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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 68 hours and counting... 

Post#201 » by BobbieL » Tue Feb 16, 2016 5:27 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
Sounds about right. Another combo guard (at least b-ref lists him as shooting guard/point guard) that McD knows he has under contract for awhile.

The big issue with that is, especially with Bogdan coming over, and of course Booker, and then Knight, I'd hate to get a guy shooting 38.8% overall, 32.2% from 3, and 68% from the FT line, who is owed over $30 million the 3 years after this one.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/s/shumpim01.html


I wouldn't love Shumpert but if I could move Chandler for say Mozgov and Shumpert - that might be worth doing as you would get the cap savings from trading Chandler. But, to your point, with Booker already at the two guard, and KNight there as well, Shumpert just muddies the waters.


Shumpert makes over $30 million over the next three years shooting 38% and 32% from 3, and Chandler makes $39 million over 3 years. That's not saving much and we need leadership and centers more than another guard who can't shoot. That's an extra $3 million a year, and despite what people may think, Chandler is much more movable imo than Shumpert.


good point - i was just speculating how the numbers work but you are right, chandler has more value

And though it may not seem right to have a 14m backup guard - don't want to just dump Knight
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 52 hours and counting... 

Post#202 » by bwgood77 » Tue Feb 16, 2016 5:37 pm

I don't think we have what it takes to get him, but it would be a nice 4 to get....

People close to Al Horford, another sell-off target about to hit free agency, say he will value that fifth year more than almost every other variable in his free-agency calculus. If teams see a crowded free-agent bidding war for a player they like, they might feel an urgency to acquire him now and use that fifth year to get a leg up in that bidding war.


http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14783975/the-nba-trade-deadline-full-big-names-cap-questions
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 53 hours and counting... 

Post#203 » by ray ray » Tue Feb 16, 2016 5:38 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
I don't think I had signed up when the Shaq trade was mentioned, but I was lurking. I was thinking that was dirtybird or something. Insiders likely change to some extent under different regimes though. Sure, people have connections, but nothing serious is going to be leaked unless someone doesn't care about their job.

I think if what might deter insiders the most is that people talk about us having insiders so much here that if anyone from the FO were to look at the forums and see that chatter, they might think "oh, is there someone leaking something? Lets watch for this guy."


My thing is - why come down on them and bust their b**ls if wrong.

Brian Windhorst - that guy has a job on ESPN for one reason, he is sycophant to LeBron. I bet 50 guys on this board know more common sense about the NBA and basketball than that guy. Like Adam Shefter - he is a good insider if he has a source. But anybody hear that guy talk football, strategy, etc - he is an idiot

Broussard is like a broken clock - only right twice a year - not twice a day

Vesey, Stephen A - not good

So, the supposed INsiders are not good - why jump on Ray Ray, Traxxed, DB - any of these guys


Those guys you mention are not insiders. They are reporters, and they report what teams tell them to report, or make stuff you to get people to read their stories and create controversy.

The guys to pay attention to are the guys who don't really claim to know anything for sure, but talk about how there is some chatter.....like Zach Lowe or Bill Simmons hear from people connected to coaches or players what the chatter is and occasionally if you listen to their pods or pay real close attention to them you see it. To break major news, follow Woj.


100% agree..
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 53 hours and counting... 

Post#204 » by MVSteve » Tue Feb 16, 2016 5:39 pm

Qwigglez wrote:
MrMiyagi wrote:
MVSteve wrote:Saw somewhere this morning that Ben McLemore might be available. You guys think we'd have any interest? I know we have a lot of guards already, and I don't know exactly what the Kings would want, but I wouldn't mind bringing him in. If one of Knight/Bledsoe leaves we'd have a little more room for another young guy with potential.

Nah. We've got Booker who is already shaping up to be better than McLemore.


Man McLemore has all the talent and athleticism, the problem with him is all mental. I think that's why he slipped so far in the draft right?


Yea I think he was knocked for being too passive.

He's been shooting better this year (50% 2P/37% 3P) but is getting less minutes. I definitely still would have Booker ahead of him, and I don't think he's going to be a star, but I think he could be a nice piece depending on the price.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 52 hours and counting... 

Post#205 » by alldayeveryday » Tue Feb 16, 2016 5:52 pm

Let the countdown begin... I'm getting nostalgia just thinking back when this board was bloody insane during the Matrix/Shaq fiasco.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and... 

Post#206 » by Jdiddy701 » Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:09 pm

Shout out to my job for allowing me to have the day off Thursday!


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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 68 hours and counting... 

Post#207 » by rsavaj » Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:18 pm

ChrisInAZ wrote:
asudevil wrote:
I have absolutely no problem with what our insiders do or don't do. I couldnt care less if they are right 10% of the time....because well even the reputable sources are rarely correct when it comes to rumors or potential trades.

as far as not being allowed specific info....i completely understand that. The true insiders are given specific knowledge, knowledge that is based off of trust. If, for example, someone from the Sun's front office came to me and said "i'll give you the scoop, but you cannot go into details online. If you do....game over." The last thing i'd do is blurb it out online to a bunch of people i couldnt care less about.

Just look at what happened to Gambo. He used to have inside sources, now he has nothing. Not that i think he LOST the trust of the FO, but i dont think he's EARNED the trust of the new FO. And i think the way he's handled the whole Markieff thing hasnt helped.

In the end with guys like Ray Ray, they are only given bits and pieces of what's going on with the FO. For every potential trade they are told about, their are 5 others that are kept hush hush. If that one they are told about works our, then great.....but if something else materializes, then this board crucifies. If anything, they give us something to talk about.


Just hypothetically. What would be your opinion of someone who is actually just doing their best at pretending to be an insider in a forum? Someone who for whatever self-serving reason needs to "get off" via the attention that comes with the tag.

To change the venue in this hypothetical- If a bunch of your friends & associates often met up at a bar and talked NBA basketball on a recurring basis, and one of these guys claimed to know inside info over & over again. How pissed might you be if after years you found out he was making...spinning it all up out of nothing? Just bulls**tting all of you.

No big deal?


Anybody who thinks this is a big deal takes internet trade rumors way too seriously.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and... 

Post#208 » by thamadkant » Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:35 pm

Jdiddy701 wrote:Shout out to my job for allowing me to have the day off Thursday!


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums





Did you take a day off because you know something big is going down or just to chill. Lol
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 52 hours and counting... 

Post#209 » by AtheJ415 » Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:37 pm

bwgood77 wrote:I don't think we have what it takes to get him, but it would be a nice 4 to get....

People close to Al Horford, another sell-off target about to hit free agency, say he will value that fifth year more than almost every other variable in his free-agency calculus. If teams see a crowded free-agent bidding war for a player they like, they might feel an urgency to acquire him now and use that fifth year to get a leg up in that bidding war.


http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/14783975/the-nba-trade-deadline-full-big-names-cap-questions


It'll take too much to get him. Besides, I'd rather get a young guy like Jones or DMo or even Meyers Leonard.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and counting... 

Post#210 » by rsavaj » Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:39 pm

Jones looks absolutely terrible in 2016. Like really, really bad.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and... 

Post#211 » by bwgood77 » Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:43 pm

Jdiddy701 wrote:Shout out to my job for allowing me to have the day off Thursday!


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Nice. Who do you think will be traded? I wonder if Kieff and Tucker will be traded together. I wonder if they even like each other.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and counting... 

Post#212 » by BobbieL » Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:44 pm

rsavaj wrote:Jones looks absolutely terrible in 2016. Like really, really bad.



I don't see Houston as a trade partner. Maybe an expiring for expiring for Teletovic. But not Jones or DMo or Brewer in any deal
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and counting... 

Post#213 » by bwgood77 » Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:54 pm

BobbieL wrote:
rsavaj wrote:Jones looks absolutely terrible in 2016. Like really, really bad.



I don't see Houston as a trade partner. Maybe an expiring for expiring for Teletovic. But not Jones or DMo or Brewer in any deal


Why would we trade Telly for an expiring?
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and counting... 

Post#214 » by BobbieL » Tue Feb 16, 2016 6:58 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
rsavaj wrote:Jones looks absolutely terrible in 2016. Like really, really bad.



I don't see Houston as a trade partner. Maybe an expiring for expiring for Teletovic. But not Jones or DMo or Brewer in any deal


Why would we trade Telly for an expiring?

forgot to add "draft pick" - good catch

Teletovic is interesting to trade - I think his absolute best value will be a team needing 5m to make the salaries work in a much larger trade.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and counting... 

Post#215 » by Cutter » Tue Feb 16, 2016 7:07 pm

Looks like Knight getting ready to return. Pay special attention to the bolded comments by the coach.

Suns Report: Knight, Price near return to action, Goodwin nears return to bench role
By Deadpoolio on Feb 16, 2016, 9:00a 56


Mark J. Rebilas-USA TODAY Sports
The imminent returns of Brandon Knight and Ronnie Price from injury will return two point guards to the active roster but will also end Archie Goodwin's career-best stretch as a starter.

The trade deadline is just two days away, but even if the Phoenix Suns stand pat on Thursday, the roster for the final 28 games will be a different one than head coach Earl Watson was working with on Feb. 10.

While it is easy to forget, both Brandon Knight (sports hernia) and Ronnie Price (toe surgery) are returning to health and nearing a return to action that was predicted to come shortly after the All-Star break. The precise dates have yet to be determined, but their returns should provide some normalcy to the rotations for the injury-riddled Suns.

"Eventually we get 20 points a game back from Brandon Knight," Watson said as he looked ahead to both players' returns after the Suns' most recent loss to Golden State. "We get Ronnie Price, intangibles. Archie (Goodwin) can go to his natural spot. Devin (Booker) will play less minutes but be effective still."

Knight was averaging a career-high 19.7 points for the Suns this season to go along with 5.1 assists until the injury, which had bothered him since late December, became too much for him to play through.

Over the first 32 games of the season, Knight offered the Suns flashes of what he could bring but did so with frustrating irregularity. After backcourt mate Eric Bledsoe tore his meniscus on Dec. 26, Knight's up-and-down season took a nosedive. His numbers were poorer in almost every statistical category despite now being the team's primary weapon. Perhaps those struggles can be attributed to the limitations placed upon him by the injury, but the fact remains the Suns went 1-9 in Knight's 10 games flying solo. Still, the Suns will welcome the owner of Phoenix's two highest-scoring games of the season with open arms, whenever his return comes.

"I hope Brandon is close," Watson said in his pregame press conference Feb. 10. "I think this break is going to be big for him, making sure he gets his treatment as he goes back home to Florida. It's important for him to stay professional and maybe get two treatments a day because he's needed. When you have guys who are starters and play big minutes, I think it's important for them to, not rush, but come back as quickly as possible."

While Watson could use Knight's contributions to the lineup immediately, he has stressed to the player that his return will come when Knight feels physically capable and not a moment sooner.

"I never want to rush a player back because I've been injured, and I understand," Watson said. "I've been rushed back before, and it leads to another injury.

"He wants to play. We're sure of that 100 percent."

Then there is Price, the third-string point guard who averaged only 4.2 points over his 34 games before undergoing mid-January surgery on his right great toe but was shooting a career-high 38.1 percent from 3. Despite unimpressive numbers, he earned 14.8 minutes per game under former coach Jeff Hornacek for being one of the few players who consistently brought maximum effort every game. Unsurprisingly, Price's on-court tenacity has bled into his rehab.

"We have to keep Ronnie Price out of practice," Watson said. "Ronnie Price is the guy who will play with one foot, and he's a warrior. He texts me sometimes after games. He wants to play. He's ready to be a part of the team."

With Knight close to returning and Price apparently champing at the bit to harass ball-handlers once again, the player who stands to be most affected by the freshly healed point guard corps is Archie Goodwin.

Goodwin has started the past 11 games at point guard since the Suns lost the last of their true point guards — Knight — to injury on Jan. 21. In that time, he has averaged 16.8 points, 4.5 assists, and 3.8 turnovers in 35.4 minutes per game. Of his seven career games scoring 20-plus points, six have come over this stretch. However, his effort has been lacking at times over the same period of time, most notably in the Golden State game, that led to P.J. Tucker shouting at Goodwin for not chasing the opening tip that went out of bounds and Markieff Morris resorting to using one of his patented motivational shoves on Goodwin at the bench.

Now, with Knight soon to be stepping back into his starter's spot, Goodwin will be returning to the bench and a role of about 20 minutes per game — if Price doesn't ninja-loot those minutes first. Looked at from a positive perspective, it will provide Goodwin with the opportunity to prove he can produce just as well in a smaller role, which will be key for him in finding consistent minutes on an NBA team. The worst-case scenario would be seeing Goodwin sulk at having his minutes halved after enjoying the first extended burn of his career.

Watson has said time and again that team trumps player, and having Knight and Price back healthy is what is best for the team. From there, the onus falls to Goodwin to prove he, too, is all about the team and give consistent effort when he takes the court, whether it's for five or 35 minutes a night.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and counting... 

Post#216 » by jcsunsfan » Tue Feb 16, 2016 7:11 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
rsavaj wrote:Jones looks absolutely terrible in 2016. Like really, really bad.



I don't see Houston as a trade partner. Maybe an expiring for expiring for Teletovic. But not Jones or DMo or Brewer in any deal


Why would we trade Telly for an expiring?


Yep. He is an expiring. Maybe a pick and an expiring.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and counting... 

Post#217 » by Twuan89 » Tue Feb 16, 2016 7:12 pm

The Raptors have no interest in Markieff Morris.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and counting... 

Post#218 » by TOO » Tue Feb 16, 2016 7:13 pm

Hugs and Ronnie Price, the Earl Watson story. Great.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 53 hours and counting... 

Post#219 » by SSOL » Tue Feb 16, 2016 7:16 pm

ray ray wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:
BobbieL wrote:
My thing is - why come down on them and bust their b**ls if wrong.

Brian Windhorst - that guy has a job on ESPN for one reason, he is sycophant to LeBron. I bet 50 guys on this board know more common sense about the NBA and basketball than that guy. Like Adam Shefter - he is a good insider if he has a source. But anybody hear that guy talk football, strategy, etc - he is an idiot

Broussard is like a broken clock - only right twice a year - not twice a day

Vesey, Stephen A - not good

So, the supposed INsiders are not good - why jump on Ray Ray, Traxxed, DB - any of these guys


Those guys you mention are not insiders. They are reporters, and they report what teams tell them to report, or make stuff you to get people to read their stories and create controversy.

The guys to pay attention to are the guys who don't really claim to know anything for sure, but talk about how there is some chatter.....like Zach Lowe or Bill Simmons hear from people connected to coaches or players what the chatter is and occasionally if you listen to their pods or pay real close attention to them you see it. To break major news, follow Woj.


100% agree..


Fixed.
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Re: The Trade Thread - The end of the phenomenal Kieff/Tucker era? 50 hours and counting... 

Post#220 » by Sunsdeuce » Tue Feb 16, 2016 7:18 pm

Cutter wrote:Looks like Knight getting ready to return. Pay special attention to the bolded comments by the coach.

Suns Report: Knight, Price near return to action, Goodwin nears return to bench role
By Deadpoolio on Feb 16, 2016, 9:00a 56


Mark J. Rebilas-USA TODAY Sports
The imminent returns of Brandon Knight and Ronnie Price from injury will return two point guards to the active roster but will also end Archie Goodwin's career-best stretch as a starter.

The trade deadline is just two days away, but even if the Phoenix Suns stand pat on Thursday, the roster for the final 28 games will be a different one than head coach Earl Watson was working with on Feb. 10.

While it is easy to forget, both Brandon Knight (sports hernia) and Ronnie Price (toe surgery) are returning to health and nearing a return to action that was predicted to come shortly after the All-Star break. The precise dates have yet to be determined, but their returns should provide some normalcy to the rotations for the injury-riddled Suns.

"Eventually we get 20 points a game back from Brandon Knight," Watson said as he looked ahead to both players' returns after the Suns' most recent loss to Golden State. "We get Ronnie Price, intangibles. Archie (Goodwin) can go to his natural spot. Devin (Booker) will play less minutes but be effective still."

Bledsoe tore his meniscus on Dec. 26, Phoenix's two highest-scoring games of the season with open arms, whenever his return comes.

"I hope Brandon is close," Watson said in his pregame press conference Feb. 10. "I think this break is going to be big for him, making sure he gets his treatment as he ters and play big minutes, I think it's important for them to, not rush, but come back as quickly as possible."

"I never want to rush a player back because I've been injured, and I understand," Watson said. "I've been rushed back before, and it leads to another injury.

"He wants to play. We're sure of that 100 percent."

brought maximum effort every game. Unsurprisingly, Price's on-court tenacity has bled into his rehab.

"We have to keep Ronnie Price out of practice," Watson said. "Ronnie Price is the guy who will play with one foot, and he's a warrior. He texts me sometimes after games. He wants to play. He's ready to be a part of the team."

With Knight close to returning and Price apparently champing at the bit to harass ball-handlers once again, the player who stands to be most affected by the freshly healed point guard corps is Archie Goodwin.

Goodwin has started the past 11 games at point guard since the Suns lost the last of Tucker shouting at Goodwin for not chasing the opening tip that went out of bounds and Markieff Morris resorting to using one of his patented motivational shoves on Goodwin at the bench.

Now, with Knight soon to be stepping back into his starter's spot, Goodwin will be returning to the bench and a role of about his career.

Watson has said time and again that team trumps player, and having Knight and Price back healthy is what is best for the team. From there, the onus falls to Goodwin to prove he, too, is all about the team and give consistent effort when he takes the court, whether it's for five or 35 minutes a night.


Honestly confused about that whole article. Watson just seems to be over his head coaching in general. I don't know.

I just wouldn't mess with a good thing. Booker is literally the only positive right now. Don't think I would change anything he is doing right now (minutes, plays run, etc) in regards to Booker.
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