2016 Draft Thread Part 4

[Kerrsed]

First off, Go Suns!!!

Ok. I'm not a Suns fan. I have a Phoenix question unrelated to the draft or basketball at all for that matter. But in regards to the draft: I hope the Suns get a great player and do unexpectedly well next year.


Here's the question: I was looking at your weather forecast!!! How the hell? I mean, O My Freakin God, look at this: https://weather.com/weather/tenday/l/USAZ0166:1:US

Look at it! How do you cope? Your lows are higher than our highs. 120 degrees? I hope that if this is the apocalypse you are all having a good one.

Once again, Go Suns! ...and please don't die.

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CasGB8GahZw[/youtube]

[JMac1]

So what you are saying is that if we draft Hield, we can expect for him to BALL-OUT in our '19-'20 season...cool. By then, We'll have pissed off Booker somehow, and he'll go play for another team, allowing Hield to 'dominate' in that season for our SG position. OK, I'm patient. Good thing drafting the Senior will make us competitive sooner than Bender or Chriss...

Can't wait til you guys are crying in your bed at night watching Buddy light it up EARLY in the season for Minny or NO. I can't wait

"How did Minny get so lucky?" is what I will be hearing. This is so 2009 all over again.

So Hield's gonna waltz right in and start over Zach LaVine or Shabazz Muhammed in Minny, or ahead of the 4-5 talented wings the Pelicans have? OK. If you say so. But I DO know I won't be crying why we are overpaying/starting Leuer or Tele at PF because we have Hield sitting on the bench behind Bledsoe, Knight, and Booker. Or worse, 'forcing' Booker to 'fail' at SF because he grew an inch and gets destroyed even worse on D.

I guess you didn't read that bit from Ford that states that NBA Scouts has Hield as a Tier 4 prospect???

Nah, I was reading about how many Booker, Lillard, CJ, Green and others were in that "Tier 4" crap disguised as some sort of system. If you have a systematic way of valuing players, have at least 70-80 percent accuracy, 50-50 or less is guessing. How could you reference that this year after all of the misses and so few hits?

[NavLDO]

For such a weak draft why are teams trying to trade Okafor and Russell to get a pick in this draft? Answer:

Dunn, Brown, Chriss and Bender are possible two way players and Hield is a shooting star...in 60% of the games on the 'big stage', or in 1 out of 4 years!

FIFY!

[JMac1]

Buddy just doesnt make any sense for the suns right now with booker, you can at least acknowledge that right?
Also, his parents must have been high as **** when they came up with his name. Jamaica right? Yea, super high.

If he isn't good enough, yea. If he is good enough, you make room. So if you don't think he is going to be a baller, that's your opinion and its cool, but if you say we can't (which we probably will POR did it twice!) draft him because of who we have, I am not feeling that argument.

[JMac1]

Man, if Buddy ends up being just a role player JMac is gonna be eating a lot of crow lol

And if

Bender fails, and Chriss fails, and Brown balls out and Dunn balls out and Buddy balls out who will be eating crow?

I guess Buddy has to be a HOFer for me not to eat Crow. As long as he out performs the other guy, I am cool.

[Stix]

Newest DX mock has us taking Chriss and Sabonis, I can live with that, but definitely think we trade one of the picks.

[JMac1]

Man, if Buddy ends up being just a role player JMac is gonna be eating a lot of crow lol

Dont forget about all the other "Lights Our Shooting Stars" that didnt even make it as a role player, like Jimmer and Morrison.

Just like I didn't forget blowing your head off for Booker gif

Why are we going back and forth on Hield? I like him other don't, case close. To try to prove me wrong and yourself right is laughable. It will come in due time. Thank you very much.

People continue to act like their chit don't stank........incredible.

[Zelaznyrules]

I figure Buddy has a better chance of excelling than most of the lottery prospects. Not that I feel very good about any of them but watching him play I saw no reason to believe his senior season was a fluke.

[JMac1]

I figure Buddy has a better chance of excelling than most of the lottery prospects. Not that I feel very good about any of them but watching him play I saw no reason to believe his senior season was a fluke.

Well you have to wait until enough people tell you to not believe what you see, then make excuse for why he did so well; and then say you are crazy for thinking rationally because of Jimmer Ferdette and Adam Morrison, all the while excluding Curry and Klay and Lillard and Draymond.

[NavLDO]

I guess you didn't read that bit from Ford that states that NBA Scouts has Hield as a Tier 4 prospect???

if we draft based on what Chad Ford says that NBA scouts think, i will fly to Phoenix and tape a "Fire McD" poster to the podium before McD introduces the rookies. giant, red Sharpie.

Ummm...who do you think GMs get their information from...non-NBA scouts???

This isn't about what Ford thinks; it's about what he's reporting from what he's heard from people who get paid to 'scout' prospects for NBA teams. Ultimately, the GM takes the info he gets from tam scouts and crunches the data, determines team fit, off-court issues, medical info, psychological profles, metrics/stats, analytics, etc., then makes a decision.

But if a large number of NBA Scouts (not media, not college coaches, not high-school scouts--NBA Scouts) feel that Hield is in a 'lower tier' as a prospect, you can be darn sure the GM is coming to take that info on board. NBA Scouts get PAID to provide this very info.

[JoRain]

In light of all this chatter about Suns loving Chriss at 4, I watched again some of his highlights and some game film and visions of another, super athletic 6'9" forward who Suns drafted came to mind - Earl Clark.


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[JMac1]

For such a weak draft why are teams trying to trade Okafor and Russell to get a pick in this draft? Answer:

Dunn, Brown, Chriss and Bender are possible two way players and Hield is a shooting star...in 60% of the games on the 'big stage', or in 1 out of 4 years!

FIFY!

Enough to take his team to the Final Four averaging 25pts on 50 46 88.......

[JMac1]

In light of all this chatter about Suns loving Chriss at 4, I watched again some of his highlights and some game film and visions of another, super athletic 6'9" forward who Suns drafted came to mind - Earl Clark.


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Great Call. Who did we miss out on that year, let me check. I liked Earl's "potential" BTW.

[8on]

I guess you didn't read that bit from Ford that states that NBA Scouts has Hield as a Tier 4 prospect???

if we draft based on what Chad Ford says that NBA scouts think, i will fly to Phoenix and tape a "Fire McD" poster to the podium before McD introduces the rookies. giant, red Sharpie.

If you look at the article I posted, it looks like his tiers do a good job at pegging the general order of how the prospects get drafted.

That doesn't mean he pegs their outlook as players properly; many players bust relative to their draft position, and some, like Booker, surprise.

But his tier structure is a pretty good tool to use when trying to figure out how teams rank these guys. For whatever reasons, scouts and GMs believe Hield is a tier below the Murray/Dunn/Bender/Brown/Chriss group. That doesn't mean he won't be better than those guys...he absolutely could be. But for now, going off the information we have at hand, he's not considered on their level by the decision makers.

i looked at the article you posted.

last year, we were smarter than Sacramento, Orlando, the Lakers, Utah......

the trick is not to be as smart as other teams, but to be smartER than those teams.

last year, we did that. McD is 5 steps ahead of almost every team, IMO. that's why he ditched the 28 year old point guard and traded for the 23 year old one, regardless of perception, why he drafted Len, who hasn't been great but is still a unique prospect, and why he wants guys like Harrison Barnes. teams like Orlando and Milwaukee will be stuck where they are for a while. they keep hoping and hoping that Tobias Harris or Greg Monroe will save them from the late lottery, and are too scared to cut bait with B to C- level players that are quickly losing trade value.

i could give a darn what Chad Ford thinks. he seems to think that Devin Booker is more likely a role player than a star. i disagree. he seems to think that Henry Ellenson won't be a star. only i seem to disagree with that, but i've been right before.

be wrong or be right, but don't make a decision based on critics. if they knew what McD knew, they might have his job by now.

[rsavaj]

if we draft based on what Chad Ford says that NBA scouts think, i will fly to Phoenix and tape a "Fire McD" poster to the podium before McD introduces the rookies. giant, red Sharpie.

If you look at the article I posted, it looks like his tiers do a good job at pegging the general order of how the prospects get drafted.

That doesn't mean he pegs their outlook as players properly; many players bust relative to their draft position, and some, like Booker, surprise.

But his tier structure is a pretty good tool to use when trying to figure out how teams rank these guys. For whatever reasons, scouts and GMs believe Hield is a tier below the Murray/Dunn/Bender/Brown/Chriss group. That doesn't mean he won't be better than those guys...he absolutely could be. But for now, going off the information we have at hand, he's not considered on their level by the decision makers.

i looked at the article you posted.

last year, we were smarter than Sacramento, Orlando, the Lakers, Utah......

the trick is not to be as smart as other teams, but to be smartER than those teams.

last year, we did that. McD is 5 steps ahead of almost every team, IMO. that's why he ditched the 28 year old point guard and traded for the 23 year old one, regardless of perception, why he drafted Len, who hasn't been great but is still a unique prospect, and why he wants guys like Harrison Barnes. teams like Orlando and Milwaukee will be stuck where they are for a while. they keep hoping and hoping that Tobias Harris or Greg Monroe will save them from the late lottery, and are too scared to cut bait with B to C- level players that are quickly losing trade value.

i could give a darn what Chad Ford thinks. he seems to think that Devin Booker is more likely a role player than a star. i disagree. he seems to think that Henry Ellenson won't be a star. only i seem to disagree with that, but i've been right before.

be wrong or be right, but don't make a decision based on critics. if they knew what McD knew, they might have his job by now.

I like your last sentence quite a bit, but just to clarify, this isn't Chad's personal Big Board. This is basically an average ranking of the prospects in terms of what the GMs/scouts have told Ford. If you look at his Big Board there are def some discrepancies between what the GMs/scouts think and what he thinks.

[NavLDO]

Can't wait til you guys are crying in your bed at night watching Buddy light it up EARLY in the season for Minny or NO. I can't wait

"How did Minny get so lucky?" is what I will be hearing. This is so 2009 all over again.

So Hield's gonna waltz right in and start over Zach LaVine or Shabazz Muhammed in Minny, or ahead of the 4-5 talented wings the Pelicans have? OK. If you say so. But I DO know I won't be crying why we are overpaying/starting Leuer or Tele at PF because we have Hield sitting on the bench behind Bledsoe, Knight, and Booker. Or worse, 'forcing' Booker to 'fail' at SF because he grew an inch and gets destroyed even worse on D.

I guess you didn't read that bit from Ford that states that NBA Scouts has Hield as a Tier 4 prospect???

Nah, I was reading about how many Booker, Lillard, CJ, Green and others were in that "Tier 4" crap disguised as some sort of system. If you have a systematic way of valuing players, have at least 70-80 percent accuracy, 50-50 or less is guessing. How could you reference that this year after all of the misses and so few hits?

Cool. Show me this system you speak of that is 70-80% accurate, that has Hield as the 4th best player in the draft, then I'll not reference NBA Scouts that get paid to do this. Are you one in disguise? Are you from the future, since you said we'll all be crying by seeing Hield lighting it up in Minny or NOP? Just curious which system you reference/use to make your decision on who we should draft...watching Hield's Senior tape, and ignoring the other 75% of his college career?

[sunsbum]

Lets leave how good he might or might not be out of the equasion. If you have a guy that is going to play 40 minutes a game at the 2 for the next 8 years of his career here 100% no question... you dont draft another guy that is a 1 position player behind him. ESPECIALLY if you have glaring holes your team needs to fill. You cant say "oh well the blazers drafted sam bowie with that mindframe" because thats pretty easy hindsight talk. Buddy is 100% unproven in the league and at a position that is dead last in need. I'd rather take a couple flyers on some power forwards.

[JoRain]

I figure Buddy has a better chance of excelling than most of the lottery prospects. Not that I feel very good about any of them but watching him play I saw no reason to believe his senior season was a fluke.

He probably does have the best chance as his floor is probably higher than any other prospect after top 2. Then again, considering rest of his game, I think his ceiling also could be the lowest among all of lottery prospects. With Suns situation I wouldn't pick him as I don't see him being clear cut better than other options at four - also because how players develop also often depends on situation they get drafted in. Not a good fit on both sides.


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[JMac1]

So Hield's gonna waltz right in and start over Zach LaVine or Shabazz Muhammed in Minny, or ahead of the 4-5 talented wings the Pelicans have? OK. If you say so. But I DO know I won't be crying why we are overpaying/starting Leuer or Tele at PF because we have Hield sitting on the bench behind Bledsoe, Knight, and Booker. Or worse, 'forcing' Booker to 'fail' at SF because he grew an inch and gets destroyed even worse on D.

I guess you didn't read that bit from Ford that states that NBA Scouts has Hield as a Tier 4 prospect???

Nah, I was reading about how many Booker, Lillard, CJ, Green and others were in that "Tier 4" crap disguised as some sort of system. If you have a systematic way of valuing players, have at least 70-80 percent accuracy, 50-50 or less is guessing. How could you reference that this year after all of the misses and so few hits?

Cool. Show me this system you speak of that is 70-80% accurate, that has Hield as the 4th best player in the draft, then I'll not reference NBA Scouts that get paid to do this. Are you one in disguise? Are you from the future, since you said we'll all be crying by seeing Hield lighting it up in Minny or NOP? Just curious which system you reference/use to make your decision on who we should draft...watching Hield's Senior tape, and ignoring the other 75% of his college career?

My point is, please don't try to reference something that is not an accurate predictor to disagree with MY opinion. Everyone has an opinion. I stated I liked Buddy and I have been defending my opinion for the last day and 1/2 against other opinions.......crazy.

[NavLDO]

Man, if Buddy ends up being just a role player JMac is gonna be eating a lot of crow lol

Dont forget about all the other "Lights Our Shooting Stars" that didnt even make it as a role player, like Jimmer and Morrison.

Just like I didn't forget blowing your head off for Booker gif

Why are we going back and forth on Hield? I like him other don't, case close. To try to prove me wrong and yourself right is laughable. It will come in due time. Thank you very much.

People continue to act like their chit don't stank........incredible.

That's rich coming from the guy claiming we'll all be crying because he's awesome in Minny/New Orleans? I think you might want to go back and read your own posts; we are simply responding to your hyperbole on how Hield's such a "Baller" and "Case closed".

At least the rest of us are open to more than ONE prospect, and aren't covering our ears, closing our eyes, saying "la la la la la...I'm not listening...Hield is great, everyone else stinks...la la la la la..."