'd have TWO non-producing whiners on the team.
Or if we would have dealt him for better pieces. However, this continual force feed of miami's protected#1 in 2017 and their pick in 2021 as being some colossal grab of assets and a victory in trade land is par for the course for 'McDuh apologizers'. We needed quality players then/now, not phantom assets. -- I do agree. It would have been nice to obtain some quality players in return, rather than 2 WAY future picks, but those are 2 very tradable assets. But don't worry Frank, we'll trade those for another player and if you don't mind me using your words 'this continual force feed' of crying over this traded LAL draft pick that has yet to materialize, will continue. And, just like, I'll use your words again, 'we needed quality players then/now, not phantom assets', we traded for a young, developing player in Knight. And just because you or some others don't like him, and just because he'll never be a #1, or #2, of 'Big 3', doesn't mean he's not a valuable piece.
repeat 2021 .... jesus guys... that kid could be 15 yrs old NOW. Yet many are trumpeting that as a victory...in the face of defeat. too much rejoicing over a reactionary move that did not need to happen. -- You keep saying it didn't need to happen. Maybe not, but we'd just have another whining distraction on the team, then would have either had to pay him $17M per, or lose him for nothing. Which option do you like better than the 2-1sts we got? I'll take the 2-1sts. Am I missing an option? Because he said he only wanted to go to 3 places, with Miami being one, and before you or others say 'tough, trade where we want'. Well, there's this thing called 'strategic communication'. And by not trading him to a place he desired, he would have cried even more, and maybe even louder. How's that for work for business, when we are trying to acquire high-quality veterans? I'll take a stab and guess 'not so well'.





Those assets have done nothing for this rebuild. NOTHING. -- YET. Do you really think that 2021 1st will remain under our control beyond the trade deadline, or the draft, or beyond the start of next season?
McDopey signed Thomas and forced the hokey Hydra on us. He then dealt him for a late late 2016 first. That move has done NOTHING for this rebuild. -- Again, YET. We got about 1/2 a season of play and a 2016 late 1st for the trouble of just signing him in the offseason OK, we traded away our 2nd Rd pick from 2013, Alex Oriakhi, who...on August 10, 2015, signed with Orlandina Basket of the Italian Serie A for the 2015–16 season, so yeah, basically, we traded that for a 2016 late 1st. Not bad.

Oh, we'll get a kid who will take 2-3 yrs to contribute if at all (see Sir Archie) Keep in mind, McDontknow also signed the troublesome MoBros...and now is eating a crap sandwich on that one. And for the record, I was a GROWN-ASS-MAN apologist first and we got NOTHING for him as well. Didn't 'Net' anything for Scola either. These are productive players that are helping play off teams now. (I will await the resident cherry pickers that will devote their entire eye poking rebuttal about Louis ) -- How come Scola gets credit as a 'productive player', yet Knight is viewed as a piece of trash? He was 'netted' from Scola (via Plumlee), along with Bogdan. Funny, how a player producing so much MORE is viewed so much LESS. Oh, that's right, Indiana is a playoff team--wait, when did those start? Man, I must be way behind...I mean, they are safely in by a whole 1/2 game.

McDonkey has stroked out 14 mill to Knight, 13 to chandler, 6 to Telly... about 4-5 more for fill ins ( Luaer being the best signing this yr which means he'll be dealt haha) Thats almost 40 million for improvements for THIS year... and what are we jazzed about...? three kids making less than 10. Any wonders why Sarver might be agitated? There is that thing called ROI and we sure as heck haven't seen much of that this yr.

Hey, I wish McDeal would have just stood down and gone about things different. He's a rookie GM (As it seems all of them have been since BC) and he makes mistakes. We are suffering with them now. I've drawn the line on him. His teeter has tottered to the middle to bad side, and the next 6 months will determine his job, IMO. He's vested in Knight ... a dude we could have bought for less on the open market....and the fact that we still have a MOBRO is irritating. McDarnit HAS to do something, and it feels like it HAS to be soon. -- Morris will be gone by the trade deadline; don't worry. I just hope it will be for a PF that can play defense.

But you know, I'd be fine just moving forward with what we have. No more confidence in what Mc50/50 will do.

Ah, Frank...your awesome--please, don't ever change. I love debating with you...

Anyway, you say the picks from Miami has netted us nothing. You are right, but the TRADE has. We saved $17M to give $14M and minutes to a young, developing, 24 YO who is better. You say Knight has done nothing for us, and we could have bought him for less on the open market. Your assuming no other teams would've been interested, or that the Buck's wouldn't have wanted to keep him. No guarantees there, Frank.

Knight, while not a World beater, is playing pretty darn well for us, and compares favorably with other SGs. Unfortunately, he's forced to play 100% as a PG, which is not ideal at the moment. Our arguably best defender/player, and most assuredly best PG, is out, but Knight is a good player, and compares favorably to a good number of SGs in the league:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&y1=2016&p1=knighbr03&y2=2016&p2=hardeja01&y3=2016&p3=derozde01&y4=2016&p4=wadedw01&y5=2016&p5=wiggian01&y6=2016&p6=thompkl01

Bu ultimately, we are in a bad position, and McD has made some mistakes along the way, but I'm still giving him...
...and in answer to silverstyne...5 years to provide a playoff roster. If by then, he hasn't produced, then yes, I would agree to have him removed, but until then, like I was trying to explain, again to silverstyne, and to anyone else that cares, is that a GM should be given 5 years to develop a playoff roster, because issues like the Morri, and Dragon-whyne, are going to happen, and Plan A, and Plan B and C, may get throttled, and the GM should be given some time to re-figure, or re-design, his master plan.

Many of you don't agree, and that's your prerogative, but I feel it's unreasonable to expect a GM to be able create a championship roster any earlier than that. And while it does not appear as if we are any closer, we might be after the trade deadline.

[saintEscaton]

Haha... a Dragic apologist ? I'll buy in. But that era is over. sure, I'd rather us kept him as our path to this point would have been drastically different. We'd still have Booker, Warren, and Len too. But likely no Knight. Nobody knows what the Dragon would be making now, nor if his play would have fallen off. -- It already had, BEFORE we traded him; that's part of the reason we traded him. The other part was his whining. If we didn't trade him, we'd have TWO non-producing whiners on the team.
Or if we would have dealt him for better pieces. However, this continual force feed of miami's protected#1 in 2017 and their pick in 2021 as being some colossal grab of assets and a victory in trade land is par for the course for 'McDuh apologizers'. We needed quality players then/now, not phantom assets. -- I do agree. It would have been nice to obtain some quality players in return, rather than 2 WAY future picks, but those are 2 very tradable assets. But don't worry Frank, we'll trade those for another player and if you don't mind me using your words 'this continual force feed' of crying over this traded LAL draft pick that has yet to materialize, will continue. And, just like, I'll use your words again, 'we needed quality players then/now, not phantom assets', we traded for a young, developing player in Knight. And just because you or some others don't like him, and just because he'll never be a #1, or #2, of 'Big 3', doesn't mean he's not a valuable piece.
repeat 2021 .... jesus guys... that kid could be 15 yrs old NOW. Yet many are trumpeting that as a victory...in the face of defeat. too much rejoicing over a reactionary move that did not need to happen. -- You keep saying it didn't need to happen. Maybe not, but we'd just have another whining distraction on the team, then would have either had to pay him $17M per, or lose him for nothing. Which option do you like better than the 2-1sts we got? I'll take the 2-1sts. Am I missing an option? Because he said he only wanted to go to 3 places, with Miami being one, and before you or others say 'tough, trade where we want'. Well, there's this thing called 'strategic communication'. And by not trading him to a place he desired, he would have cried even more, and maybe even louder. How's that for work for business, when we are trying to acquire high-quality veterans? I'll take a stab and guess 'not so well'.





Those assets have done nothing for this rebuild. NOTHING. -- YET. Do you really think that 2021 1st will remain under our control beyond the trade deadline, or the draft, or beyond the start of next season?
McDopey signed Thomas and forced the hokey Hydra on us. He then dealt him for a late late 2016 first. That move has done NOTHING for this rebuild. -- Again, YET. We got about 1/2 a season of play and a 2016 late 1st for the trouble of just signing him in the offseason OK, we traded away our 2nd Rd pick from 2013, Alex Oriakhi, who...on August 10, 2015, signed with Orlandina Basket of the Italian Serie A for the 2015–16 season, so yeah, basically, we traded that for a 2016 late 1st. Not bad.

Oh, we'll get a kid who will take 2-3 yrs to contribute if at all (see Sir Archie) Keep in mind, McDontknow also signed the troublesome MoBros...and now is eating a crap sandwich on that one. And for the record, I was a GROWN-ASS-MAN apologist first and we got NOTHING for him as well. Didn't 'Net' anything for Scola either. These are productive players that are helping play off teams now. (I will await the resident cherry pickers that will devote their entire eye poking rebuttal about Louis ) -- How come Scola gets credit as a 'productive player', yet Knight is viewed as a piece of trash? He was 'netted' from Scola (via Plumlee), along with Bogdan. Funny, how a player producing so much MORE is viewed so much LESS. Oh, that's right, Indiana is a playoff team--wait, when did those start? Man, I must be way behind...I mean, they are safely in by a whole 1/2 game.

McDonkey has stroked out 14 mill to Knight, 13 to chandler, 6 to Telly... about 4-5 more for fill ins ( Luaer being the best signing this yr which means he'll be dealt haha) Thats almost 40 million for improvements for THIS year... and what are we jazzed about...? three kids making less than 10. Any wonders why Sarver might be agitated? There is that thing called ROI and we sure as heck haven't seen much of that this yr.

Hey, I wish McDeal would have just stood down and gone about things different. He's a rookie GM (As it seems all of them have been since BC) and he makes mistakes. We are suffering with them now. I've drawn the line on him. His teeter has tottered to the middle to bad side, and the next 6 months will determine his job, IMO. He's vested in Knight ... a dude we could have bought for less on the open market....and the fact that we still have a MOBRO is irritating. McDarnit HAS to do something, and it feels like it HAS to be soon. -- Morris will be gone by the trade deadline; don't worry. I just hope it will be for a PF that can play defense.

But you know, I'd be fine just moving forward with what we have. No more confidence in what Mc50/50 will do.

Ah, Frank...your awesome--please, don't ever change. I love debating with you...

Anyway, you say the picks from Miami has netted us nothing. You are right, but the TRADE has. We saved $17M to give $14M and minutes to a young, developing, 24 YO who is better. You say Knight has done nothing for us, and we could have bought him for less on the open market. Your assuming no other teams would've been interested, or that the Buck's wouldn't have wanted to keep him. No guarantees there, Frank.

Knight, while not a World beater, is playing pretty darn well for us, and compares favorably with other SGs. Unfortunately, he's forced to play 100% as a PG, which is not ideal at the moment. Our arguably best defender/player, and most assuredly best PG, is out, but Knight is a good player, and compares favorably to a good number of SGs in the league:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&y1=2016&p1=knighbr03&y2=2016&p2=hardeja01&y3=2016&p3=derozde01&y4=2016&p4=wadedw01&y5=2016&p5=wiggian01&y6=2016&p6=thompkl01

Bu ultimately, we are in a bad position, and McD has made some mistakes along the way, but I'm still giving him...
...and in answer to silverstyne...5 years to provide a playoff roster. If by then, he hasn't produced, then yes, I would agree to have him removed, but until then, like I was trying to explain, again to silverstyne, and to anyone else that cares, is that a GM should be given 5 years to develop a playoff roster, because issues like the Morri, and Dragon-whyne, are going to happen, and Plan A, and Plan B and C, may get throttled, and the GM should be given some time to re-figure, or re-design, his master plan.

Many of you don't agree, and that's your prerogative, but I feel it's unreasonable to expect a GM to be able create a championship roster any earlier than that. And while it does not appear as if we are any closer, we might be after the trade deadline.

If he's given 5 years he better assemble something more than just a meddling squad of overachievers scrapping at the 8th seed. At the very least a team that has a shot to make it out of the first round and build off of that to achieve a deep postseason run after.But of course you gotta make it into the big dance first. I think that is reasonable expectations if he wants his leash lengthened

[AtheJ415]

Many seem to forget that both Beldsoe and Goran were extremely inconsistent, which caused the need for more playing time for Thomas. To me, it seemed like an attempt to force the competitive spirit from the two starters. Unfortunately it didn't have that result. However, when they were all on the court at the same time, they did a good job.

You have a chance to nab a 20/6 guy for that contract....you go for it.

Not when you have 2 other point guards on the roster, who both want to start and need the ball in their hands to be effective. Having 3 starting caliber combo point guards is just asking for locker room and chemistry issues. Was having all that turmoil last year before the trade deadline, and wasting another season, really worth having IT as a trade asset? It is not exactly like we got a whole lot for him. Ryan Mcdonough seems to forget that a teams best players shouldn't all play the same position. Its way too redundant, and when you are doing it with combo guards, who cant run an offense, you get the mess the Suns are in.

What offense are they supposed to be running? I mean, how many PGs do we need to run through before we stop blaming the PGs for the offense's problems. Besides, we got rid of a 28 year old vet for picks. I'm happy with the result, particularly given how awful Dragic has been in Miami.

[blacksun]

The front office, under Sarver's orders i believe, is trying to be smart thinking that they can try to win, and eventually be a contender at the exact same time. Sarver wants to have his cake and eat it too. Unfortunately that stuff just does not happen. You start your path to be a contender through the draft, by getting your franchise guy there. The hit rate isnt good, but its really the best option. You look at all the teams in the playoff picture, and only Houston built their core (Harden and Dwight) through trades and free agency. All others got their star players and key guys through the draft.

Its clear to me that the Knight acquisition was a panic move, a rushed deal. Sarver knew that trading Dragic would decrease the attendance at US Airways. He wanted a shiny new guy to parade around Phoenix. McD brings out his list, scrolls down to see whos available and sees Brandon Knight as the best option. Its not a good option, but its good enough for Bob. And now still, it seems that Sarver just wants to keep them checks coming. He does not want a full rebuild, as evidenced by the script he made McD read.

I really believe that back in the start of the 2013-2014 season, McD wanted to start from scratch and get a shot at Andrew Wiggins. Sarver was okay with it too at the time, but then we started winning. He asks the FO to build through the houston model and McD agrees. Now i think McD wishes he can blow this all up again, but i doubt Sarver would let him. Hes stuck in a bad situation IMO. Not that i feel bad for him.

Its unfortunate that Sarver doesnt see what drafting a guy like Ben Simmons can do to a franchise, or how exciting a young team with promising players can be. And to top it all off, hes now trying to buy a football team in Spain FFS. Give me a break.

[Mulhollanddrive]

History shows getting lucky with ping pong balls and / or other teams passing on a player is a mandatory step to becoming a championship team:

You could argue 14 draft picks have determined the last 35 championships:

Curry, Leonard, Wade, Nowitzki, Bryant, Pierce, Duncan, Wallace, Jordan, Olajuwon, Thomas, Johnson, Bird, Irving.

Same determining factors this season with the top 5 contenders - Curry, LeBron, Leonard, Durant, Paul.

It's just how it's worked for decades, you need to get lucky and draft a top 50 of All-Time type.

Everyone knows it, everyone wants Simmons. Problem is GMs can't take credit for getting lucky, so they have to do stuff that makes them look compentent week to week, which is why you hear more from McDonough about an irrelevent player like Morris than Simmons.

[Frank Lee]

Many seem to forget that both Beldsoe and Goran were extremely inconsistent, which caused the need for more playing time for Thomas. To me, it seemed like an attempt to force the competitive spirit from the two starters. Unfortunately it didn't have that result. However, when they were all on the court at the same time, they did a good job.

You have a chance to nab a 20/6 guy for that contract....you go for it.

Not when you have 2 other point guards on the roster, who both want to start and need the ball in their hands to be effective. Having 3 starting caliber combo point guards is just asking for locker room and chemistry issues. Was having all that turmoil last year before the trade deadline, and wasting another season, really worth having IT as a trade asset? It is not exactly like we got a whole lot for him. Ryan Mcdonough seems to forget that a teams best players shouldn't all play the same position. Its way too redundant, and when you are doing it with combo guards, who cant run an offense, you get the mess the Suns are in.

Re-read this from the Scutt... its such a GD nose on the face simple explanation/summary. Yeah, sure, its no fun because you don't get to blame Dragic for black eying McDoubletalk and forcing the issue. So what... Miami accommodated and most of you here are still filling a drool cup over the marvelous far away assets gifted to us from Riley.

And you Dragon Slayers can periodically take comfort pointing out his contract and production, but if you take the time to read the in-depth discussion on the Miami board, you will see that there are many disappointed with the system Miami is running and not Dragic's play or payday... essentially, it comes down to Wade and his late game ISO mentality. Whiteside and his lane packing presence. And Deng's limit non floor stretching range. (do you guys remember the lectures Los Soles gave on that? you hung on every word from that oracle) Many Heaters want their game to speed up and let the Dragon fly. Give the team to him and Bosh. They are plodders now. Thats not and never has been Dragic's game.... but he and the coaching staff have to respectfully bow to slo-mo Wade on his last hurrah.

If anything, stuff the stats and use the good old fashioned eye test with Knight and Dragic. I don't recall much discussion questioning Goran's BBIQ. His shot selection, his heart, his complete freeze up under fire moments, his inability to finish.... yet, Knight has had issues... scary ones that can only be explained away with the 'but he's only 24' song and dance rinse and repeat routine.

It is what it is, but the convenience of the 'yeah but look what the dragon is doing/getting paid' to defend the acquisition of Knight is a smoke and mirror trick to address the flaws of our new kind-of-might-be-may be PG. We very well could just had IT here instead. And he's ballin now for almost half the Knightly rate.

And as the Scutt says... it didn't have to come down that way... except for the maneuvers of McDamntheTorpedos.

[AtheJ415]

I just want to know what realistically everyone who wants McDonough fired wanted us to do that would have us in a better position in the future. Dragic is 28, and at best let's say he continues playing at all-NBA 3rd team level, so he's the 15th best player in basketball. That isn't a cornerstone you can build around given the age and quality of everyone around him. And there's no evidence that moving him that offseason nets us 3 first rounders. So, what are the moves we should've been making? Who should we have been drafting? Let's see this plan actually work.

Because if this is just because of signing guys like Tyson, well, we could probably move him for something and eliminate that move while gaining an asset, and if anything he's helped us tank. And the whole holding on to Markieff thing could be moved soon, and we can gauge what we get at that time.

I can understand the Knight trade, but that's frankly the only criticism of his I can really understand. We're a rebuilding team. We always have been. Even chemistry issues and other aspects are secondary to talent acquisition when you are rebuilding.