Trade Deadline Countdown....January 2016

[Mr Puddles]

I think a ball-handling SF who can hit the three like Batum is what's needed. Problem is he's likely going to cost the max!

I can see this as being a really solid and balanced starting 5...minus the gaping hole at PF.

Len
?
Batum
Booker
Bledsoe
---
Knight - scoring 6th man/spot starter

Horford would be PERFECT as a stretch 4 and then whatever pick we nab can be eased in.

If they can move Chandler, Kieff and Tucker then we would have room to throw two big deals out at Horford and Batum.

So not a big fan of Warren? I don't see why Horford would leave his situation for ours under any cirumstance. I like Batum pretty well, but I don't want to keep holding up Warren.

Argh duh - I completely forgot him! I do like his game for sure.

I'm not sure if Warren's not better suited to a bench scorer's role, but there's only one way to find out and that's for Hornacek/whoever to play him 32mpg the rest of the season. Then we'll know what we need in the draft and through FA.

I actually think it's a combo forward that we need. Simmons would be perfect. Basically both Simmons and Warren are somewhere between a 3 and a 4, so they can alternate to keep the defense guessing. Also, Simmons' passing should complete Warren's ability to position himself for easy baskets.

C: Len
F: Simmons (#1 pick)
F: Warren
G: Booker
G: Knight

Knight would work well with line-up because he wouldn't have to create. He'd basically have the role that Jason Terry had in Houston. We'll have to see whoever has the most trade value between Knight and Bledsoe IMO, next season.

Trade idea Bledsoe to Orlando, Oladipo to Utah, Gordon + Lyles to Phoenix .

Second Unit:

C: Chandler
F: Lyles
F: Gordon
G: Tucker
G: Melo Trimple (CLE pick)

[King4Day]

Would you do it? Would Brooklyn? Open to modifications.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=hjocqcn

Suns get:
Thad Young
RHJ

Nets Get:
Morris
Tucker
Goodwin

Brooklyn is very high on RHJ from what I understand. Remember, they don't have any of their own picks for a while so they need to develop where they can. They also need to use their upcoming cap space to lure young top talent that will become available.
Getting Morris, Tucker, and a fillter in Goodwin will set them back even further.

I also read a re-draft type article that had RHJ in the top 10.
He's not being traded and if we were lucky enough to do that one, King would have to be fired and banned from anything NBA

[King4Day]

You want salary dumps? There is one obvious one available for the Suns.

Kieff and Chandler for Joe Johnson

Brooklyn gets humans who have contracts to play basketball and the Suns tank and hope they win the lottery and are somehow attractive to FAs this offseason.

I hate the trade but it might honestly be where we're at as a franchise.

The Nets are going to use that capspace to either sign young talent in the offseason or take on expirings for picks like Philly does. They can't afford to take 2 bad players just for the sake of adding players.

[King4Day]

Chandler is done. They should get out of his contract asafp. If there were a way to move Knight, Chandler, and Markieff to Brooklyn for JJ & Lopez I would be super thrilled. I'd include a 1st (just not our own) in order to open up that much cap space. It would mean 40 games of starting Goodwin or Price at PG but I don't even care.

I'm Beating the same drum here but Lopez is BKN's best player. They can probably get a mid late lottery pick for him depending on what the teams that are in the lottery needs.

IMO, the Nets are a team that makes no sense in discussing. They know the direction they have to go in and our players won't help them get there.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Sarver, McDonough and Hornacek want results ASAP. A week ago they were holding meetings asking players to tell inspiring stories about how to make playoffs, Teletovic told them he lost like 19 games in a row and still made it lol, and McD loved it so much he told a radio show.

[No-Man]

the only player Brooklyn might interested in is Knight, the question is, do you trade Knight, and maybe Chandler or Markieff, for Joe mega expiring and a young prospect, like RHJ?
Because that is the only option there.
I'd hold my horses with that type of move just yet.

[Leapinlarry22]

The correct course of action at this point would be to suck for Simmons, with the consolation prize being Ingram. At the end of the year we will all be happy that we had Ben tanking.


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[bwgood77]

So not a big fan of Warren? I don't see why Horford would leave his situation for ours under any cirumstance. I like Batum pretty well, but I don't want to keep holding up Warren.

Argh duh - I completely forgot him! I do like his game for sure.

I'm not sure if Warren's not better suited to a bench scorer's role, but there's only one way to find out and that's for Hornacek/whoever to play him 32mpg the rest of the season. Then we'll know what we need in the draft and through FA.

I actually think it's a combo forward that we need. Simmons would be perfect. Basically both Simmons and Warren are somewhere between a 3 and a 4, so they can alternate to keep the defense guessing. Also, Simmons' passing should complete Warren's ability to position himself for easy baskets.

C: Len
F: Simmons (#1 pick)
F: Warren
G: Booker
G: Knight

Knight would work well with line-up because he wouldn't have to create. He'd basically have the role that Jason Terry had in Houston. We'll have to see whoever has the most trade value between Knight and Bledsoe IMO, next season.

Trade idea Bledsoe to Orlando, Oladipo to Utah, Gordon + Lyles to Phoenix .

Second Unit:

C: Chandler
F: Lyles
F: Gordon
G: Tucker
G: Melo Trimple (CLE pick)

Why would Orlando trade Oladipo and Gordon for Bledsoe when they have Payton? I doubt they want a guy who has had two meniscus tears in three years making what he does while giving up on young guys with tons of potential. Simmons would be perfect with that first pick as Point Forward to keep the ball out of Knight's overdribbling hands but our 1/2/3 defense would stink. We just need to hope Bledsoe comes back and hopefully move Knight to 6th man type role

[bwgood77]

The correct course of action at this point would be to suck for Simmons, with the consolation prize being Ingram. At the end of the year we will all be happy that we had Ben tanking.

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The thing is, we probably will be fairly lucky to get in the bottom 3 or 4, and may end up at 6 or 7, and likely drop a spot from where we end up, but of course you have a decent chance of jumping into top 3 too.

[Mr Puddles]

Argh duh - I completely forgot him! I do like his game for sure.

I'm not sure if Warren's not better suited to a bench scorer's role, but there's only one way to find out and that's for Hornacek/whoever to play him 32mpg the rest of the season. Then we'll know what we need in the draft and through FA.

I actually think it's a combo forward that we need. Simmons would be perfect. Basically both Simmons and Warren are somewhere between a 3 and a 4, so they can alternate to keep the defense guessing. Also, Simmons' passing should complete Warren's ability to position himself for easy baskets.

C: Len
F: Simmons (#1 pick)
F: Warren
G: Booker
G: Knight

Knight would work well with line-up because he wouldn't have to create. He'd basically have the role that Jason Terry had in Houston. We'll have to see whoever has the most trade value between Knight and Bledsoe IMO, next season.

Trade idea Bledsoe to Orlando, Oladipo to Utah, Gordon + Lyles to Phoenix .

Second Unit:

C: Chandler
F: Lyles
F: Gordon
G: Tucker
G: Melo Trimple (CLE pick)

Why would Orlando trade Oladipo and Gordon for Bledsoe when they have Payton? I doubt they want a guy who has had two meniscus tears in three years making what he does while giving up on young guys with tons of potential. Simmons would be perfect with that first pick as Point Forward to keep the ball out of Knight's overdribbling hands but our 1/2/3 defense would stink. We just need to hope Bledsoe comes back and hopefully move Knight to 6th man type role

Altruism? I didn't realize how high Orlando was on Payton, had a quick look on their board and their fans seems to consider him untradeable. How about Knight to Orlando for their top 5 projected 2018 Lakers pick

[bwgood77]

Sarver, McDonough and Hornacek want results ASAP. A week ago they were holding meetings asking players to tell inspiring stories about how to make playoffs, Teletovic told them he lost like 19 games in a row and still made it lol, and McD loved it so much he told a radio show.

I was thinking earlier today about how the KC Chiefs won 10 in a row after starting 1-5 and thought, that's a team sitting at 20% winning rate, and then they win 2 games more than half the season in a streak. That would be like starting 6 and 25 and winning your last 51 games in the NBA. I think they lost Jamaal Charles, their best player somewhere in there too, maybe early on.

Of course something like that has never come close to happening the NBA. Also, once the Chargers started 0-4 and finish 11-5.

But I'm thinking even going on a 12 game winning streak is pretty unlikely with this team, especially with Bledsoe out. We could get considerably better if Knight became a passing machine and Booker and Warren became stud defenders, but what's the point at this point anyway?

I'm interested to see how they respond against Charlotte after some recovery and reflection. You go play 4 games in 5 nights, lose your best player in the 1st game, play competitively in the 2nd, and just run out of wind in the last two and get blown out, one for lack of defense, and one for lack of offense. They must have been so tired in game 5 they couldn't shoot straight. There is just no other way to explain that clankfest.

[bwgood77]

I actually think it's a combo forward that we need. Simmons would be perfect. Basically both Simmons and Warren are somewhere between a 3 and a 4, so they can alternate to keep the defense guessing. Also, Simmons' passing should complete Warren's ability to position himself for easy baskets.

C: Len
F: Simmons (#1 pick)
F: Warren
G: Booker
G: Knight

Knight would work well with line-up because he wouldn't have to create. He'd basically have the role that Jason Terry had in Houston. We'll have to see whoever has the most trade value between Knight and Bledsoe IMO, next season.

Trade idea Bledsoe to Orlando, Oladipo to Utah, Gordon + Lyles to Phoenix .

Second Unit:

C: Chandler
F: Lyles
F: Gordon
G: Tucker
G: Melo Trimple (CLE pick)

Why would Orlando trade Oladipo and Gordon for Bledsoe when they have Payton? I doubt they want a guy who has had two meniscus tears in three years making what he does while giving up on young guys with tons of potential. Simmons would be perfect with that first pick as Point Forward to keep the ball out of Knight's overdribbling hands but our 1/2/3 defense would stink. We just need to hope Bledsoe comes back and hopefully move Knight to 6th man type role

Altruism? I didn't realize how high Orlando was on Payton, had a quick look on their board and their fans seems to consider him untradeable. How about Knight to Orlando for their top 5 projected 2018 Lakers pick

They are playing really competitively AND are stocked with young talent. They are in a good position. I don't really think they need to trade for anything. Who would have thought maybe Skiles was the type of guy we need?

[AtheJ415]

Why are we trying to clear cap space? What FA is going to sign with this team, this off-season, after what has happened over the course of the last month?

Given that nearly 3/4 of NBA teams will have max contract space this summer, many of them with winning records and appealing rosters, dumping assets at their lowest value doesn't make any sense and moving Chandler in January for nothing makes zero sense.

I agree we probably won't get some star this year, but clearing the cap space still has value. You wouldn't do it for this season, you'd do it for the next few seasons. Also, it gives you the freedom to front-load deals or overspend for young guys who could help us down the line (like a Terrence Jones, Evan Fournier, or Whiteside, although I expect him to go to a better team). Keeping vets who aren't helping us or leading us and simply serve to take minutes from the younger players is pointless. It's clear Hornacek likes them, but they don't seem to like each other or playing with each other or the young guys who are important to our future.

That is all well and good but my point remains. A focus on clearing cap space should not be the priority. There are too many teams with cap space to find value. Again, what young players (like Terrence Jones, Evan Fournier, or Whiteside) would choose the Suns in a marketplace where there will be a dozen teams willing to over pay them (many with better situations than PHX).

Chandler is playing better and looks fully healed from that hammy. Let the guy play 25 minutes a game and build his value. Tucker can get back SOMETHING of value. Kieff will be dealt on the 15th for an asset (probably attached to a bad contract).

Trading the three for Joe Johnson is not a good idea.

You'd do it for the following years. Contending teams will use their cap space this year. The following year, all these teams wouldn't have cap space, and you're not just losing the contracts for this season, you lose them going forward. So yes, it has value. Obviously, you'd want to get something more back, but selling cap space as a single year thing is a misnomer. Cap space provides flexibility for as long as you have it. It's a multi-year thing. If you don't lose it, you don't magically lose it or its value.

[bwgood77]

I agree we probably won't get some star this year, but clearing the cap space still has value. You wouldn't do it for this season, you'd do it for the next few seasons. Also, it gives you the freedom to front-load deals or overspend for young guys who could help us down the line (like a Terrence Jones, Evan Fournier, or Whiteside, although I expect him to go to a better team). Keeping vets who aren't helping us or leading us and simply serve to take minutes from the younger players is pointless. It's clear Hornacek likes them, but they don't seem to like each other or playing with each other or the young guys who are important to our future.

That is all well and good but my point remains. A focus on clearing cap space should not be the priority. There are too many teams with cap space to find value. Again, what young players (like Terrence Jones, Evan Fournier, or Whiteside) would choose the Suns in a marketplace where there will be a dozen teams willing to over pay them (many with better situations than PHX).

Chandler is playing better and looks fully healed from that hammy. Let the guy play 25 minutes a game and build his value. Tucker can get back SOMETHING of value. Kieff will be dealt on the 15th for an asset (probably attached to a bad contract).

Trading the three for Joe Johnson is not a good idea.

You'd do it for the following years. Contending teams will use their cap space this year. The following year, all these teams wouldn't have cap space, and you're not just losing the contracts for this season, you lose them going forward. So yes, it has value. Obviously, you'd want to get something more back, but selling cap space as a single year thing is a misnomer. Cap space provides flexibility for as long as you have it. It's a multi-year thing. If you don't lose it, you don't magically lose it or its value.

I gotta agree with jredsaz. If you HAVE to dump them later for cap space, fine, but to not give it some time and assess trade value which you never know when it will pop up due to injuries, people desperate at trade deadlines, desperate after FA targets going elsewhere, etc. Most all of our guys have trade value. Dumping them for cap space when you don't need to at this point in time makes no sense. You can always do so later if you suddenly find out Kevin Durant wants to come to Phx or something.

I thought you wanted to at least get Terrence Jones or a pick for guys like Kieff and not just dump them.

[NavLDO]

The correct course of action at this point would be to suck for Simmons, with the consolation prize being Ingram. At the end of the year we will all be happy that we had Ben tanking.

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The thing is, we probably will be fairly lucky to get in the bottom 3 or 4, and may end up at 6 or 7, and likely drop a spot from where we end up, but of course you have a decent chance of jumping into top 3 too.

I read what you said a couple of posts down, but without Bledsoe, I do not see us sniffing the playoffs, unless we somehow acquire an above average starting PG before the deadline; then, and ONLY then, could I see us making the playoffs.

I don't understand, however, how we can have the really nice 'pieces' we have, yet are just not competitive night after night. Leuer/Tele are better than Kieff has likely been over the past couple of seasons. Leuer can play a bit of 'stretch'; he can play down low and get some tough rebounds. Warren has played very nicely in 80% of his contests. I agree with a article I read recently that said Warren is better off playing the 4 then 3;problem is, what to do with Leuer and Tele. I think Warren has difficult guarding some of the quicker guys at the 3, though.

Len should be starting, and Booker has been a nice surprise this season. Knight plays fairly well, but PG is not his best position, and his stats are inflated by garbage time assists/points.

So, all this points to a decent team, but are missing a solid PG to guide them. I think if we can get an expiring PG (have no idea who), I think this team could get back to being competitive. If we don't, and continue down the same road, we are going to have a lot of nice players, but not a team; and with that a lot of losses. I mean, we just lost to the two worst teams in the NBA...handily. So again, if this continues, I think we have a great shot at being the 3rd or 4th worst record going into the lotto; what happens after that, who knows. I wouldn't be surprised to see us worse off than our '12-'13 season of 25-57--like 23-59, or something to that effect' The difference being, we'll have a nice young roster (Len, Warren, Booker, Leuer, Bledsoe, Knight, and Goodwin to build off of, and a new HC, I'm certain.

[bwgood77]

The correct course of action at this point would be to suck for Simmons, with the consolation prize being Ingram. At the end of the year we will all be happy that we had Ben tanking.

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The thing is, we probably will be fairly lucky to get in the bottom 3 or 4, and may end up at 6 or 7, and likely drop a spot from where we end up, but of course you have a decent chance of jumping into top 3 too.

I read what you said a couple of posts down, but without Bledsoe, I do not see us sniffing the playoffs, unless we somehow acquire an above average starting PG before the deadline; then, and ONLY then, could I see us making the playoffs.

I don't understand, however, how we can have the really nice 'pieces' we have, yet are just not competitive night after night. Leuer/Tele are better than Kieff has likely been over the past couple of seasons. Leuer can play a bit of 'stretch'; he can play down low and get some tough rebounds. Warren has played very nicely in 80% of his contests. I agree with a article I read recently that said Warren is better off playing the 4 then 3;problem is, what to do with Leuer and Tele. I think Warren has difficult guarding some of the quicker guys at the 3, though.

Len should be starting, and Booker has been a nice surprise this season. Knight plays fairly well, but PG is not his best position, and his stats are inflated by garbage time assists/points.

So, all this points to a decent team, but are missing a solid PG to guide them. I think if we can get an expiring PG (have no idea who), I think this team could get back to being competitive. If we don't, and continue down the same road, we are going to have a lot of nice players, but not a team; and with that a lot of losses. I mean, we just lost to the two worst teams in the NBA...handily. So again, if this continues, I think we have a great shot at being the 3rd or 4th worst record going into the lotto; what happens after that, who knows. I wouldn't be surprised to see us worse off than our '12-'13 season of 25-57--like 23-59, or something to that effect' The difference being, we'll have a nice young roster (Len, Warren, Booker, Leuer, Bledsoe, Knight, and Goodwin to build off of, and a new HC, I'm certain.

I really like Leuer, and even if you compare Leuer this year to Markieff last year like I did here http://bkref.com/tiny/iX3kP Leuer is better at many things, like shooting, but Markieff was better at many other things, particulary being a go to guy and clutch scorer at the end of games.

The biggest problem has been, ever since Knight and Bledsoe started off well together, they seemed to get to where they really each wanted to get their own, and so many times got tunnel vision. Knight would have a huge game, so Bledsoe wanted the next huge game, and it seemed like neither looked to pass nearly as much. On top of that PJ's D has regressed, but no one else on the team can play a lick of D. Even Bledsoe measures out barely better than average this year. Everyone else is such a HUGE liability on defense, except Leuer, Len and Chandler, the latter two taking turns being injured, that it's just that it's tough for us to stop ANYONE, and will be particularly without Bledsoe, if Tucker doesn't play.

I'm fine with going young, but we are going to give up a TON of points if we start Knight, Booker and Warren, and we just simply won't be very good. I'd probably alternate the frontcourt with Leuer and PJ at 4, and PJ can slide to 3 when Warren rests, and if we go small, Leuer can play 5. But mostly alternate Len and Chandler at 5 if they can stay healthy, out of foul trouble, not miss dunks and get ejected.

[bwgood77]

Unless there comes a good offer, unrealistic, stay put with Chandler and Knight.
Chandler is easily dumpable during the FA, there are a ton of teams with capspace and not so much talent, some teams are going to fall short and they will want guys to keep competing, Atlanta, Boston, Charlotte, Chicago, Cleveland, Houston, Los Angeles, Miami, Milwaukee, etc, are all teams I can see been in the mix, and maybe giving up a 2nd round pick and a lower contract for him.
Same with Knight, if he puts up good stats he might be moveable, and if not the plan next season should be giving him the Jason Terry role and having him as insurance since the situation with Bledsoe injuries could be a problem.

That means that the guys I'd focus on moving are, Teletovic or Leuer, you are not going to retain both and they might sweeten a deal, Morris, obvious, Goodwin, not much room to grow if BBogdanovic comes over, and Tucker, no way you are gonna re-sign him and PO teams might be interested.

I'd aim for whatever is best that I can get for any combination of those guys, pick the best prospect in next years draft, where you'd have at least 3 quality picks and maybe more if you are able to grab some picks in this deadline for those guys, and dump Chandler during the summer.

The focus should be some type of roster like,...

Bledsoe-Knight-Price?
Booker-Bogdanovic
Warren-Weems-wing draft
PF draft-Leuer or Teletovic-Jefferson?
Len-C draft

Plus whoever you might get in those trades and the FA, try to aim for cheap young talent with some upside, see Portland's past offseason.

I'd easily keep Leuer over Telly, he is much much better defensively and is far more multi dimensional offensively. He might even be cheaper too. I agree about keeping those other guys and not just dumping contracts as I've mentioned. Once teams have injuries or strike out in FA, they may want guys like Chandler, Morris, Tucker or Knight (if we want to trade him).

[Frank Lee]

Bledsoe's Defense prowess was a myth. People looked at his athletic ability, a limited book of business, and projected him to be some sort of lock down defender all D guy.

He isn't.

his length, speed and hops allow him to make up for lack of pure intensity and desire. Seems to me his steals usually come off of lazy entry passes and rarely from his on Ball pressure. His blocks are more chase down ones.

Am I wrong ? Can we just quit pretending are players are better than what they are ? The rest of the league has.

[RaisingArizona]

We can't win a game without Bledsoe. I think that should tell you all you need to know about his worth to us.

[Barkley_34]

We can't win a game without Bledsoe. I think that should tell you all you need to know about his worth to us.

this!