When Will the Clippers Draft Another Player that Gets Minutes?

[mattd13]

i have supported doc and his coaching since his days in Orlando. by the way I live in florida. with that being said, I have watched almost every game since jj arrived in la and have now lost confidence in doc's ability to take this team to the next level. sure others are involved but he is the guy at the top and must take responsibility for a number of poor decisions on players. I know it is a crap shoot when you draft or bring in a questionable player who has been traded from team to team. my problem is he does not define roles or demand these players stick to the plan. his use of Austin has been unbelievable and everyone is amazed with his use of jamal. to bring in pp and think a guy of his age will be a game changer is just not smart. I was not in favor of lance and now we have green who is out of control. we are watching the team implode and doc refuses to change. there is no discipline on offense and the defense is starting to decline starting with the play of dj. I was really worried when blake went down but they surprised me for a while. reality is starting set in. i think he is losing control of the team and i just do not see him fixing it

[og15]

I think as a team that has been drafting low for the past 4-5 seasons, the Clippers actually need to value second round picks more, and they need to do so by investing heavily in scouting. Clippers aim should be to scout as well or better than anyone. It doesn't mean you'll find gems over the place, but if you first of all value the second round picks, and just found one player over the last 4 seasons, that makes a difference.

Where the second round is very productive is in the early second round, picks 31-40ish. In the 50's where the Clippers have been picking, there isn't generally as much. A team like the Clippers should look to find ways to acquire earlier second round picks whenever possible.

Let's look at the productive early second round players:

2012: Jae Crowder, Draymond Green, Quincy Acy, Khris Middleton, Will Barton, Mike Scott (31-43), at 49 we also had Kyle O'Quinn
2013: Allen Crabbe, Isaiah Canaan, Ray McCallum, Jeff Withey, Mike Muscula (31-44), Raul Neto (47), Ryan Kelly? (48), James Ennis (50), Joffrey Lauvergne (55)
2014: KJ McDaniels, Jeramie Grant, Nikola Jokic, Dwight Powell, Jordan Clarkson (31-46)
2015: Since they are all rookies, it is harder to know, but so far: Josh Richardson, Monterzl Harrell and Richaun Holmes (31-40)

2012 was more of an outlier year as it actually produced four guys who are starting caliber or top rotation players, and actually even stars. 2013 had a lot of guys who have gotten minutes, but no one at a high level. 2014 has some decent guys, still a little early to know for some. 2015 is obviously too early for the majority.

....but this could be a cheap way of finding some talent. Next is obviously maximizing the first round picks.

2013 - The options were: Bullock, Roberson, Gobert, Crabbe, and people like Glenn Rice Jr. Bullock was the safest pick, no doubt. The team didn't end up necessarily needing a wing after making the trade for Dudley and also signing Redick, but there was a need at draft time. There was also a need for a backup big. Roberson was a college PF with no range, and one of Doc's things was improving shooting. Bullock was known more for his defense than Crabbe.

2014 - I know Rodney Hood was the favorite of many, I liked him a lot too but he went before the Clippers pick, 5 picks before. The actual options were CJ Wilcox, Josh Huestis, Kyle Anderson, Damien Inglis, KJ McDaniels, and I think Cleanthony Early was discussed too. The only reason the CJ Wilcox choice was odd was because he was a shooting and offense based SG being drafted to a team with JJ Redick and Jamal Crawford, a team that had more need at SF, especially defensively and at the backup big position. Just didn't seem like a logical pick for the teams situation. The guys who most people wanted most were KJ McDaniels or Kyle Anderson. McDaniels is not getting minutes on a good team in Houston and doesn't seem to have figured out shooting and smart defense and the things that will get you on the court. Anderson has looked like a useful rotation player, but I question if that would happen as quickly outside of SA's system with their D-League team that also stresses ball movement and motion. Anderson was a guy who could naturally have a tendency to be ball dominant and cause some stagnance, and while Doc is a good coach, he doesn't have a system and doesn't naturally force players out of a habit like that as we've seen with Jamal, and even his son.

2015 - No draft pick

The other thing is obviously strategic trades. Which is why I said you need to be super up on your scouting. Strategic trades are ones like trading George Hill for Kawhi Leonard. The Clippers could likely have used Jamal to get a mid-late first round prospect over the last two seasons, but you're only comfortable with that if you've done your homework. It is a bit of a risk no matter what.

[MartinToVaught]

Oh ok, so it WAS another "Doc doesn't play rookies" thread in the end. Sprinkled with a bit of "Doc doesn't practice" baseless speculation and a bit of embellishment to make other teams picks look like gold

It's ok, it's obvious you guys all think this one guy that appears on your TV complaining to the refs is the one single reason for everything bad that happens to the Clippers, so I'm probably the contrarían one here. I did give an opening to discuss other aspects of our scouting staff, but it's obvious everything ends in a very simplistic "it's Doc's fault" around here. And a lot of it is, but it's hard to have a decent discussion about anything here without ending in the same old moaning about Doc circlejerk.

Glenn gets paid the big bucks to run the front office and "coach" the team. He forced his way here because his ego couldn't handle another rebuild in Boston, considering how badly his coaching got exposed the last time they were rebuilding. He's the public face of the team. He has a level of power over this organization unmatched by anyone other than Popovich and SVG (who are both better than him). If Glenn and his sycophants want him to have all that power, then you guys can't cry when he is held responsible for things going wrong.

I don't think Glenn is 100% to blame for this team's mediocrity, but he's maybe 60% to blame. Every year, he gives away draft picks like candy, makes impulsive trades, doesn't trust the players he brings in, then trades them for pennies on the dollar to a conference rival, usually for a washed-up security blanket from his Boston days. Rinse and repeat. Jamal, Pierce and Austin can crap the bed every night with no consequences, but Lance gets thrown under the bus. The constant roller-coaster ride of desperation moves and mistreated players is not conducive to a winning team.

After the second-round meltdown last year, Glenn said that when he first came to LA, he laughed at the roster that he inherited from Olshey and Sacks. You know - the one that had Bledsoe, the best bench in the league, and plenty of draft picks coming up to add young talent with. In the years since he took over, Glenn has taken the promising but flawed team he was given and turned it into Brooklyn Nets West. At this point, anyone still defending the horrible job he's doing must love mediocrity.

[Wammy Giveaway]

Martin, let you give you a scenario. When you mentioned how Doc laughed at the roster after his arrival, I had a feeling he wasn't just referring to Eric Bledsoe. He might have been referring to Blake Griffin and DeAndre Jordan as well. I had a feeling he didn't want them, but couldn't get rid of them for two reasons:

1. Clippers loved Griffin and Jordan too much. Griffin resurrected the franchise, Jordan is Griffin's best friend. They were off-limits.
2. The gag order. Doc couldn't trade for Pierce or Garnett due to the coaching trade that brought Doc here. Doc thought about trading DJ for Garnett.

The Clippers have already lost in the 2nd round twice. A third 2nd round exit would spell the end of the Clippers and a forced rebuild. Doc wants that to happen so that he can convince the Clippers they have to trade Griffin and Jordan to win for real. The players he always wanted were superstars: Dwight Howard, Carmelo Anthony, Kevin Durant, DeMarcus Cousins, LeBron James (only if he loses in the finals again). Doc wanted a superstar-starting lineup that was similar to his 2008 Celtics team, and he wanted it done as a blockbuster farm trade.

However, he would have to risk getting fired for this plan to work:

Steve: I am truly disappointed in you, Glenn! Three second round exits, and we're the laughing stock all over again.
Doc: It's not my fault. I told you it was Griffin and DJ's fault, but you wouldn't listen.
Steve: That's it, you're FIRED.
Doc: Wait! If I gave up my GM job, can I stay?
Steve: I don't know. What do you have in mind?
Doc: I'll only give up my job as general manager if you can get Danny Ainge from Boston.

This is Doc's ultimate plan: get Danny Ainge to take over as GM, and have him handle the blockbuster trades, with the condition that Paul, Pierce and Austin are the only Clippers that stay. (I don't know if Redick stays either)

Could you see this happening, Martin?

[og15]

I'm not sure Doc thougth about trading DJ for Garnett, I believe that was Ainge trying to pull that off and had nothing to do with Doc.

[Clemenza]

Doc doesn't develop players unless his last name is Rivers. If we had Porzingas he would be in the D League. I thought he was going to surround the core with some young athletes instead of senior citizens

[Ranma]

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[Ranma]

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[Ranma]

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[Ranma]

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[Ranma]

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[Wammy Giveaway]

Could Thon Maker end up being the next Michael Olowokandi or the next Jeff Green?