2016 Draft

[NavLDO]

Why not? Everyone is saying "we can't add 4 rookies next year". We have so many picks we can use some of them on high risk high reward players.

The way I see it, we have the 28th and 33rd picks to be creative, but need to 'hit' on one of the two lotto picks at PF...maybe one combo PF/C guy like Bender, Labissierre, or Ellenson, and then a pure PF or potential SF/PF hybrid, like Jaylon Brown (7' 1" Wingspan at 225lbs,but with SF height at 6' 7"). Or maybe, and to me, it may work out well for us and ease their transition into the NBA by taking two teammates with chemistry together like Brown/Rabb; both appear to be ranked close to what our picks are likely to be (3 and 13). I've often wondered about this theory, and wonder if anyone's done research on how it benefits/hinders players. Here are some other potential combos, depending where we pick:

Jamal Murray/Skal Labissiere/Tyler Ulis (Kentucky--imagine those as our 3, 13, 28 selections... ;-O )
Ingram/Grayson Allen (Duke - picks 2 and 33)
Dunn/Benjamin Bentil (Providence - picks 4? and 33)
Luwawu/Zubac (Mega Leks - picks 13 and 28)
Deyonta Davis/Valentine (Mich St - would likely have to trade back to late-lotto/mid-teens to make this happen, which with our luck, we could slide to like, 5th or 6th overall. It may be wise to trade that 5th/6th overall for, say 14th overall Bulls, or 18th overall, Memphis...or maybe Boston, with owning the Nets pick at 4, and we have the 5th, maybe they trade their 16th and 24th overall, along with the Nets 2018 1st Rd pick that they own or their right to swap their 2017th 1st with the Nets. Anyway, would have to happen for us to have two late-lotto/mid-teens picks, since Davis is DE ranked 13th, and Valentine 17th.)
Chriss/Dejounte Murray (Washington - picks 13 and 33)
Wade Baldwin/Damian Jones (Vandy - picks 13 and 28)
Diamond Stone/Melo Trimble (Maryland - picks 28 and 33)
Cheick Diallo/Wayne Selden/Perry Ellis (Kansas - picks 28 and 33, and camp invite/tryout)

Any of those other combos jump out at anyone? To me, the Brown/Rabb combo would both fit best when comparing draft stock to likely picks, as well as, position need. But the Ingram/Allen comb is intriguing, and so is the Murray/Labissiere/Ulis, Davis/Valentine, and Luwawu/Zubac). Thoughts??

[jcsunsfan]

Someone is going to fall to that 28th pick. It always happens that way. Whoever we get there we will all be amazed and think what a steal it is--unless the player that is falling gets ignored by McD and he picks someone esle.

[bwgood77]

How are you guys comparing Chriss to Amare and Keef? He resembles neither. Can you guys only make comparisons to Suns players? You're aware there are 29 other teams out there, right?

I think he probably shouldn't be compared to nba players right now because he's only played for two years. His shot blocking ability and ability to hit the 3 with that height and athleticism would put him on a short list those qualities, but then he has a very low rebounding rate and fouls a ton. Ibaka fouled a lot coming into the league but had a high rebound rate.

For him it all depends on learning things like boxing out, defending without fouling and being in the right position. If you put him next to an elite rebounder that is limited offensively, like perhaps a Tyson Chandler, that would offset the weakness in rebounindg that would help since on offense he can spread the floor. There will probably be a big question for teams in the 5-8 range if they need a PF that can hit the 3 between him and Ellenson...since Ellenson is a premier rebounder who people assume will become a 3 pt threat, but he lacks athleticism and may struggle defending PFs.

[bwgood77]

Why not? Everyone is saying "we can't add 4 rookies next year". We have so many picks we can use some of them on high risk high reward players.

The way I see it, we have the 28th and 33rd picks to be creative, but need to 'hit' on one of the two lotto picks at PF...maybe one combo PF/C guy like Bender, Labissierre, or Ellenson, and then a pure PF or potential SF/PF hybrid, like Jaylon Brown (7' 1" Wingspan at 225lbs,but with SF height at 6' 7"). Or maybe, and to me, it may work out well for us and ease their transition into the NBA by taking two teammates with chemistry together like Brown/Rabb; both appear to be ranked close to what our picks are likely to be (3 and 13). I've often wondered about this theory, and wonder if anyone's done research on how it benefits/hinders players. Here are some other potential combos, depending where we pick:

Jamal Murray/Skal Labissiere/Tyler Ulis (Kentucky--imagine those as our 3, 13, 28 selections... ;-O )
Ingram/Grayson Allen (Duke - picks 2 and 33)
Dunn/Benjamin Bentil (Providence - picks 4? and 33)
Luwawu/Zubac (Mega Leks - picks 13 and 28)
Deyonta Davis/Valentine (Mich St - would likely have to trade back to late-lotto/mid-teens to make this happen, which with our luck, we could slide to like, 5th or 6th overall. It may be wise to trade that 5th/6th overall for, say 14th overall Bulls, or 18th overall, Memphis...or maybe Boston, with owning the Nets pick at 4, and we have the 5th, maybe they trade their 16th and 24th overall, along with the Nets 2018 1st Rd pick that they own or their right to swap their 2017th 1st with the Nets. Anyway, would have to happen for us to have two late-lotto/mid-teens picks, since Davis is DE ranked 13th, and Valentine 17th.)
Chriss/Dejounte Murray (Washington - picks 13 and 33)
Wade Baldwin/Damian Jones (Vandy - picks 13 and 28)
Diamond Stone/Melo Trimble (Maryland - picks 28 and 33)
Cheick Diallo/Wayne Selden/Perry Ellis (Kansas - picks 28 and 33, and camp invite/tryout)

Any of those other combos jump out at anyone? To me, the Brown/Rabb combo would both fit best when comparing draft stock to likely picks, as well as, position need. But the Ingram/Allen comb is intriguing, and so is the Murray/Labissiere/Ulis, Davis/Valentine, and Luwawu/Zubac). Thoughts??

I'd rather not take two players who played for the same team in college. I'd rather not risk stuff like guys preferring to pass only to one another, etc, and coming in much closer and kind of in their own clique. I'm not terribly enamored with either player either. Out of that group though, if we could somehow get Davis at 13 and Valentine at 27 I might be ok with that. One is a senior and one a freshman, so if anything, one is probably more like a mentor to the other than more of a buddy.

But ultimately I'd rather guys spend more time on working hard and getting to know and developing chemistry with their new teammates.

[Krush32]

I know everyone loves super athletic guys...they are fun to watch but that doesnt necessarily lead to wins. Warriors, and spurs arent made up of superior athletes but what they do have is skilled players with versatilty.

My problem with Chriss is the same size as tj warren. He has a small forward body without length. Thats probably why he avgs 5 rebs a game. Big men take him to the post it negates his jumping ability and they can jump hook over him all day. He isnt a bad player but I dont see him as a starting PF in the nba. Maybe energy backup off the bench.

His foul problem is probably from lack of fundamentals. Most big guys know to use their length and play straight up making people shoot over the top. I bet he tries to make up for it with his jumping ability which leads to biting on pump fakes and foul trouble.

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

I know everyone loves super athletic guys...they are fun to watch but that doesnt necessarily lead to wins. Warriors, and spurs arent made up of superior athletes but what they do have is skilled players with versatilty.

My problem with Chriss is the same size as tj warren. He has a small forward body without length. Thats probably why he avgs 5 rebs a game. Big men take him to the post it negates his jumping ability and they can jump hook over him all day. He isnt a bad player but I dont see him as a starting PF in the nba. Maybe energy backup off the bench.

His foul problem is probably from lack of fundamentals. Most big guys know to use their length and play straight up making people shoot over the top. I bet he tries to make up for it with his jumping ability which leads to biting on pump fakes and foul trouble.

Chriss could use another year of seasoning, imo. But the combination of his tantalizing freshman year and a stronger draft class next year make it a no-brainer for him to come out. Opposing bigs will punish him down low, coaches will hate his defense and lack of tenacity on the glass, and he probably does not yet have NBA range on his 3, meaning whoever takes him will have to wait for production. I'm talking myself into thinking he'll still be available at 12/13, should we want him. But I think we pass.

[MathiasPW]

I have been mostly quiet on Draft and Trade threads, and just realized why I spend so much time reading and gathering opinions while I have none of my own.

I concluded that at this point, I have absolutely no idea what we need for our team.

We don't have a system in place, we don't even have a coach for next season, and are left to fill the blanks when figuring if we will continue with the dual PG system.

How am I to choose between a stretch four like Ellenson or a post guy like Sabonis if I can't tell what job our frontcourt will have next season ?

When looking at the backcourt, should I pay attention to a combo guard like Murray or Hield, or expect us to go back to traditional basketball with a guy like Dunn ?
I don't know how to evaluate talent. I must take fit into account,and then see what particular characteristics of each player available best fill these needs.
And at this point, it's impossible to say what our needs are, given we have absolutely no hint at what we are aiming at.

It's frustrating not to know where we are headed.

[bwgood77]

I have been mostly quiet on Draft and Trade threads, and just realized why I spend so much time reading and gathering opinions while I have none of my own.

I concluded that at this point, I have absolutely no idea what we need for our team.

We don't have a system in place, we don't even have a coach for next season, and are left to fill the blanks when figuring if we will continue with the dual PG system.

How am I to choose between a stretch four like Ellenson or a post guy like Sabonis if I can't tell what job our frontcourt will have next season ?

When looking at the backcourt, should I pay attention to a combo guard like Murray or Hield, or expect us to go back to traditional basketball with a guy like Dunn ?
I don't know how to evaluate talent. I must take fit into account,and then see what particular characteristics of each player available best fill these needs.
And at this point, it's impossible to say what our needs are, given we have absolutely no hint at what we are aiming at.

It's frustrating not to know where we are headed.

Yes, it's tough to know. I think one thing we DO know, is that McD will try to turn this team into a competitive playoff team for next year, whether that is the best idea for the Suns long term or not....he has said things like "we are not as far off as some people might think".

[NavLDO]

At 28 and 33, Here's some guys I hope they consider. And I'm fine with taking no Euro Stash types or 3; if all 4 end up good enough to play, I'm sure another team will take one or two off our hands for a nominal fee, of course... . But even better would be if all 4 panned out to allow us to do a complete and proper roster overhaul of anyone over the age of 26; keep a couple of vets for leadership. And depending upon how you personally view it, we really only have fro 3 to 6 "core" guys, so to me, there is plenty of room for 4 rookies...if they are the RIGHT rookies. The age listed is what they'll be on Day 1 of the '16/'17 season; DE = Draft Express.

Petr Cornelie, 21YO - (DE Ranked 33rd) - 7' w/ 7'1" Wingspan Stretch 4 (42% from 3, 75% FT%, 30% from 2)...yep, shot 12% better from 3, than 2

Brice Johnson, 22YO - (DE Ranked 36th) - 6' 9.5", 230 w/ 6' 11" Wingspan (78% FT%, 62% from 2)...all good %s, and the FT% is promising, as he averaged almost 4.5 attempts in 27 minutes/gm.

Cheick Diallo - 20YO - (DE Ranked 39th) - 6' 9" w/ 7'4" Wingspan (54% FT%, 55% from 2)

Chinanu Onuaku - 20YO - (DE Ranked 53rd) - 6' 10", 246lbs w/ 7'2.5" Wingspan, Center (59% FT%, 62% from 2) - 8.5 Rebs/2.0 Blks per 25 minutes

Jarrod Uthoff - 23YO - (DE Ranked 54th) - 6' 9.5" w/ 6'10.5"" Wingspan SF/Stretch 4 (39% from 3, 81% FT%, 49.5% from 2) - 19Pts, 6.5 Rebs, and over 5, 3Pt attempts, AND...2.6 Blks per 31 minutes--not bad for a hybrid SF/PF.

Robert Carter - 22YO - (DE Ranked 58th) - 6'8", 247lbs, w/ 7'2" Wingspan, PF with some range (2.2 3PT att per gm) (34% from 3, 74% FT%, 63% from 2)

Pascal Siakam - 22YO - (DE Ranked 64th) - 6'9" w/ "very long" (unspecified) Wingspan PF (69% FT%, 55% from 2) - 12 Rebs and 2.2 Blks per 35 minutes

Anyway, some intriguing guys, kind of like the 7'2" "Stretch 5" we drafted a couple years back in the 2nd Rd; he didn't work out, but it was worth a shot. A few will need some development, obviously, but as I mentioned above, I'd be perfectly fine drafting 4 PFs and letting them shake out as they will, but it wouldn't hurt to 'hedge your bets' and try to make sure at least a couple are hybrid 3/4s or 4/5s. Maybe McD gets lucky and gets 2 or 3, no-kidding NBA talents in; even if it takes 2-3 years for one to develop. We have 4 picks in likely, the top 33 picks in the draft; I like our chances of getting 2 starter-level talents. But if McD turns the picks into a star player, that's fine, too. I know this draft is viewed as being weak, but I trust McD to be able to find the gems or turn those pics into an asset.

[ATTL]

Bad comparison of the day: Chriss and Tyrus Thomas.

Sent from my SM-G900P using Tapatalk

[Damkac]

I have been mostly quiet on Draft and Trade threads, and just realized why I spend so much time reading and gathering opinions while I have none of my own.

I concluded that at this point, I have absolutely no idea what we need for our team.

We don't have a system in place, we don't even have a coach for next season, and are left to fill the blanks when figuring if we will continue with the dual PG system.

How am I to choose between a stretch four like Ellenson or a post guy like Sabonis if I can't tell what job our frontcourt will have next season ?

When looking at the backcourt, should I pay attention to a combo guard like Murray or Hield, or expect us to go back to traditional basketball with a guy like Dunn ?
I don't know how to evaluate talent. I must take fit into account,and then see what particular characteristics of each player available best fill these needs.
And at this point, it's impossible to say what our needs are, given we have absolutely no hint at what we are aiming at.

It's frustrating not to know where we are headed.

If no big trades will happen then imo Suns biggest needs are:
- pf, preferably stretch but with not terrible D
- defensive sf who will replace Tucker (hopefully more talented than him)
If Chandler is traded then backup center would be also needed
For now Suns have enough guards and BB may also come next year. Unles Bledsoe or/and Knight is traded any new guard is redundant.
Booker, Len and Warren are supposedly Suns core so I don't expect them to be traded.

And about Bender's contract situation:

ICYMI
[tweet]https://twitter.com/Sportando/status/710467357601308672[/tweet]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/IAmDPick/status/717445489923371012[/tweet]

[thamadkant]

If the Suns had a strong team culture, picking players in the draft wouldnt be as hard as it is.


Top 5 = Pick the best player that matches the team's corporate values and team fitting personality
Pick 5 to 15 = Pick the player that will make an impact but at the same time matches the team's overall personality.
Beyond pick 15 = Pick the the best fitting player that matches the team's overall personality.

If the team has a winning culture that discourages bad behaviour or selfish tendencies.. then it becomes easier to pick players when you have 2 to 3 to choose from.

[GetYourPHX]

Someone is going to fall to that 28th pick. It always happens that way. Whoever we get there we will all be amazed and think what a steal it is--unless the player that is falling gets ignored by McD and he picks someone esle.

Juanchooooooooooooooo

[lilfishi22]

How are you guys comparing Chriss to Amare and Keef? He resembles neither. Can you guys only make comparisons to Suns players? You're aware there are 29 other teams out there, right?

That said, he is moving up my board. I still take Sabonis over him, easy.

I'm not. Thus the green font.

[DirtyDez]

Skal will go top-10 after workouts. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=j0_-gfys8yM

[jredsaz]

Skal will go top-10 after workouts. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=j0_-gfys8yM

Absolutely. Ranked at the top of the recruiting class. Terrible frosh but with the weak draft someone will take the potential.

[Jsbath]

What about thon maker?

I select with the whasinton picl

[MrTwister]

And about Bender's contract situation:

ICYMI
[tweet]https://twitter.com/Sportando/status/710467357601308672[/tweet]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/IAmDPick/status/717445489923371012[/tweet]

Updated

[tweet]https://twitter.com/IAmDPick/status/717716673105625088[/tweet]

[kennydorglas]

This is some great news about Bender.
We'll need an extensive look at him tho.

Right now i'm looking at some bluechip defenders in this 'probable' class.
Mikal Bridges stands out for me. I think he's the best one available and I'm just hoping he'll declare.
OG Anunoby is a freak!!! I absolutely love him but his numbers seems screwed to me (44% in 3pt and 47% in FT)... low usage/minutes... I think he'll stay.
Anthony Lawrence Jr. is another guy to keep an eye. All-around player in the textbook meaning.

All of this guys have at least 6'7 and 7'0 wingspan. They're all very young. Probably they'll stay but if one of those declares, we need to jump on them.

[jcsunsfan]

I have been mostly quiet on Draft and Trade threads, and just realized why I spend so much time reading and gathering opinions while I have none of my own.

I concluded that at this point, I have absolutely no idea what we need for our team.

We don't have a system in place, we don't even have a coach for next season, and are left to fill the blanks when figuring if we will continue with the dual PG system.

How am I to choose between a stretch four like Ellenson or a post guy like Sabonis if I can't tell what job our frontcourt will have next season ?

When looking at the backcourt, should I pay attention to a combo guard like Murray or Hield, or expect us to go back to traditional basketball with a guy like Dunn ?
I don't know how to evaluate talent. I must take fit into account,and then see what particular characteristics of each player available best fill these needs.
And at this point, it's impossible to say what our needs are, given we have absolutely no hint at what we are aiming at.

It's frustrating not to know where we are headed.

Yes, it's tough to know. I think one thing we DO know, is that McD will try to turn this team into a competitive playoff team for next year, whether that is the best idea for the Suns long term or not....he has said things like "we are not as far off as some people might think".

IOW

"We are alot better than our present record would indicate because we are tanking big time."

BTW. I have never ever seen a Suns team so blatantly tank. They play competitively through three quarters and then "inexplicably" run scrub lineups and weird schemes throughout the 4th quarter.