Political Roundtable Part IX

dckingsfan · Post #321 » by **dckingsfan** » Fri Apr 29, 2016 12:20 am

I think hate is an understatement in this case. Cruz has really taken a beating in this campaign

JWizmentality · Post #322 » by **JWizmentality** » Fri Apr 29, 2016 12:23 am

Trump may be an ****, but I've heard numerous reports from people that he's actually a nice guy behind the scenes. Cruz is a piece of $h*t and for once I agree with Boehner.

Post #323 » by **nate33** » Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:14 am

dckingsfan wrote:And this SHOULD be one of the major topics in the presidential debate - but I doubt that either side can get an edge elucidating the issue.

That graph is pretty much the reason Trump won the Republican primary.

dckingsfan · Post #324 » by **dckingsfan** » Fri Apr 29, 2016 2:06 am

Well, certainly the reason that some wanted change.

I_Like_Dirt · Post #325 » by **I_Like_Dirt** » Fri Apr 29, 2016 2:27 pm

pineappleheadindc wrote:
Whoa-- if that's an accurate quote, Boehner really HATES Cruz.

Just amazing.

In the same interview, he mocked Hillary a bit before stopping with the jokes and calling her very accomplished and smart, while saying that he actually wouldn't vote for Cruz if he won the nomination. He puts Cruz on a whole different level from anyone else, from a guy who's had to work with pretty much everyone from both sides of the aisle.

Post #326 » by **nate33** » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:40 pm

It's like the protestors are trying to get Trump elected:

[tweet]https://twitter.com/NickMiller510/status/726150362697060352[/tweet]

Mexican flags? Kill Whitey? Seriously?

What are the odds that the mainstream media asks Sanders or Clinton whether or not their supporters should tone down their racist rhetoric. Don't answer my question. It's rhetorical.

Post #327 » by **nate33** » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:58 pm

Five Trump supporters, including two little girls, were pepper-sprayed by a demonstrator during the heated confrontation, police said.

CobraCommander · Post #328 » by **CobraCommander** » Sun May 1, 2016 4:06 am

nate33 wrote:It's like the protestors are trying to get Trump elected:

[tweet]https://twitter.com/NickMiller510/status/726150362697060352[/tweet]

Mexican flags? Kill Whitey? Seriously?

What are the odds that the mainstream media asks Sanders or Clinton whether or not their supporters should tone down their racist rhetoric. Don't answer my question. It's rhetorical.

You and I are thinking the same thing. It's like Trump hired these people to make the average Americans react in a jingoistic manner.

CobraCommander · Post #329 » by **CobraCommander** » Sun May 1, 2016 4:08 am

the Correspondance Dinner was pretty good - except for one comedian that went to far

Cramer · Post #330 » by **Cramer** » Mon May 2, 2016 3:32 pm

nate33 wrote:
Five Trump supporters, including two little girls, were pepper-sprayed by a demonstrator during the heated confrontation, police said.

Wow, remember all those violent Tea Party protesters (I don't either but play along) and the outrage?

Not really feeling/seeing it with these asshats.

Wonder what the difference could be?

verbal8 · Post #331 » by **verbal8** » Mon May 2, 2016 9:35 pm

It does look like Trump is headed to the Republican nomination. It probably will be a lot clearer tomorrow when the results for Indiana are in.

In the brokered convention - it seems like it could go on forever. Cruz might have a small shot in the second ballot, but beyond that I think his complete lack of likability would do him in. Kasich and Rubio ran, but one could only win his home state and the other couldn't win his own state. I guess eventually a dark horse could emerge, but it seems it would take a while. I guess one "unity ticket" possibility might be Rubio/Kasich.

JWizmentality · Post #332 » by **JWizmentality** » Mon May 2, 2016 10:56 pm

nate33 wrote:It's like the protestors are trying to get Trump elected:

[tweet]https://twitter.com/NickMiller510/status/726150362697060352[/tweet]

Mexican flags? Kill Whitey? Seriously?

What are the odds that the mainstream media asks Sanders or Clinton whether or not their supporters should tone down their racist rhetoric. Don't answer my question. It's rhetorical.

So what exactly is your angle nate? I can post a litany of pictures going the other way. None of which I condone. At this point you're just shocked and amazed that there is gambling in this establishment. What did you expect when you trumpet the rhetoric Trump has and attracts the supporters he has? Kumbaya and daisies?

dckingsfan · Post #333 » by **dckingsfan** » Mon May 2, 2016 11:15 pm

I think Nate's point - and one I share - is that these kinds of political showings only help Trump. He has been able to run a campaign with free publicity that brings his followers out.

This is just brain dead politics, IMO.

Post #334 » by **nate33** » Tue May 3, 2016 12:19 am

JWizmentality wrote:So what exactly is your angle nate? I can post a litany of pictures going the other way. None of which I condone. At this point you're just shocked and amazed that there is gambling in this establishment. What did you expect when you trumpet the rhetoric Trump has and attracts the supporters he has? Kumbaya and daisies?

Show me some pictures of bloodied Bernie/Hillary supporters attacked by Trump supporters. I'd like to see that. You can show me some pictures of the victims of Tea Party riots while you're at it. You can also show me some signs held by Trump fans saying "kill Black people".

The only attacks by Trump fans were attacks on professional protestors who were intentionally disrupting Trump rallies and trying to provoke a reaction. Trump fans have never gone to Hillary/Bernie rallies and bloodied up average Democrat supporters.

DCZards · Post #335 » by **DCZards** » Tue May 3, 2016 2:35 pm

The physical attacks on Trump's supporters are ugly and despicable. I think we all can agree on that. But we shouldn't make the mistake of automatically believing that these are Bernie or Hillary supporters. Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if very few of the attackers even knew who was running for the Dem nomination.

These are mostly hardcore anti-Trump folks who are responding (in the wrong fashion) to Trump's divisive, often mean-spirited, rhetoric.

bsilver · Post #336 » by **bsilver** » Tue May 3, 2016 3:14 pm

nate33 wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:And this SHOULD be one of the major topics in the presidential debate - but I doubt that either side can get an edge elucidating the issue.

That graph is pretty much the reason Trump won the Republican primary.

The graph doesn't take into account the large number of baby boomers retiring since 2010. A better graph would be labor participation by age group. I think the main issue is wage stagnation. Working class jobs have not kept up with inflation due to globalization, etc. Trump supporters buy into his explanations that the problem is caused by legal and illegal immigration, and bad trade deals.

Post #337 » by **nate33** » Tue May 3, 2016 3:16 pm

bsilver wrote:
nate33 wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:And this SHOULD be one of the major topics in the presidential debate - but I doubt that either side can get an edge elucidating the issue.

That graph is pretty much the reason Trump won the Republican primary.

The graph doesn't take into account the large number of baby boomers retiring since 2010. A better graph would be labor participation by age group. I think the main issue is wage stagnation. Working class jobs have not kept up with inflation due to globalization, etc. Trump supporters buy into his explanations that the problem is caused by legal and illegal immigration, and bad trade deals.

Good point. Wage stagnation is just as much of a problem, if not more so, than unemployment.

dckingsfan · Post #338 » by **dckingsfan** » Tue May 3, 2016 4:59 pm

bsilver wrote:The graph doesn't take into account the large number of baby boomers retiring since 2010. A better graph would be labor participation by age group. I think the main issue is wage stagnation. Working class jobs have not kept up with inflation due to globalization, etc. Trump supporters buy into his explanations that the problem is caused by legal and illegal immigration, and bad trade deals.

Our slow growth policies have resulted in wage stagnation. It isn't the global competition that has done us in, it is our own policies.

Growth between 1950 and 2000 was 3.5%. If it was 2 percent then average wages would be 23,000 instead of 50,000. So, growth should be the number one issue.

The reason that growth has become anemic is because of our policies. Our immigration policies - bringing in qualified talent. Our education policies - not allowing for competition. Our entitlement programs - not giving people a reason to work and squeezing out infrastructure and research funding. Our regulatory state - which makes it difficult to start business or get initiatives going. Our corporate tax policy which is so convoluted as to make our multi-nationals hold their cash off continent instead of investing here and causing the inversions and have so many loopholes from both sides as to make your head spin. Our individual tax policies that have an inordinate number of loopholes for the rich.

And it is all on us.

We constantly complain that we want little things addressed. Those little things add up until you can't do business any longer.

We vilify the other side so that neither side feels comfortable compromising. That Cruz or Bernie would get even 1% of the vote makes my point.

But yes, Trump (and Bernie) supporters are more than happy to vilify immigrants (or bankers) and are happy to ignore the real problems before us.

JWizmentality · Post #339 » by **JWizmentality** » Tue May 3, 2016 6:31 pm

nate33 wrote:
JWizmentality wrote:So what exactly is your angle nate? I can post a litany of pictures going the other way. None of which I condone. At this point you're just shocked and amazed that there is gambling in this establishment. What did you expect when you trumpet the rhetoric Trump has and attracts the supporters he has? Kumbaya and daisies?

Show me some pictures of bloodied Bernie/Hillary supporters attacked by Trump supporters. I'd like to see that. You can show me some pictures of the victims of Tea Party riots while you're at it. You can also show me some signs held by Trump fans saying "kill Black people".

The only attacks by Trump fans were attacks on professional protestors who were intentionally disrupting Trump rallies and trying to provoke a reaction. Trump fans have never gone to Hillary/Bernie rallies and bloodied up average Democrat supporters.

How about this?
http://www.rawstory.com/2016/03/police-seek-arrest-of-yet-another-trump-supporter-for-bloody-violent-assault-on-black-activist/

...but stop it. I'm not going to play this game. There have been multiple reports of what have been said at his rallies and videos of protesters being assaulted. It's happening on both sides so stop playing the victim card...and how did we circle to the Tea Party?

dckingsfan · Post #340 » by **dckingsfan** » Tue May 3, 2016 7:11 pm

JWizmentality - you just made his point - he was at a Trump rally. That doesn't condone the action in any way shape or form but the escalation is working against Hillary.

And at this point - I am leaning Hillary vs. Trump. So, I am largely on your side. But when folks on the Democratic side agitate to go to Trump rallies to protest - they are just agitating for violence.

And all of that takes us away from meaningful debate on what policies should be implemented. And if you want to get away from policy and into the emotional in this campaign season - smh.