Sam Hinkie steps down per Marc Stein

[Lou_23]

Grant has played a majority of his minutes at PF. Assuming you just ignored the link? Multiple metrics paint them as having similar impact.

I have no idea what Jerami Grant you were watching but the one I was watching the past two seasons was playing SF and was made to create shots around the perimeter. A complete disaster from a development standpoint. He should be getting bigger, and shooting less 3s.

Full time starter per =/= backup's per. By just by per numbers, Holmes was a better player than Grant, which begs the question... why would Grant playing over him? Also the team has no guards, dumb team building, hurting your assets' value by stacking them up on each other, etc.

Cite the bit about Covington?

Can you cite where I said he said RoCo 's agent? BTW Noel and Okafor's agents having been trying to push them out of town since last summer. Two best players, who play the same position, want out. The Process.

We gave away nothing and got players in return. You mentioned Stauskas and his PER, how about Landry? 22.5 PER...

In 15 minutes a game. Please stop reciting per as if it were the gospel. It has to be contextualized at least.

Noel agent what? Link please?

Enviado desde mi KFFOWI mediante Tapatalk

[GiantRobot]

That report did not bear the words of Hinkie saying he wanted Russell, all it said was 'the word on the street is they want Russell",

I don't think you know what a report is... when do GMs ever say who they're going to take before the draft or after they didn't get them? What an unrealistic standard

Brown said that he expected to leave the draft with Stauskas and Wiggins. But did we.....?

Considering both were gone at their expected spots? No, that would be impossible

[GiantRobot]

Noel agent what? Link please?

Enviado desde mi KFFOWI mediante Tapatalk

More Zach Lowe stuff, it was from the end of the 2014 season and then a few months later fake trades putting Noel with his hometown Celtics arose, 100% agent placed (speculation based upon Lowe)

[GiantRobot]

The funny thing is that this all time great Warriors team was built over 4 drafts

2009- Steph Curry
2010- Ekpe Udoh (Bust! THEIR ENTIRE PROCESS IS A SHAM! FIRE EVERYONE!)
2011- Klay Thompson
2012- Harrison Barnes, Festus Ezeli, Draymond Green

4 years. 4 years on top of 20 where they pretty much blew ass. 3 of those 4 they had soon-to-be 2 time MVP Steph Curry. Why would they keep sucking with Curry? Why didn't they splooge in FA on overpriced vets? They really blew it. Look at them now; struggling since they built through the draft. You're right, Hinkie was stupid to try and execute this plan. And when Embiid is healthy and kicking ass along with our first this year, we'll just hand Colangelo a 3rd Exec of the year trophy for trotting out Hinkie's players.

This was supposed to be the draft to finish out the core, I'm so disgusted at how we've been duped

Sixers don't have a core. They have Okafor, who wants out and who Hinkie would've never wanted as his center. That's about it

[GiantRobot]

You need at least one franchise level player in place before you start building incrementally.

No... you can build while also still tanking. 4 of the 6 top worse teams were tanking but already had good players on their teams. TWolves have two franchise players and The Pelicans have one of the best centers in the league. You can put yourself into contention for the #1 pick without exorcising all talent off the roster like it's beelzebub.

(BTW the two other teams were the Nets, who were Billy Kinged and of course, the process)

[WVU]

You need at least one franchise level player in place before you start building incrementally.

No... you can build while also still tanking. 4 of the 6 top worse teams were tanking but already had good players on their teams. TWolves have two franchise players and The Pelicans have one of the best centers in the league. You can put yourself into contention for the #1 pick without exorcising all talent off the roster like it's beelzebub.

(BTW the two other teams were the Nets, who were Billy Kinged and of course, the process)

And soon we will have the pleasure of being Colangeloed

[Negrodamus]

The funny thing is that this all time great Warriors team was built over 4 drafts

2009- Steph Curry
2010- Ekpe Udoh (Bust! THEIR ENTIRE PROCESS IS A SHAM! FIRE EVERYONE!)
2011- Klay Thompson
2012- Harrison Barnes, Festus Ezeli, Draymond Green

4 years. 4 years on top of 20 where they pretty much blew ass. 3 of those 4 they had soon-to-be 2 time MVP Steph Curry. Why would they keep sucking with Curry? Why didn't they splooge in FA on overpriced vets? They really blew it. Look at them now; struggling since they built through the draft. You're right, Hinkie was stupid to try and execute this plan. And when Embiid is healthy and kicking ass along with our first this year, we'll just hand Colangelo a 3rd Exec of the year trophy for trotting out Hinkie's players.

This was supposed to be the draft to finish out the core, I'm so disgusted at how we've been duped

Sixers don't have a core. They have Okafor, who wants out and who Hinkie would've never wanted as his center. That's about it

You're not posting an argument. You're throwing in speculation. Hearsay.

You don't know what we have in Saric or Embiid. We have potentially two enormous draft picks in 2 months. Talk to me in October when we do have a core. I'm only hoping that we don't overpay for mediocre players in that time.

[GiantRobot]

You need at least one franchise level player in place before you start building incrementally.

No... you can build while also still tanking. 4 of the 6 top worse teams were tanking but already had good players on their teams. TWolves have two franchise players and The Pelicans have one of the best centers in the league. You can put yourself into contention for the #1 pick without exorcising all talent off the roster like it's beelzebub.

(BTW the two other teams were the Nets, who were Billy Kinged and of course, the process)

And soon we will have the pleasure of being Colangeloed

You mean the guy who rallied back from a failed 1st overall pick and built a core in Toronto that's in the mid 50s for wins? Or built the Suns team that was in constant contention for the championship in the mid 2000s?

[WVU]

No... you can build while also still tanking. 4 of the 6 top worse teams were tanking but already had good players on their teams. TWolves have two franchise players and The Pelicans have one of the best centers in the league. You can put yourself into contention for the #1 pick without exorcising all talent off the roster like it's beelzebub.

(BTW the two other teams were the Nets, who were Billy Kinged and of course, the process)

And soon we will have the pleasure of being Colangeloed

You mean the guy who rallied back from a failed 1st overall pick and built a core in Toronto that's in the mid 50s for wins? Or built the Suns team that was in constant contention for the championship in the mid 2000s?

Yes.. that's the guy. Remember, he had his dad overseeing him in PHX. His dad just resigned from his role in Philadelphia. To give BC the bulk of credit over Masai Ujiri would be a bad call imo.

[wickedwrister]

Can't recall a sports even that has straight ticked me off more with any of my teams in my lifetime. I'm fairly sure with some time maybe how annoyed I am will fade but for now still so livid at our owners and the Sixers for having us sit through 3 years of terrible basketball and pulling the plug before the payoff (all while the team operated under the salary floor lining the owners pockets). I really hope this is about selling the team and that process has already started behind the scenes. Once in my lifetime I want owners for the Sixers that actually care about it and have a cohesive long term vision for it. At least this means the Devils will be a mess too as long as Harris owns them.

Choosing to vote with my wallet for the time being, don't plan on buying any ticket plans next year (maybe will stubhub 1 game to see Embiid). Had been in the market for some new Sixers gear and actually saw what I wanted in a store yesterday and opted not to buy it.

[WVU]

Can't recall a sports even that has straight ticked me off more with any of my teams in my lifetime. I'm fairly sure with some time maybe how annoyed I am will fade but for now still so livid at our owners and the Sixers for having us sit through 3 years of terrible basketball and pulling the plug before the payoff (all while the team operated under the salary floor lining the owners pockets). I really hope this is about selling the team and that process has already started behind the scenes. Once in my lifetime I want owners for the Sixers that actually care about it and have a cohesive long term vision for it. At least this means the Devils will be a mess too as long as Harris owns them.

Choosing to vote with my wallet for the time being, don't plan on buying any ticket plans next year (maybe will stubhub 1 game to see Embiid). Had been in the market for some new Sixers gear and actually saw what I wanted in a store yesterday and opted not to buy it.

I hear ya. I feel the same way too.

Just a heads up, the 76ers actually have partnered up with StubHub
http://www.nba.com/sixers/news/sixers-stubhub-launch-revolutionary-new-ticketing-platform

[wickedwrister]

Can't recall a sports even that has straight ticked me off more with any of my teams in my lifetime. I'm fairly sure with some time maybe how annoyed I am will fade but for now still so livid at our owners and the Sixers for having us sit through 3 years of terrible basketball and pulling the plug before the payoff (all while the team operated under the salary floor lining the owners pockets). I really hope this is about selling the team and that process has already started behind the scenes. Once in my lifetime I want owners for the Sixers that actually care about it and have a cohesive long term vision for it. At least this means the Devils will be a mess too as long as Harris owns them.

Choosing to vote with my wallet for the time being, don't plan on buying any ticket plans next year (maybe will stubhub 1 game to see Embiid). Had been in the market for some new Sixers gear and actually saw what I wanted in a store yesterday and opted not to buy it.

I hear ya. I feel the same way too.

Just a heads up, the 76ers actually have partnered up with StubHub
http://www.nba.com/sixers/news/sixers-stubhub-launch-revolutionary-new-ticketing-platform

seat geek it is then

[spikeslovechild]

No... you can build while also still tanking. 4 of the 6 top worse teams were tanking but already had good players on their teams. TWolves have two franchise players and The Pelicans have one of the best centers in the league. You can put yourself into contention for the #1 pick without exorcising all talent off the roster like it's beelzebub.

(BTW the two other teams were the Nets, who were Billy Kinged and of course, the process)

And soon we will have the pleasure of being Colangeloed

You mean the guy who rallied back from a failed 1st overall pick and built a core in Toronto that's in the mid 50s for wins? Or built the Suns team that was in constant contention for the championship in the mid 2000s?

Rallied? How did he rally? Letting Bosh go? Drafting Ross over Drummond? Signing Hedo? Signing Bargs to a 50 million extension? Signing Kleiza for 20 million? Signing Fred Jones? Signing Jorge Garbosa? Trading rookie Roy Hibbert and TJ Ford for the corpse of O'neal. Signing Landry fields for 12 million.

He didn't leave a core. He left three good players obtained over the course of SIX years of ineptitude. One of which Lowry he didn't even want moving forward. I mean he can try to deny it but Lowry publicly asked to be traded and BC tried to get Nash both of which would have been disasters so thank god his own ineptitude saved him.

Also it was Masai who saved the Raptors cap situation by trading Bargs and Gay. Thats what allowed him to bring in the free agents and build the Raptors into the faux contender they are. I mean if you are into those things.

[Sixercise]

You mean the guy who rallied back from a failed 1st overall pick and built a core in Toronto that's in the mid 50s for wins?

Your revisionist history is very awful....

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/TOR/

He only made the playoffs twice in his tenure for the Raps. 47 and 41 ain't nowhere near mid-50s, BUDDY.

And by your logic, a 5 year/$50M extension is "a rally back from a failed 1st overall pick". If your intention here is to troll, you're not very good at it. But if this is what you really believe, I would suggest you leave this board before someone reports you for condescending this board with false information.

[GiantRobot]

Rallied? How did he rally? Letting Bosh go?

I'm sure that's how he wanted it to play out. He got Jonas Valanciunas in return, so yeah, not nearly as bad as it could've been.

Drafting Ross over Drummond?

Drummond went 9th, he was not some known quantity and Valanciunas was already on the team. Colangelo has been a GM since 94, there's going to be bad ones and good ones. Danny Ainge hasn't picked above mediocrity in the first round in almost a decade but is still well respected in the NBA (and looked up to by... drumroll... Sam Hinkie).

Signing Hedo? Signing Bargs to a 50 million extension? Signing Kleiza for 20 million? Signing Fred Jones? Signing Jorge Garbosa? Trading rookie Roy Hibbert and TJ Ford for the corpse of O'neal. Signing Landry fields for 12 million.

waaaaah waaaaaaah

Again, he's been in the NBA for 20 years, there's going to be some bad signings and trades and getting people to go to and/or stay in double tax land is not an easy task. Jonas, DeRozan and Lowry are all in Toronto thanks to him. So were Nash, Stoudemire and Marion for the Suns. Team building. Not endless IOUs and bashing people trying to better their teams as your team is the laughing stock of the NBA.

He didn't leave a core. He left three good players obtained over the course of SIX years of ineptitude.

"he didn't leave a core, HE JUST LEFT A CORE "

One of which Lowry he didn't even want moving forward. I mean he can try to deny it but Lowry publicly asked to be traded and BC tried to get Nash both of which would have been disasters so thank god his own ineptitude saved him.

Toronto ownership wanted people to come to the games and were pushing for Nash.
http://www.lakersnation.com/kyle-lowry-didnt-want-to-backup-steve-nash-in-toronto/2014/09/24/
The plan was for Nash to put people in the seats and mentor a then, OK, Lowry and when he inevitably got hurt, Lowry would come in. I do love revisionist history by fans to BASH THEIR OWN GM. Unreal, only Philadelphia fans.

[GiantRobot]

Your revisionist history is very awful....

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/TOR/

He only made the playoffs twice in his tenure for the Raps. 47 and 41 ain't nowhere near mid-50s, BUDDY.

Yeah, Colangelo shouldn't get any credit for getting the three big pieces in Toronto...

BUT MAN THE OWNERSHIP FIRING HINKIE BEFORE HIS MASTER 13 YEAR PLAN CAME TO FRUITION? GRRRRR. He didn't even get use tha assetz!

[Embiid P]

Giant Robot makes some good points. There are a few different ways to look at this. At then end of the day, there is absolutely no reason/excuse to lose 70 games in a season. Brown should be fired, Hinkie had to leave at that point, this has been all about tanking. 70 losses? I count maybe five NBA players on this roster, and the most talented of them all (Okafor) , idiots are clamoring for him to be traded in favor of Noel who does one thing really well, or better yet...in favor of the broken footed savior Joel Embiid.
The entire situation is a mess, how Hinkie was treated I don't agree with, but he was by no means a savant when it came to building or drafting. Doing what he did was easy, building it back is going to be the challenge.

To be fair we might have gotten around 5-6 more wins this season if guys like Okafor and Holmes were healthy down the stretch. Obviously we'd still be bad, but not bad enough to the point where the league and media would pressure our ownership and Colangelo to get rid of Hinkie.

[CoreyGallagher]

I have no idea what Jerami Grant you were watching but the one I was watching the past two seasons was playing SF and was made to create shots around the perimeter. A complete disaster from a development standpoint. He should be getting bigger, and shooting less 3s.

http://nyloncalculus.com/stats/nba-playing-time-estimates-by-position/

This season, as of March 27th, 81.1% of Grant's minutes have been played at PF...

Full time starter per =/= backup's per. By just by per numbers, Holmes was a better player than Grant, which begs the question... why would Grant playing over him?

Grant has started 50 games this year and has only played about 5 minutes less per game than Clarkson, there'd likely be starter overlap even when he isn't starting. With consideration, shouldn't discount the metrics.

Also the team has no guards, dumb team building, hurting your assets' value by stacking them up on each other, etc.

Grant was drafted early on in the process, regardless, nobody is drafting for fit in the second round (especially Hinkie, har har). You're taking who you believe to be best available and hoping they stick around as there's an 88.58% bust rate.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fancy-stats/wp/2014/05/21/the-cleveland-cavaliers-won-the-nba-draft-lottery-again-but-that-doesnt-guarantee-success/

EDIT: Updated/fixed link.

Can you cite where I said he said RoCo 's agent? BTW Noel and Okafor's agents having been trying to push them out of town since last summer. Two best players, who play the same position, want out. The Process.

Cite (anything)? You said that Lowe mentioned about the agents, if I recall he was referring to non-guaranteed contracts (referred to as Hinkie special's). That's not what Covington was signed to - his years are guaranteed. You said on top of jerking Covington around, I assumed you meant Lowe said both(?).

In 15 minutes a game. Please stop reciting per as if it were the gospel. It has to be contextualized at least.

Gospel? You initially cited PER. Regardless, that high of a efficiency rating in even 15 minutes per is still impressive.

You're a hostile poster. Interacting with you is annoying.

[GiantRobot]

This season, as of March 27th, 81.1% of Grant's minutes have been played at PF...

By that person's own estimation he admits it's hardly a full proof statistic. Grant was given the ball and asked to create around the perimeter and asked to guard swing players more times than not. A horrendous use of a young big.

Grant was drafted early on in the process, regardless, nobody is drafting for fit in the second round (especially Hinkie, har har).

You are when you've built a team where a second rounder will get 25+ min more than likely. And if Hinkie's valuation of Grant/Clarkson was still that off then that's barely a defense of him.

Cite? You said that Lowe mentioned about the agents, if I recall he was referring to non-guaranteed contracts (referred to as Hinkie special's). That's not what Covington was signed to, his years are guaranteed. You said on top of jerking Covington around, I assumed you meant Lowe said both(?).

Clearly talking about each issue separately, try following along. On top of the Hinkie specials he's giving out deals to players that will inevitably hate him for taking advantage of their vulnerability. The fact a new contract for RoCo has never been even suggested furthers that even more.

You're a hostile poster. Interacting with you is annoying.

If only I were like every other poster who sang the gospel of St Sam, eh? You're not signed to a bad contract that includes you having to interact with me, feel free to not.

[CoreyGallagher]

By that person's own estimation he admits it's hardly a full proof statistic.

http://nbawowy.com/aumusho8arjmbp8zv5lpvnp14i#/aumusho8arjmbp8zv5lpvnp14i

Click the 'Units' tab (can't hyperlink). There is a single line-up in the top 13 that feature Grant at SF, 11 PF. Vast majority of the list he plays PF.

You are when you've built a team where a second rounder will get 25+ min more than likely.

No, you're still not.

And if Hinkie's valuation of Grant/Clarkson was still that off then that's barely a defense of him.

How do you know Clarkson wasn't next up?

Clearly talking about each issue separately, try following along.

It wasn't clear to me - you didn't even break sentence.

On top of the Hinkie specials he's giving out deals to players that will inevitably hate him for taking advantage of their vulnerability. The fact a new contract for RoCo has never been even suggested furthers that even more.

Covington isn't even halfway through his current contract. Regardless, how do you know that it hadn't been discussed?

If only I were like every other poster who sang the gospel of St Sam, eh? You're not signed to a bad contract that includes you having to interact with me, feel free to not.

No, it's your derisive posting style. There have been plenty of posters that haven't 'sung the gospel of Hinkie' that I've interacted with civilly (for the most part =P).