Is Presti's weakness his love of BIG's?

[kraytinprime]

Its pretty obvious our biggest weakness is lack of wings to play the shooting guard and small forward position. While we are absolutely loaded at the big's that McGary can't even get a single minute of playing time that matters.

Is Presti's weakness his love of stockpiling BIG's? This was understandable in the mid 2000's as the power teams all had multiple big men that did damage - Lakers, Spurs, and Mavs. But has Presti been too slow to adapt to the smallification of the NBA? Lets look at some of the moves he made since OKC made the Finals and lost to a small ball team:

1. Picking Ibaka/Perkins over Harden. That is basically what it boiled down to. OKC could have easily given Harden the max if they did a salary dump for Ibaka or amnestied Perk. This was a case of Presti thinking the big man was more valuable than the wing.

2. Drafting Steven Adams. He could have gotten a stretch 4 in Kelly Olynyk, Giannis Antetokoumpo, Dennis Schroder, or Tony Snell. Instead Presti drafted a traditional big man.

3. Drafting Mitch McGary. He could have drafted a solid wing player in Rodney Hood.

4. Trading Reggie Jackson for Kanter. No doubt Jackson had to go. But Presti could have gotten a solid wing instead of Kanter.


So was it a mistake for Presti to collect a ton of bigs the last 3 years - Adams, McGary, and Kanter? Should he have targeted at least 2 wings instead?

Of course hindsight is 20/20 but imagine if Presti saw the rise of small ball and did this instead:

1. Traded Ibaka for Trevor Ariza and future #1 pick (Ariza was traded for Rashard Lewis in 2012)
2. Amnestied Perkins.
3. Paid Harden the max.
4. Draft Festus Ezeli/Draymond Green/Jae Crowder/Kris Middleton instead of PJ3
5. Use #1 pick in Ibaka trade to draft Tony Snell at #20
6. Draft Allen Crabbe instead of Roberson
7. Draft Rodney Hood instead of McGary
8. Draft Kyle Anderson instead of Josh Huestus

2012-2013 Roster: Russ/KD/Harden/Collison/Ariza/Ezeli/Fisher/Reggie Jackson

2013-2014 Roster: Russ/KD/Harden/Collison/Ariza/Ezeli/Jackson/Snell/Crabbe

2014-2015 Roster: Russ/KD/Harden/Ariza/Jackson/Ezeli/Jackson/Snell/Crabbe/Hood/Anderson

[Andre Roberstan]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/officialjaden/status/377146748226904064[/tweet]

Don't let your dreams be dreams

[bondom34]

Ibaka's better than Ariza.

Harden wanted out

Everyone passed on Draymond.

Adams is the best player of anyone listed other than maybe Giannis, and KO isn't a 4.

Everyone still has a center, everyone still plays centers Not really seeing a problem, Durant isn't a PF.

[kraytinprime]

Ibaka's better than Ariza.

Harden wanted out

Everyone passed on Draymond.

Adams is the best player of anyone listed other than maybe Giannis, and KO isn't a 4.

Everyone still has a center, everyone still plays centers Not really seeing a problem, Durant isn't a PF.

Ibaka is better than Ariza. That's why OKC would have gotten Ariza + Pick (would be a top 20 pick). Basically you are getting Harden, Ariza, and Tony Snell for Ibaka.

There is no documented proof that Harden wanted out. Scott Brooks himself said Harden was 100% fine coming off the bench. In fact Harden has said it himself many times before. I've yet to hear a solid named source that said Harden would not sign for the max. Sounds like a bunch of OKC front office propaganda more than anything else. If Harden was truly unhappy with his role at OKC he would have shown it like Reggie did. I saw none of that on or off the court. All Harden wanted was fair market value for his services. He obviously was worth the max.

Also lets not forget that it was Presti who traded Harden.
Lets not forget it was Presti who gave Harden exactly 1 hour to make the biggest decision in his life.
Why not give the man at least 24 hours to make a decision? Why not at least try to make a compromise? Presti/Harden were only $2.5 million apart.

[Old Man Game]

I actually think you are onto something here. Presti is a basketball traditionalist at heart.

[bondom34]

Ibaka's better than Ariza.

Harden wanted out

Everyone passed on Draymond.

Adams is the best player of anyone listed other than maybe Giannis, and KO isn't a 4.

Everyone still has a center, everyone still plays centers Not really seeing a problem, Durant isn't a PF.

Ibaka is better than Ariza. That's why OKC would have gotten Ariza + Pick (would be a top 20 pick). Basically you are getting Harden, Ariza, and Tony Snell for Ibaka.

There is no documented proof that Harden wanted out. Scott Brooks himself said Harden was 100% fine coming off the bench. In fact Harden has said it himself many times before. I've yet to hear a solid named source that said Harden would not sign for the max. Sounds like a bunch of OKC front office propaganda more than anything else. If Harden was truly unhappy with his role at OKC he would have shown it like Reggie did. I saw none of that on or off the court. All Harden wanted was fair market value for his services. He obviously was worth the max.

Also lets not forget that it was Presti who traded Harden.
Lets not forget it was Presti who gave Harden exactly 1 hour to make the biggest decision in his life.
Why not give the man at least 24 hours to make a decision? Why not at least try to make a compromise? Presti/Harden were only $2.5 million apart.

I trust who told me he wanted out. To add, he doesn't really strike me as someone willing to be a third wheel. He can't be the second guy in Houston, and his personality has shown some faults to me. If he were not traded the team would be much weaker defensively then it even is now, and the big men would be awful.

[bondom34]

To add, if he really loved bigs, wouldn't something have been done to address the front court sooner? Until last season., this was never even a question. It isn't a matter of what he loves, but that one specific team built differently and it exposes some weaknesses. That small ball idea however doesn't generally work for a full game and can still be exploited.

Put it this way, San Antonio has the similar number of big man, but they don't have a problem. It's simply a matter of having a few bad wings on the roster over the last few years. And really only one bad one the rest were just one way players, I really don't see much of an issue other than that. Also, the other names mentioned who would have been drafted over Adams were either guys taken much later, worst players, or would be backing up one of the big 2.

[kraytinprime]

Ibaka's better than Ariza.

Harden wanted out

Everyone passed on Draymond.

Adams is the best player of anyone listed other than maybe Giannis, and KO isn't a 4.

Everyone still has a center, everyone still plays centers Not really seeing a problem, Durant isn't a PF.

Ibaka is better than Ariza. That's why OKC would have gotten Ariza + Pick (would be a top 20 pick). Basically you are getting Harden, Ariza, and Tony Snell for Ibaka.

There is no documented proof that Harden wanted out. Scott Brooks himself said Harden was 100% fine coming off the bench. In fact Harden has said it himself many times before. I've yet to hear a solid named source that said Harden would not sign for the max. Sounds like a bunch of OKC front office propaganda more than anything else. If Harden was truly unhappy with his role at OKC he would have shown it like Reggie did. I saw none of that on or off the court. All Harden wanted was fair market value for his services. He obviously was worth the max.

Also lets not forget that it was Presti who traded Harden.
Lets not forget it was Presti who gave Harden exactly 1 hour to make the biggest decision in his life.
Why not give the man at least 24 hours to make a decision? Why not at least try to make a compromise? Presti/Harden were only $2.5 million apart.

I trust who told me he wanted out. To add, he doesn't really strike me as someone willing to be a third wheel. He can't be the second guy in Houston, and his personality has shown some faults to me. If he were not traded the team would be much weaker defensively then it even is now, and the big men would be awful.

Who's your source? My source is Scott Brooks, Kevin Durant, Westbrook, and Harden himself. NONE of them said Harden wanted to leave. Again, Harden was TRADED after having 1 hour to make the biggest decision in his life. Before he was traded there was not a SINGLE word spoken that Harden was not happy at OKC, not a SINGLE WORD.

The reason Harden can't be a second guy in Houston because he is far and away the best player in Houston. Why the hell would Harden want to be the second guy in Houston if he's the best? In OKC he knew his place and accepted being below KD/Russ. Like Scott Brooks said you need 3 stars to win titles.

Our defense would not be worse. Why? Because with KD/Russ/Harden we would have won a title by now and big men ring chasers would have signed with us. Guys like Pau Gasol, David West, ect. Its madness that to this day people think it was a smart move to trade away a top5 offensive player in the entire league for mid-round draft picks.

[Andre Roberstan]

http://grantland.com/features/a-look-oklahoma-city-trade-james-harden-houston-rockets/

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--inside-look-at-james-harden-s-trade-to-rockets-28301609.html

http://grantland.com/the-triangle/ibakas-return-fuels-more-what-if-questions-about-james-harden/

Read the Woj article. Perk at least expected it.

[bondom34]

Ibaka is better than Ariza. That's why OKC would have gotten Ariza + Pick (would be a top 20 pick). Basically you are getting Harden, Ariza, and Tony Snell for Ibaka.

There is no documented proof that Harden wanted out. Scott Brooks himself said Harden was 100% fine coming off the bench. In fact Harden has said it himself many times before. I've yet to hear a solid named source that said Harden would not sign for the max. Sounds like a bunch of OKC front office propaganda more than anything else. If Harden was truly unhappy with his role at OKC he would have shown it like Reggie did. I saw none of that on or off the court. All Harden wanted was fair market value for his services. He obviously was worth the max.

Also lets not forget that it was Presti who traded Harden.
Lets not forget it was Presti who gave Harden exactly 1 hour to make the biggest decision in his life.
Why not give the man at least 24 hours to make a decision? Why not at least try to make a compromise? Presti/Harden were only $2.5 million apart.

I trust who told me he wanted out. To add, he doesn't really strike me as someone willing to be a third wheel. He can't be the second guy in Houston, and his personality has shown some faults to me. If he were not traded the team would be much weaker defensively then it even is now, and the big men would be awful.

Who's your source? My source is Scott Brooks, Kevin Durant, Westbrook, and Harden himself. NONE of them said Harden wanted to leave. Again, Harden was TRADED after having 1 hour to make the biggest decision in his life. Before he was traded there was not a SINGLE word spoken that Harden was not happy at OKC, not a SINGLE WORD.

The reason Harden can't be a second guy in Houston because he is far and away the best player in Houston. Why the hell would Harden want to be the second guy in Houston if he's the best? In OKC he knew his place and accepted being below KD/Russ. Like Scott Brooks said you need 3 stars to win titles.

Our defense would not be worse. Why? Because with KD/Russ/Harden we would have won a title by now and big men ring chasers would have signed with us. Guys like Pau Gasol, David West, ect. Its madness that to this day people think it was a smart move to trade away a top5 offensive player in the entire league for mid-round draft picks.

My source is a poster here who I trust. And why would they make it public, it ust makes him look bad which they don't want. And Harden not only won't be a second guy, he won't be a good teammate, that's the issue. Brooks said a lot in that interview and tbh I don't know what to believe.

And yes, the defense certainly would be worse. We already saw ring chasers don't join OKC, Mike Miller and Gasol passed for other teams. The team would have no center, no PF, and no depth. Oh, and they still wouldn't have titles because of injury. Frankly, Harden wouldn't be half the player he is today on the Thunder. There aren't that many touches.
Edit: See above post from db as well.

Second edit: And the rest of the stuff on bigs wasn't any "love of bigs", Adams was pretty much BPA and fits the team like a glove, he traded for Kanter because every team has backup bigs too, McGary is basically younger Collison.

[Old Man Game]

We can re-litigate the Harden trade. But I feel like the original poster was onto a different point. Presti and this organization has shown a tendency to opt for bigs and to want to play big. Let's look at some of the evidence.

Acquiring Bigs:
- Traded a pick that eventually became Bledsoe so that he could draft Cole Aldrich (facepalm).

- Traded for Perkins. Never even got to see him play 1 NBA game after recovering from the ACL injury before re-signing him to a deal that hamstrung this franchise for years. Then refused to use the amnesty provision on him when most every commentator that cared to state an opinion could see he wasn't a regular NBA rotation player anymore.

- Drafted Mitch McGary when McGary was coming off a serious back injury and essentially had to miss most of a season of NCAA basketball. On this one, it's not who he passed up so much as what he overlooked to draft him (the injury concerns). There's a reason most viewed McGary as a second rounder going into that draft. You have to really like bigs to throw caution to wind on a red flag like that.

- Related to the above, still had Nick on the roster. Ends up re-signing Nick to a 2 year deal in the midst of Mitch's rookie season.

- Traded for Enes Kanter in the midst of Mitch's rookie season. Re-signs him in the off season despite a mountain of evidence that he doesn't actually help your team that much.

Playing Big:

- Brooks continued to not only play but to start a 2 big lineup in the finals. Cost us a championship. No one will ever convince me otherwise.

- NBA small ball revolution is in full effect. We have the best stretch 4 on the planet in Durant. Small ball lineups are playing less this year than they have in previous years. Makes absolutely no sense unless you view it through the prism of trying to find minutes for both Steven and Kanter.