Draft Thread Part 2

[bwgood77]

It is just dunk after dunk after dunk lol, almost all of his highlight reels are him getting it in transition, making one change of direction with an in and out or hesitation dribble, and dunking. His jump shot form needs to be changed, in my mind that's pretty broken, his step back isn't even good, and neither is his ball handling.

Just saw Chriss at #3 on DX lol I've been saying he'd get into the top 5 since before he was even on their mock draft in mid March, so I'm pretty happy about that, although I kind of doubt he goes that early.

Yeah, I got sick of watching one highlight video because it almost seemed like a loop of the same play.

Our forum seems to like him more than most every other team forum though.

[darealjuice]

It is just dunk after dunk after dunk lol, almost all of his highlight reels are him getting it in transition, making one change of direction with an in and out or hesitation dribble, and dunking. His jump shot form needs to be changed, in my mind that's pretty broken, his step back isn't even good, and neither is his ball handling.

Just saw Chriss at #3 on DX lol I've been saying he'd get into the top 5 since before he was even on their mock draft in mid March, so I'm pretty happy about that, although I kind of doubt he goes that early.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6rEF4fRdjE[/youtube]


Maybe you should have watched this one. Especially when it talks about his shooting potential. Totally disagrees with you about shot being broken, actually says the opposite

I've watched many tapes and all of the DX stuff on Jaylen Brown and have seen him play in person lol I watch a lot of PAC basketball. It's pretty funny how his weaknesses column is twice as long as his strengths column on DX though. It also says in his weaknesses, that "If he can clean up his mechanical issues as a shooter and ball-handler, he could look like an entirely different player on this end a few short years from now," which means he needs to change his shot mechanics. If you need to change your mechanical issues, your shot is broken. It's funny your opinions come from a DX strengths video though, maybe you should check out the weaknesses one too so you can level out your thinking?

[Jarlaxle0204]

It is just dunk after dunk after dunk lol, almost all of his highlight reels are him getting it in transition, making one change of direction with an in and out or hesitation dribble, and dunking. His jump shot form needs to be changed, in my mind that's pretty broken, his step back isn't even good, and neither is his ball handling.

Just saw Chriss at #3 on DX lol I've been saying he'd get into the top 5 since before he was even on their mock draft in mid March, so I'm pretty happy about that, although I kind of doubt he goes that early.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6rEF4fRdjE[/youtube]


Maybe you should have watched this one. Especially when it talks about his shooting potential. Totally disagrees with you about shot being broken, actually says the opposite

Maybe if he cuts his hair.

[JMac1]

It is just dunk after dunk after dunk lol, almost all of his highlight reels are him getting it in transition, making one change of direction with an in and out or hesitation dribble, and dunking. His jump shot form needs to be changed, in my mind that's pretty broken, his step back isn't even good, and neither is his ball handling.

Just saw Chriss at #3 on DX lol I've been saying he'd get into the top 5 since before he was even on their mock draft in mid March, so I'm pretty happy about that, although I kind of doubt he goes that early.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6rEF4fRdjE[/youtube]


Maybe you should have watched this one. Especially when it talks about his shooting potential. Totally disagrees with you about shot being broken, actually says the opposite

I've watched many tapes and all of the DX stuff on Jaylen Brown and have seen him play in person lol I watch a lot of PAC basketball. It's pretty funny how his weaknesses column is twice as long as his strengths column on DX though. It also says in his weaknesses, that "If he can clean up his mechanical issues as a shooter and ball-handler, he could look like an entirely different player on this end a few short years from now," which means he needs to change his shot mechanics. If you need to change your mechanical issues, your shot is broken. It's funny your opinions come from a DX strengths video though, maybe you should check out the weaknesses one too so you can level out your thinking?

Disagree. In the basketball world a broken shot means, broken beyond repair, not fixable. Not broken (good form with bad or inconsistent mechanics, ie shooting apex.) means fixable with adjustments that fit with-in the natural shooting stroke so there is no major adjustments that muscle memory will not let take place.

[JMac1]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6rEF4fRdjE[/youtube]


Maybe you should have watched this one. Especially when it talks about his shooting potential. Totally disagrees with you about shot being broken, actually says the opposite

I've watched many tapes and all of the DX stuff on Jaylen Brown and have seen him play in person lol I watch a lot of PAC basketball. It's pretty funny how his weaknesses column is twice as long as his strengths column on DX though. It also says in his weaknesses, that "If he can clean up his mechanical issues as a shooter and ball-handler, he could look like an entirely different player on this end a few short years from now," which means he needs to change his shot mechanics. If you need to change your mechanical issues, your shot is broken. It's funny your opinions come from a DX strengths video though, maybe you should check out the weaknesses one too so you can level out your thinking?

Disagree. In the basketball world a broken shot means, broken beyond repair, not fixable. Not broken (good form with bad or inconsistent mechanics, ie shooting apex.) means fixable with adjustments that fit with-in the natural shooting stroke so there is no major adjustments that muscle memory will not let take place.

Edit: I know what his weaknesses are......that's not the focus for me. If you believe his weaknesses will always overcome his strengths and he won't evolve, that's you prerogative. I take the stance that he can overcome his weaknesses within a NBA setting and add to his strengths.

Let's move on from Brown. You either like him or you don't no matter what, so it is kinda redundant to continue to bring him up. Unless their is some news on his workouts or rumors about him coming here, I done discussing the dude...........playing the dude, disguised as another dude.

[carey]

I don't have much to add about Jaylen's shot really. I'm not a shot doctor. I do know that we had Goodwin here with a pretty **** up shot studying under one of the best shooters ever that turned Kyle Korver into an assassin and he's done very little to improve. That tells me a few things. 1) It's harder than we think to fix shooting mechanics. (On a personal note, my 9-year-old is a pitcher on a travel baseball team. I taught him how to pitch without knowing much beyond my old rec league days as a kid. He was having control issues and when I took him to an actual pitching instructor we had to change almost everything. It's been 6 months and we are just now seeing the slightest improvement. Point is, when you've been doing something the wrong way for years it's very difficult to just change.) 2) Not everyone can do it. By every account Goodwin is a tireless worker. Yet the improvement has been minute. 3) It's easier to improve from an ok shooter to a good one or a good one to an excellent one than a bad one to an o.k. one.

Please note that these are just my **** opinions about something I know very little about. I just like to hear myself type.

[TeamTragic]

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/242088/Marquese-Chriss-Moves-Up-To-Celtics-At-No-3-In-Latest-DX-Mock

Chriss moving up the ranks. Celtics pick him in the mock. Apparently we stick with Bender.

[jcsunsfan]

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/242088/Marquese-Chriss-Moves-Up-To-Celtics-At-No-3-In-Latest-DX-Mock

Chriss moving up the ranks. Celtics pick him in the mock. Apparently we stick with Bender.

I think that is probably good news. I think I would like Bender of Chriss.

[darealjuice]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6rEF4fRdjE[/youtube]


Maybe you should have watched this one. Especially when it talks about his shooting potential. Totally disagrees with you about shot being broken, actually says the opposite

I've watched many tapes and all of the DX stuff on Jaylen Brown and have seen him play in person lol I watch a lot of PAC basketball. It's pretty funny how his weaknesses column is twice as long as his strengths column on DX though. It also says in his weaknesses, that "If he can clean up his mechanical issues as a shooter and ball-handler, he could look like an entirely different player on this end a few short years from now," which means he needs to change his shot mechanics. If you need to change your mechanical issues, your shot is broken. It's funny your opinions come from a DX strengths video though, maybe you should check out the weaknesses one too so you can level out your thinking?

Disagree. In the basketball world a broken shot means, broken beyond repair, not fixable. Not broken (good form with bad or inconsistent mechanics, ie shooting apex.) means fixable with adjustments that fit with-in the natural shooting stroke so there is no major adjustments that muscle memory will not let take place.

Yeah, I played basketball in college (albeit at a D2 school for only 2 years before I quit), I think I have a good idea of what terms mean in "the basketball world" but thanks for informing me. His shooting stroke is not natural at all and needs pretty big adjustments, his release point changing at every shot is just one of them. His shot mechanics almost echo Archie's, and we've seen just how well Archie's improved his shot over the last few years.

[JMac1]

I've watched many tapes and all of the DX stuff on Jaylen Brown and have seen him play in person lol I watch a lot of PAC basketball. It's pretty funny how his weaknesses column is twice as long as his strengths column on DX though. It also says in his weaknesses, that "If he can clean up his mechanical issues as a shooter and ball-handler, he could look like an entirely different player on this end a few short years from now," which means he needs to change his shot mechanics. If you need to change your mechanical issues, your shot is broken. It's funny your opinions come from a DX strengths video though, maybe you should check out the weaknesses one too so you can level out your thinking?

Disagree. In the basketball world a broken shot means, broken beyond repair, not fixable. Not broken (good form with bad or inconsistent mechanics, ie shooting apex.) means fixable with adjustments that fit with-in the natural shooting stroke so there is no major adjustments that muscle memory will not let take place.

Yeah, I played basketball in college (albeit at a D2 school for only 2 years before I quit), I think I have a good idea of what terms mean in "the basketball world" but thanks for informing me. His shooting stroke is not natural at all and needs pretty big adjustments, his release point changing at every shot is just one of them. His shot mechanics almost echo Archie's, and we've seen just how well Archie's improved his shot over the last few years.

Don't tell me tell DX, maybe they will change their assessment.

[Cactus Jack]

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/242088/Marquese-Chriss-Moves-Up-To-Celtics-At-No-3-In-Latest-DX-Mock

Chriss moving up the ranks. Celtics pick him in the mock. Apparently we stick with Bender.

Wow.

[Kerrsed]

Dareal has it somewhat correct, Browns shot mechanics change for damn near ever shot he takes. His form constantly changes, his release constantly changes, but to me, he just needs a good shooting coach to find what the correct form is for him and for him to get used to that form so its constant.

Marion was the same way coming into the league. He worked on it and got it down so it was consistent. It wasnt pretty, hell it was a downright UGLY shooting form, but that didnt matter because it worked for him. Thats all Brown needs is to find what works for him and to stick with it.

As for comparing him to Archie.....no. I consider not just Browns IQ to be double that of Archies, but his basketball IQ as well. Brown is the type of person that is smart, and if something isnt working, he will look to find something that does. They both may have the "Bull-in-a-china-shop" label due to running into the paint and drawing contact, but watching Brown he is more aware of his surroundings and can finish. From day one Goodwin has always kept his head down when doing so, and thats the wrong way to do it. It didnt work then and it doesnt work now. Instead of working on his game and maybe keeping his head up, he just continued doing the same, getting more irritated and mad when it doesnt work and the ref's give him no love. When Archie gets into that irritated mode, everything suffers (his defense, his shot, his court vision, EVERYTHING). Some players step their game up when they are mad, Archie is not one of them.

Wade in Kawaii's body. Thats Brown. Wade wasnt a great shooter when he came into the league, but worked on it, and once he got it down, it made defenses have to cover him further out by the 3 point line. It kept the D honest. Wade's mid-range pump fake move became one of his greatest assets. Catch the defender in the air or off guard, then attack the rim. Thats how i can see Brown becoming great.

[darealjuice]

Disagree. In the basketball world a broken shot means, broken beyond repair, not fixable. Not broken (good form with bad or inconsistent mechanics, ie shooting apex.) means fixable with adjustments that fit with-in the natural shooting stroke so there is no major adjustments that muscle memory will not let take place.

Yeah, I played basketball in college (albeit at a D2 school for only 2 years before I quit), I think I have a good idea of what terms mean in "the basketball world" but thanks for informing me. His shooting stroke is not natural at all and needs pretty big adjustments, his release point changing at every shot is just one of them. His shot mechanics almost echo Archie's, and we've seen just how well Archie's improved his shot over the last few years.

Don't tell me tell DX, maybe they will change their assessment.

"Don't tell me to think about things myself, I let other people do my thinking for me"

[JMac1]

I don't have much to add about Jaylen's shot really. I'm not a shot doctor. I do know that we had Goodwin here with a pretty **** up shot studying under one of the best shooters ever that turned Kyle Korver into an assassin and he's done very little to improve. That tells me a few things. 1) It's harder than we think to fix shooting mechanics. (On a personal note, my 9-year-old is a pitcher on a travel baseball team. I taught him how to pitch without knowing much beyond my old rec league days as a kid. He was having control issues and when I took him to an actual pitching instructor we had to change almost everything. It's been 6 months and we are just now seeing the slightest improvement. Point is, when you've been doing something the wrong way for years it's very difficult to just change.) 2) Not everyone can do it. By every account Goodwin is a tireless worker. Yet the improvement has been minute. 3) It's easier to improve from an ok shooter to a good one or a good one to an excellent one than a bad one to an o.k. one.

Please note that these are just my **** opinions about something I know very little about. I just like to hear myself type.

Goodwin's shot is broken, that's why.

[Kerrsed]

I don't have much to add about Jaylen's shot really. I'm not a shot doctor. I do know that we had Goodwin here with a pretty **** up shot studying under one of the best shooters ever that turned Kyle Korver into an assassin and he's done very little to improve. That tells me a few things. 1) It's harder than we think to fix shooting mechanics. (On a personal note, my 9-year-old is a pitcher on a travel baseball team. I taught him how to pitch without knowing much beyond my old rec league days as a kid. He was having control issues and when I took him to an actual pitching instructor we had to change almost everything. It's been 6 months and we are just now seeing the slightest improvement. Point is, when you've been doing something the wrong way for years it's very difficult to just change.) 2) Not everyone can do it. By every account Goodwin is a tireless worker. Yet the improvement has been minute. 3) It's easier to improve from an ok shooter to a good one or a good one to an excellent one than a bad one to an o.k. one.

Please note that these are just my **** opinions about something I know very little about. I just like to hear myself type.

Goodwin's shot is broken, that's why.

He also isnt the smartest tool in the outside house full of tools.

[JMac1]

Yeah, I played basketball in college (albeit at a D2 school for only 2 years before I quit), I think I have a good idea of what terms mean in "the basketball world" but thanks for informing me. His shooting stroke is not natural at all and needs pretty big adjustments, his release point changing at every shot is just one of them. His shot mechanics almost echo Archie's, and we've seen just how well Archie's improved his shot over the last few years.

Don't tell me tell DX, maybe they will change their assessment.

"Don't tell me to think about things myself, I let other people do my thinking for me"

No. We have a difference of opinion and I cited just one of many assessments (not looking them all up to prove a point) on Brown's shot not being broken that support my opinion, but you insist his shot is broken. I have seen broken shots that were not effective (Archie Goodwin) and broken shots that were effective (Miller, World B Free) and I am sorry if you don't want to believe it, but Brown's shot is not broken and anyone without extreme bias can see that.

We all (I thought) somewhat respect DX and they SPECIFICALLY pointed out in their assessment his shot isn't broken, don't shoot the messenger because you don't like the message.

[darealjuice]

As for comparing him to Archie.....no. I consider not just Browns IQ to be double that of Archies, but his basketball IQ as well. Brown is the type of person that is smart, and if something isnt working, he will look to find something that does. They both may have the "Bull-in-a-china-shop" label due to running into the paint and drawing contact, but watching Brown he is more aware of his surroundings and can finish. From day one Goodwin has always kept his head down when doing so, and thats the wrong way to do it. It didnt work then and it doesnt work now. Instead of working on his game and maybe keeping his head up, he just continued doing the same, getting more irritated and mad when it doesnt work and the ref's give him no love. When Archie gets into that irritated mode, everything suffers (his defense, his shot, his court vision, EVERYTHING). Some players step their game up when they are mad, Archie is not one of them.

Wade in Kawaii's body. Thats Brown. Wade wasnt a great shooter when he came into the league, but worked on it, and once he got it down, it made defenses have to cover him further out by the 3 point line. It kept the D honest. Wade's mid-range pump fake move became one of his greatest assets. Catch the defender in the air or off guard, then attack the rim. Thats how i can see Brown becoming great.

Sure, Jaylen is smarter than Archie is academically, but their basketball IQ is pretty much at the same level. I don't know where you're getting that Brown was a good finisher at the rim from, his stats seem to suggest otherwise. Brown's entire game this year was transition run outs and head-down slashing into the paint, just like Archie's was in college. I'm not pulling this Archie Goodwin comparison out of my ass lol so much about them in college is similar. Their shot mechanics are very similar, they're both tunnel vision-type players in the half court and get their points mostly in transition, and both of them are projected to be high level defenders in the future because of their athleticism and measurables despite both being undisciplined defenders in college. Someone said this the other day, it may have been you, but the only reason Brown is being looked at so much more favorably is because his (and Archie's) skill set both make more sense for someone Brown's size. Maybe that was supposed to be a positive for Brown, but I don't see why it would be.

Comparing to Brown to Wade in Kawhi's body is pretty terrible, that's insulting to the two of them. Wade in college was a lot more refined and crafty of a basketball player than Brown is now, and Kawhi coming into the league was already touted for showing elite defensive skills, it was his lack of offensive skill that scared people off. I wouldn't even put his max ceiling as high as Wade or Kawhi in the perfect scenario, Wade is an all-time great for God's sake.

[darealjuice]

Don't tell me tell DX, maybe they will change their assessment.

"Don't tell me to think about things myself, I let other people do my thinking for me"

No. We have a difference of opinion and I cited just one of many assessments (not looking them all up to prove a point) on Brown's shot not being broken that support my opinion, but you insist his shot is broken. I have seen broken shots that were not effective (Archie Goodwin) and broken shots that were effective (Miller, World B Free) and I am sorry if you don't want to believe it, but Brown's shot is not broken and anyone without extreme bias can see that.

We all (I thought) somewhat respect DX and they SPECIFICALLY pointed out in their assessment his shot isn't broken, don't shoot the messenger because you don't like the message.

I don't see why me not liking Brown as a prospect is any more biased than you constantly pretending all of his criticism is invalid lol. I honestly want you to go watch some of Archie's old tape from Kentucky, and watch Jaylen Brown's tape from Cal and come back and tell me they don't play the exact same, because you'd have to be pretty much blind not to see it. Their shot mechanics, their moves to get into the lane, their footwork once they get in the lane, their bad defensive discipline, their transition game, it's all amazingly similarly. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.

I'll even use DX to help prove my point since you sourced them and seem to take everything I say from watching him myself like I have no idea what I'm talking about lol. Jaylen Brown's strengths as per the video you posted: physical profile, slashing ability, defensive potential, upside. Archie Goodwin's strengths as per his DX video: physical tools, attacking the rim, defensive potential, upside. Wow, those are literally the exact same things in the same order, crazy huh? What about their weaknesses, Jaylen Brown: Perimeter Shooting, Creating Offense, Feel for the Game, Consistency. Archie Goodwin: Shooting Stroke, Lack of Polish, Finishing Ability, Red Flags. Wow, those are pretty damn similar too? They even go on to point out one of Goodwin's major problems is the breaking down of his shot mechanics when he gets pressure, particularly changing his release point, and guess who else has the exact same problem? I've never even been on Archie's DX page before and I'm honestly surprised how similar they are.

Read Archie and Jaylen's scouting reports from them yourself, the parallels between the two are pretty damn evident.

[saintEscaton]

You guys are blowing things outta propotion. Brown doesn't have that herky jerky hitch at the top of his jumper like Archie's ] and comes down straight most of the time, he just fades away on occasion

[JMac1]

You guys are blowing things outta propotion. Brown doesn't have that herky jerky hitch at the top of his jumper and comes down straight most of the time, he just fades away on occasion

Thank you. I will leave it at that Juice.