Dragan Bender - 97 born Croatian prospect

[Novocaine]

Kukoc was a much more aggressive scorer and better shooter than Bender. More advanced floor game. Bender is more high post oriented, yes.

In the U19 World Championships, Kukoc dropped 37 points on a team USA filled with future NBAers (Gary Payton, Larry Johnson, Kevin Pritchard, Stacy Augmon, Lionel Simmons, etc) while shooting something like 10/12 or 11/13 from the 3pt line.

It was this game:
http://archive.fiba.com/pages/eng/fa/game/p/gid/12/grid/A/rid/898/sid/2893/tid/390/_/1987_World_Championship_for_Junior_Men/statistic.html


Bender always seemed to me as a player who projected to be a high-level facilitator, but not a go-to scorer. More like a Draymond Green/Kirilenko style of player - well, not far off the NBA Kukoc role, but a different player.

[Stackey]

Kukoc was a much more aggressive scorer and better shooter than Bender. More advanced floor game. Bender is more high post oriented, yes.

In the U19 World Championships, Kukoc dropped 37 points on a team USA filled with future NBAers (Gary Payton, Larry Johnson, Kevin Pritchard, Stacy Augmon, Lionel Simmons, etc) while shooting something like 10/12 or 11/13 from the 3pt line.

It was this game:
http://archive.fiba.com/pages/eng/fa/game/p/gid/12/grid/A/rid/898/sid/2893/tid/390/_/1987_World_Championship_for_Junior_Men/statistic.html


Bender always seemed to me as a player who projected to be a high-level facilitator, but not a go-to scorer. More like a Draymond Green/Kirilenko style of player - well, not far off the NBA Kukoc role, but a different player.

lol Yugoslavia stronk, Toni Kukoc, Dino Radja, Vlade Divac. Some other players from that roster I know more as the fathers of the current basketball players

Teoman Alibegovic is the father of Amar Alibegovic, St John's Red Storm player
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBe2dP_-DFE

Slavisa Koprivica is the father of Balsa Koprivica, highly rated high school prospect in the USA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKVrZSEN1Yc

Miroslav Pecarski is the father of Marko Pecarski, highly rated 2000 born prospect in Europe. Samir Avdic is the father of Rijad Avdic, 1998 born player of ALBA Berlin.

Just trivia. Continue with Bender

[Mirotic12]

This thread is now reaching the same levels the Hezonja thread did last year with the exaggerating and enormous overrating of the level of Croatian players.

Bender is only 18, and so naturally he should get a lot better. Especially since he is a big man, and they take longer to develop.

But I have seen no evidence to indicate he is in any way comparable to the level of players like Kukoc or Kirilenko. The hype has already gone overboard now, and we are not even near to the draft. Comparing him to Kukoc or Kirilenko, and even going as far as to imply he is a better version of them...yeah, OK, sure.

On the other hand though, we have some other extremes here too, going in the opposite direction, with some claiming he would not be as good as D. Sabonis, and basically basing that on because D. Sabonis was good at Gonzaga, which is actually even to the point of being funny.

Europe produces better big men than D. Sabonis all the time. There is too much NCAA (American) centric thinking for sure going on, if so many people think D. Sabonis is anything special at all, as far as European talent goes.

[Golabki]

The U18 eurochampionships, what level of play were you expecting at those ages? Couldn't be any higher. Anyway, it was two years ago, that's why I brought it up.

That's what I thought, it just wasn't totally clear from your post.

I am EXTREMELY skeptical of players who are top draft picks based purely on play for the UXX teams (Bender is one). The tiny samples sizes, lack of overall talent and poor coaching in those games makes them pretty close to irrelevant to me. I also don't want to watch garbage basketball so I'm partially convincing myself to ignore it.

I applaud folks that do deep dives on this, but I'm just not really going to put much stock it in.

Fair enough, but about 95% of the players in the draft have none or little pro experience, so that's a radically nihilistic approach. I disagree about sample size, between national teams and high level tournaments like L'Hospitalet, Schweitzer, Eurocamps and junior Euroleague there are plenty of games, or about the lack of overall talent - in that game, there were two first round picks, potentially lottery, a couple of other guys who might end up being drafted and playing in the NBA and a handful who will play at a high level in Europe - that's more high-level talent than most college games.

To be fair, I recall feeling that game was telling me more about Sabonis than about Bender, about whom I'm agnostic, as I said here before.

Anyway, you were the one who claimed that the Sabonis of two years ago was better than the current Bender. Frankly, the 2 years ago Sabonis wasn't really better than the 16 years old Bender.

I think there's a big difference between college basketball and u18 games... College is ugly but it's organized and has real schedules and coaches with long term interest in the quality of play... U18 is more like an exhibition or all star game.

[Gordon]

Bender has two skills that are very coveted in the NBA
- ability to defend pick and roll and switch onto perimeter players
- perimeter shooting ability to strecht the defense

That alone will get him ample court time. Now i am not sure if he is build to be a superstar/all-star type of scorer. But with his soft hands, great size, quick feet and good profile off the court, teams are willing to make that bet. I like Kirilenko comparison for Bender.

Regarding Sabonis, they are not on the same level as prospects. Sabonis has neither physical tools nor shooting ability of Bender. He is just older, more mature and ready to contribute earlier in his career. I personally think Sabonis will not be more than 3rd bigmen on depth chart in his prime.

[saintEscaton]

Kirlienko was basically a long limbed SF with wing athleticism who transcended position with his ungodly measurables. I don't really see the comparison tbh. Could easily be another Vesley, similar scouting reports praising their ball handling, open court mobility and playmaking skills. Both described as cerebral hustle players with limited moves inside the arc

[Gordon]

Kirlienko was basically a long limbed SF with wing athleticism who transcended position with his ungodly measurables. I don't really see the comparison tbh. Could easily be another Vesley, similar scouting reports praising their ball handling, open court mobility and playmaking skills. Both described as cerebral hustle players with limited moves inside the arc

Well, he is nothing like Vesely. If you watched both of them, Vesely would not even come to mind as a comparisions.

Vesely was and is just terrible shooter. He has no perimeter game to speak off. Now in Europe he is playing as C full time - Tyson Chandler type of role as a dive man on pick and roll. And is pretty effective at it due to his great athleticism for european game (he is much more of a leaper than Bender). On the other hand If he was as good of a shooter as Bender, he would still be in the league. Or vice versa, if Bender shoot the ball like Vesely noone would talk about him as a lottery pick.

[Mattya]

I hope people keep questioning him and he slips to the Wolves.

[saintEscaton]

Kirlienko was basically a long limbed SF with wing athleticism who transcended position with his ungodly measurables. I don't really see the comparison tbh. Could easily be another Vesley, similar scouting reports praising their ball handling, open court mobility and playmaking skills. Both described as cerebral hustle players with limited moves inside the arc

Well, he is nothing like Vesely. If you watched both of them, Vesely would not even come to mind as a comparisions.

Vesely was and is just terrible shooter. He has no perimeter game to speak off. Now in Europe he is playing as C full time - Tyson Chandler type of role as a dive man on pick and roll. And is pretty effective at it due to his great athleticism for european game (he is much more of a leaper than Bender). On the other hand If he was as good of a shooter as Bender, he would still be in the league. Or vice versa, if Bender shoot the ball like Vesely noone would talk about him as a lottery pick.

He's not really setting the world on fire, sure he stroked it in the 2014 FIBA U18 cup. last season playing for second tier Ramat Gan he shot 41.8% from the field, 28.4% from three-point range and 64.1% from the free-throw line on signifcant volume. This season playing for Maccabi in the Premiere League he is shooting 23% from the field, 17%% from three-point range and 50% from the free throw line on smaller sample size in 10 game

[bwgood77]

Kirlienko was basically a long limbed SF with wing athleticism who transcended position with his ungodly measurables. I don't really see the comparison tbh. Could easily be another Vesley, similar scouting reports praising their ball handling, open court mobility and playmaking skills. Both described as cerebral hustle players with limited moves inside the arc

Well, he is nothing like Vesely. If you watched both of them, Vesely would not even come to mind as a comparisions.

Vesely was and is just terrible shooter. He has no perimeter game to speak off. Now in Europe he is playing as C full time - Tyson Chandler type of role as a dive man on pick and roll. And is pretty effective at it due to his great athleticism for european game (he is much more of a leaper than Bender). On the other hand If he was as good of a shooter as Bender, he would still be in the league. Or vice versa, if Bender shoot the ball like Vesely noone would talk about him as a lottery pick.

He's not really setting the world on fire, sure he stroked it in the 2014 FIBA U18 cup. last season playing for second tier Ramat Gan he shot 41.8% from the field, 28.4% from three-point range and 64.1% from the free-throw line on signifcant volume. This season playing for Maccabi in the Premiere League he is shooting 23% from the field, 17%% from three-point range and 50% from the free throw line on smaller sample size in 10 game

Can you post a link to where those #s come from because when I've researched him this year I found far different #s. In a quick search now I found a very small sample size, but not enough to get any real insight from. http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=E2015

[saintEscaton]

Well, he is nothing like Vesely. If you watched both of them, Vesely would not even come to mind as a comparisions.

Vesely was and is just terrible shooter. He has no perimeter game to speak off. Now in Europe he is playing as C full time - Tyson Chandler type of role as a dive man on pick and roll. And is pretty effective at it due to his great athleticism for european game (he is much more of a leaper than Bender). On the other hand If he was as good of a shooter as Bender, he would still be in the league. Or vice versa, if Bender shoot the ball like Vesely noone would talk about him as a lottery pick.

He's not really setting the world on fire, sure he stroked it in the 2014 FIBA U18 cup. last season playing for second tier Ramat Gan he shot 41.8% from the field, 28.4% from three-point range and 64.1% from the free-throw line on signifcant volume. This season playing for Maccabi in the Premiere League he is shooting 23% from the field, 17%% from three-point range and 50% from the free throw line on smaller sample size in 10 game

Can you post a link to where those #s come from because when I've researched him this year I found far different #s. In a quick search now I found a very small sample size, but not enough to get any real insight from. http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=E2015

I'm assuming these are up to date but I may be wrong
http://www.fiba.com/pages/eng/fc/gamecent/p/leagueid/ISR2/ot/1/pid/6058533/season/2015/tid/6006013/playerview.html

[Mirotic12]

That's what I thought, it just wasn't totally clear from your post.

I am EXTREMELY skeptical of players who are top draft picks based purely on play for the UXX teams (Bender is one). The tiny samples sizes, lack of overall talent and poor coaching in those games makes them pretty close to irrelevant to me. I also don't want to watch garbage basketball so I'm partially convincing myself to ignore it.

I applaud folks that do deep dives on this, but I'm just not really going to put much stock it in.

Fair enough, but about 95% of the players in the draft have none or little pro experience, so that's a radically nihilistic approach. I disagree about sample size, between national teams and high level tournaments like L'Hospitalet, Schweitzer, Eurocamps and junior Euroleague there are plenty of games, or about the lack of overall talent - in that game, there were two first round picks, potentially lottery, a couple of other guys who might end up being drafted and playing in the NBA and a handful who will play at a high level in Europe - that's more high-level talent than most college games.

To be fair, I recall feeling that game was telling me more about Sabonis than about Bender, about whom I'm agnostic, as I said here before.

Anyway, you were the one who claimed that the Sabonis of two years ago was better than the current Bender. Frankly, the 2 years ago Sabonis wasn't really better than the 16 years old Bender.

I think there's a big difference between college basketball and u18 games... College is ugly but it's organized and has real schedules and coaches with long term interest in the quality of play... U18 is more like an exhibition or all star game.

I think Under-18 Euro championship is definitely worse than NCAA DI. But it's better for sure than typical high school basketball in USA. Under-19 World championship and Under-20 Euro championship are more comparable with NCAA DI, although the power DI conferences I think are better.

But you are right that most teams at Under-18 just use it as an exhibition for player development. Only some of the countries like say France, Lithuania, Spain, Croatia, and Serbia even care about the results. It's pretty obvious all the other countries use it for player evaluation, and don't even care if they win games or not.

Kirlienko was basically a long limbed SF with wing athleticism who transcended position with his ungodly measurables. I don't really see the comparison tbh. Could easily be another Vesley, similar scouting reports praising their ball handling, open court mobility and playmaking skills. Both described as cerebral hustle players with limited moves inside the arc

I've seen many of Bender's games this year, and I see no comparison at all to Kirilenko. It's another lazy typical "Euro white player X must be like Euro white player Y" comparison, and it's just totally irrelevant and makes no sense.

Bender is a very good outside shooter, while Kirilenko was through his whole career, the guy the other team always left wide open to shoot 3s. When he played in Euroleague in 2011-2012 and last year, he was magically somehow wide open the whole game in half court. There is no way teams would leave Bender wide open all the game.

On the other hand, Kirilenko was a way better ball handler, passer, rebounder, defender, and just all around player, and was infinitely more versatile and athletic than Bender is. Bender is really, really mobile, fast, and quick for a guy his size. But he's not even in the same discussion with someone like Kirilenko athletically. Not even is it remotely close.

Kirilenko was the ultimate role player, the ultimate role player both on offense and defense. Bender's role playing depth basically starts and ends with he has the ability to stretch the floor. Kirilenko could play 3, 4, or small ball 5, and at his best, he could definitely easily guard positions 2-5. Bender is pretty obviously a pure stretch/face up PF, and if he can consistently guard one position, he will have been successful in that regard, compared to where he is at now.

There basically is no similarity at all in these players, other than they are white and European.

About Vesely, any scouting report that claimed he had ball handling and play making skills was imaginary, fake, and made up, almost 100% for sure was written by someone that had never seen him play. He never had any play making or ball handling skills.

Kirlienko was basically a long limbed SF with wing athleticism who transcended position with his ungodly measurables. I don't really see the comparison tbh. Could easily be another Vesley, similar scouting reports praising their ball handling, open court mobility and playmaking skills. Both described as cerebral hustle players with limited moves inside the arc

Well, he is nothing like Vesely. If you watched both of them, Vesely would not even come to mind as a comparisions.

Vesely was and is just terrible shooter. He has no perimeter game to speak off. Now in Europe he is playing as C full time - Tyson Chandler type of role as a dive man on pick and roll. And is pretty effective at it due to his great athleticism for european game (he is much more of a leaper than Bender). On the other hand If he was as good of a shooter as Bender, he would still be in the league. Or vice versa, if Bender shoot the ball like Vesely noone would talk about him as a lottery pick.

The problem with Vesely is that he's a pure C on offense, but on defense he can't guard big centers, or mobile power forwards. He basically has spent his entire career as a pure tweener. He started as a SF with insane athleticism and zero ability to play basketball, and no skills other than hustle.

Then he switched into a PF that could not guard anyone man to man, and that could not make a shot past 3 feet.

Now, he is a pure old school style 5 on offense, but he cant't play a lick of defense, other than covering on switches and getting off the ball weak side blocks.

Vesely is one of the freakiest of all time freaks genetically and athletically. 7 feet, 7-6 wingspan, 40 inch vertical, can run the floor exceptionally well...I mean he's not only vastly superior physically to someone like Bender, but he is also to someone like Antetokounmpo, who is shorter, has less length, and who is clearly slower and less explosive.

With all that insane physical upside though, Vesely still can't score outside of 3-5 feet, he still can't make a free throw, and he still has no natural position on defense, and not in a good way, not in a versatile can guard multiple positions way, but in a mired in a career-long tweener way.

So yeah, Vesely and Bender are pretty far apart on the basketball spectrum. They are possibly even 180 degrees polar opposites of each other basketball wise.

[Mirotic12]

Well, he is nothing like Vesely. If you watched both of them, Vesely would not even come to mind as a comparisions.

Vesely was and is just terrible shooter. He has no perimeter game to speak off. Now in Europe he is playing as C full time - Tyson Chandler type of role as a dive man on pick and roll. And is pretty effective at it due to his great athleticism for european game (he is much more of a leaper than Bender). On the other hand If he was as good of a shooter as Bender, he would still be in the league. Or vice versa, if Bender shoot the ball like Vesely noone would talk about him as a lottery pick.

He's not really setting the world on fire, sure he stroked it in the 2014 FIBA U18 cup. last season playing for second tier Ramat Gan he shot 41.8% from the field, 28.4% from three-point range and 64.1% from the free-throw line on signifcant volume. This season playing for Maccabi in the Premiere League he is shooting 23% from the field, 17%% from three-point range and 50% from the free throw line on smaller sample size in 10 game

Can you post a link to where those #s come from because when I've researched him this year I found far different #s. In a quick search now I found a very small sample size, but not enough to get any real insight from. http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=E2015

It's very easy to find.

Euroleague: (first tier European league) - this is the best league in Europe, and ESPN and draft sites lie every single time they claim ACB is the best, because it's nowhere close to Euroleague level.

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=E2015

2/8 = 25%

Eurocup: (second tier European league - his team got dropped down to that league because they got eliminated early in Euroleague) - this is basically the 2nd best league in Europe at this time, again better than ACB, that USA sports media falsely claims is the "2nd best league in the world".

http://www.eurocupbasketball.com/eurocup/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=U2015

0/4 = 0%

Israeli League: (the national domestic league where Bender plays, with only teams from Israel) - this is definitely one of the worst leagues in Europe, probably being something around the 10th best ranking among European national and regional leagues, and also being much worse than either Euroleague or Eurocup (the European competitions). So something like 12th best league in Europe overall.

http://basket.co.il/PlayerPage.asp?PlayerNumber=03&TeamId=950&cYear=2016&lang=en

23/52 = 44.2%

Add it all up together, and you get:

25/64 = 39.1%

I put the level of the leagues in, so that it gives proper perspective. If you read stuff like ESPN mocks, Chad Ford, etc., they would make it seem like Israeli League is the equivalent of Euroleague, when it's a huge disparity in level.

[Novocaine]

I think there's a big difference between college basketball and u18 games... College is ugly but it's organized and has real schedules and coaches with long term interest in the quality of play... U18 is more like an exhibition or all star game.

Nah, you're wrong on all accounts -maybe you're confusing the FIBA competitions with those exhibition games and tournaments like the Europcamp and such- but that's beyond the point: someone has already posted the game there and people can watch for themselves if it was competitive or not and how the 18 year old Sabonics stacked up against the 16 years old Bender. Of course, some people will insist on having opinions without watching, but we agree we can safely discard those as silly.

I'm assuming these are up to date but I may be wrong
http://www.fiba.com/pages/eng/fc/gamecent/p/leagueid/ISR2/ot/1/pid/6058533/season/2015/tid/6006013/playerview.html

Where did you get those "This season playing for Maccabi in the Premiere League he is shooting 23% from the field, 17%% from three-point range and 50% from the free throw line" values though? Your link is good, but it shows this season he's shooting 60% from 2pt, 45% from 3pt range and 80% from the free-throw line for Maccabi in the Premier League. If you include european games, his numbers for the year are 48.1 FG%, 42.4 3pt% and 77.8 FT%.

You somehow got the wrong numbers.

Kirlienko was basically a long limbed SF with wing athleticism who transcended position with his ungodly measurables. I don't really see the comparison tbh. Could easily be another Vesley, similar scouting reports praising their ball handling, open court mobility and playmaking skills. Both described as cerebral hustle players with limited moves inside the arc

Comparisons always depend on what one is comparing. I brought up that comparison and it was clear I was talking about role - not a go-to scorer, rather a high-end facilitator, hence why I named Draymond Green and Kukoc as other examples - none of those players is identical to each other. COuld have said Diaw or McRoberts. Kirilenko was a long perimeter forward (who would've played a lot more 4 than 3 in today's league) who was good at many things without having the scoring instincts or shot-creation skills to be more than a complementary scorer, but a very versatile player on both sides of the court. Does that description of Kirilenko works for you?

If you read a report on Vesely praising his ball-handling and playmaking, you need to drop that service. Did you mean Gallinari or something? It defies credulity anyone would describe Vesely that way.

[Mirotic12]

Where did you get those "This season playing for Maccabi in the Premiere League he is shooting 23% from the field, 17%% from three-point range and 50% from the free throw line" values though? Your link is good, but it shows this season he's shooting 60% from 2pt, 45% from 3pt range and 80% from the free-throw line for Maccabi in the Premier League. If you include european games, his numbers for the year are 48.1 FG%, 42.4 3pt% and 77.8 FT%.

You somehow got the wrong numbers.

I posted the actual correct numbers. You have to go to the actual leagues, get their official stats, then add them up. The stats on FIBA, draftexpress, and Eurobasket are always full of tons of errors, as are the stats given by major US sports media.

The accumulated stats on FIBA are almost always wrong and almost always outdated.

Just look at the official stats I posted, from the actual official leagues he plays in. Then add them up.

Euroleague =

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=E2015

6/18 FG = 33%
2/8 3 PT FG = 25%
1/2 FT = 50%

Eurocup =

http://www.eurocupbasketball.com/eurocup/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=U2015

0/8 FG = 0%
0/4 3 PT FG = 0%
0/0 FT = 0%

Israeli League =

http://basket.co.il/PlayerPage.asp?PlayerNumber=03&TeamId=950&cYear=2016&lang=en

44/87 FG = 50.6%
23/52 3 PT FG = 44.2%
20/25 FT = 80%

[bwgood77]

He's not really setting the world on fire, sure he stroked it in the 2014 FIBA U18 cup. last season playing for second tier Ramat Gan he shot 41.8% from the field, 28.4% from three-point range and 64.1% from the free-throw line on signifcant volume. This season playing for Maccabi in the Premiere League he is shooting 23% from the field, 17%% from three-point range and 50% from the free throw line on smaller sample size in 10 game

Can you post a link to where those #s come from because when I've researched him this year I found far different #s. In a quick search now I found a very small sample size, but not enough to get any real insight from. http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=E2015

It's very easy to find.

Euroleague: (first tier European league) - this is the best league in Europe, and ESPN and draft sites lie every single time they claim ACB is the best, because it's nowhere close to Euroleague level.

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=E2015

2/8 = 25%

Eurocup: (second tier European league - his team got dropped down to that league because they got eliminated early in Euroleague) - this is basically the 2nd best league in Europe at this time, again better than ACB, that USA sports media falsely claims is the "2nd best league in the world".

http://www.eurocupbasketball.com/eurocup/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=U2015

0/4 = 0%

Israeli League: (the national domestic league where Bender plays, with only teams from Israel) - this is definitely one of the worst leagues in Europe, probably being something around the 10th best ranking among European national and regional leagues, and also being much worse than either Euroleague or Eurocup (the European competitions). So something like 12th best league in Europe overall.

http://basket.co.il/PlayerPage.asp?PlayerNumber=03&TeamId=950&cYear=2016&lang=en

23/52 = 44.2%

Add it all up together, and you get:

25/64 = 39.1%

I put the level of the leagues in, so that it gives proper perspective. If you read stuff like ESPN mocks, Chad Ford, etc., they would make it seem like Israeli League is the equivalent of Euroleague, when it's a huge disparity in level.

So where would you put these leagues in comparison to NCAA conferences? Top euroleague above ACC? Israeli league like a mid major conference?

Either way you slice those stats, you can't get a ton from them..too small of sample size in the good leagues, and I can understand him not getting many minutes if the leagues are that great. On small, but at least enough volume to judge, it looks like he probably is a pretty good 3 pt shooter. Probably currently not good enough to shoot 40% in the NBA, but few guys his age are, if any.

[Novocaine]

It's very easy to find.

Yeah, especially if you just click on his FIBA page that Escanton provided:
http://www.fiba.com/pages/eng/fc/gameCent/p/leagueid/ISR2/ot/1/pid/6058533/season/2016/tid/6006013/tidstat//playerView.html

and then click where it says "Accumulated Stats".

and I see no comparison at all to Kirilenko. It's another lazy typical "Euro white player X must be like Euro white player Y" comparison, and it's just totally irrelevant and makes no sense.

Yeps. Must have have been. That's why I said "More like a Draymond Green/Kirilenko style of player" - if I had a 165IQ like claim to have (or was it 164?), then I would know Draymond Green is an Euro white player. I always thought he was American and black, but that's because I'm not as smart as you are.

I've seen many of Bender's games this year.

Really? How, just out of curiosity? I didn't know Maccabi domestic games were available for viewers in small towns in Arksansa. On what channel do you catch them?

[Novocaine]

Where did you get those "This season playing for Maccabi in the Premiere League he is shooting 23% from the field, 17%% from three-point range and 50% from the free throw line" values though? Your link is good, but it shows this season he's shooting 60% from 2pt, 45% from 3pt range and 80% from the free-throw line for Maccabi in the Premier League. If you include european games, his numbers for the year are 48.1 FG%, 42.4 3pt% and 77.8 FT%.

You somehow got the wrong numbers.

I posted the actual correct numbers. You have to go to the actual leagues, get their official stats, then add them up. The stats on FIBA, draftexpress, and Eurobasket are always full of tons of errors, as are the stats given by major US sports media.

Just look at the official stats I posted, from the actual official leagues he plays in. Then add them up.

Are you claiming that

"This season playing for Maccabi in the Premiere League he is shooting 23% from the field, 17%% from three-point range and 50% from the free throw line"

are the correct numbers?

Or the correct numbers were the one I posted?

[bwgood77]

I'm assuming these are up to date but I may be wrong
http://www.fiba.com/pages/eng/fc/gamecent/p/leagueid/ISR2/ot/1/pid/6058533/season/2015/tid/6006013/playerview.html

Where did you get those "This season playing for Maccabi in the Premiere League he is shooting 23% from the field, 17%% from three-point range and 50% from the free throw line" values though? Your link is good, but it shows this season he's shooting 60% from 2pt, 45% from 3pt range and 80% from the free-throw line for Maccabi in the Premier League. If you include european games, his numbers for the year are 48.1 FG%, 42.4 3pt% and 77.8 FT%.

You somehow got the wrong numbers.

OK, good. Those look like the #s I had found.

[Mirotic12]

Yeah, especially if you just click on his FIBA page that Escanton provided:
http://www.fiba.com/pages/eng/fc/gameCent/p/leagueid/ISR2/ot/1/pid/6058533/season/2016/tid/6006013/tidstat//playerView.html

and then click where it says "Accumulated Stats".

Those stats are not updated like they should be. You have to go the actual league sites to get the always current, correct, and updated stats. Excuse me for having the audacity to provide that information here, when others asked for it.

Euroleague =

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=E2015

6/18 FG = 33%
2/8 3 PT FG = 25%
1/2 FT = 50%

Eurocup =

http://www.eurocupbasketball.com/eurocup/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=004549&seasoncode=U2015

0/8 FG = 0%
0/4 3 PT FG = 0%
0/0 FT = 0%

Israeli League =

http://basket.co.il/PlayerPage.asp?PlayerNumber=03&TeamId=950&cYear=2016&lang=en

44/87 FG = 50.6%
23/52 3 PT FG = 44.2%
20/25 FT = 80%

Add that up, and you get this:

50/113 FG = 44.2%
25/64 3 PT FG = 39.1%
21/27 FT = 77.8%

These are the numbers you claimed were factually correct, and that supposedly FIBA has it right,

48.1 FG%
42.4 3pt%
77.8 FT%

Nope, FIBA only has the free throw percentage right. They are wrong on the field goal percentage and the 3 point field goal percentage.

I am sorry you don't like it, but if someone here asks what Dragan Bender's actual real shooting percentages are - I am going to post them. I am going to post the real actual numbers, and not incorrect ones, whether you like it or not.