The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2)

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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#981 » by BasketballFan7 » Mon Jun 20, 2016 8:29 pm

Reservoirdawgs wrote:
BasketballFan7 wrote:You can't just use TS%. He went from GOAT TS% on elite superstar volume to above average TS% on all-star volume. His playmaking was bad. His versatility was bad. He was continuously picked on defensively. He made stupid fouls and lacked composure.

Curry is damn amazing. It's dumb how good he is. But this defending of his finals / PS is wrong.


When did a 58 TS% become only "above average"? His TS% for such a "terrible" series was higher than almost all other superstars out there! His shooting wasn't his issue in the Finals...his playmaking and lackadaisical passing was the issue. The Cavs got him out of his comfort zone and he never really figured out what to do with their defensive switching the way he had been doing all season. Averaging over 4 TOVs a game along with under 4 assists was his biggest undoing, which he can absolutely be criticized for. What I take exception to is people coming out and saying how he choked or how he was exposed when the Warriors easily could have won that game and the entire series and that narrative would have been moot.

What is the average TS% among all star level players? 56%? Curry doesn't get compared to league average scrubs, he was making a run for GOAT season. His TS% you can label however you like. But you aren't addressing that his volume also decreased when generally volume / TS% have an inverse correlation.

Really you are only addressing his playmaking, and there was more wrong with Curry than that. His finishing fell off, his 3 ability decreased to only elite levels, he was attacked relentlessly defensively, and he played like a novice by collecting some really bad fouls (others being questionable). His composure was off. Decision making was bad not only in passing but in what shots to take (in post game interview he stated he should have driven past Love instead of taking the 3 and repeatedly stated that he settled too much in the series). He didn't control the pace of the game. I can go on.

Yes, the Warriors could have won the series and the narrative would have been different. But Curry wouldn't have won FMVP again and he would still be under fire. And, more relevant in this discussion, the Warriors undoubtedly win this series if Curry doesn't play so far below his standards. Isn't that choking?

Again, Curry is great! Amazing! He really, really is. But he did not impact the game anywhere close to what is expected of him and it isn't as you are portraying it.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#982 » by Reservoirdawgs » Mon Jun 20, 2016 8:38 pm

MisterHibachi wrote:Win or lose, there are some serious flaws in his game that certainly were exposed. Maybe you don't wanna use that word, but he has clear flaws that we kept brushing over in the RS because the Warriors were doing what they did in the RS. His defense was certainly 'exposed', the burden to make plays and make decisions with the ball fell on him after LeBron took Draymond out of the picture and he made bad decisions, decisions which he had been making all year, but on a smaller, less important scale. His decision making needs improvement, and no one was really talking about this before the finals. So the finals did 'expose' that. It was a 7 game series, but we did learn a lot about Curry, regardless of what his TS% was.


I think it's fair to bring up some flaws in his game that were exposed. Watching the team without Curry for the six games did suggest that Green is really as important to the flow of the Warriors as his RAPM and +/- has been suggesting, and the Thunder and Cavs were able to show that Curry can be knocked out of his comfort zone through the switching of 1-5 on defense. His playmaking was poor for the series, there's no doubt about that.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#983 » by ppedro123 » Mon Jun 20, 2016 8:38 pm

Curry was a virtual no show in the Finals. Stop giving the dude a pass.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#984 » by Pillendreher » Mon Jun 20, 2016 8:45 pm

Reservoirdawgs wrote:
BasketballFan7 wrote:You can't just use TS%. He went from GOAT TS% on elite superstar volume to above average TS% on all-star volume. His playmaking was bad. His versatility was bad. He was continuously picked on defensively. He made stupid fouls and lacked composure.

Curry is damn amazing. It's dumb how good he is. But this defending of his finals / PS is wrong.


When did a 58 TS% become only "above average"? His TS% for such a "terrible" series was higher than almost all other superstars out there! His shooting wasn't his issue in the Finals


Here are his 2PT-FGAs/FGMs over the last two series:

Overall: 48/109 (44%)
Jumpers: 24/59 (40.7%)
Layups: 24/50 (48%)

Both those % don't even put him into the top 100 (at least 150 fga) during the RS. He finished first in layups (69 %) and 10th in jumpers (44.6 %) in the RS.
If you look at this postseason, those numbers above put him (40 fga min. just to get a bigger player-pool) 18th in Layups and 19th in Jumpers. Based on at least 80 fga from 2pt territory, he's 20th overall in these Playoffs - his FG% (47.9 %) would put him 143th among players with at least 200 FGA from 2pt territory during the RS; he indeed finished 21st.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#985 » by Senior » Mon Jun 20, 2016 9:26 pm

I think we really need to consider how important we weigh efficiency in player evaluations and how resilient a player's skills are that led to those efficiency stats. Yes, Curry shot 58% TS in the Finals which is great, but not only was it a huge drop from his RS (67% so a drop of ~9%), we need to think about why that percent dropped and if those reasons are due to circumstance (injury? cold streak?) or if the reasons are due to an exploitable flaw in Curry's game. It's possible that OKC/Cleveland's ability to play Curry physical (running him into screens, forcing him to play defense) caused his shot to drop off, and even though Curry's efficiency was still great, the decrease still needs to be discussed. If Curry's slight frame means that he's more affected in deeper playoff runs, then that would be an issue. It's worth noting that against the physical/good defenses Curry faced the last two years (MEM/OKC/CLE x2), his TS% has decreased by about 5% (2015: MEM 56% TS, CLE 59%, 2016 OKC 61% CLE 58%)

We've seen efficiency monsters (D-Rob, Durant, Harden) drop off in the playoffs because they faced teams that could take away the things that made them insanely efficient. We have also seen players maintain their efficiency because the way they produced points and their skills were more translatable to the stronger defensive environment of the playoffs (Hakeem, Kareem, Shaq, Kobe). In this case Curry's efficiency has dropped the last two MVP years (64% TS to 61% last year, then 67% to 60% this year) in the playoffs.

Obviously it's great to be hitting those levels of efficiency in the RS to begin with, but I think we need to give more weight to players that have skills that playoff-level defenses cannot stop as easily. The playoffs provide a better representation of a player's ability despite the sample size difference between RS and PS for a lot of reasons (tanking/coasting/terrible teams, scheduling issues, injuries, etc.) MVP-caliber players can probably destroy 26 teams night in and out, but what can they do against the locked in defenses that have game planned to stop them?

Also, picc mentioned this earlier but I was just as baffled at Curry's careless turnovers. Like...what? I don't even have the words to describe my reaction to those TOs. You can do flashy behind the back stuff in pre-season, not in Game 7 of the Finals. Just totally unnecessary or lazy passes. He did this in the RS too and got away with it, and this decision making can't be attributed to the injury.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#986 » by Bruh Man » Mon Jun 20, 2016 9:53 pm

Senior wrote:I think we really need to consider how important we weigh efficiency in player evaluations and how resilient a player's skills are that led to those efficiency stats. Yes, Curry shot 58% TS in the Finals which is great, but not only was it a huge drop from his RS (67% so a drop of ~9%), we need to think about why that percent dropped and if those reasons are due to circumstance (injury? cold streak?) or if the reasons are due to an exploitable flaw in Curry's game. It's possible that OKC/Cleveland's ability to play Curry physical (running him into screens, forcing him to play defense) caused his shot to drop off, and even though Curry's efficiency was still great, the decrease still needs to be discussed. If Curry's slight frame means that he's more affected in deeper playoff runs, then that would be an issue. It's worth noting that against the physical/good defenses Curry faced the last two years (MEM/OKC/CLE x2), his TS% has decreased by about 5% (2015: MEM 56% TS, CLE 59%, 2016 OKC 61% CLE 58%)

We've seen efficiency monsters (D-Rob, Durant, Harden) drop off in the playoffs because they faced teams that could take away the things that made them insanely efficient. We have also seen players maintain their efficiency because the way they produced points and their skills were more translatable to the stronger defensive environment of the playoffs (Hakeem, Kareem, Shaq, Kobe). In this case Curry's efficiency has dropped the last two MVP years (64% TS to 61% last year, then 67% to 60% this year) in the playoffs.

Obviously it's great to be hitting those levels of efficiency in the RS to begin with, but I think we need to give more weight to players that have skills that playoff-level defenses cannot stop as easily. The playoffs provide a better representation of a player's ability despite the sample size difference between RS and PS for a lot of reasons (tanking/coasting/terrible teams, scheduling issues, injuries, etc.) MVP-caliber players can probably destroy 26 teams night in and out, but what can they do against the locked in defenses that have game planned to stop them?

Also, picc mentioned this earlier but I was just as baffled at Curry's careless turnovers. Like...what? I don't even have the words to describe my reaction to those TOs. You can do flashy behind the back stuff in pre-season, not in Game 7 of the Finals. Just totally unnecessary or lazy passes. He did this in the RS too and got away with it, and this decision making can't be attributed to the injury.

Curry had more turnovers than assists in finals. 30 turnovers to 26 assists, that is terrible.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#987 » by AceofSpades69 » Mon Jun 20, 2016 10:57 pm

Top 8 offensive season ever in my eyes. Overall, he surely doesn't break my Top 15 GOAT peaks. Don't know where I rank him exactly..
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#988 » by Sark » Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:08 pm

His efficiency dip had more to do with seeing actual defenses, which he didn't see in the regular season. There are about 5 teams in the current NBA that play real defense in the regular season, one of which is the Warriors. The rest of the teams are tanking or are just flat out awful. He was heavily focused on these last 2 rounds, and rightfully so. They took away his shot, so it was up to him to adjust his game. Unfortunately he's so reliant on his shot, he didn't really adjust.

What he should have done, is try to be a real playmaking point guard and rack up 10+ assists a game.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#989 » by Quotatious » Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:18 pm

Sark wrote:His efficiency dip had more to do with seeing actual defenses, which he didn't see in the regular season. There are about 5 teams in the current NBA that play real defense in the regular season, one of which is the Warriors. The rest of the teams are tanking or are just flat out awful. He was heavily focused on these last 2 rounds, and rightfully so. They took away his shot, so it was up to him to adjust his game. Unfortunately he's so reliant on his shot, he didn't really adjust.

What he should have done, is try to be a real playmaking point guard and rack up 10+ assists a game.

I don't think the Thunder did that good of a job against him in WCF. He had a pretty good series that I think will be underrated in the future because of the way his season ended in the finals. 28/6/6/2 stl. on 61% TS with still a largely positive AST/TOV ratio. He hardly struggled against OKC.

Cavs did a hell of a job against him, though. That much is true.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#990 » by mikejames23 » Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:45 pm

Senior wrote:
Also, picc mentioned this earlier but I was just as baffled at Curry's careless turnovers. Like...what? I don't even have the words to describe my reaction to those TOs. You can do flashy behind the back stuff in pre-season, not in Game 7 of the Finals. Just totally unnecessary or lazy passes. He did this in the RS too and got away with it, and this decision making can't be attributed to the injury.



Yeah, I don't get this either. The last few games, his pass attempts were a bit ridiculous to be honest, which caused me to reevaluate his value as a playmaker this year. Injury is one thing, but his decision making is questionable at times. Klay Thompson called him out indirectly after Game 6 on the passing, and there was some Steve Kerr talk earlier in the game where he talked about MOVING the ball, instead of settling for quicker shots. This is on Steph Curry to me, I can't point to anyone else.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#991 » by RSCD3_ » Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:48 pm

Quotatious wrote:
Sark wrote:His efficiency dip had more to do with seeing actual defenses, which he didn't see in the regular season. There are about 5 teams in the current NBA that play real defense in the regular season, one of which is the Warriors. The rest of the teams are tanking or are just flat out awful. He was heavily focused on these last 2 rounds, and rightfully so. They took away his shot, so it was up to him to adjust his game. Unfortunately he's so reliant on his shot, he didn't really adjust.

What he should have done, is try to be a real playmaking point guard and rack up 10+ assists a game.

I don't think the Thunder did that good of a job against him in WCF. He had a pretty good series that I think will be underrated in the future because of the way his season ended in the finals. 28/6/6/2 stl. on 61% TS with still a largely positive AST/TOV ratio. He hardly struggled against OKC.

Cavs did a hell of a job against him, though. That much is true.



In my opinion the cavs made his motion a lot more congested but they had more defensive breakdowns than golden state and curry missed a lot of shots we would have made in the RS

Cleveland dialed up their intensity but I think them going at him all the time on offense night have taken more out of him than the defense if that makes any sense. Especially when you look at the later games when they kept having his guy screen on him while he had to deal with being bumped and swarmed off ball.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#992 » by Sark » Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:54 pm

Quotatious wrote:
Sark wrote:His efficiency dip had more to do with seeing actual defenses, which he didn't see in the regular season. There are about 5 teams in the current NBA that play real defense in the regular season, one of which is the Warriors. The rest of the teams are tanking or are just flat out awful. He was heavily focused on these last 2 rounds, and rightfully so. They took away his shot, so it was up to him to adjust his game. Unfortunately he's so reliant on his shot, he didn't really adjust.

What he should have done, is try to be a real playmaking point guard and rack up 10+ assists a game.

I don't think the Thunder did that good of a job against him in WCF. He had a pretty good series that I think will be underrated in the future because of the way his season ended in the finals. 28/6/6/2 stl. on 61% TS with still a largely positive AST/TOV ratio. He hardly struggled against OKC.

Cavs did a hell of a job against him, though. That much is true.



In the first 6 games he only had 1 where he shot over 50% from the field. His efficiency for the series is largely a product of game 7 and free throws. Now I know fg percentage is not a great indicator of how well a player is doing, but for a guy that was an efficiency freak during the regular season that's a pretty sizeable streak of shooting poorly from the field.

I bet he didn't have more than 3 games in a row all year where he shot poorly from the field like that.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#993 » by JordansBulls » Tue Jun 21, 2016 3:06 am

Golden State had soo much luck in the regular season. Remember against OKC Iggy gets fouled by Durant with 1 second left and then he hits 2 free throws on the road. Well in game 7 with 7:30 left in the 4th he misses two free throws. Bet you he wished hit those in the game 7 and missed those in OKC. Curry hits the 30 footer to win the game but couldn't sh** in the 4th in game 7. He would trade making that shot as well. And that is just one game in particular.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#994 » by JordansBulls » Tue Jun 21, 2016 3:14 am

One thing this showed is nearly all the greats lost series with HCA. So Curry losing with it is the norm. I mean Lebron has lost 3 series with it, Durant twice, Wade twice, CP3 once, Duncan 7 times, KG twice, Dirk twice, Rose once to name some of the guys in the league now.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#995 » by JordansBulls » Tue Jun 21, 2016 4:03 am

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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#996 » by picc » Tue Jun 21, 2016 4:32 am

re: Curry's defense

As harsh as i've been on Curry for his playoffs, I feel this is the one place its appropriate to defend him.

The Cavs gameplan was to switch any of the primary offensive players on Steph, yes, because he is the weakest defender in the lineup, but moreso to get him in foul trouble. They were deliberately trying to remove him from the game, even more than to score on him. It worked, due to some typically careless play by Steph, but what exactly happened on these switches?

I don't know the stats for Lebron's fg% when matched up with Curry on a switch, but I doubt it'd be what you expect. From my observation, he defended James as well as a person his size physically could. Curry was consistently staying in front of Lebron, only really getting abused when James was able to get low post position and go straight up. If you are judging his defense by how well he did being switched onto Lebron "Hulk" James, there's something fundamentally wrong.

Furthermore, you can point to Kyrie's success against him in isolation, but what I saw in the finals was Kyrie doing to Steph what he did to nearly everyone during the playoffs. He was smoking Klay Thompson and Livingston in isolation as well. The shots Irving was hitting over Steph he would have hit over anyone under 6'7. That last dagger 3 in game 7 was a terrible shot, that he would have gotten off against any point guard with possible exception of John Wall.

What I'm seeing is Curry being demolished for his defense against A) A 6'9 SF built like Karl Malone, and B) A career isolation scorer who was automatic finishing at the rim and shooting over anyone smaller than a 3. That doesnt make any sense at all to me. Steph's defense was the one thing he did at his standard levels this series. They sought him out on switches, but its not his fault the Cavs desperately wanted to get him out of the game - what's he supposed to do, not play?

Really interested to see James FG% on switches vs Curry. Steph was good in the passing lanes and got punished by refs on some brutal foul calls all series, but by and large he was spectacular staying in front of his man and putting a hand up. If the guy hits, which Cleveland did, what else are you supposed to do but shake his hand?

re: Curry's offense

Steph's offense, otoh, I feel was exposed in more than one way.

For one, I think its fair to attribute more of GS's offensive efficacy, and thus Steph's, to Draymond Green than we prior believed. The trap --> slip pass --> made play that made them such a juggernaut over the past couple years is so successful obviously because Steph demands the attention - but it wouldn't have the same potency if Green wasn't so outstandingly versatile a receiver. He can handle, pass, and shoot like a guard, with SF like mobility and quickness. So I think its fair to say he has a larger role on offense than we thought possible, given who the initial pass is coming from. I don't have the knowledge to say exactly how much, but its obvious the synergy between Steph's gravity and Green's skillset is far, far greater than the sum of their parts. Which is part of the reason I now firmly believe Green is just as valuable to the team as Steph. But thats for another thread.

Second, one underrated thing CLE did with their defense was spread the trap. Steph wasn't able to make the same passes he had all season because (and I have no idea the hell how) Cleveland managed to clog the passing lanes that nobody else has been able to. Even with Kevin Love. The passing angles available were extremely slim, and a passing savant like CP3 or Nash could have made them, but Steph clearly showed he's nowhere near their levels as fundamental passing guards. Teams are going to watch a lot of tape on this series when they determine HOW to trap GS in the upcoming future.

Third, Steph's struggles illustrated a minor aspect of why I believe its been so rare for point guards to lead championship teams. His lack of physicality is a problem when it comes to sophisticated defenses trying to stop him from scoring. When a player relies on screens, the opposing team is put in an easier position to take them out of the play via hedging or trapping. That's no problem when your teammates are hitting and you can make an efficient pass out of the trap. But neither of those was true for Steph in the finals. Kyrie demolished - DEMOLISHED - the PG matchup halfway because he doesn't require a screen a operate at peak proficiency, and may even prefer not to get one. That kind of ball won't necessarily get you the most wins through an 82 game season, but all it takes is a few hot games to win a best of 7 playoff series. Everytime people say iso ball is dead, it wins another championship. Players who are comfortable scoring independent of the rest of the team don't sit well with many posters, but coincidentally have been the cornerstones for the most title teams.

Steph never looked comfortable with his own game out there, and never gained the confidence Kyrie did by dominating his individual matchups. This contributed to Steph letting himself be taken out of games, and instead letting far, far less talented teammates tackle the shotclock-inspired isolations that he should have been running his ass to the ball for. They needed Steph to shoot more than he did, be more aggressive than he was, but he wouldn't allow himself to, partly because he's not a natural leader, and partly because he lost confidence along the way. I've heard the "he was just trusting his teammates" rationale, which I reject because he was taking every hero shot during the regular season, and because there is no circumstance under which Festus Ezeli, Andre Iguodala, or Harrison Barnes isolating to shoot is a preferable option to Stephen Curry isolating to shoot. He just unselfish'd his way to the most legendary choke in NBA history, and its hard to continue to take seriously the criticisms of this style of play when the players who utilize it are home polishing their many rings.

His decision-making has been talked about ad naseum, but its worth minorly noting that he is so unable to control his careless habits that he'll continue them even after visually admonishing himself. Its one thing to take a bad shot - you may be a bad shot maker who can justify the attempt even if you miss. I can excuse almost any shot Curry takes. But to totally blow so many fundamentally simple basketball actions like he does, ie. non-duress passing or dribbling turnovers, communicates to me that he's not taking the game (in a universal sense) as seriously as his predecessors, or even many of his contemporaries. That's a major flag if I'm deciding how much trust to place in my teams best player and leader.

re: Curry's intangibles

Steph is not a leader. When he's feeling cocky he'll take a high volume of absurdly difficult shots and may even make them, but he has little to no rallying effect on his teammates and even less grasp of what the team needs from him at any given moment. His one and only response to any adverse situation is to chuck a three pointer. He displays none of the strategic thinking many of the other great players did, none of the floor generalship that many other great players (and especially great point guards) did, and very little understanding of what his team needs any given moment, if its not a three pointer. He's an extremely immature player whose lack of alpha characteristics and basketball IQ are drastically overshadowed by his unprecedented shotmaking ability....except when they aren't. Which over the past few seasons, has just happened to be on the biggest stages.

He has a tendency to allow himself to be taken entirely out of a basketball game in a way I've rarely seen from a superstar caliber player, never seen from a leader, and definitely never seen from a superstar caliber leader. If he makes a couple attempts to get the ball and is denied by the defense, he'll simply give up and wait by the sideline for something to happen, no matter what the stakes of the play or game are. No verbal quarterbacking, no pointing to mismatches, none of the things the great guards I've watched in my lifetime do on the rare occasion they simply cannot get the ball. If the clock is running down, he'll make no attempt to get it, content to let whatever happens happen. Which isn't a mortal sin for an allstar level player.

For a unanimous, 2-time MVP point guard being compared to all-time greats and chasing a historic record-setting season, its completely unacceptable. And those are the standards we're rightly judging him by. This isn't Ricky Rubio blowing a playoff run. When we criticize Steph, we're doing so with the greatest NBA players of all time in mind. That's who he's built against when he's winning, so that's who he'll be built against when he loses. Simply a "fair" statline isn't good enough for Stephen Curry. Not with the year we've had.

In a lot of ways he simply let this postseason pass him by, and thus let the chance to make history pass him by. Robotically pointing to his true shooting % in an attempt to rationalize his play just misses the big picture by so much. It genuinely and sincerely makes me sad that this is what basketball gets reduced to.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#997 » by picc » Tue Jun 21, 2016 4:33 am

On a personal level, part of my disappointment is the feeling that I've been lied to all season. I honestly believed the guy had solved offensive basketball earlier in the year, in large part due to his skills, but also to the incredible amount of confidence he played with. He seemed like he was just having fun and toying with even more intense defenses than I saw him face in the finals, but that confidence evaporated slowly but steadily through the season. It re-emerged in that first game against Houston before the ankle injury, and then reappeared against Portland. But it just wasn't there for much of the last two rounds, and it affected every part of what I described above, becoming part of a now two-year trend of his efficacy being unsustainable in deeper playoff rounds against better teams, by way of increased physicality and a possibly correlated loss of confidence and intensity.

He lacks a midrange game, has no real desire to drive to the rim, and relies on screens that can take him out of scoring position depending on the defense's disposition. Otoh, he's the best shooter (at the least, 3 point shooter) of all time and any shot attempt has a chance to go in. But so far, they've only done so on a transcendent level in regular season play. His team is far better than I previously thought, and his two-man game partner has proven himself one of the most versatile offensive AND defensive players in the league, and arguably a more valuable commodity to the teams success than Steph himself.

This isn't the place to compare players, but my question when discussing "peaks" is, what is your goal for an NBA calendar year? To win as many games as possible during the 82-game season, or to win a championship? If your goal is the former, having an ensemble of incredible defensive players, shooters, and one of the most versatile smallball centers of all time will be the perfect storm for maximizing a player with unlimited shooting range. It will also be the perfect storm for minimizing his weaknesses. But without seeing other players in a situation like that, how am I to know how they'd look in similar situations? Very rarely has a team been as complete offensively and defensively as Golden State.

If your goal is to win a championship, and I don't know why it wouldn't be, i'm struggling for reasons why playoff performance wouldn't take massive precedent over regular season performance given what just unfolded, and what we know from prior seasons. Its even more difficult for me to come up with reasons there haven't been around 25 other players that would give you just as good a shot at a title as Steph would, and many better. Many if not all of them larger, more physically imposing, more aggressive players tougher to take out of their own individual games.

It's very likely Chris Paul wouldn't have won 73 games with this Warriors team, but there's no question in my mind they still have homecourt throughout the playoffs and win the championship with him. And Paul is likely overkill. So why should I care about Curry's regular season PER? Or his three point record? I certainly won't when remembering who proved the best when it mattered. I won't care when I remember all the possessions he allowed the most important postseason of his career to unfold without him - or just threw them away. If the goal of an NBA season is to win the NBA title, what we learn on the way to that goal is logically far more important than what we learn in December. And what I've learned is that as great as Curry is, there are still a large number of players I'd trust to lead my team into the playoffs over him. That's it for me on this guy. Sorry for the text wall.
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#998 » by NO-KG-AI » Tue Jun 21, 2016 5:26 am

Yea, at this point there is no doubting that Curry is a great player regular or post season, but he just had a GOAT-like regular season, but we've seen no indication that he can be GOAT like over the course of the playoffs.

I don't understand all of the defense for Curry's play in the post season at all. If your star is that inconsistent your team has to be basically good enough to beat elite teams without him if you want to win 4 out 7.


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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#999 » by MyUniBroDavis » Tue Jun 21, 2016 5:31 am

I don't think anyone is denying curry had a horrible series. He did have a horrible series, the only thing is if he was 100% or not. I don't think he was, others think he was. His decision making was horrible, and injuries aren't a complete excuse, but I don't think he basically has a worse year than last year because of this.

I'll say that while I still think steph is better, playoffs means lebron arguably should with the POY ballot.

Next year will be interesting
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Re: The Stephen Curry Thread (2015-16 Pt. 2) 

Post#1000 » by RebelWithACause » Tue Jun 21, 2016 8:38 am

On Curry:

I am one of those that still believe Curry was seriously hampered.

Really disappointed though, those turnovers were just incredibly bad and have nothing to do with anything.

Curious to see how he bounces back and if he really was that hampered by those injuries or the bad play was actually caused by the way he was defended.

Next season will be ultimately exciting for that exact reason. Was Curry's offensive GOATness due to defenses that haven't figured him out during the RS or was it the injuries that slowed him in the PS.

Until then I am going to restrain myself evaluating this season of Curry in detail.

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