Ryan Kelly at Center

[LApwnd]

Scott should try that crazy line up more....Dlo/Clarkson/Nance/Randle/Kelly.....looked kind find last night hahaha, or maybe that's cause nobody cared anymore at that point?

[stan francisco]

Milesfides, you're one of the posters that inspired me sign up here for good discussion. I usually agree with much of what you say, and I love how well you always back up your opinions with well presented informed substance and sound reasoning.

Plus, you can sell snow to Eskimos.

First of all, I think they should try what you suggest. I see no reason why they shouldn't. In this case, however, and I know that you're very well aware of the Lakers tradition of big men like Mikan, Wilt, KAJ, Shaq, Gasol. Through that historical lens, my eye test on Kelly says it's yellow snow. I see his ceiling as a prime Brian Cooke. He was serviceable. But, as I'm sure you agree with, this is a band aid on a torn off limb in the reputable lake show that always won with great bigs. I, like you, don't expect this lineup change that you suggest will change the balance of the WC, but we could at the very least raise his trade value by giving him this opportunity of time along the lines of Suckre's minutes. We should definitely exhaust this as an option before saying no. If it works, it works.

But in my view, I'd take a 6'10" non-shooting screen setting beast like Tarik Black, Tractor Traylor etc, over a Kelly, Cooke type 7'0" and 100Lbs every day, if you know what I mean. I believe it's a center's sport, that grinding inside out ball and fearsome rebounding and boxing out by bumping out and playing heavy down low still wins championships in the long run. Kelly doesn't match that vision. GSW is a temporary uniqum, one ankle twist away from not winning rings. A fad not to adjust to, in my opinion. I want to build a heavy roster that others have yo react to instead. Be the aggressor in changing it back to being a big man's league. The paint should hurt a bit. Fast breaks.

Still, we should try it. With tempered expectations.

Pleasure speaking with you here.

[stan francisco]

What's his name in San Antonio, Marjanovic? I like that type of center. He can move off the ball, and he is a beast of a Bigfoot down low. His numbers my suck statistically, I don't know, but he hurts you in the paint, literally just by being massive. Doesn't show in stats how much it hurts but in seven games, it wins you a potentially deciding edge in that series. Especially with our young guards, they need a rock solid screen setter, back to the basket beast..

[milesfides]

Agreed, I just don't see those kinds of big men out there. As good as Golden State is, a prime Shaq would destroy them for three quarters and Kobe would finish them off in the fourth. A prime Shaq would affect how teams assemble their rosters and organize their philosophies - league-wide. Just that one player messed up so many teams because they had to roll with some 7-foot 300 pound stiff just to give him some resistance. In many ways, Kobe inspired all these Kobe-stoppers too, these one-dimensional guards who made a living just guarding Kobe (and T-Mac, Vince, etc.), and we still see ghosts of that today.

I'm not on the GSW bandwagon. Kerr, Steph and Draymond/Iggy make them special. Pop, Duncan, and Kawhi make SA special. It'll be a fool's errand to try to rebuild their exact formula, in the same way teams were foolish to try to emulate the Kobe-Shaq Lakers.

But I am fan of the general trend of analytics, because it subverts prejudices and provides different ways of solving a problem. I'm a fan of open-minded, flexible ways of looking at the game. You've got to respect such an old guard like Pop, who still decided to adopt the 3-point shot as a major part of the Spurs' offense. Only the Spurs would look at Diaw, a failed point guard, a failed small forward, into a center. But Diaw knows how to play the game, and that's how he hurts you, because you can't gameplan him as simply as you do other centers.

It's silly trying to emulate a Curry or a Green, but we can emulate how Kerr followed the advice of his video coordinator and started Iguodala for Bogut, despite getting out rebounded - and even playing David Lee, whom everybody considered a defensive liability, but he was huge for them in turning that series. And Iguodala got the MVP, but credit the Warriors staff, because having another great basketball player on the court was the decisive factor in the series. Iguodala's defense, shooting, passing, all of that - forget position - he's a basketball player. The Warriors won the small vs. big not because small is inherently better, but because small consisted of better basketball players.

That's the common denominator, isn't it? Talent. Forget position, forget preconceived notions of how to win - put your talented players on the floor in a context that capitalizes on their strengths. In short, put the five best basketball players on the floor, which ends up being small ball just because it's statistically hard to find giants, and even harder to find giants who can play a skill game.

But this in general leads to good basketball, good ball movement, because five guys who can play ball will always beat one, even if that one is a Kobe, MJ, or a Shaq.

As an aside, Kobe did it his way. It's amazing that a selfish, single-minded stubborn player won 5-rings by the force of his will and individual talent. You have to think, though, what he would have accomplished, had he been more open-minded, more unselfish with how he saw the game.

As far as Kelly goes, I don't think the Brian Cook comparison is really fair. Cook did nothing except set that high pick and pop for the three. In fact, 3-point shooting is probably Kelly's weakest part of his game. Kelly's not a shooter like Cook, he's a team guy. Makes the extra pass, takes good shots, attacks the basket, plays team defense. He does nothing great, but a lot of things well, and considering his size, maybe really well. I think he would burn teams the way Diaw does, because Kelly can do a lot of different things, and his team-first attitude is not only a positive, it's a requirement for this current selfish roster.

In short, I think we should play Kelly at center because he's the best basketball player among our bigs, and we've got nothing to lose. Even if he just becomes a trade asset, that's better than nothing, since he's probably walking at the end of the season.

[stan francisco]

Good post. I agree that we should try. In fact, early this season I was hoping he would drive a bit more to the rim off of head fakes, to open up his shooting, but then he got benched forever. I was optimistic. Then the "BS system" dog house nulled his PT... I just wanted expectations to be tempered to reality. Even if it works as great as one can hope, he's still a twig, never will be a back to basket beast with badass defense like I think we need to swing style back to fast break showtime.

Long term lens: Noah could be a bargain this summer now. I expect full recovery because he's a hard, hard worker by nature. Recovering, he'll be a determined physical therapy study.

Whiteside: my top choice C target outside of Drummond and Gasol who are untouchable.

Nevertheless, I'd center the major FA signings around a center first, then the other pieces. Well, unless Durant wants to be it. If he doesn't, build around a center and I'm looking at Batum and Iggy as our secondary need (SF) from free agency for next season.

Lots can and will happen before then.

[TKainZero]

I like whiteside as well, but his assist numbers are a red flag (especially with so many "me first" players on the team already.

Noah is a good passer

It all depends on where the pick falls. Adding simmions, and then trading for another superstar (cousins) could make it appealing to a top-flight FA (durrant)


If we get the 3rd pick (no simmions no ingraham) I would be interested to see what the move is, and think it is possible that the team would move the pick for a player

[DEEP3CL]

If anybody watched Kelly last night against the Rockets.....how in hell can you tell me this man can play heavy NBA minutes?

Like I said his ball IQ to actual ability is horrible....yeah he may have a decent IQ but his ability doesn't match. Look Kelly can stick in thos league only when he realizes his actual abilities. Now a lot of this is on our guards who don't realize how and when he should be getting the ball.

I know how Kelly should play as opposed to guys here who think you can just load minutes on him. Kelly is a spot up shooter with weak rebounding ability and not a very good man on man defender.

It is what it is....forget what the fantasy numbers say,the eye test is all I'll ever need to judge him.

[Marionettetc]

Miles just likes to see himself type. I'm pretty sure even he knows Kelly doesn't belong in the league.

[milesfides]

Calm down, it was one game. Also he grabbed 9 boards in 20 min. He's had some really good games too.

Can't accurately evaluate a player unless you give him a legit opportunity.

Based on the trade rumor reports and diminished role, Hibbert looks on his way out.

Nance should be iced for the rest of the year, considering his knee and well, we know what he can do now.

That leaves Kelly and Black, so I'm looking forward to seeing what they can do for the rest of the year.

You guys can keep whining, but it's going to happen, because there's no alternative. Looks like the Lakers have realized it.