Celtics to pursue Harrison Barnes in Free Agency

[sully00]

Barnes is 23, roughly the same age as Buddy Hield. He's not a finished product, and it'ss ridiculous to predict that "he'll never be an all-star."

He shot nearly 38% from eyond the arc despite low usage. He's a starter on a championship team (soon to be two championship teams). He defends and he rebounds. Even so, his upside is substantial.

He's a starter on a championship team, but he's probably not a top 5 player on that team, so I don't see the relevance. Iggy and Bogut are better than Harrison Barnes on a per minute basis, and it's not close (nor was it close last season either). You could make the argument that Shaun Livingston is more important to the Warriors than Barnes is also.


I don't understand the first sentence, why did you say he shot 38% despite low usage? Typically speaking, the lower your usage is the better your efficiency should be.

Essentially PER (if that is what you mean by efficiency) hurts guys whose primary role is to stretch the defense. If your job is to roam the perimeter and draw a defender and knock down 3's it just does not translate into PER, though every team values the role but you statistically appear to be playing empty mins.

If Barnes was on a team like Boston he could get 13-14 shots a game in his 30 mpg instead of 8-9 so his PER would increase significantly. Obviously more assists, rebounds, steals wouldn't hurt.

[Slartibartfast]

James Posey at the max? No thanks.

[Ed Pinkney]

I would hate to see the Celtics throw a max offer at him but would you pay 18-20 million for him, bearing in mind under the existing cap that is probably more like a 12-15 million contract? Warriors probably match any offer like that, but for the sake of a hypothetical question.

[CeltsfanSinceBirth]

I would hate to see the Celtics throw a max offer at him but would you pay 18-20 million for him, bearing in mind under the existing cap that is probably more like a 12-15 million contract? Warriors probably match any offer like that, but for the sake of a hypothetical question.

Nope. That money could be spent elsewhere.

[31to6]

I would hate to see the Celtics throw a max offer at him but would you pay 18-20 million for him, bearing in mind under the existing cap that is probably more like a 12-15 million contract? Warriors probably match any offer like that, but for the sake of a hypothetical question.

Nope. That money could be spent elsewhere.

Yup. Let's keep our cap situation gorgeous while continuing to make the playoffs and draft in the high lotto (thanks Billy King!).

[sully00]

I am not so worried about the money as long as it isn't a trade then you spend the money instead of the assets. I have the same reservations about Barnes as everyone else but what is the difference between Barnes and Nicholas Batum? Or Chandler Parsons? Well besides 3 years in age.

[leper-con]

I am not so worried about the money as long as it isn't a trade then you spend the money instead of the assets. I have the same reservations about Barnes as everyone else but what is the difference between Barnes and Nicholas Batum? Or Chandler Parsons? Well besides 3 years in age.

Agreed Sully also, this isn't a move in a vacuum. Lets say we get Barnes and use the 3rd pick on Murray. That gives us two new shooters which this team desperately needs. add a shot blocker/eraser to the team and we make another step up the NBA food chain.

[Slartibartfast]

I am not so worried about the money as long as it isn't a trade then you spend the money instead of the assets. I have the same reservations about Barnes as everyone else but what is the difference between Barnes and Nicholas Batum? Or Chandler Parsons? Well besides 3 years in age.

Ball-handling and playmaking ability.

Barnes just can't do much with the ball in his hands on the perimeter, where a guy like Batum can handle and pass at a high level.

Take away Batum's ball-handling and he's just a longer Jared Dudley. And that's pretty much what Barnes is.

And Batum isn't even worth the max because, like Barnes, he has a pretty firm cap on his scoring ability.

Barnes just isn't very good. I probably wouldn't even start him over Crowder and I'm not as cray-cray for Jae as most.

[sam_I_am]

Overpaying to steal an asset you cannot get otherwise is a good move. We have room for 3 maxes but where are we going to get them? When Tobias Harris was overpaid, Orlando had no trouble moving him. A young player like Barnes who is by all accounts a good kid and healthy is low risk investment.

Obviously if you sign him and miss out on Durant because of wasted cap space that would suck. I won't lose sleep over unrealistic worries like that. We need a ready to produce scoring wing like Barnes and I think it's worth risking him being a Jeff Green repeat.

Would I rather trade for Butler, sign Horford and complete the Pat Riley like coup by signing Durant -of course.

That said, Horford, Barnes, Murray( or Brown/Chrriss/Bender) off season plus 2 Qi/Zizac/Thon/Forkmaz/Luwuwu type draft and stash players and a solid LaVert/Bembry/Isaiah Cousins second rounder would be a dream come true.

[CeltsfanSinceBirth]

Overpaying to steal an asset you cannot get otherwise is a good move. We have room for 3 maxes but where are we going to get them? When Tobias Harris was overpaid, Orlando had no trouble moving him. A young player like Barnes who is by all accounts a good kid and healthy is low risk investment.

Obviously if you sign him and miss out on Durant because of wasted cap space that would suck. I won't lose sleep over unrealistic worries like that. We need a ready to produce scoring wing like Barnes and I think it's worth risking him being a Jeff Green repeat.

It's not a low-risk signing if you're paying Barnes close to $20 million/year. A low-risk signing is a guy like Evan Turner, where he doesn't eat up almost 1/5th of your cap space.

And again, Cave has already said it, but it needs to be repeated - the only reason this guy starts on the Warriors is because he's mentally fragile. He will crawl into his shell and sulk if asked to come off the bench, which is a very real possibility on the Celtics since Bradley and Crowder are better than him.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgqmCpQkQkk[/youtube]

[sam_I_am]

Overpaying to steal an asset you cannot get otherwise is a good move. We have room for 3 maxes but where are we going to get them? When Tobias Harris was overpaid, Orlando had no trouble moving him. A young player like Barnes who is by all accounts a good kid and healthy is low risk investment.

Obviously if you sign him and miss out on Durant because of wasted cap space that would suck. I won't lose sleep over unrealistic worries like that. We need a ready to produce scoring wing like Barnes and I think it's worth risking him being a Jeff Green repeat.

It's not a low-risk signing if you're paying Barnes close to $20 million/year. A low-risk signing is a guy like Evan Turner, where he doesn't eat up almost 1/5th of your cap space.

And again, Cave has already said it, but it needs to be repeated - the only reason this guy starts on the Warriors is because he's mentally fragile. He will crawl into his shell and sulk if asked to come off the bench, which is a very real possibility on the Celtics since Bradley and Crowder are better than him.


[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgqmCpQkQkk[/youtube]

I think it is a bad analogy. Turner was a bust and a guy who needs the ball to be effective. Low cost low risk possible reward gamble.

Barnes is an expensive gamble but we have tons of cap space, a roster full of low cost options and we are talking about a player who is only 23 yo and already has experience starting on a championship team about to repeat. Is he worth 20 mil? Probably not unless he grows. If the Celtics have regret he won't be hard to move on from. Alternative is to take on Butler - assuming you can a big if - and give up pick 3, future NJ pick and Bradley. Does that even make you better? Another alternative I like is Evan Fournier.

[truth18]

Has anyone seen this commercial with Barnes? Been laughing whenever it comes on all finals because they are playing "Emience Front" by the Who in the background.

Perfectly describes him.

[youtube]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AvyQ-RWTeCg[/youtube]

IT'S A PUT ON

[djFan71]

Has anyone seen this commercial with Barnes? Been laughing whenever it comes on all finals because they are playing "Emience Front" by the Who in the background.

Perfectly describes him.

[youtube]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AvyQ-RWTeCg[/youtube]

IT'S A PUT ON

My wife thought that song was "Livin in the funk". I can't not hear that anymore. You're welcome...

[truth18]

Has anyone seen this commercial with Barnes? Been laughing whenever it comes on all finals because they are playing "Emience Front" by the Who in the background.

Perfectly describes him.

[youtube]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AvyQ-RWTeCg[/youtube]

IT'S A PUT ON

My wife thought that song was "Livin in the funk". I can't not hear that anymore. You're welcome...

Thanks, now I will never unhear that.

I raise you the yellow lights on the TD garden floor. You will never unsee them once you notice them.

[djFan71]

Spoiler:

Has anyone seen this commercial with Barnes? Been laughing whenever it comes on all finals because they are playing "Emience Front" by the Who in the background.

Perfectly describes him.

[youtube]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AvyQ-RWTeCg[/youtube]

IT'S A PUT ON

My wife thought that song was "Livin in the funk". I can't not hear that anymore. You're welcome...

Thanks, now I will never unhear that.

I raise you the yellow lights on the TD garden floor. You will never unsee them once you notice them.

Well played, sir. <doffing cap emoji >
Are you talking the insanely bright light intermittently on the floor that I was always assuming was the jumbotron? Or some other horror I've yet to notice?

[CeltsfanSinceBirth]

Overpaying to steal an asset you cannot get otherwise is a good move. We have room for 3 maxes but where are we going to get them? When Tobias Harris was overpaid, Orlando had no trouble moving him. A young player like Barnes who is by all accounts a good kid and healthy is low risk investment.

Obviously if you sign him and miss out on Durant because of wasted cap space that would suck. I won't lose sleep over unrealistic worries like that. We need a ready to produce scoring wing like Barnes and I think it's worth risking him being a Jeff Green repeat.

It's not a low-risk signing if you're paying Barnes close to $20 million/year. A low-risk signing is a guy like Evan Turner, where he doesn't eat up almost 1/5th of your cap space.

And again, Cave has already said it, but it needs to be repeated - the only reason this guy starts on the Warriors is because he's mentally fragile. He will crawl into his shell and sulk if asked to come off the bench, which is a very real possibility on the Celtics since Bradley and Crowder are better than him.


[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LgqmCpQkQkk[/youtube]

I think it is a bad analogy. Turner was a bust and a guy who needs the ball to be effective. Low cost low risk possible reward gamble.

Barnes is an expensive gamble but we have tons of cap space, a roster full of low cost options and we are talking about a player who is only 23 yo and already has experience starting on a championship team about to repeat. Is he worth 20 mil? Probably not unless he grows. If the Celtics have regret he won't be hard to move on from. Alternative is to take on Butler - assuming you can a big if - and give up pick 3, future NJ pick and Bradley. Does that even make you better? Another alternative I like is Evan Fournier.

Danny isn't giving up a future Nets pick (unless he knows for sure that Durant is on his way here). And I don't agree with gambling $20 million/year just because the Cs have cap space. Don't pay someone money just for the sake of using up cap space. Then you look like Joe Dumars, who gave stupid contracts to Ben Gordon, Charlie Villanueva, and Josh Smith.

I just don't see the infatuation with Barnes. His game hasn't grown. At all. You ever see him create his own shot? I haven't. If you're going to pay $20 million/year to someone, then at least show you have one elite skill.

[sam_I_am]

I think he is versatile and his 3 pt shot is close to very good. He has had his share of clutch moments even if game 5 wasn't one of them.

Inherent in my interest in Barnes is that Ainge and Stevens believe in his talent. If they see a player who can make a leap given a bigger role, the money doesn't bother me because he is young, movable and we have nobody else to spend it on.

[CeltsfanSinceBirth]

I think he is versatile and his 3 pt shot is close to very good. He has had his share of clutch moments even if game 5 wasn't one of them.

Inherent in my interest in Barnes is that Ainge and Stevens believe in his talent. If they see a player who can make a leap given a bigger role, the money doesn't bother me because he is young, movable and we have nobody else to spend it on.

If Ainge was in the business of spending money just for the sake of spending money, he would have made an offer for Tobias Harris. As for his interest in Barnes - yeah, sure, he tried to trade for him when he was a rookie in exchange for Paul Pierce. Has his game grown enough the past 3-4 years to keep Ainge's interest? We'll see come July 1st. IMHO, I don't even think Barnes gets a phone call from Danny, as Avery Bradley and Jae Crowder are still better than him.

[Homerclease]

I think the Celtics need to strongly consider punting their cap space to next season. Let everyone else blow their wads on these guys and swing for the fences next year with less competition. If Ainge hits on the third pick then they have another extremely valueable asset to make a move via trade. Standing pat might be the best move this offseason

[tmorgan]

Don't do it, Celts.

Harrison Barnes is a starter on the Warriors because he's incapable of playing the role of "bench offense". They tried it, and he sucked. He can't create his own shot and he isn't much of a passer. Iggy plays the role (and thus doesn't start) because Barnes can't handle it skill-wise.

Barnes is a versatile defender, OK on the perimeter and good in the post, a good (not great) athlete, and a good spot-up shooter with his feet set. He's sort of a crappy version of the unicorn everyone is looking for, but he doesn't play big enough (rebounding, help defense) to be the Porzingis or Ibaka or KAT that everyone wants.

Every team can use a guy like Harrison Barnes. If you give him 25% of your cap, though, you're going to seriously regret it. He just doesn't do enough. He's young, yes, but he hasn't progressed much (a one dribble pull up and smarter team defense, that's about it), and there's no reason to think he will. For the 4/64 he already turned down, you could get your money's worth under an expanding cap, although that's not certain. For 4/80 or (gasp) 4/92, you're just wasting money.