llcc25 wrote:Sorry cobra and Nate, I forgot whiteside was unrestricted so that trade I agree doesn't make sense. And I'm no wall troll. He's the best and most valuable trade trip we got but it's clear to be that although good/very good, he will never be great. He doesn't do the little things when we need to. His defense and decision making, finishing at rim, hasn't improved so I'm willing to move him IF he team can get better. I think it's arguable that the favors, Exum, #1pick and hood or lyles for wall and Morris does that. Favors immediately upgrades our PF position on both ends but more importNtly it fits well w gortat. Secondly, Exum and utahs pick which could be used to take Ulis who calipari said was his best ever floor general is nice consolation at PG. and then add to that lyles or hood I do think it makes us no worse than this year and builds toward the future. I'm willing to take a step back one year to take two steps forward and I think this trade possibly does that. With wall I know what we have- a team that will battle for 7/8 in east. Thats not good enough for me.
Your argument makes no sense... If you are simply saying trade Wall for a better player that makes the Wizards Better right now. Then you win...you will get no argument there. But the same can be said for Lillard, Durant, Lebron, Paul, and Curry- Yes trade them for some one that makes your team better immediately.
But if you suggest that The Wizards trade their best player that is avg 20 & 10 at 25 years old and is a bargin under the new salary cap for another player that you suggest will make the Wiz better immediately because this other player will at some point in the future be "great"...I say to you that you are truly a wishful thinker and a disciple of Hienke and Grufeld. Yes mortage the present and the future for some distant future dream of something great... Yes good call- like Erine didn't improve the team last offseason in hopes of pulling Durant this offseason by hiring his highschool coach or how the 76ers kept drafting the "best player available" and stockpiling picks in hopes that one of them would GREAT instead of building a team with those picks that could play together (now they got 3 big men that play the same position...moderately)
Your assessment that Wall will never be great while not explaining how you know any of these other guys will be great is illogical. At 25 Wall may not be a top 3 point guard but ALL NBA pundits have him anywhere from 3-7 with 2 guys that are in the discussion Lowery 30 and Paul 30 being on the other side of 30 (also known as in your prime) while Wall and Lillard are the youngest in the best point guard discussion at 25. Portland wouldn't dream of trading Lillard even though by all accounts Lillard was harder to play for most of his team mates last year than Wall because he was a shoot first point guard and many of the fans blame him for Aldridge leaving.
You also are saying someone fits well with Gortat? And you said Gortat and the word future in the same post- that's cute. I love the Polish Hammer - Great Guy - good team guy but he is a 32 year old career 10 point and 7 rebound guy. Last year he was 13 and 9 and this year he is 12 and 9- do you think he will be significantly better next year because he is playing with a new point guard and PF and 33 years old? You also said that you are willing to take a step back for the next two years if it makes us significantly better in the future. And again you are suggesting trading WALL at 25 so you can get a guy that (as you put it...more importantly) PAIRS well with Gortat who will be 33 next year...wow
You also said with Wall we will battle for 7/8 for the next couple years and that's not good enough for you...like Wall is playing by himself. Most of the good teams build around their best player especially if that best player takes accountability when he does wrong, is coachable by all accounts, stays out of trouble, is young, stays relatively healthy, an all star 3 times by 25, one of the best at his position, a bargin based on the salary cap and is liked by the fans.
Since making the playoffs isn't good enough for you I would like to remind you that- that most people believe only 3 teams have a chance this year. Cleveland, GS and San Antonio. So this year you need 1 MVP level and two great players to compete for a ring (Cleveland and GS) or the the best coach in the league with an amazing system, 3 HOFers and two of the best players in the league (San Antonio). The rest of the league is playing for 4th- OKC could be playing for a ring if they kept Harden...they would have 3 MVP level guys but they gave up on Harden for cash considerations and the PLAYERs voted HARDEN their MVP last year...oops - I bet if OKC could do it over they would have kept the Beard---but I digress.
These are my points-
1: If making the playoffs isn't enough- none of the guys you named are going to make the wiz a title contender.
2: you can't talk future while trading a 25 year old 3 time MVP for someone even younger and unproven while talking about how someone would pair well with your 32 year old center
3:If you need a big 3 to compete for a title- Wall is at very least a piece of a big 3 (especially if Kyrie is considered that in Cleveland) and if you trade him for another point you have just traded out or even upgraded your point guard...you are in a relatively similar situation after the trade (even if you traded for 25 year old Chris Paul...who remains ringless at 30). Unless you go get Curry for Wall we ain't competing for a ring and I don't even think Curry could get this team through a healthy Cleveland with this roster. So what's the point of that??
4: Pop ain't walking through that door and as long as we have Wittless and Erine - Wall will have to brute force it to get us to 9th in the east because the East is MUCH BETTER this year and will be better next year. If we don't keep Wall and get 2 other great players and a coach...its down hill from here. But don't worry Wall will be demanding a trade by Christmas because why wouldn't he..and we can go back to the pre-Wall good ole days when this franchise was dominating the league.
5: your "blowing it up" trade for Dragic (30 year old overpaid and horribly over rated - Goran is a career 12pt 4.5 assist guy but he did have that carreer year in that CONTRACT YEAR...20 and 6 and then promptly back to 16 and 4 the next) Whiteside (young, talented and uncoachable...remember we tried that and it sucks) and Winslow (unproven) would clearly make the wiz better because that team without good coaching and DWade would be better than 10 in the east (laughable!)
Or we can go out there get a coach, a GM and try to surround Wall with some young players that can stay healthy and by the time Wall 27 maybe we are competing for something significant.
the Wiz are doomed until we get a new GM and Coach... Unless Durant just decides to come here because...he is crazy.
Btw- I can tell you study at the foot of Skip Bayless
