2016 Draft

[Foliohattu]

Dragan Bender to me is a high risk, potentially high reward... but as mentioned earlier... what are the chances of another young euro tall living up to his potential. It almost never happens. Porzingis is the "latest" euro tall to live up to the hype... a year later, another one is available???.... they dont fall from trees afterall.

So if Porzingis would've been a bust, you would feel more comfortable picking Dragan ?

[Damkac]

You're right. Porzingis and Bender are 2 different players and I don't know how they affect each other. Imo Porzingis playing good makes Bender looks like a more safe choice.

[bwgood77]

You're right. Porzingis and Bender are 2 different players and I don't know how they affect each other. Imo Porzingis playing good makes Bender looks like a more safe choice.

I was a lot higher on Porzingis when the draft was approaching than I am on Bender, now, but there is time. He looks good in some videos, but we knew this was a weak draft. There may not be much difference between the 3rd and 10th pick, so it may not matter where we pick. We are going to need some luck no matter where we finish to get a top 3 pick anyway. If you finish 2nd you still need luck to get a top 2 pick, same as if you finish 5th. Your odds are better, but it still boils down to luck.

[thamadkant]

Dragan Bender to me is a high risk, potentially high reward... but as mentioned earlier... what are the chances of another young euro tall living up to his potential. It almost never happens. Porzingis is the "latest" euro tall to live up to the hype... a year later, another one is available???.... they dont fall from trees afterall.

So if Porzingis would've been a bust, you would feel more comfortable picking Dragan ?

Yes.

Odds become higher that the next Euro Tall is the heir to Dirk lol

[No-Man]

This talk about Bender, and some of the comps I read just proves that people havent seen him play, like at all, he is similar to Kirilenko in Pau's body, or a taller Kukoc, his best trait right now is how intelligent he is defensively, and versatile, plus his shooting and passing ability.
He is not as long, or as athletic, vertically as KP6, but he is much more fluid and a more advanced basketball player at the same age.
At Bender's age, KP6 was barely starting to play with Sevilla, a much worse team than Maccabi.

[MrMiyagi]

This talk about Bender, and some of the comps I read just proves that people havent seen him play, like at all, he is similar to Kirilenko in Pau's body, or a taller Kukoc, his best trait right now is how intelligent he is defensively, and versatile, plus his shooting and passing ability.
He is not as long, or as athletic, vertically as KP6, but he is much more fluid and a more advanced basketball player at the same age.
At Bender's age, KP6 was barely starting to play with Sevilla, a much worse team than Maccabi.

That is the biggest reason I'm leery of international players, there is a lot of misinformation about them. Porzingis seemed to come from nowhere, there were highlights of him but people were making huge claims that seemed way too good to be true, and then he didn't work out against guys like Towns and Okafor, it makes you wonder if he's even close to being that good. Now, he's doing pretty well, I'll admit I was wrong, but when you have guys like Jan Vesely and Yi Jianlian and Bargnani being taken really high and not living up to the hype, it makes me question every international prospect. Dante Exum and Mudiay and Brandon Jennings and Hezonja are included, it's not just the big guys. Two out of those four have had some success so far in their careers, but how it makes you wonder good are those international leagues really? Professional just means you get paid to do it, it doesn't have any bearing on the level of competition.

Now I'm not saying international basketball is bad or all international players can't play in the NBA, but I am familiar with college basketball because it is readily available. I can watch these guys play entire games instead of catching their highlights. I can see Ben Simmons be a knucklehead, throwing an arm at Skal Labissiere, or Jakob Poeltl be a non-factor against the Wildcats twice last season or Buddy Hield have the game of his life agains Kansas after not doing so hot against Iowa St. Who is Bender going up against? I have no clue.

[No-Man]

Well, in my case I am spanish and had watched next to every game Porzingis played in ACB or Eurocup, have watched a ton of Bender play in under-age national team tournaments, plus israeli league, it is not difficult to watch if you are into it.

Bender is going up against much higher competition, you can bet on that, especially when he, rarely, plays Euroleague.
Still, Dragan just turned 18 and is already in a team of the importance of Maccabi, and palying well in the israeli league, that speaks wonders.
He is the best player out of his generation in Europe clearly, the best players out of the last generations have been Giannis, Saric, Hezonja, Porzingis, or Poeltl who is left to make it to the league next summer.
With the exception of 96' class who is pretty weak, in terms of europeans, the other 3 have been oustanding (94', 95' and 97' looks the part).

And by the way, Bargnani is a fine player, he would still go top10 in a re-draft of his class, he was just part of a really poor class, first one without high schoolers, and had some desire/motivation issues, Vesely is a tremendous player who is an NBA talent no doubt if used correctly (top5-10 player in Euroleague) and Yi was a lie, he was 3 years older than advertised.

[AtheJ415]

Can somebody who watches Marquette tell me a bit about Ellenson's defense and passing?

[Twuan89]

Will the Suns be able to get Simmons or Ingram?

Or will the Suns beat able to land a superstar in the draft?

[Twuan89]

What do you guys think about Ivan Rabb?

[bwgood77]

Can somebody who watches Marquette tell me a bit about Ellenson's defense and passing?

Don't know about his defense, but one GM mentioned his passing.

4. Henry Ellenson


Previous rank: No. 6
Marquette
Freshman
Forward/center

Last month I wrote that Ellenson was a hot month away from surpassing Jaylen Brown and Skal Labissiere on our board. I wouldn't say he lit it up over the past month, but his more-than-solid play as a freshman -- combined with major struggles by Brown and Labissiere -- has pushed him past both.

His shaky 3-point shooting (just 26 percent from deep) is a source of concern, but he's stroking the ball from everywhere else on the floor.

"Every time I see him I can't help but see some Kevin Love there," one NBA GM said. "He's probably a better shooter at this stage and I think he's a more willing passer."

With teams emphasizing bigs who can stretch the floor and still protect the rim, he should be very popular on draft night.

From Chad Ford's latest big board. http://espn.go.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/14541016/chad-ford-big-board-40-led-ben-simmons-brandon-ingram-nba-draft-2016

This sounds like the ideal guard for McD, likely falling right in our range (right where Brandon Knight was taken and sounds JUST LIKE HIM!):

8. Jamal Murray


Previous rank: No. 8
Kentucky
Freshman
Guard

Where would Kentucky be without Murray right now? While the rest of its elite recruiting class has struggled, Murray has been the Wildcats' go-to scorer. Murray's ability to create his own shot, his deep range and his terrific feel all make him a great prospect.

However, scouts are beginning to wonder about his ability to play the point in the NBA. When Tyler Ulis is out and Murray is running the offense, he doesn't look as comfortable as some hoped. That could give teams pause before taking him in the top 10.

At 6-foot-5, he has great size if he's a point guard. But if he's a 2-guard in the NBA, he's average in size and that could be an issue without elite athleticism.

And, more on Dunn..

5. Kris Dunn


Previous rank: No. 9
Providence
Junior
Guard

Dunn has been one of the three or four best players in the country. His speed with the ball, creative ball handling, passing skills and willingness to rebound are all major pluses. And after a slow start shooting from deep, Dunn is 11-for-17 from 3 in his past four games.

His age (he turns 22 in March) and questions about his long-term shooting promise (his 65 percent free throw shooting is telling) give scouts pause. But with the possible exception of Buddy Hield, there hasn't been a more dynamic guard in the country this season.

[bwgood77]

What do you guys think about Ivan Rabb?

I haven't watched him much, but here is Chad Ford's recent comments on his latest big board

12. Ivan Rabb


Previous rank: No. 11
Cal
Freshman
Forward/center

A year ago Rabb was ahead of Labissiere on most recruiting boards, only to see the Kentucky prospect pass him after a terrific spring. Now Rabb, who some believed lacked the physicality to be a one-and-done prospect, could end up ahead of Labissiere.

Rabb has not only been a solid low-post threat (he shoots 80 percent at the rim) and rebounder for Cal, he also has shown the ability to step out and shoot. He's hitting 46 percent of his jumpers, about 20 percent higher than teammate Jaylen Brown.

http://espn.go.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/14541016/chad-ford-big-board-40-led-ben-simmons-brandon-ingram-nba-draft-2016

[ATTL]

Diamond Stone with 15&9 so far against Michigan. Wouldn't take him with our top pick unless something odd happens.

[bwgood77]

Diamond Stone with 15&9 so far against Michigan. Wouldn't take him with our top pick unless something odd happens.

Wow, check out his points per shot attempt against Michigan and Penn St. 39 pts on 15 shots? Shoots 25 free throws? That's Penn St, but 22 on 13 shots tonight with 9 free throws.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/3924880/diamond-stone

[ATTL]

Diamond Stone with 15&9 so far against Michigan. Wouldn't take him with our top pick unless something odd happens.

Wow, check out his points per shot attempt against Michigan and Penn St. 39 pts on 15 shots? Shoots 25 free throws? That's Penn St, but 22 on 13 shots tonight with 9 free throws.

http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/3924880/diamond-stone

He'll probably shoot up the board if he has a good tournament.

[TheTrooper]

That is the biggest reason I'm leery of international players, there is a lot of misinformation about them. Porzingis seemed to come from nowhere, there were highlights of him but people were making huge claims that seemed way too good to be true, and then he didn't work out against guys like Towns and Okafor, it makes you wonder if he's even close to being that good. Now, he's doing pretty well, I'll admit I was wrong, but when you have guys like Jan Vesely and Yi Jianlian and Bargnani being taken really high and not living up to the hype, it makes me question every international prospect.

Bargniani didn't live up the hype,but when you look at it now he is not that bad.A lot of the guys in the lottery from that draft are not in the NBA anymore. Vesely was predictable, but scouts were too much in love with his athletic abilities to look at everything else. Yi.....wasnt he older or something ?

Dante Exum and Mudiay and Brandon Jennings and Hezonja are included, it's not just the big guys. Two out of those four have had some success so far in their careers, but how it makes you wonder good are those international leagues really? Professional just means you get paid to do it, it doesn't have any bearing on the level of competition.

Wait....it's a bit too early to tell for 3 out of those 4 mentioned. For Mudiay and Hezonja way way too early. They haven even played half a season in the NBA.

As far as the quality of the basketball it really depends on the league we are talking about. Most leagues are really bad, or only have a couple of teams that stand out and bring the quality up a bit. Spanish league, Turkish and VTB leagues are stronger than college. ABA, Italian, German, Greek and French are not as good, but have several strong teams that stick out.
The strongest of course is the Euroleague in which the top teams from all over the continent play. Euroleague teams are generally really strong.

[saintEscaton]

Its gunna be a total crapshoot if we're picking outside the Top 5. Hope we have a chance to land one of the Cal guys as a contingency plan

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

Its gunna be a total crapshoot if we're picking outside the Top 5.

Fortunately, we are excellent at shooting crap.

[bwgood77]

Its gunna be a total crapshoot if we're picking outside the Top 5. Hope we have a chance to land one of the Cal guys as a contingency plan

Who's your top 5? The consensus three and who else? I'm guessing you don't like Ellenson based on an earlier comment so who? Dunn?

[saintEscaton]

Its gunna be a total crapshoot if we're picking outside the Top 5. Hope we have a chance to land one of the Cal guys as a contingency plan

Who's your top 5? The consensus three and who else? I'm guessing you don't like Ellenson based on an earlier comment so who? Dunn?

3) Dunn
4) Bender
5) Brown