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Miami Heat @ Sacramento Kings- 4/1, 10 pm(Ughh)

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Re: RE: Re: Miami Heat @ Sacramento Kings- 4/1, 10 pm(Ughh) 

Post#701 » by QUIZ » Sat Apr 2, 2016 9:44 pm

HIF wrote:
QUIZ wrote:IDK why people keep acting like Goran is our problem defensively. He isn't a stopper by any means but he competes hard.

Wade, JJ, and Stat are the liabilities not him. Lol



Wade and JJ are better defenders, Wade is on another plateau.

Goran is more like a revolving door on defence.

Still I guess we knew that when we got him, the bigger worry is his lack of leadership and inability to break down a set defense.

If Wade was playing last night I don't believe that goran would have had crunch time minutes, he's better when there is less pressure. I think teams will give him the jeremy lin treatment on offense more often in the playoffs.

Collison looked world class in comparison on both O and D.

No he isn't. The numbers don't support that. The eye test doesn't support that. Nothing supports that.

Wade can for breif stretches play lock down D, like if we're playing the Cavs for example but on the whole, he has statistically been a very poor defender this season.

JJ has been our worst defender since his acquisition.
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Re: Miami Heat @ Sacramento Kings- 4/1, 10 pm(Ughh) 

Post#702 » by orphicwhip » Sat Apr 2, 2016 9:47 pm

JJ is horrible on Defense. Wade doesn't care most of the time.
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Re: RE: Re: Miami Heat @ Sacramento Kings- 4/1, 10 pm(Ughh) 

Post#703 » by PaulieWal » Sat Apr 2, 2016 9:58 pm

HIF wrote:
QUIZ wrote:IDK why people keep acting like Goran is our problem defensively. He isn't a stopper by any means but he competes hard.

Wade, JJ, and Stat are the liabilities not him. Lol



Wade and JJ are better defenders, Wade is on another plateau.

Goran is more like a revolving door on defence.

Still I guess we knew that when we got him, the bigger worry is his lack of leadership and inability to break down a set defense.

If Wade was playing last night I don't believe that goran would have had crunch time minutes, he's better when there is less pressure. I think teams will give him the jeremy lin treatment on offense more often in the playoffs.

Collison looked world class in comparison on both O and D.


By the numbers (DRAPM, DRTG etc.) and eye-test Wade hasn't really been a good defender since after the 2013 Finals IMO except for brief stretches here and there.

Maybe it's me but Wade and JJ definitely play more porous defense. Dragic struggles with quicker guys but he at least moves his feet and tries to fight over the screens and doesn't gamble a whole lot.

I am still more hopeful of Dragic playing well in the PS especially now with JJ to space the floor and a healthy Wade to draw the defensive attention from him. Time will tell...
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Re: Miami Heat @ Sacramento Kings- 4/1, 10 pm(Ughh) 

Post#704 » by cyclix » Sat Apr 2, 2016 9:59 pm

Goran's offense is absolute trash in half court settings. It is alot better when he involves Whiteside however. I hope his USG% decreases in the playoffs. Goran's offense is too gimmicky for quality defensive teams.
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Re: Miami Heat @ Sacramento Kings- 4/1, 10 pm(Ughh) 

Post#705 » by PaulieWal » Sat Apr 2, 2016 10:03 pm

cyclix wrote:Goran's offense is absolute trash in half court settings. It is alot better when he involves Whiteside however. I hope his USG% decreases in the playoffs. Goran's offense is too gimmicky for quality defensive teams.


Are you sure about that? He does initiate a lot of our offense and helps with the ball movement. If you are decreasing his USG% and taking the ball more out of his hands you are relying on JJ/Wade who are more prone to stopping the ball.
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Re: Miami Heat @ Sacramento Kings- 4/1, 10 pm(Ughh) 

Post#706 » by cyclix » Sat Apr 2, 2016 10:23 pm

PaulieWal wrote:
cyclix wrote:Goran's offense is absolute trash in half court settings. It is alot better when he involves Whiteside however. I hope his USG% decreases in the playoffs. Goran's offense is too gimmicky for quality defensive teams.


Are you sure about that? He does initiate a lot of our offense and helps with the ball movement. If you are decreasing his USG% and taking the ball more out of his hands you are relying on JJ/Wade who are more prone to stopping the ball.

Thats what the playoffs is about for the most part. Have you watched playoff basketball? The game is alot slower generally. If we're getting consistent stops on defense, then Goran's transition game flourishes alot better. Wade and JJ is better at breaking halfcourt defenses and they have more experience in the postseason. Unless we're a pace team, I prefer the ball on those guys hands alot more than Dragic.
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Re: Miami Heat @ Sacramento Kings- 4/1, 10 pm(Ughh) 

Post#707 » by PaulieWal » Sat Apr 2, 2016 10:38 pm

cyclix wrote:
PaulieWal wrote:
cyclix wrote:Goran's offense is absolute trash in half court settings. It is alot better when he involves Whiteside however. I hope his USG% decreases in the playoffs. Goran's offense is too gimmicky for quality defensive teams.


Are you sure about that? He does initiate a lot of our offense and helps with the ball movement. If you are decreasing his USG% and taking the ball more out of his hands you are relying on JJ/Wade who are more prone to stopping the ball.

Thats what the playoffs is about for the most part. Have you watched playoff basketball? The game is alot slower generally. If we're getting consistent stops on defense, then Goran's transition game flourishes alot better. Wade and JJ is better at breaking halfcourt defenses and they have more experience in the postseason. Unless we're a pace team, I prefer the ball on those guys hands alot more than Dragic.


No, I have never watched playoff basketball. I only enjoy RS games, PS is boring.

The best teams even if they play slow like we did from 2011-2014 (and more specifically from 2012-2014) still move the ball and try to get good shots. Ball stopping and bogging down your offense is not a recipe for success in the PS. Not to even mention JJ and Wade are both older. Hell even if this was 09 Wade I'd say we should be moving the ball more and using Wade's off-ball game/athleticism to destroy defenses. Have Goran set him up for easy baskets.

Tl;DR - Slow basketball should not = iso offense.
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Re: RE: Re: Miami Heat @ Sacramento Kings- 4/1, 10 pm(Ughh) 

Post#708 » by HIF » Mon Apr 4, 2016 3:05 pm

QUIZ wrote:
HIF wrote:
QUIZ wrote:IDK why people keep acting like Goran is our problem defensively. He isn't a stopper by any means but he competes hard.

Wade, JJ, and Stat are the liabilities not him. Lol



Wade and JJ are better defenders, Wade is on another plateau.

Goran is more like a revolving door on defence.

Still I guess we knew that when we got him, the bigger worry is his lack of leadership and inability to break down a set defense.

If Wade was playing last night I don't believe that goran would have had crunch time minutes, he's better when there is less pressure. I think teams will give him the jeremy lin treatment on offense more often in the playoffs.

Collison looked world class in comparison on both O and D.

No he isn't. The numbers don't support that. The eye test doesn't support that. Nothing supports that.

Wade can for breif stretches play lock down D, like if we're playing the Cavs for example but on the whole, he has statistically been a very poor defender this season.

JJ has been our worst defender since his acquisition.


As you say Wade has shown he can still play lock down defense. He's just lazy in the regular season.

He is also on a completely different level than Goran Offensively and with leadership.

I'm not sure what you are seeing when you watch Goran. For me it's getting worse. His D gets killed nearly every play, I'm so tired of seeing him trailing his opponent and forcing every other player out of position to try and cover. I'm tired of his offense where he runs up and then takes too long to find anyone or he takes the ball low and loses it and surely being a PG he should have worked out how to get the ball to the big man when he's in front of him and marked by another midget.

Portland was so embarrassing for him, he couldn't even score there and when his leadership was most needed there simply wasn't any.

JJ has been a poor defender but not as bad as Goran and worse than that he has to play alongside him.
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