Thon Maker

[BoyzNTheHood]

It's incredible how hyped some people are about a guy who never played in a meaningful game in his life.

He has played as many meaningful games as any other player straight from HS

Yes, but we aren't in 2005 anymore.

Your logic makes no sense. LeBron never played a meaningful game before he turned pro, and neither did Kobe, KG or Moses. Is Thon Maker any of those guys? Who knows? But it doesn't change the fact that the logic you're using is porous.

[Mustinjo]

He has played as many meaningful games as any other player straight from HS

Yes, but we aren't in 2005 anymore.

Your logic makes no sense. LeBron never played a meaningful game before he turned pro, and neither did Kobe, KG or Moses. Is Thon Maker any of those guys? Who knows? But it doesn't change the fact that the logic you're using is porous.

Back then it was normal for those guys to come into league without playing any meaningful games and it wasn't unusual or a major minus for them because it was sort of expected, not to mention that most of those guys were a year younger than Thon coming out of high school.
Today it isn't normal for a guy as old as Maker (same age as most freshmen in this class) to never have played on a serious level in his life and that is a major issue especially for a guy as raw as he is.

[BoyzNTheHood]

Yes, but we aren't in 2005 anymore.

Your logic makes no sense. LeBron never played a meaningful game before he turned pro, and neither did Kobe, KG or Moses. Is Thon Maker any of those guys? Who knows? But it doesn't change the fact that the logic you're using is porous.

Back then it was normal for those guys to come into league without playing any meaningful games and it wasn't unusual or a major minus for them because it was sort of expected, not to mention that most of those guys were a year younger than Thon coming out of high school.
Today it isn't normal for a guy as old as Maker (same age as most freshmen in this class) to never have played on a serious level in his life and that is a major issue especially for a guy as raw as he is.

He probably should have went to the D-League this past season, but the main point is that it's not weird for a player to come out of high school and not have played against good competition.

[Mustinjo]

Your logic makes no sense. LeBron never played a meaningful game before he turned pro, and neither did Kobe, KG or Moses. Is Thon Maker any of those guys? Who knows? But it doesn't change the fact that the logic you're using is porous.

Back then it was normal for those guys to come into league without playing any meaningful games and it wasn't unusual or a major minus for them because it was sort of expected, not to mention that most of those guys were a year younger than Thon coming out of high school.
Today it isn't normal for a guy as old as Maker (same age as most freshmen in this class) to never have played on a serious level in his life and that is a major issue especially for a guy as raw as he is.

He probably should have went to the D-League this past season, but the main point is that it's not weird for a player to come out of high school and not have played against good competition.

No, but it's not normal nowadays to have a guy who's 19 years old and never have played on a serious level, either college or international.

[Bum Adebayo]

Why do people NOT believe in him? Is it his character? Experience? BBIQ? Motor? Other?

Because at 18, I can't put a final judgement on his body or his skills.

To me it is the fact that he has bad hands and average touch.
There is no doubt he has very good motor, his character is fine, experience you can obtain it by playing more. BBIQ is hard to judge sometimes, part of it can be lack of experience. But bad hands in a big man is something you are not going to fix. He bobbles a lot of passes and even though he is a capable shooter, he is not a consistent shooter and I doubt he'll never be one due to his average touch.
That is exactly why scouts are saying he projects more as an energy big.

[Skin]

Why do people NOT believe in him? Is it his character? Experience? BBIQ? Motor? Other?

Because at 18, I can't put a final judgement on his body or his skills.

To me it is the fact that he has bad hands and average touch.
There is no doubt he has very good motor, his character is fine, experience you can obtain it by playing more. BBIQ is hard to judge sometimes, part of it can be lack of experience. But bad hands in a big man is something you are not going to fix. He bobbles a lot of passes and even though he is a capable shooter, he is not a consistent shooter and I doubt he'll never be one due to his average touch.
That is exactly why scouts are saying he projects more as an energy big.

I don't know if I buy the small hands bit. Extremely big hands have been one of the reasons why big men typically can't shoot the ball and are terrible FT shooters. It's like normal people shooting tennis balls in the basket. Dramatic example, but it's a totally different type of feel to the ball.

You watch him dribble, he does it better than most big men his size. You don't do that if your hands are problematically small.

Average touch? Compared to who? Other 7 footers? I don't think so. I feel like there is an extreme negative bias because folks didn't see him play in college. The same similar bias that existed to those that hated Porzingis and knocked his level of competition and perceived rawness.

Don't bother talking about a KP vs Thon side by side comparison because that's not what I'm saying. I'm talking about the bias against players who don't come out of the NCAA.

[NO-KG-AI]

Why do people NOT believe in him? Is it his character? Experience? BBIQ? Motor? Other?

Because at 18, I can't put a final judgement on his body or his skills.

He looks pretty awkward as an athlete to me, and some of the skills (like ballhandling and stuff) won't really be used at the next level at all, so it's kind of pointless to care about. If your team wants Thon Maker creating from the perimeter, your team is really bad, and needs a complete overhaul.

I like his length, height, and ability to possibly stretch the floor. I don't think he's a star, but every team could use a guy who could potentially become a force blocking shots, while not damaging floor spacing or free throw shooting.

[DrCoach]

Yes, but we aren't in 2005 anymore.

Your logic makes no sense. LeBron never played a meaningful game before he turned pro, and neither did Kobe, KG or Moses. Is Thon Maker any of those guys? Who knows? But it doesn't change the fact that the logic you're using is porous.

Back then it was normal for those guys to come into league without playing any meaningful games and it wasn't unusual or a major minus for them because it was sort of expected, not to mention that most of those guys were a year younger than Thon coming out of high school.
Today it isn't normal for a guy as old as Maker (same age as most freshmen in this class) to never have played on a serious level in his life and that is a major issue especially for a guy as raw as he is.

So you are saying a 18 yr old HS player has a greater chance of success than a 19 yr old HS player????

[Bum Adebayo]

Why do people NOT believe in him? Is it his character? Experience? BBIQ? Motor? Other?

Because at 18, I can't put a final judgement on his body or his skills.

To me it is the fact that he has bad hands and average touch.
There is no doubt he has very good motor, his character is fine, experience you can obtain it by playing more. BBIQ is hard to judge sometimes, part of it can be lack of experience. But bad hands in a big man is something you are not going to fix. He bobbles a lot of passes and even though he is a capable shooter, he is not a consistent shooter and I doubt he'll never be one due to his average touch.
That is exactly why scouts are saying he projects more as an energy big.

I don't know if I buy the small hands bit. Extremely big hands have been one of the reasons why big men typically can't shoot the ball and are terrible FT shooters. It's like normal people shooting tennis balls in the basket. Dramatic example, but it's a totally different type of feel to the ball.

You watch him dribble, he does it better than most big men his size. You don't do that if your hands are problematically small.

Average touch? Compared to who? Other 7 footers? I don't think so. I feel like there is an extreme negative bias because folks didn't see him play in college. The same similar bias that existed to those that hated Porzingis and knocked his level of competition and perceived rawness.

Don't bother talking about a KP vs Thon side by side comparison because that's not what I'm saying. I'm talking about the bias against players who don't come out of the NCAA.

I never said his hands are bad because of them being small, they are bad because he has a hard time catching the ball, think nerlens noel hands but a bit better. Anthony davis has small hands but has one of the best hands in the league for a big, and has elite touch too.
I'm talking strictly about his ceiling here, couldn't care less if he is coming out of HS or from college.
Skal labissiere is your pick if you want rim protection with good hands and touch for the magic, or deyonta.
Have yiu seen him play in a game, or only mixtapes?

[Skin]

To me it is the fact that he has bad hands and average touch.
There is no doubt he has very good motor, his character is fine, experience you can obtain it by playing more. BBIQ is hard to judge sometimes, part of it can be lack of experience. But bad hands in a big man is something you are not going to fix. He bobbles a lot of passes and even though he is a capable shooter, he is not a consistent shooter and I doubt he'll never be one due to his average touch.
That is exactly why scouts are saying he projects more as an energy big.

I don't know if I buy the small hands bit. Extremely big hands have been one of the reasons why big men typically can't shoot the ball and are terrible FT shooters. It's like normal people shooting tennis balls in the basket. Dramatic example, but it's a totally different type of feel to the ball.

You watch him dribble, he does it better than most big men his size. You don't do that if your hands are problematically small.

Average touch? Compared to who? Other 7 footers? I don't think so. I feel like there is an extreme negative bias because folks didn't see him play in college. The same similar bias that existed to those that hated Porzingis and knocked his level of competition and perceived rawness.

Don't bother talking about a KP vs Thon side by side comparison because that's not what I'm saying. I'm talking about the bias against players who don't come out of the NCAA.

I never said his hands are bad because of them being small, they are bad because he has a hard time catching the ball, think nerlens noel hands but a bit better. Anthony davis has small hands but has one of the best hands in the league for a big, and has elite touch too.
I'm talking strictly about his ceiling here, couldn't care less if he is coming out of HS or from college.
Skal labissiere is your pick if you want rim protection with good hands and touch for the magic, or deyonta.
Have yiu seen him play in a game, or only mixtapes?

Maybe I would be worried if he was a Wide Receiver catching bullet passes. But I think your concern is overreaction. Skal and Deyonta have their warts too. I don't mind them for the Magic, but they aren't being talked about nearly as negatively as Thon. It's like they're in a different class. Deyonta wasn't even on draft radars when Izzo got him, but had a season in college and now is a sure lottery guy. I don't see the reason why Thon shouldn't be considered a late lottery pick like those guys are. All I see is a fear of not seeing him play in college. Where is the art of scouting a prospect? Must he be seen in college in order to recognize talent now days?

...and why is he so criticized for not having elite touch? Ben Simmons doesn't have elite touch. He's not even that bad. There's no hitch in his stroke... he doesn't shoot it from the side of his head or look awkward like Joakim Noah.

Just listening to your justification about "have you seen him play"? It's HS ball. ...and you're judging him based off his level of competition. That's my whole point. People are bashing him because they haven't seen him play college. Same stuff happened when people bashed Porzingis. You people want "show me first" type of convincing. There is not art to your evaluation of finding a hidden gem.

Looking at his smarts, character, work ethic, competitive drive, size, length, explosion, coordination... there's a lot to like out of the box. For sure, he's not a finished product... none of these guys are. There could be a big return for the team who takes him. I don't know why he's being knocked for frame and skill level at his age. His body is going to get bigger and his skills are going to improve. Everything is about potential with him and the underlying makings of it seem to be there.

Is he not a lottery pick if he comes out as a Freshman, Sophomore, Junior, or Senior? Doubt it. Saying he's not worth it now because he only has film from HS evaluations is just a weak argument.

[HotelVitale]

Looking at his smarts, character, work ethic, competitive drive, size, length, explosion, coordination... there's a lot to like out of the box. For sure, he's not a finished product... none of these guys are. There could be a big return for the team who takes him. I don't know why he's being knocked for frame and skill level at his age. His body is going to get bigger and his skills are going to improve. Everything is about potential with him and the underlying makings of it seem to be there. Is he not a lottery pick if he comes out as a Freshman, Sophomore, Junior, or Senior? Doubt it. Saying he's not worth it now because he only has film from HS evaluations is just a weak argument.

Just curious--do you think you're the first person to have looked at him honestly, while everyone else is just borrowing DX notes and copying what the last person said? You sort of talking as though no scout of draft writer has any idea of what they're talking about, and that this multi-billion dollar business that is the NBA is refusing to actually look at this player without bias. Before getting into Thon himself as a prospect--do you think that's the case?

[Skin]

Looking at his smarts, character, work ethic, competitive drive, size, length, explosion, coordination... there's a lot to like out of the box. For sure, he's not a finished product... none of these guys are. There could be a big return for the team who takes him. I don't know why he's being knocked for frame and skill level at his age. His body is going to get bigger and his skills are going to improve. Everything is about potential with him and the underlying makings of it seem to be there. Is he not a lottery pick if he comes out as a Freshman, Sophomore, Junior, or Senior? Doubt it. Saying he's not worth it now because he only has film from HS evaluations is just a weak argument.

Just curious--do you think you're the first person to have looked at him honestly, while everyone else is just borrowing DX notes and copying what the last person said? You sort of talking as though no scout of draft writer has any idea of what they're talking about, and that this multi-billion dollar business that is the NBA is refusing to actually look at this player without bias. Before getting into Thon himself as a prospect--do you think that's the case?

He's probably the most polarizing player in the draft. People seem to love him or hate him. Many opinions on both sides. I don't think this is a me against the world opinion of him.

[ferk]

he'd be a nice pick for the grizz , maybe just trade bait but i'd rather keep him around . we have a nice group of vets and now a coach known for working with players etc..

[shangrila]

I like the work ethic I've heard about him. That's always good and can make all the difference for his career.

As far as where he is now though? Well, he's in a pretty weird place. It looks like he ignored working on his big man game, like post moves, in favour of the perimeter. The problem is he's not good enough at the latter to make up for his lack of the former. So he spent his precious development time on skills that are probably going to be useless to him in the NBA.

[freewhitemoon]

I like the work ethic I've heard about him. That's always good and can make all the difference for his career.

As far as where he is now though? Well, he's in a pretty weird place. It looks like he ignored working on his big man game, like post moves, in favour of the perimeter. The problem is he's not good enough at the latter to make up for his lack of the former. So he spent his precious development time on skills that are probably going to be useless to him in the NBA.

Yeah he seems to spend all his time developing guard skills like ball handling but his BBIQ and passing is nowhere near good enough for a team to want him handling the ball anyway

[toussaud]

here is the thing. everyone keeps saying hes not a star. hes not a star. he cant shoot trees consistantly. he's not a guard like ball handler. he doesnt havre great hands


so what lol? do you people not reaalize this is the worst draft since 2000. there might, might be 2 stars in this draft. might. i doubt it. probably one. and would not be suprised at all if there are none.


i wouldnt give a damn if he literally had stones on the end of his arms lol, he's 71, a well above avg athlete to be 7 1, strong work ethic, high motor, are you **** kidding? really? in this draaft you take that and run.

this draft has become ben simmons, brandon ingram and gamble for an all star. by the time maker is 22-23 years old he
s going to be an elite rim protecting rebounding menance that can at worst hit the occuasional outside soht.

[Spens1]

he's not a star now, in fact he's more unproven then anyone else (no college, euroleague etc because whoever is behind him was stuffing around, should have gone to college of europe).

Also his measurements came out and they're pretty good, (7'3 wingspan, 9.25 standing reach, 36.5 inch vert, 32 standing vert)

He has a lot of the tools you need to become a damn good shot blocker and rebounder (as long as he bulks up a bit).

Streaky shot but it is there at least, consistency can be taught at least.

He's going in the first round (which makes me sad because i wanted him at 32 for sure) and if he develops he could be one of the biggest steals in the later first round of the draft (spurs could do a lot worse, they're drafting late so him or qi both represent good value)

[RollingWave]

here is the thing. everyone keeps saying hes not a star. hes not a star. he cant shoot trees consistantly. he's not a guard like ball handler. he doesnt havre great hands


so what lol? do you people not reaalize this is the worst draft since 2000. there might, might be 2 stars in this draft. might. i doubt it. probably one. and would not be suprised at all if there are none.


i wouldnt give a damn if he literally had stones on the end of his arms lol, he's 71, a well above avg athlete to be 7 1, strong work ethic, high motor, are you **** kidding? really? in this draaft you take that and run.

this draft has become ben simmons, brandon ingram and gamble for an all star. by the time maker is 22-23 years old he
s going to be an elite rim protecting rebounding menance that can at worst hit the occuasional outside soht.

that seems excessive, this probably isn't even the worst draft since 2013. it's hard to imagine this draft be like that 13 draft where almost every lottery pick is a total bust or meh players, and the 2 good players (Noel and CJ) isn't even really THAT great (would you be shocked if neither ever makes an all star team?)

This draft is high variance, the fact is someone between 15-45 (maybe even more like 3-4 guys.) in this draft will make half the teams or more look very silly for passing up on him ala Rudy Gobert, but obviously we just don't know who that guy is. Thon is a guy in that group who might fit that bill, I'm not sure i like his chances just based on comparing him to past highschool draftees. but who really know, even pro scouts don't know if you give them truth serum .

[neno]

Thon could be a sham a basketball player who doesn't play much basketball. He measures better than he plays.

[Mustinjo]

Jake Fischer ✔ @JakeLFischer
Several teams have entirely ruled Thon Maker out of the first round due to his age. Multiple sources believe Maker to be 21-23, not 19.
3:06 PM - 23 Jun 2016

So much for Thon Maker. What a sham this guy was from the beginning.