Thank Nation! Pre-Lottery: Denver 9th, NY pick 7th (PART 4)

[Risk101]

I wonder how Ross feels about not getting any questions from the media and seeing Norman being flocked to like he's the vet

It has to sting a bit.

[Jermaine OBosh]

The last thing this team needs is a development player like Skal who has huge questions about his motivation and real skill over downstream potential. We have invested 2 years in Bruno and likely one more for him to be considered a productive player. Also think Luwawu is over rated on this board he would be fine at SG but don't see him playing SF.

If it is true that Saric is coming over, I would trade Ross, 9th & 27th for Saric, 24th & 26th.

I'm not sure why people keep proposing trading for more picks because it's been repeated to death that Masai has said numerous times he doesn't think he has the roster space for all the picks he already has. You think he's going to dedicate more than half the roster to rookie and sophomore players??

Powell, Wright, Bruno, Saric, 24th, 26th, and then next year LAC & our own (nvm 2nd rdrs)....7 first or 2nd yr players...

Yeah not happening.

Can we all please let go of the idea of trading down or for multiple picks??

Picks are gold in this era of average players being paid outrageous amounts of money. Right now Powell isn't a prospect anymore at very worst a solid role player and Wright looks to be close behind. Saric obviously is classified as a rookie but he has been playing in Europe hardly a raw rookie. Bruno is the only player that is going to spend time in D League next year and I see Bebe moved. If we take a couple of Euro players giving them time to develop in Euro on foul and for all you know they might turn out to be studs the only minor downside is we have to keep there minimum salaries on our books.

So I hardly see a downside for the Raptors unless you have been told by Masai his plans and are taking a public statement as fact you have absolutely no idea of his plans.

I would do something like this, Ross + 9th + rights to Deandre Daniels for Dario Saric + Covington.


lowry(12)/cojo(7.3)/wright(1.6)=20.9
dd(25)/Norman(.9)=25.9
DC(14.2)/COvington (1)/Bruno(1.6)=16.8
Saric(2.5)/pp(6)=8.5
jv(14.4)/bb(10)/Bebe(1.9)=26.3


13 players with ~ 98.4 mil

[CunningLinguist]

It's been discussed to death at this point yet those who never watched Skal continue to speak about what they don't know. His issue isn't in his head, it's with his inability to stay on the court whether it's because of foul trouble or Cal's desire to bench him (like Casey and Jonas). His foul issue is much like Chriss who many of those same people are drooling over. It's much like AMIR JOHNSON who couldn't stay on the court to save his life as a young Raptor. Fouling issues are experience issues. Skal is relatively new to basketball. With time comes experience. And being a pro, all he'll have is time to learn.

I've seen games with Skal in high school. How can you let your coach get in your head to make you play that way. Many bigs have fouling issues, I don't even care about that. Skal is not that new to basketball - he's been on the radar of scouts for a long time now. Chriss is new to basketball because he was not highly ranked.

Cal thought he can be Towns but Towns is a beast mentally. In other words Skal is not... So Cal thought Skal thought he had the tools to do what Towns could but he didn't have the make-up. That's a red flag to me and not worthy of our pick.

Also two teams gave up on Amir before he got it right. I can see the same happening to Skal and Amir was always a tough son of a gun. Lastly they will have different roles on a team. Skal is a skilled big while Amir is a lunch pail big that does the dirty work. If Skal not showing his skill is like Amir not giving effort - it hurts their game.

The Pistons were the only team that gave up on Amir.

[OAKLEY_2]

I'm not sure why people keep proposing trading for more picks because it's been repeated to death that Masai has said numerous times he doesn't think he has the roster space for all the picks he already has. You think he's going to dedicate more than half the roster to rookie and sophomore players??

Powell, Wright, Bruno, Saric, 24th, 26th, and then next year LAC & our own (nvm 2nd rdrs)....7 first or 2nd yr players...

Yeah not happening.

Can we all please let go of the idea of trading down or for multiple picks??

Picks are gold in this era of average players being paid outrageous amounts of money. Right now Powell isn't a prospect anymore at very worst a solid role player and Wright looks to be close behind. Saric obviously is classified as a rookie but he has been playing in Europe hardly a raw rookie. Bruno is the only player that is going to spend time in D League next year and I see Bebe moved. If we take a couple of Euro players giving them time to develop in Euro on foul and for all you know they might turn out to be studs the only minor downside is we have to keep there minimum salaries on our books.

So I hardly see a downside for the Raptors unless you have been told by Masai his plans and are taking a public statement as fact you have absolutely no idea of his plans.

I would do something like this, Ross + 9th + rights to Deandre Daniels for Dario Saric + Covington.


lowry(12)/cojo(7.3)/wright(1.6)=20.9
dd(25)/Norman(.9)=25.9
DC(14.2)/COvington (1)/Bruno(1.6)=16.8
Saric(2.5)/pp(6)=8.5
jv(14.4)/bb(10)/Bebe(1.9)=26.3


13 players with ~ 98.4 mil

Ross wasn't BC's guy. I must be in the slim minority who believe Ross will break out but does so at his own pace and not the expectations of this board. He is a hell of a shooter.

[Woody Allen]

Ross is not hell of a shooter. There's an overabundance of shooters at his talent level in the league. He's nothing special.

[JackedFinancier]

Someone needs to sell me on Davis.

He just seems like a smallball C or something to me, despite having a decent touch he doesn't really seem all that skilled imo. For all this talk of Ulis setting up Skal...majority of what I've seen of Davis it seems Valentine did that even more so with him and when he wasn't set up a lot of baskets came as a result of a putbacks, drop offs or the occasional back down on smaller looking PFs; not exactly tantalizing stuff. I'm not criticizing the kid, I just really haven't seen anything that wows me. He doesn't have great quickness and actually looks pretty slow for a PF from what I've seen but does have a strong looking base and length that makes me think he could become a C but again doesn't look like anything exceptional as I don't see any advanced footwork.

To me he just looks like a kid with some development could be a solid starter but I really don't see any star potential. Somebody help me out here....what am I missing here that has so many considering him with our pick? I'd even take Chriss ahead of him at this point.

I don't think the team who drafts Davis will be looking for a home run, just a defensively capable prospect (he blocked a lot of shots and had good lateral mobility) who finishes efficiently at the rim. He is also a 19 year old who put up 16 pts/40 so I don't think he's broken when it comes to his skill game, possibly a few years from now he's hitting midrange shots. I'm not the biggest fan though.

Random question - but are you a Spieth fan bro? Golf fan?


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[Kevin Willis]

When the coach thinks you're something you're not it's going to get into your head. If you don't play the way he wants you to he'll bench you, which is exactly what happened. Skal is not KAT, not even close. KAT is a special talent and if Skal were as good as KAT he'd be the undoubted #1.

The Amir comparison is in terms of foul trouble and being able to stay on the court. Amir had that issue, and so does Skal. As a matter of fact, JV has that problem against Indiana right now. Bigs like Skal who block shots will get in foul trouble when they're young. Help defense leaves you prone to fouls until you learn how to do it more effectively.

Actually I agree with you 100%. Cal made the mistake for thinking he was Towns but Skal was projected as No. 1 pick at the start of the year. So everyone was wrong about what he could become. That's not good.

Foul trouble is not a big thing for me. Skal is a help defender but a weak man to man defender. I think he will pick up more fouls trying to guard post PFs. He's a big risk and I'm not sure the reward is there.

That's Cal's problem if he can't scout his recruit effectively enough to know what he is. You can watch Skal for 2 minutes and know that he doesn't have the same game as KAT. Skal is much more Ibaka than KAT.

He can't defend one on one because he's frail. NBA weight rooms and strength trainers will change that. If you don't think a potential Serge Ibaka is a good reward at 9 then there's nothing else to discuss.

Serge Ibaka - 6'10" Power Forward around 220 lbs. Shot Blocker. Strong Defender (lacked fundamentals coming into the league) uber athletic. Can shoot the three. Not overly skilled. Not a great passer. Great motor
Chriss - 6'10" Power Forward around 220 lbs. Shot Blocker. Lacks defensive fundamentals into college. Uber athletic. Can shoot the three. Not overly skilled. Not a great passer. Iffy motor
Paskal Siakam - 6'9" Power Forward around 230 lbs. Shot Blocker. Decent on defense, needs work on fundamentals. Uber athletic. Can shoot the three - sort of. Not overly skilled. Not a great passer. Great motor
Skal - 7'0" Power Forward / Center around 215 lbs. Shot Blocker. Good on defense - good fundamentals. Athletic. Can't shoot the three this year. Very skilled. Not a great passer. Motor???

Skal might be a bit like a more athletic Myles Turner or a rich man's Anthony Randolph which are both pretty good.

[Dr Positivity]

Yes, though I'm due to change my avatar to something Raptors related

[Skeezo]

http://espn.go.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/15381906/chad-ford-nba-draft-2016-big-board-70-ranking-ben-simmons-brandon-ingram-buddy-hield

Luwawu takes a major drop on Ford's latest Big Board... Smoke and mirrors maybe?

"28. Timothe Luwawu


Previous rank: No. 18
France
Age: 20
Guard/forward

Luwawu is generally considered an ideal 3-and-D prospect, though lately I've heard more and more teams come back a bit disappointed after scouting him overseas.

He may be on the underrated-then-overrated curve right now."

[OAKLEY_2]

Ross is not hell of a shooter. There's an overabundance of shooters at his talent level in the league. He's nothing special.

39 per cent from three... Nice to have a skillset like that on our team.

[Risk101]

Chad Fords latest mock. Enjoy.

http://i.imgur.com/ERVgy2I.png

[CoachJReturns]

http://espn.go.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/15381906/chad-ford-nba-draft-2016-big-board-70-ranking-ben-simmons-brandon-ingram-buddy-hield

Luwawu takes a major drop on Ford's latest Big Board... Smoke and mirrors maybe?

"28. Timothe Luwawu


Previous rank: No. 18
France
Age: 20
Guard/forward

Luwawu is generally considered an ideal 3-and-D prospect, though lately I've heard more and more teams come back a bit disappointed after scouting him overseas.

He may be on the underrated-then-overrated curve right now."

If we walked away with Luwawu at 28 I would call that a successful draft. If we could draft any of the following wirh the lotto pick and I'd be happy:
Jackson, Davis, Skal or anyone who falls.

[0 - 100]

Chad Ford has the crappiest mocks. He lost all credibility after he was altering old mocks

[rapsdotcom]

In his big board Chad also has Jaylen Brown much lower than most here and Ellenson higher. Size usually does find its way up draft boards so that might not be a huge shock. I'd be thrilled with Brown at 9.

[Risk101]

Chad Ford has the crappiest mocks. He lost all credibility after he was altering old mocks

He was altering old mocks?

Anyways I like reading his mocks because it's a different perspective. Draft express is great but it really isn't a mock draft as it is a ranking system for most of the year. They don't take team need into consideration. Atleast with Chad he gives a different perspective wether you agree with them or not. He's well respected in his field and has some inside knowledge on what GM's are thinking.

[bonjovi0308]

Chad Fords latest mock. Enjoy.

http://i.imgur.com/ERVgy2I.png

Demetrius Jackson at spot 23? I think his upside is higher than both Joseph and Wright (not a knock against our own backup pgs)

[Caboclo]

Chad Ford has the crappiest mocks. He lost all credibility after he was altering old mocks

He was altering old mocks?

Anyways I like reading his mocks because it's a different perspective. Draft express is great but it really isn't a mock draft as it is a ranking system for most of the year. They don't take team need into consideration. Atleast with Chad he gives a different perspective wether you agree with them or not. He's well respected in his field and has some inside knowledge on what GM's are thinking.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/2tk9xa/chad_ford_changes_his_draft_boards_years_after

zero credibility

[0 - 100]

and more evidence he's a fraud:

I worked for a prominent NBA agent years ago. Chad Ford came by our office a few times and was buddy/buddy with the agent. He would always write puff pieces about the agent's clients while he was in town and would without fail shoot the clients up his draft board and call them "fast risers" based on "sources" who were impressed with their workouts. None of our clients ever had a bad workout. I never put an ounce of stock into anything he's written since that time.

[Risk101]

and more evidence he's garbage:

I worked for a prominent NBA agent years ago. Chad Ford came by our office a few times and was buddy/buddy with the agent. He would always write puff pieces about the agent's clients while he was in town and would without fail shoot the clients up his draft board and call them "fast risers" based on "sources" who were impressed with their workouts. None of our clients ever had a bad workout. I never put an ounce of stock into anything he's written since that time.

Dont really think someone anonymous posting a comment about something he was told by someone else is considered evidence.

[CoachJReturns]

I just hope we don't pick Ellenson or some high bust potential guy in the lotto. Skal scares the hell out of me. I may be leaning toward Jackson now with Rabb gone. Just take the guy who looks like an NBA player and trade for Lyles.