General NBA Discussion Thread

[Hero]

Drummond probably was in awe of the greatness that is KAT. Such power. Such speed.

[primopastalove2]

Drummond is the most overrated player in the league, along with DJ and Whiteside. All those put up empty stats even more so than love. They all cannot shot free throws, are among the worst post up players that are qualified, are terrible defender as centre and gets praised for putting up the most overrated stats rebound. I cannot believe the obsession over rebounds, I mean Reggie Evans was good at that, if RE was good at something you know it should be irrelevant.

[zilby]

Marc Gasol with 2 rebounds in 31 minutes in a loss to the Wolves. Bargnani much?

obviously not, but I think it's exceedingly obvious that we'd see JV crucified by certain posters had he logged only 2 rebounds in that amount of time, especially in a loss against a poor team.

For what it's worth, Marc only had 3 rebound chances. So by collecting 66.7% of the available rebounds in his vicinity I'd say he did what he was supposed to. Simply goes to show you can't simply say "2 rebounds for a 7 footer? unacceptable, he's Bargnani-like!" There's always more to it than that.

Speaking for myself, I can assure you I will never make the mistake of comparing former Defensive Player of The Year Marc Gasol to Bargnani, for obvious reasons. :p

Lue was never going to change anything in Cleveland. It's still the LeBron show and it's only a matter of time before LBJ either bolts again or Lue is scapegoated for something that was never his fault, nor Blatt's. LeBron never took well to coaching, it's always about him and whatever he wants. I have no doubts that if someone in the Cavs organization tried to control him, he'd have zero issues taking off again.

As for tonight, basically all the teams in the tanking race won, so no complaints lol. Need them to catch up to the Knicks (except you, Denver, you stay in that same crappy position) and for NY to fall off. They're all extremely clustered together and it'd only take a bad week from the Knicks and a good week from everyone else to vault them to a very low standing. Already tonight, the Knicks loss knocked them down a spot to Washington, and they're something like a single percentage point from falling two or three more spots. Need a lot of things to go our way here.

[Kabookalu]

Detroit bit the dust was Drummond hurt?

No, he's not hurt. He's a baby.

Watch a Pistons game, he has terrible body language, looks annoyed a lot of the time and has poor defensive instincts to begin with.

It's too bad. The guy has the potential to be the most dominant C in the league. There are multiple threads on the Pistons forum about this if you doubt it.

Eg. - viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1423618

Funny I've been saying this since before he was drafted. Drummond is the classic gentle giant. If he wasn't a 6'11 athletic behemoth he'd be studying engineering or something. Watch all of his videos before the NBA, he's a family oriented man that loves to smile and wants nothing but good vibes. Hardening him up was always an uphill task.

With that said I still wanted him. It's kind of ironic that Ross' mentality isn't too far off from Drummond's.

[Thespianoid]

Detroit bit the dust was Drummond hurt?

No, he's not hurt. He's a baby.

Watch a Pistons game, he has terrible body language, looks annoyed a lot of the time and has poor defensive instincts to begin with.

It's too bad. The guy has the potential to be the most dominant C in the league. There are multiple threads on the Pistons forum about this if you doubt it.

Eg. - viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1423618

Funny I've been saying this since before he was drafted. Drummond is the classic gentle giant. If he wasn't a 6'11 athletic behemoth he'd be studying engineering or something. Watch all of his videos before the NBA, he's a family oriented man that loves to smile and wants nothing but good vibes. Hardening him up was always an uphill task.

With that said I still wanted him. It's kind of ironic that Ross' mentality isn't too far off from Drummond's.

Sounds a bit like Andrew Bynum. Obviously not comparing the two, but when you brought up engineering, I immediately thought of Bynum, whose biggest interest was computers. If what you say is true, Drummond's inherent personality might not be cut out for the ultra-competitive, dog-eat-dog environment of the NBA. Somewhat like Larry Sanders, who realized his heart wasn't in basketball and decided to spend his life doing other things.

Actually makes me wonder how well SVG's tough love approach will work with Drummond. He's really testing him, pushing him to take over a leadership role, assert himself and his will. Much like with Dwight, I'm not sure it will work. Dwight's just not that kind of personality. So far it seems like Drummond may be shrinking away from the pressure, but got to give it time.

Related segue, this hits at the heart of the side of coaching that we don't really consider aside from X's and O's - managing egos, personalities, etc. Catering your development/motivational style to the personnel you have in order to get the most out of them (Same goes for physical training actually, but that's a separate discipline). Spurs are some of the best at this, either through better teaching or through better identifying of personalities that will fit their culture.

[7 Footer]

Drummond is the most overrated player in the league, along with DJ and Whiteside. All those put up empty stats even more so than love. They all cannot shot free throws, are among the worst post up players that are qualified, are terrible defender as centre and gets praised for putting up the most overrated stats rebound. I cannot believe the obsession over rebounds, I mean Reggie Evans was good at that, if RE was good at something you know it should be irrelevant.

LMFAO, imagine the chaos on here when Drummond would miss free throws. He'd be eaten alive

[Thespianoid]

Drummond is the most overrated player in the league, along with DJ and Whiteside. All those put up empty stats even more so than love. They all cannot shot free throws, are among the worst post up players that are qualified, are terrible defender as centre and gets praised for putting up the most overrated stats rebound. I cannot believe the obsession over rebounds, I mean Reggie Evans was good at that, if RE was good at something you know it should be irrelevant.

LMFAO, imagine the chaos on here when Drummond would miss free throws. He'd be eaten alive

or if he misses a defensive rotation, or wasn't able to block a shot while contesting.

That kinda stuff happens quite a lot with Drummond, but let's just keep saying "bench him/terrible defense/release him each time that happens with JV. You want to see a high level of defensive focus and effort, obviously. If a guy misses an obvious rotation, or isn't contesting like he should, then by all means call them out. But no player will be 100% perfect on every possession. That's simply not possible.

[cammac]

Drummond is the most overrated player in the league, along with DJ and Whiteside. All those put up empty stats even more so than love. They all cannot shot free throws, are among the worst post up players that are qualified, are terrible defender as centre and gets praised for putting up the most overrated stats rebound. I cannot believe the obsession over rebounds, I mean Reggie Evans was good at that, if RE was good at something you know it should be irrelevant.

LMFAO, imagine the chaos on here when Drummond would miss free throws. He'd be eaten alive

or if he misses a defensive rotation, or wasn't able to block a shot while contesting.

That kinda stuff happens quite a lot with Drummond, but let's just keep saying "bench JV" each time that happens. You want to see a high level of defensive focus and effort, obviously. If a guy misses an obvious rotation, or isn't contesting like he should, then by all means call them out. But no player will be 100% perfect on every possession. That's simply not possible.

Since his hand injury Jonas has become a better all round player yes he is far from perfect but he has definitely improved his assist rate substantially 2.5 , his block rate has doubled, his steals increased, rebounds up marginally only his offensive numbers are down marginally. His defense is a work in progress but it works within the current defensive system and will get better as he matures. Yes it was a mistake not drafting Drummond but only from the aspect that he could have been traded for assets. Ive always believed Jonas will be a better overall C.

[deeps6x]

No, he's not hurt. He's a baby.

Watch a Pistons game, he has terrible body language, looks annoyed a lot of the time and has poor defensive instincts to begin with.

It's too bad. The guy has the potential to be the most dominant C in the league. There are multiple threads on the Pistons forum about this if you doubt it.

Eg. - viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1423618

Funny I've been saying this since before he was drafted. Drummond is the classic gentle giant. If he wasn't a 6'11 athletic behemoth he'd be studying engineering or something. Watch all of his videos before the NBA, he's a family oriented man that loves to smile and wants nothing but good vibes. Hardening him up was always an uphill task.

With that said I still wanted him. It's kind of ironic that Ross' mentality isn't too far off from Drummond's.

Sounds a bit like Andrew Bynum. Obviously not comparing the two, but when you brought up engineering, I immediately thought of Bynum, whose biggest interest was computers. If what you say is true, Drummond's inherent personality might not be cut out for the ultra-competitive, dog-eat-dog environment of the NBA. Somewhat like Larry Sanders, who realized his heart wasn't in basketball and decided to spend his life doing other things.

Actually makes me wonder how well SVG's tough love approach will work with Drummond. He's really testing him, pushing him to take over a leadership role, assert himself and his will. Much like with Dwight, I'm not sure it will work. Dwight's just not that kind of personality. So far it seems like Drummond may be shrinking away from the pressure, but got to give it time.

Related segue, this hits at the heart of the side of coaching that we don't really consider aside from X's and O's - managing egos, personalities, etc. Catering your development/motivational style to the personnel you have in order to get the most out of them (Same goes for physical training actually, but that's a separate discipline). Spurs are some of the best at this, either through better teaching or through better identifying of personalities that will fit their culture.

Yup and Casey may be great or horrible at the stuff that goes on behind the scenes.


However, if we lose in the first round again, I WANT HIM GONE!

[Thespianoid]

Funny I've been saying this since before he was drafted. Drummond is the classic gentle giant. If he wasn't a 6'11 athletic behemoth he'd be studying engineering or something. Watch all of his videos before the NBA, he's a family oriented man that loves to smile and wants nothing but good vibes. Hardening him up was always an uphill task.

With that said I still wanted him. It's kind of ironic that Ross' mentality isn't too far off from Drummond's.

Sounds a bit like Andrew Bynum. Obviously not comparing the two, but when you brought up engineering, I immediately thought of Bynum, whose biggest interest was computers. If what you say is true, Drummond's inherent personality might not be cut out for the ultra-competitive, dog-eat-dog environment of the NBA. Somewhat like Larry Sanders, who realized his heart wasn't in basketball and decided to spend his life doing other things.

Actually makes me wonder how well SVG's tough love approach will work with Drummond. He's really testing him, pushing him to take over a leadership role, assert himself and his will. Much like with Dwight, I'm not sure it will work. Dwight's just not that kind of personality. So far it seems like Drummond may be shrinking away from the pressure, but got to give it time.

Related segue, this hits at the heart of the side of coaching that we don't really consider aside from X's and O's - managing egos, personalities, etc. Catering your development/motivational style to the personnel you have in order to get the most out of them (Same goes for physical training actually, but that's a separate discipline). Spurs are some of the best at this, either through better teaching or through better identifying of personalities that will fit their culture.

Yup and Casey may be great or horrible at the stuff that goes on behind the scenes.


However, if we lose in the first round again, I WANT HIM GONE!

I actually think Casey is very good at the stuff that goes on behind the scenes. That's his strength. It's the X's and O's stuff where he struggles a bit. Rotations, plays, timeouts to enforce unselfish team play.

If the team does lose in the first round again, it's tough to see him being retained. That will have been three straight years of disappointment, and as we've seen lately, the coach is the first to go.

[Kabookalu]

No, he's not hurt. He's a baby.

Watch a Pistons game, he has terrible body language, looks annoyed a lot of the time and has poor defensive instincts to begin with.

It's too bad. The guy has the potential to be the most dominant C in the league. There are multiple threads on the Pistons forum about this if you doubt it.

Eg. - viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1423618

Funny I've been saying this since before he was drafted. Drummond is the classic gentle giant. If he wasn't a 6'11 athletic behemoth he'd be studying engineering or something. Watch all of his videos before the NBA, he's a family oriented man that loves to smile and wants nothing but good vibes. Hardening him up was always an uphill task.

With that said I still wanted him. It's kind of ironic that Ross' mentality isn't too far off from Drummond's.

Sounds a bit like Andrew Bynum. Obviously not comparing the two, but when you brought up engineering, I immediately thought of Bynum, whose biggest interest was computers. If what you say is true, Drummond's inherent personality might not be cut out for the ultra-competitive, dog-eat-dog environment of the NBA. Somewhat like Larry Sanders, who realized his heart wasn't in basketball and decided to spend his life doing other things.

Actually makes me wonder how well SVG's tough love approach will work with Drummond. He's really testing him, pushing him to take over a leadership role, assert himself and his will. Much like with Dwight, I'm not sure it will work. Dwight's just not that kind of personality. So far it seems like Drummond may be shrinking away from the pressure, but got to give it time.

Related segue, this hits at the heart of the side of coaching that we don't really consider aside from X's and O's - managing egos, personalities, etc. Catering your development/motivational style to the personnel you have in order to get the most out of them (Same goes for physical training actually, but that's a separate discipline). Spurs are some of the best at this, either through better teaching or through better identifying of personalities that will fit their culture.

I was off and on about how Drummond should be developed. At one point I believed Stan's approach was the correct one, throw him in the fire and see how he responds. Mo Cheeks had the complete opposite approach, encouraging him and easing in his development, and I wasn't sure if that was delaying his development. In the end though I'm not sure if there's a correct answer here, because it seems no matter what, Drummond's just never going to change his kind hearted ways. The tough love approach may push him away, but the holding your hand one still means he's going to underachieve.

Not sure how to get Drummond out of his shell without resorting to extreme measures. It really is a shame sometimes because Drummond is one of the most fascinating physical specimens we've seen since LeBron James.

[Thespianoid]

LMFAO, imagine the chaos on here when Drummond would miss free throws. He'd be eaten alive

or if he misses a defensive rotation, or wasn't able to block a shot while contesting.

That kinda stuff happens quite a lot with Drummond, but let's just keep saying "bench JV" each time that happens. You want to see a high level of defensive focus and effort, obviously. If a guy misses an obvious rotation, or isn't contesting like he should, then by all means call them out. But no player will be 100% perfect on every possession. That's simply not possible.

Since his hand injury Jonas has become a better all round player yes he is far from perfect but he has definitely improved his assist rate substantially 2.5 , his block rate has doubled, his steals increased, rebounds up marginally only his offensive numbers are down marginally. His defense is a work in progress but it works within the current defensive system and will get better as he matures. Yes it was a mistake not drafting Drummond but only from the aspect that he could have been traded for assets. Ive always believed Jonas will be a better overall C.

I think JV's hand injury was a blessing in disguise, really - came back more mobile and active, more unselfish and looking to pass the ball, better defensive focus. He's being used and playing more like his rookie year (roll/elbow primarily with a few post touches), and while his offense has been down a bit, it seems to be just an adjustment period. Need to remember to shoot open jumpers without hesitation. Need to consistently be focused defensively, and contest around the rim often.

Drummond obviously has the greater overall potential. No doubting that - his physical attributes simply make him the better talent. But it's a greater WIP in terms of his attitude and approach than it is JV's skillset and focus.

[Thespianoid]

I was off and on about how Drummond should be developed. At one point I believed Stan's approach was the correct one, throw him in the fire and see how he responds. Mo Cheeks had the complete opposite approach, encouraging him and easing in his development, and I wasn't sure if that was delaying his development. In the end though I'm not sure if there's a correct answer here, because it seems no matter what, Drummond's just never going to change his kind hearted ways. The tough love approach may push him away, but the holding your hand one still means he's going to underachieve.

Not sure how to get Drummond out of his shell without resorting to extreme measures. It really is a shame sometimes because Drummond is one of the most fascinating physical specimens we've seen since LeBron James.

I suppose we're seeing both approaches tried with Drummond thus far. Opposite Cheeks/SVG styles, and if neither of them work, then what will? There's still a lot of time. Drummond is young. He may yet respond positively to SVG's style and tap into his full potential. Hell, in a way he already has through his statistical pts/rebs production (but that may have to do with usage).

It's possible that Casey has taken the Cheeks approach with JV. Slowly easing him into his development, slow increases of usage (1% per year, which is SLOW) and responsibility within the offense, as well as with anchoring the defense. Whether or not that was the correct approach for his personality, that's up for debate. Maybe his efficiency and production has been maximized to this point. I'd argue it's time to take the next step though - increase his usage from around 20% to the 25% range, across elbow touches and post touches. His efficiency warrants as much.

[Mikestro]

If there has ever been a year where we have even the SLIGHTEST chance of making the NBA Finals... It's this year.

[Potential]

Lol the bulls have the best free throw shooting defense in the league.

[Potential]

We're 5.5 games separated from the 5th seed... there are 4 teams currently 23-21 tied for 5th

CLE
TOR - 2.5 games back

CHI
ATL - both 3 games back of us

IND
DET
BOS
MIA - all 5.5 games back of us

[Asif16]

We're 5.5 games separated from the 5th seed... there are 4 teams currently 23-21 tied for 5th

CLE
TOR - 2.5 games back

CHI
ATL - both 3 games back of us

IND
DET
BOS
MIA - all 5.5 games back of us

Great to see we are slowly separating ourselves from the pack. Gotta keep making hay on this homestand

[GP2]

Drummond is the most overrated player in the league, along with DJ and Whiteside. All those put up empty stats even more so than love. They all cannot shot free throws, are among the worst post up players that are qualified, are terrible defender as centre and gets praised for putting up the most overrated stats rebound. I cannot believe the obsession over rebounds, I mean Reggie Evans was good at that, if RE was good at something you know it should be irrelevant.

Kinda surprised me when there was such an overwhelming consensus on the TNT panel that Drummond should be starting. I can understand Shaq but was a tad surprised at the rest. That said, I think Paul Millsap should be the one starting over Melo in the all-star game, not Drummond.

[vaff87]

We're 5.5 games separated from the 5th seed... there are 4 teams currently 23-21 tied for 5th

CLE
TOR - 2.5 games back

CHI
ATL - both 3 games back of us

IND
DET
BOS
MIA - all 5.5 games back of us

Fifth and twelfth is separated by two games.

[hsb]

Josh Smith playing well in his first game back.