ImageImageImage

Jeff Hornacek Fired

Moderators: bwgood77, lilfishi22, Qwigglez

User avatar
bwgood77
Global Mod
Global Mod
Posts: 98,149
And1: 61,003
Joined: Feb 06, 2009
Location: Austin
Contact:
   

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#141 » by bwgood77 » Mon Feb 1, 2016 9:25 pm

letsgosuns wrote:Gambo just broke a news story as he was talking on the radio. He said he just got a text from one of the players on the team (he would not say which player) and the player said the team found about Hornacek's firing on the news this morning and the front office did not tell the players themselves. I guess that is not surprising considering how this organization has been run recently. The media knew about Hornacek's firing before the players did.


You've got to be kidding me. Unbelievable. Or believable, I guess. He seems to be a good speaker, but he certainly isn't very good with player relationships.
Jdiddy701
RealGM
Posts: 10,145
And1: 6,555
Joined: Jun 05, 2006

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#142 » by Jdiddy701 » Mon Feb 1, 2016 9:28 pm

letsgosuns wrote:Gambo just broke a news story as he was talking on the radio. He said he just got a text from one of the players on the team (he would not say which player) and the player said the team found about Hornacek's firing on the news this morning and the front office did not tell the players themselves. I guess that is not surprising considering how this organization has been run recently. The media knew about Hornacek's firing before the players did.


Who cares. He got fired at 1-4am this morning when arriving home to Phoenix. You think McD is going to conduct a meeting with the players at that time? Gambo just trying to stir something up, as always. They went to sleep, woke up and saw it on the news/twitter. Duh!


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums
User avatar
saintEscaton
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,996
And1: 2,865
Joined: Jan 31, 2015
Location: The Sonoran
         

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#143 » by saintEscaton » Mon Feb 1, 2016 9:33 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
letsgosuns wrote:Gambo just broke a news story as he was talking on the radio. He said he just got a text from one of the players on the team (he would not say which player) and the player said the team found about Hornacek's firing on the news this morning and the front office did not tell the players themselves. I guess that is not surprising considering how this organization has been run recently. The media knew about Hornacek's firing before the players did.


You've got to be kidding me. Unbelievable. Or believable, I guess. He seems to be a good speaker, but he certainly isn't very good with player relationships.

McD should just go back to being a scout where he can just deal with analytics, because he's an hotheaded interpersonally challenged clown who doesn't think twice before hanging out someone to dry to save his own hide. He has probably alienated the entire team and he keeps wondering why players are either refusing to come here or are demanding out
Jonestown Suicide Squad

[. Sign the Petition To Force Sarver Into Selling Our Team

https://www.change.org/p/robert-sarver-sell-the-phoenix-suns-basketball-team-2

Image
User avatar
bwgood77
Global Mod
Global Mod
Posts: 98,149
And1: 61,003
Joined: Feb 06, 2009
Location: Austin
Contact:
   

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#144 » by bwgood77 » Mon Feb 1, 2016 10:10 pm

Jdiddy701 wrote:
letsgosuns wrote:Gambo just broke a news story as he was talking on the radio. He said he just got a text from one of the players on the team (he would not say which player) and the player said the team found about Hornacek's firing on the news this morning and the front office did not tell the players themselves. I guess that is not surprising considering how this organization has been run recently. The media knew about Hornacek's firing before the players did.


Who cares. He got fired at 1-4am this morning when arriving home to Phoenix. You think McD is going to conduct a meeting with the players at that time? Gambo just trying to stir something up, as always. They went to sleep, woke up and saw it on the news/twitter. Duh!


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums


Well the best course of action was to do it this morning and meet with him, followed by a meeting with the players. Wouldn't surprise me if the players still haven't been contacted.

I mean, firing someone in the middle of the night right after they get off the flight?

None of it matters that much, but it just shows a lack of class.
Damkac
Analyst
Posts: 3,143
And1: 3,062
Joined: Apr 18, 2011
Location: Poland

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#145 » by Damkac » Mon Feb 1, 2016 10:13 pm

Maybe Sarver simply likes when people talks about Suns? No matter if positively or negative. Image of the team was destroyed lately and it's getting worse with every decision.
GMATCallahan
Suns Forum History Expert
Posts: 1,027
And1: 749
Joined: Jan 10, 2011

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#146 » by GMATCallahan » Mon Feb 1, 2016 10:18 pm

Funky Tut wrote:Cleveland got rid of Blatt with a winning record and we canned Jeff after getting absolutely destroyed by really terrible teams and looking like a d-league team out there. I don't see Jeff as the entire cause of the situation but firing him was the right thing to do.


I have some news for you: without Eric Bledsoe and Brandon Knight (and, heck, Ronnie Price), the Suns possess the worst roster in the NBA and basically constitute a D-League team based on talent and personnel.

Hornacek may not have been the man to coach this club in the future, but firing him now rather than at the end of the season is pretty much pointless in my estimation. The only plausible rationale would be to try out one of the current assistants, but are the Suns really going to turn to one of these guys over the long term? If so, then why is Robert Sarver apparently interested in hiring Steve Nash as head coach (even though Nash allegedly has no interest in full-time coaching, much as Kobe Bryant does not, much as LeBron James does not, much as Kevin Johnson never did, much as many former great players do not), and why is Sarver also apparently interested in bringing back Mike D'Antoni?

Two seasons ago, when the Suns honored Kevin Johnson for his dunk on Hakeem Olajuwon twenty years earlier, Johnson pointed to two major reasons for Phoenix's turnaround: Jeff Hornacek and Mark West. Then management makes some questionable roster decisions, injuries hamper progress, and how does management respond? First it removes West from the coaching staff and then it fires Hornacek!

I am not a Sarver hater—he has done some good things financially and socially with the franchise, such as absorbing hundreds of millions of dollars in debt that Jerry Colangelo had accrued, renovating the team's arena without leaning on taxpayers (unlike most of the super-rich crooks who pass for owners and commissioners in major American sports nowadays), and supporting diversity (even if there is a business motive at play). But until he becomes more patient and develops a vision for long-term planning on the court, the Suns will continue to founder. At some point, you cannot be scared of being terrible. That does not mean that you do it in the manner that Philadelphia has done it, but you may have to take a step back in order to take two steps forward down the road. Sarver does not seem willing to commit to that process, hence his decision to hold onto Steve Nash and Grant Hill too long, followed by the Suns' decision to try and be 'competitive' in their absence by acquiring ill-fitting parts such as Michael Beasley and Luis Scola, followed by the franchise now turning to what will be their fourth head coach in the last four seasons even though more losses—and thus more ping-pong balls—are actually what Phoenix needs. Even the Lakers' ownership, for as bad as it has been in recent years and for as many foolish decisions as it has made and as much money as it has wasted, now seems to have a better grasp on a rebuilding process than the Suns.

This year, Phoenix will miss the playoffs for the sixth straight season and the seventh time in the last eight years. The primary reason is not coaching—it is ownership and management.
GMATCallahan
Suns Forum History Expert
Posts: 1,027
And1: 749
Joined: Jan 10, 2011

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#147 » by GMATCallahan » Mon Feb 1, 2016 10:20 pm

Did we not see this movie three years ago when the Suns constructed a dysfunctional roster, fired Alvin Gentry in the middle of the year, replaced him with Lindsey Hunter, made no progress, and then fired Hunter after the season and replaced him with Jeff Hornacek? McDonough was not around then, but Robert Sarver and Lon Babby obviously were around—so I wonder who is calling the shots now.

Either way, what is the point of firing Hornacek now? He may well have lost the team back in December, but why would anyone expect the Suns to be winning anything without Eric Bledsoe and Brandon Knight (as well as Ronnie Price), especially when they were sub-mediocre with Bledsoe and Knight? Phoenix's starting guards right now (Archie Goodwin and Devin Booker) should both be in college, and the Suns possess no starting-caliber forwards. Without Bledsoe and Knight, this roster is worse than Philadelphia's. Why blame the coach, and why fire him now? The Suns either should have fired Hornacek when they jettisoned those two assistants about a month ago, or Phoenix should have retained him for the remainder of the season. So management or ownership was expecting improvement within a month's time without Bledsoe and eventually Knight (and Price)? And why would management actually want any more wins when the priority should be accumulating the most lottery balls possible? And even if Hornacek has lost the overall team, Booker was developing nicely under him. As a former All-Star shooting guard who played a similar game in certain respects, would Hornacek not have constituted a good choice to continue teaching Booker for three more months?

The Suns have been run in an inept manner for years now. Bryan Colangelo was not perfect, but he was much better than this mess. Bring him back ...

Heck, bring back Jerry Colangelo, too. The Suns need him as much as the Sixers do, and he belongs with Phoenix.
User avatar
RunSunRun
Veteran
Posts: 2,789
And1: 723
Joined: Apr 25, 2010
Location: PHX
       

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#148 » by RunSunRun » Mon Feb 1, 2016 10:25 pm

**** it, let's just hire D'Antoni, Nash, and Barkley, and run some weird SSOL twin tower abomination. It would be $arvers wet dream.
GMATCallahan
Suns Forum History Expert
Posts: 1,027
And1: 749
Joined: Jan 10, 2011

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#149 » by GMATCallahan » Mon Feb 1, 2016 10:38 pm

LukasBMW wrote:WTF? Seriously WTF?

Hornacek was a lame duck. I thought for sure he would finish out the season to secure our tank. Things SEEMED to be going well. We were losing all of our games, we were finally playing Archie, and the injuries gave us the perfect excuse to take on a few d-league guys who would ensure a 4th quarter collapse each game.

Why on God's Green Earth would you fire the perfect lame duck head coach and risk upsetting the tank? Let Jeff finish the year and bring in a fresh face after the season ends.

A rally at this point would be a disaster! Our season is over. Done! Fork in it! Let's just finish out the season as losers so we can get a top 3 pick.

The only thing that makes sense is that the front office knew he lost the locker room, was concerned about his relationship with future allstar TJ Warren, and wanted to bring in a new coach asap to better mentor our young guys.

At least, it better be that!

Our next coach better give Archie, Booker, Warren, and Len 30 minutes a game. Otherwise I'm gonna flip.


If the Suns are banking on Warren as a franchise cornerstone, then they really do not have a grip. Warren could become a good player, but he has a long way to go. Yes, he can score points efficiently if feeding off others, but right now he is basically a one-dimensional supplementary piece and a backup-level player.

More significantly, Devin Booker, who has much more game than Warren, was developing nicely under Hornacek. Management should have cared more about that relationship.
User avatar
saintEscaton
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,996
And1: 2,865
Joined: Jan 31, 2015
Location: The Sonoran
         

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#150 » by saintEscaton » Mon Feb 1, 2016 10:46 pm

GMATCallahan wrote:
LukasBMW wrote:WTF? Seriously WTF?

Hornacek was a lame duck. I thought for sure he would finish out the season to secure our tank. Things SEEMED to be going well. We were losing all of our games, we were finally playing Archie, and the injuries gave us the perfect excuse to take on a few d-league guys who would ensure a 4th quarter collapse each game.

Why on God's Green Earth would you fire the perfect lame duck head coach and risk upsetting the tank? Let Jeff finish the year and bring in a fresh face after the season ends.

A rally at this point would be a disaster! Our season is over. Done! Fork in it! Let's just finish out the season as losers so we can get a top 3 pick.

The only thing that makes sense is that the front office knew he lost the locker room, was concerned about his relationship with future allstar TJ Warren, and wanted to bring in a new coach asap to better mentor our young guys.

At least, it better be that!

Our next coach better give Archie, Booker, Warren, and Len 30 minutes a game. Otherwise I'm gonna flip.


If the Suns are banking on Warren as a franchise cornerstone, then they really do not have a grip. Warren could become a good player, but he has a long way to go. Yes, he can score points efficiently if feeding off others, but right now he is basically a one-dimensional supplementary piece and a backup-level player.

More significantly, Devin Booker, who has much more game than Warren, was developing nicely under Hornacek. Management should have cared more about that relationship.



Warren will probably end up being a premiere low-maintenance 6th man who doesn't neeed plays drawn up for him but we can't have two unathletic wings who are complete liabilities on the other end. I want another 3&D SF to give us interchangeable personnel and small ball lineup possibiities. When he's off he's not contributing, giving up more than he gets and is a net negative on the floor. To justify being a starter he will have to diversify his skillset or prove that he can create his own offense and maintain his efficiency with increased volume.
Jonestown Suicide Squad

[. Sign the Petition To Force Sarver Into Selling Our Team

https://www.change.org/p/robert-sarver-sell-the-phoenix-suns-basketball-team-2

Image
User avatar
bwgood77
Global Mod
Global Mod
Posts: 98,149
And1: 61,003
Joined: Feb 06, 2009
Location: Austin
Contact:
   

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#151 » by bwgood77 » Mon Feb 1, 2016 10:48 pm

GMATCallahan wrote:Did we not see this movie three years ago when the Suns constructed a dysfunctional roster, fired Alvin Gentry in the middle of the year, replaced him with Lindsey Hunter, made no progress, and then fired Hunter after the season and replaced him with Jeff Hornacek? McDonough was not around then, but Robert Sarver and Lon Babby obviously were around—so I wonder who is calling the shots now.

Either way, what is the point of firing Hornacek now? He may well have lost the team back in December, but why would anyone expect the Suns to be winning anything without Eric Bledsoe and Brandon Knight (as well as Ronnie Price), especially when they were sub-mediocre with Bledsoe and Knight? Phoenix's starting guards right now (Archie Goodwin and Devin Booker) should both be in college, and the Suns possess no starting-caliber forwards. Without Bledsoe and Knight, this roster is worse than Philadelphia's. Why blame the coach, and why fire him now? The Suns either should have fired Hornacek when they jettisoned those two assistants about a month ago, or Phoenix should have retained him for the remainder of the season. So management or ownership was expecting improvement within a month's time without Bledsoe and eventually Knight (and Price)? And why would management actually want any more wins when the priority should be accumulating the most lottery balls possible? And even if Hornacek has lost the overall team, Booker was developing nicely under him. As a former All-Star shooting guard who played a similar game in certain respects, would Hornacek not have constituted a good choice to continue teaching Booker for three more months?

The Suns have been run in an inept manner for years now. Bryan Colangelo was not perfect, but he was much better than this mess. Bring him back ...

Heck, bring back Jerry Colangelo, too. The Suns need him as much as the Sixers do, and he belongs with Phoenix.


Yes, it's been crazy how the expectations were with what this squad has become this year. Came across this funny tweet.

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Gibberman10/status/694276120133312512[/tweet]
Gorilla Warfare
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,787
And1: 2,325
Joined: Jun 18, 2008
   

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#152 » by Gorilla Warfare » Mon Feb 1, 2016 10:49 pm

I'm going to say 0% chance Nash takes the head coaching job here. Hard 0%
Frank Lee
RealGM
Posts: 14,268
And1: 10,086
Joined: Nov 07, 2006

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#153 » by Frank Lee » Mon Feb 1, 2016 11:00 pm

NavLDO wrote:
Spoiler:
Frank Lee wrote:Would not be surprised if Sarver backrooms a GM/Coach deal. This isn't exactly an attractive job for an experienced coach, especially with McDismantle monkeying around the roster continuously. Make no mistake here, shots have been fired across the GMs bow.

Look for a trade deadline swing at the fences response with one last Mudville-ian hurrah from McDeals.


So which is it, Frank, McDoNothing, or McDealTooMuch...you can't have it both ways?

If he doesn't do anything, you'll cry foul because he just let the roster ride as is...if he DOES do something, via trades, you'll claim he's monkeying around too much with the roster.

When are you going to realize that McD is just an extension of Sarver's designs...And Horny was the baker, yet was provided no Yeast, and his cake didn't rise, yet still took the blame from Sarver, which McD will as well soon, I'm sure, and be fired just as well. We all know you'll be happier than a **** when that happens. Just know you'll need to work on a bunch of new names that match the new GM...because he'll make the same type of moves, just with less vision...then there's the drop off in Draft Pick's we'll likely suffer...

...anyway, I guess my point is, doing 'Sarver-isms' would actually be more representative of ground truth, because I have a sneaking suspicion Sarver is more of a 'puppet-master' than fans actually see..
.

...but by all means, you may continue to contradict yourself, if you desire...


haha... 'McDoNothing' was my prediction.... (you are familiar with MudVille?) .. because he WONT be able to do much with the overpriced bag of chips he has to offer up. He'll try, as it is his MO. but I said it before... I do not anticipate much activity by the end of the Trade Deadline. The big wheeling dealing will be the off season when $$ restrictions are essentially removed.

Not going to cry. Its his party.
What ? Me Worry ?
HootieRules
Veteran
Posts: 2,506
And1: 82
Joined: Oct 09, 2007

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#154 » by HootieRules » Mon Feb 1, 2016 11:04 pm

Gorilla Warfare wrote:I'm going to say 0% chance Nash takes the head coaching job here. Hard 0%


Correct. And that would pretty much go for every other attractive candidate with an I.Q. over 70 who can look at this roster, front office and owner and give this job zero thought.
User avatar
harshey1388
Assistant Coach
Posts: 3,818
And1: 249
Joined: Oct 26, 2008
Location: Phoenix/Tucson
Contact:

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#155 » by harshey1388 » Mon Feb 1, 2016 11:07 pm

[tweet]https://twitter.com/SpearsNBAYahoo/status/694294168810577920[/tweet]
Gorilla Warfare
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,787
And1: 2,325
Joined: Jun 18, 2008
   

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#156 » by Gorilla Warfare » Mon Feb 1, 2016 11:08 pm

harshey1388 wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/SpearsNBAYahoo/status/694294168810577920[/tweet]


called it.
GMATCallahan
Suns Forum History Expert
Posts: 1,027
And1: 749
Joined: Jan 10, 2011

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#157 » by GMATCallahan » Mon Feb 1, 2016 11:20 pm

RunSunRun wrote:**** it, let's just hire D'Antoni, Nash, and Barkley, and run some weird SSOL twin tower abomination. It would be $arvers wet dream.


Remember how Barkley wanted to become the Suns' general manager? Given Sarver's impatience and interest in gimmicks (as if Nash could somehow turn Archie Goodwin into a competent NBA point guard), he should have just hired Barkley back in 2013. Maybe Sarver would have learned his lesson by now.

He could still do it: hire Barkley as general manager (paying whatever it costs to get him to break his new Turner Sports contract extension), pay Nash $10M a year to coach ... whatever it takes to get Sarver to start confronting reality and think in a strategic manner rather than a reactive manner.
jcsunsfan
Head Coach
Posts: 6,477
And1: 4,829
Joined: Dec 20, 2006
     

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#158 » by jcsunsfan » Mon Feb 1, 2016 11:20 pm

He might be the youngest head coach in the league now. He is two years younger than Lue.
Frank Lee
RealGM
Posts: 14,268
And1: 10,086
Joined: Nov 07, 2006

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#159 » by Frank Lee » Mon Feb 1, 2016 11:24 pm

saintEscaton wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
letsgosuns wrote:Gambo just broke a news story as he was talking on the radio. He said he just got a text from one of the players on the team (he would not say which player) and the player said the team found about Hornacek's firing on the news this morning and the front office did not tell the players themselves. I guess that is not surprising considering how this organization has been run recently. The media knew about Hornacek's firing before the players did.


You've got to be kidding me. Unbelievable. Or believable, I guess. He seems to be a good speaker, but he certainly isn't very good with player relationships.

McD should just go back to being a scout where he can just deal with analytics, because he's an hotheaded interpersonally challenged clown who doesn't think twice before hanging out someone to dry to save his own hide. He has probably alienated the entire team and he keeps wondering why players are either refusing to come here or are demanding out



well said and echoed


seems rather awkward... may be there should have been a team meeting/practice to announce this first thing in the AM. But, we have heard it before... McDamntheTorpedos does not see the need to discuss personnel moves with players.
What ? Me Worry ?
GMATCallahan
Suns Forum History Expert
Posts: 1,027
And1: 749
Joined: Jan 10, 2011

Re: Jeff Hornacek Fired 

Post#160 » by GMATCallahan » Mon Feb 1, 2016 11:24 pm

saintEscaton wrote:
GMATCallahan wrote:[If the Suns are banking on Warren as a franchise cornerstone, then they really do not have a grip. Warren could become a good player, but he has a long way to go. Yes, he can score points efficiently if feeding off others, but right now he is basically a one-dimensional supplementary piece and a backup-level player.

More significantly, Devin Booker, who has much more game than Warren, was developing nicely under Hornacek. Management should have cared more about that relationship.



Warren will probably end up being a premiere low-maintenance 6th man who doesn't neeed plays drawn up for him but we can't have two unathletic wings who are complete liabilities on the other end. I want another 3&D SF to give us interchangeable personnel and small ball lineup possibiities. When he's off he's not contributing, giving up more than he gets and is a net negative on the floor. To justify being a starter he will have to diversify his skillset or prove that he can create his own offense and maintain his efficiency with increased volume.


... yup. Right now, Warren is essentially Shawn Marion without the athleticism, speed, defense, rebounding, or even as much passing ability.

And Marion without the athleticism, speed, defense, rebounding, or even as much passing ability would have been an oxymoron ... and a fairly marginal player.

Return to Phoenix Suns