Political Roundtable Part IX

[nate33]

So if you are interested in having a country, the starting point is the law. What laws should we agree on? Those provide the boundaries for what types of cultures we should permit in. Cultures that do not fit the boundaries of those laws should be restricted from entering, or we should insist that they modify their culture to fit the existing laws.

We are seeing this in Europe already with "no go zones" in Brussels and parts of Britain. Muslim enclaves are insisting on ruling their community via Sharia Law and are forbidding the police from entering to enforce the law of the government.

Agreed with you point but I still think we need to accelerate not decelerate immigration - we may disagree there. I think we want to bring in more educated workers from abroad as they tend to create decent paying jobs locally.

I think that we want to have an admission policy vs. a numbers policy and the top three criteria would be

1) Allow for advanced degrees and specialties that we need
a) get an advanced degree in the US and you are offered a diploma & citizenship
b) have an advanced degree from abroad and you move up in line

2) Make sure that you have an equal mix of men & women
a) part of the issues in Europe trend from bringing in far more men than women

3) Assets are of value
a) if you have assets or own a company that you want to relocate to the US, you jump up in line

Try to bring in an equal mix of immigrants from as many regions as you can and make sure you question each applicant to make sure they are willing to comply with our rule of law. It needs to be stated and documented - with the notion of deportation if you violate that agreed for bargain. Some would say that this wouldn't apply once they are citizens... I wouldn't agree with that notion.

I think the number of people with advanced degrees clamoring to enter the U.S. is much smaller than you believe. Most immigrants are poorly educated. And many of the "college educated" ones aren't necessarily educated in the specialties where we have some kind of dire shortage. The immigrants need to address true shortages are mostly STEM types, which are almost exclusively males from India and China. Your idea of having an equal mix of men and women from many regions is simply not possible because there isn't the type of supply you are hoping for.

[dckingsfan]

I think the number of people with advanced degrees clamoring to enter the U.S. is much smaller than you believe.

Actually, we have many more highly educated workers applying for H1B visas than are available.

Most immigrants are poorly educated. And many of the "college educated" ones aren't necessarily educated in the specialties where we have some kind of dire shortage.

True, but we are looking at raw numbers vs. overall numbers. And there are many more college educated workers that want to come here than there are spots available. And if they don't meet the criteria, then we don't bring them in. This should be a win-win.

The immigrants need to address true shortages are mostly STEM types, which are almost exclusively males from India and China.

2000, the countries estimated to have the largest number of high-skill women emigrants living in OECD countries were the United Kingdom (1.5 million), the Philippines (1.1 million), India (1.0 million), Mexico (0.9 million), and Germany (0.9 million) (figure 3-41). The proportion of high-skill emigrants who are women varied considerably across source countries (see Docquier, Lowell, and Marfouk 2009).

Your idea of having an equal mix of men and women from many regions is simply not possible because there isn't the type of supply you are hoping for.

Again, that may be a limiting factor - if there are only 100K women, then you only take 100K men.

[nate33]

I thought this was interesting:

[tweet]https://twitter.com/Heritage/status/717334953382391808[/tweet]

[nate33]

The immigrants need to address true shortages are mostly STEM types, which are almost exclusively males from India and China.

2000, the countries estimated to have the largest number of high-skill women emigrants living in OECD countries were the United Kingdom (1.5 million), the Philippines (1.1 million), India (1.0 million), Mexico (0.9 million), and Germany (0.9 million) (figure 3-41). The proportion of high-skill emigrants who are women varied considerably across source countries (see Docquier, Lowell, and Marfouk 2009).

I'm curious what their definition of "high-skill" is? My guess is that most of them aren't STEM. We've already got a bunch of college educated liberal arts majors working at Starbucks. We don't need more.

[nate33]

Meanwhile, in Sweden:

[tweet]https://twitter.com/camefromempires/status/717318254117593088[/tweet]

[nate33]

Rapper Azealia Banks Calls for Sarah Palin to Be Gang-Raped by Black Men:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2016/04/04/rapper-azealia-banks-calls-sarah-palin-gang-raped-black-men/

Of course there will be no consequences, no condemnation at all. Her career will go on. Imagine if, say, Toby Keith said that Carol Moseley Braun should be gang raped by skinheads.

[DCZards]

Here is a proposal that almost no one will like.

Have restitution to black families in the form of education vouchers. Those education vouchers could be used by adults and children.

Many Rs would be opposed to any kind of restitution.

Many Ds would be opposed to any kind of voucher (vs. publicly controlled education spending). The status quo is that black families wouldn't be as shrewd in spending their vouchers as the system - I think that is absolute hogwash - when it is your money, you will figure it out.

Part of the education spending should be targeted at entrepreneurship. Blacks are much less likely to get a job interview if their name is "black leaning". If you are creating your own job you have a better (not as good) shot:
http://www.nber.org/digest/sep03/w9873.html

First of all, what you call restitution many of us in the black community call reparations. You know, that “40 acres and a mule” that were promised 150 years ago.

As for your education voucher idea, I’m for doing the tough, hard work that it will take to reform our nation’s public schools and not for looking for ways to have a handful of children escape them. While it might be easier to provide a voucher that allows some families and children to flee broken public schools, I’m concerned about the children left behind, who are certain to be our neediest kids.

There have always been a lot of questions about education vouchers and the answers have usually been inadequate for many of us. For example, how much will the vouchers be for? Will they be enough to let ALL black children attend a quality school? Or will most of these kids end up in “instant schools” opened by fly-by-night hucksters for the express purpose of taking advantage of the government money now available to them thanks to vouchers?

I can assure you that almost all of these “instant schools” will be inferior to even our worse public schools today…and they will likely be shut down in 2-3 years for financial malfeasance.

Vouchers are too often an excuse to abandon the urban public schools, which will always be the place where a majority of kids are educated. There are simply not enough good private or parochial schools to change that dynamic. So I say let’s focus on fixing our public schools and improving the education of ALL of our children.

Finally, if you’re really concerned about the well-being of black folks, why not give them money or a voucher to use as they see fit, and not restrict it to education?

[Wizardspride]

Rapper Azealia Banks Calls for Sarah Palin to Be Gang-Raped by Black Men:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2016/04/04/rapper-azealia-banks-calls-sarah-palin-gang-raped-black-men/

Of course there will be no consequences, no condemnation at all. Her career will go on. Imagine if, say, Toby Keith said that Carol Moseley Braun should be gang raped by skinheads.

Nate, google Azealia Banks and you'll see why this won't make any waves.

She literally hates everyone. Other rappers, gay people etc etc.

If would be like David Duke saying dumb ****. You pretty much expect it.

[TGW]

I have no interest in vouchers. It's just a hidden subsidy for private institutions. And on top of that, education is useless without jobs. It's a sad indictment on American society that a college educated black male is less likely to be employed than a white male with a HS diploma.

Give AA's a check, or tax exempt status so that they can start businesses and become self-reliant.

[TGW]

Rapper Azealia Banks Calls for Sarah Palin to Be Gang-Raped by Black Men:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2016/04/04/rapper-azealia-banks-calls-sarah-palin-gang-raped-black-men/

Of course there will be no consequences, no condemnation at all. Her career will go on. Imagine if, say, Toby Keith said that Carol Moseley Braun should be gang raped by skinheads.

Azalia Banks is an attention whore and a nobody who says outlandish stuff for attention. Does Breitbart have nothing better to report on? LOL

[nate33]

Rapper Azealia Banks Calls for Sarah Palin to Be Gang-Raped by Black Men:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2016/04/04/rapper-azealia-banks-calls-sarah-palin-gang-raped-black-men/

Of course there will be no consequences, no condemnation at all. Her career will go on. Imagine if, say, Toby Keith said that Carol Moseley Braun should be gang raped by skinheads.

Azalia Banks is an attention whore and a nobody who says outlandish stuff for attention. Does Breitbart have nothing better to report on? LOL

The point is, she can be easily dismissed as an "attention whore". It would be impossible for any famous white person anywhere in America to make an equivalent comment about a black political figure.

[DCZards]

Rapper Azealia Banks Calls for Sarah Palin to Be Gang-Raped by Black Men:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2016/04/04/rapper-azealia-banks-calls-sarah-palin-gang-raped-black-men/

Of course there will be no consequences, no condemnation at all. Her career will go on. Imagine if, say, Toby Keith said that Carol Moseley Braun should be gang raped by skinheads.

Azalia Banks is an attention whore and a nobody who says outlandish stuff for attention. Does Breitbart have nothing better to report on? LOL

The point is, she can be easily dismissed as an "attention whore". It would be impossible for any famous white person anywhere in America to make an equivalent comment about a black political figure.

Keyword here is "famous." Had you even heard of Azalia Banks before now? I know I hadn't.

[dckingsfan]

The immigrants need to address true shortages are mostly STEM types, which are almost exclusively males from India and China.

2000, the countries estimated to have the largest number of high-skill women emigrants living in OECD countries were the United Kingdom (1.5 million), the Philippines (1.1 million), India (1.0 million), Mexico (0.9 million), and Germany (0.9 million) (figure 3-41). The proportion of high-skill emigrants who are women varied considerably across source countries (see Docquier, Lowell, and Marfouk 2009).

I'm curious what their definition of "high-skill" is? My guess is that most of them aren't STEM. We've already got a bunch of college educated liberal arts majors working at Starbucks. We don't need more.

Actually, those were the STEM folks. It is actually quite a small number - but for our purposes a reasonably large number.

[dckingsfan]

I have no interest in vouchers. It's just a hidden subsidy for private institutions. And on top of that, education is useless without jobs. It's a sad indictment on American society that a college educated black male is less likely to be employed than a white male with a HS diploma.

Give AA's a check, or tax exempt status so that they can start businesses and become self-reliant.

Well, we knew it was unpopular for traditional more government Ds

And if you combine entrepreneurship with education - then you have something. And we already have breaks for small businesses - I think expanding those would be wise. And yes to being self-reliant.

[dckingsfan]

First of all, what you call restitution many of us in the black community call reparations. You know, that “40 acres and a mule” that were promised 150 years ago.

As for your education voucher idea, I’m for doing the tough, hard work that it will take to reform our nation’s public schools and not for looking for ways to have a handful of children escape them. While it might be easier to provide a voucher that allows some families and children to flee broken public schools, I’m concerned about the children left behind, who are certain to be our neediest kids.

There have always been a lot of questions about education vouchers and the answers have usually been inadequate for many of us. For example, how much will the vouchers be for? Will they be enough to let ALL black children attend a quality school? Or will most of these kids end up in “instant schools” opened by fly-by-night hucksters for the express purpose of taking advantage of the government money now available to them thanks to vouchers?

I can assure you that almost all of these “instant schools” will be inferior to even our worse public schools today…and they will likely be shut down in 2-3 years for financial malfeasance.

Vouchers are too often an excuse to abandon the urban public schools, which will always be the place where a majority of kids are educated. There are simply not enough good private or parochial schools to change that dynamic. So I say let’s focus on fixing our public schools and improving the education of ALL of our children.

Finally, if you’re really concerned about the well-being of black folks, why not give them money or a voucher to use as they see fit, and not restrict it to education?

Great questions... I would think that the vouchers would start well before kindergarten and last after high school.

And I see you are taking the "blacks can't navigate a purchase" paradigm. I summarily dismiss this argument.

And yes, public schools are broken - but if someone wanted to go to the public school and use their voucher for tutoring - so be it.

Let them have a choice as how to use their voucher. You might find they are pretty clever.

[DCZards]

Great questions... I would think that the vouchers would start well before kindergarten and last after high school.

And I see you are taking the "blacks can't navigate a purchase" paradigm. I summarily dismiss this argument.

And yes, public schools are broken - but if someone wanted to go to the public school and use their voucher for tutoring - so be it.

Let them have a choice as how to use their voucher. You might find they are pretty clever.

Actually, you're implicitly taking the "blacks can't navigate a purchase" paradigm by limiting vouchers to education. Why not let black families use the vouchers (or reparations) as they see fit. Why limit it to education?

My concern is not navigation but the existence of enough quality private or parochial schools to even make it possible for those who receive education vouchers to decide where to spend them.

[TGW]

Rapper Azealia Banks Calls for Sarah Palin to Be Gang-Raped by Black Men:

http://www.breitbart.com/big-hollywood/2016/04/04/rapper-azealia-banks-calls-sarah-palin-gang-raped-black-men/

Of course there will be no consequences, no condemnation at all. Her career will go on. Imagine if, say, Toby Keith said that Carol Moseley Braun should be gang raped by skinheads.

Azalia Banks is an attention whore and a nobody who says outlandish stuff for attention. Does Breitbart have nothing better to report on? LOL

The point is, she can be easily dismissed as an "attention whore". It would be impossible for any famous white person anywhere in America to make an equivalent comment about a black political figure.

Uh huh...so when Ted Nugent called obama a "chimp ass" and called for him to be hung, what did you say about it?

[dckingsfan]

Great questions... I would think that the vouchers would start well before kindergarten and last after high school.

And I see you are taking the "blacks can't navigate a purchase" paradigm. I summarily dismiss this argument.

And yes, public schools are broken - but if someone wanted to go to the public school and use their voucher for tutoring - so be it.

Let them have a choice as how to use their voucher. You might find they are pretty clever.

Actually, you're implicitly taking the "blacks can't navigate a purchase" paradigm by limiting vouchers to education. Why not let black families use the vouchers (or reparations) as they see fit. Why limit it to education?

My concern is not navigation but the existence of enough quality private or parochial schools to even make it possible for those who receive education vouchers to decide where to spend them.

You make a good point and maybe that is the better way to go.

The reason I think that it should be in the form of education vouchers is that the country needs a better educated populace and education is one of the best precursors to wealth.

I might not agree - but your point(s) is very valid.

[nate33]

Azalia Banks is an attention whore and a nobody who says outlandish stuff for attention. Does Breitbart have nothing better to report on? LOL

The point is, she can be easily dismissed as an "attention whore". It would be impossible for any famous white person anywhere in America to make an equivalent comment about a black political figure.

Uh huh...so when Ted Nugent called obama a "chimp ass" and called for him to be hung, what did you say about it?

"Chimp ass" is a far cry from "she should be gang raped".

[TGW]

The point is, she can be easily dismissed as an "attention whore". It would be impossible for any famous white person anywhere in America to make an equivalent comment about a black political figure.

Uh huh...so when Ted Nugent called obama a "chimp ass" and called for him to be hung, what did you say about it?

"Chimp ass" is a far cry from "she should be gang raped".

so a racial slur and a lynching reference isn't as bad as a rape slur? You sound like a whiny liberal nate.