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Rookie of the Year: The Marco Belinelli Thread

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Re: Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#161 » by spaceballer » Fri Jun 24, 2016 4:55 pm

MountBiyombo wrote:
Vanderbilt_Grad wrote:
yosemiteben wrote:Is that true? I thought you used average of current plus extension, which is right around $6M. Seems like it would have gone through.

The Hornets are technically over the cap until they start renouncing folks due to all the cap holds. Until his salary actually goes up Lamb is technically a poison pill contract (#90 on the CBA FAQ). This mean that Charlotte would have treated Lamb's salary as roughly $3M in terms of what they sent out, but the Kings would have treated it as the average. The deal would still work from their side, but Charlotte wouldn't have opened enough space to take Beli back. After Lamb's salary officially goes up he's not a poison pill and the salaries match well for a trade.

I also take into account that the pre-draft rumors were Lamb + 22 for space. This was the next best thing for the Hornets, and likely means that Lin is gone.


Lin has already said that he wants to start. There is no realistic reason to expect him back.


He said it was one of the factors, but not the only one. He also listed other items like possibility to win and humble teammates.

Using the #22 pick to obtain a 6.3M contract for a 30yr old combo guard/sixth man to back up Batum at SG and Kemba at PG likely means both C.Lee and J.Lin are gone.

With MKG returning and shifting Batum's minutes to SG, it meant one of C.Lee or JLin would have been gone anyway due to lack of minutes/money. Now, with the Belinelli $6.3M contract, it means both of them are gone.

I guess Cho couldn't find any good offers for #22 + Hawes/Lamb (too expensive), so decided to use the pick on Belinelli. The philosophy of having locked in, defined costs contracts in a exploding cap seems to be the same tack taken with both the early Lamb extension and picking up Belinelli.

Instead of having to compete in the summer's free agent market, where C.Lee is expecting $11M-14M and Steve Kyler says JLin is worth at least $12M, Cho decided to stay with the the cheaper $6.5M Lamb and pick up the $6.3M Belinelli.

His first choice of moving Lamb/Hawes with the #22 pick to create cap space didn't pan out (too expensive, whatever that means), so it seems he opted to change tack and replace Lee and Lin with the cheaper tandem of Lamb and Belinelli for next season.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#162 » by rallydurham » Fri Jun 24, 2016 5:16 pm

I'm just pissed off that we decided to take on MORE salary with the cap going up next year. We would have space to add another free agent. We should contend for a 4-8 seed again this year and it would have been nice to sell ourselves as a free agent Destination once we knew what we were missing.

Our front office is just (Please Use More Appropriate Word). Now I want us to tank and not resign marvin. Let frank get the minutes and we can miss playotfs. Spend all offseason trying to dump hawes, belinelli, and lamb and try to build a contender
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#163 » by yosemiteben » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:32 pm

If there is one thing we can be sure of, it's that our FO is well aware of our cap situation this summer. There is no way they went from trying to free up space to saying "F it, let's get Belinelli" without a specific plan in place.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#164 » by Walt Cronkite » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:34 pm

I don't mind picking up Belinelli as a player, my shock yesterday was that there were reports of us using the pick to dump a contract (which seems to not be the case unless something happens when all is official) and it felt like minimal return on the pick based on the 20 for Young trade. However, comparing contracts of Belinelli and Young, today the value seems closer.

It's been said before that Cliff has more of a role in free agency because he scouts guys around the league but doesn't have time to watch draft prospects. With us attempting to sign Belinelli before, I assume this is a guy the front office and coaching staffs all see as working out in the team structure. In fact, I think he gels pretty well as the utility guy off of the bench. He protects the ball, can create from the secondary p&r and I'm optimistic his shot will return to him with our ball movement. In many ways, I think he could fill the role Jeremy Lin was thrust into more naturally (Lin fans, he shouldn't be as capable of driving and getting fouled).

So, maybe he doesn't have the upside of Lin, but I don't think there will be a tremendous drop off in that role. Further, if we consider MKG to be improving on what Lee's impact was, we've more or less broken even?
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#165 » by driveandkick » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:36 pm

I see no way Belinelli plays as well for us this year as Lin did last year. Lin was one of the best 6th men in the league, imo
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#166 » by Walt Cronkite » Fri Jun 24, 2016 6:51 pm

driveandkick wrote:I see no way Belinelli plays as well for us this year as Lin did last year. Lin was one of the best 6th men in the league, imo


Lin certainly had many great moments this season, but when the team was at full strength, there were lots of complaints from the guys that have watched a lot more of his games or highlights of than I have that were upset he was playing off the ball/sitting in the corner to catch and shoot. That should be much more natural to Belinelli. I don't expect we can have a deficit and that we can give the ball to Belinelli and see if he can work some magic the same way Lin was sometimes capable of, but I think the role he will be asked to replace when the team is healthy will be easier to slot him into than it was for Lin. Belinelli's seasons with the Spurs, at least from an advanced statistics perspective, look pretty similar to what Lin produced last season. Lin used the ball a bit more and had tos and assists more frequently and shot a little worse. My post wasn't about Lin vs Belinelli as talents, only expected roles they fill. If you get Belinelli to provide close to what Lin did for the season (Lin's outliers excluded), but for potentially half of the salary, that's not so bad.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#167 » by BobsBuddy » Fri Jun 24, 2016 7:34 pm

:nod: :meditate: Don't worry....Marco will be able to replace the production lost by losing Lee to free agency. As for the money,it really doesn't matter as this is only the first move in retooling our roster with Vets. Cho knows exactly what he is doing..I suspect he will pull the trigger on a couple of more FA deals July 7th. Hawes and Lamb probably will be fillers. I believe EVERYBODY is subject to trade. This draft would not help us after pick#10..That's why we got out and are concentrating on 2nd tier NBA vets with expiring contracts.Marco would be a perfect backup for Nic or Mkg. If Batum wants Max$ we may have to pass in order to put a complete team together. Don't be suprised if Nic ends up a Laker .
Anyway Marco is good insurance to have on this team.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#168 » by amcoolio » Fri Jun 24, 2016 7:40 pm

I understand why Cho did it but why did he have to do it early, when he could have waited and saw that Furkan Korkmaz, who is basically a younger cheaper Bellineli RIGHT NOW and still has upside, was still on the board. He has to answer for this. Why do the deal early. Someone from our **** media has to grill him on that, because we need an answer.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#169 » by BlackOutBuzz » Fri Jun 24, 2016 7:43 pm

[tweet]https://twitter.com/PeteGuelli/status/746412860251594752[/tweet]

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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#170 » by amcoolio » Fri Jun 24, 2016 7:45 pm

They can fluff it up all they want but this move ain't gonna get any better. Ive seen this song and dance many times before, like with the Dampier trade. They've sold us on hype for way too long. There's nothing else coming, and this was a treadmill move.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#171 » by euphorbus » Fri Jun 24, 2016 9:29 pm

All but two Hornets last season, Hairston and Harrison, had a better TS% than Marco Belinelli. Every single Hornet had a better RB%. Seven Hornets had a better AST%, and two more were very close. Every single Hornet had a better Defensive Box Plus/Minus, which was -2.9.

I realize this was a tough season for the Kings and for Belinelli, but this is not a treadmill move, it takes the team backwards.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#172 » by ChokeFasncists » Fri Jun 24, 2016 9:30 pm

Logical trajectory and possible future forecast for Beli:

3pt%:
43
37
30
22

:lol: (j/k)
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#173 » by PG13 » Sat Jun 25, 2016 1:48 am

All the podcasts I listened to plus most of the blogs I read considered this a laughable trade (on Hornets' part) if not the most laughable.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#174 » by Marino » Sat Jun 25, 2016 1:51 am

PG13 wrote:All the podcasts I listened to plus most of the blogs I read considered this a laughable trade (on Hornets' part) if not the most laughable.

Are these the same bloggers that pretty much made a mockery of their mock drafts?


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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#175 » by catch20two » Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:07 am

Bad trade. A guy coming off that type of bad production would make teams hesitant to trade a 2nd rounder for him. A guy coming off that type of bad production is the type of guy teams dump for anything just to get his contract off the books.

And to think we couldn't get a 1st rounder for Hendo in previous years. Ha!
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#176 » by fatlever » Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:25 am

PG13 wrote:All the podcasts I listened to plus most of the blogs I read considered this a laughable trade (on Hornets' part) if not the most laughable.


Its an expected reaction. Its hard to support the move as it stands. It only becomes passable if follow-up moves are a success, big picture stuff.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#177 » by SpearNMgicHelmt » Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:44 am

We could take Cousins off their hands. :-)
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#178 » by chellis » Sat Jun 25, 2016 2:54 am

Honestly, I've moved past this trade at this point. I've come to accept Cho and the FO are flat out incompetent when it comes to the draft. Is this trade good? No. But I'm sure they would have found a way to screw up the pick.

What I find more frustrating is Cho doing his pressed mid-second round. Stick with it to the end. See if you can swing a deal to get a second rounder. There was still solid talent left on the board (McCaw, Bentil, Jackson,etc). You are paid to be the GM for the Charlotte Hornets. Part of it is to oversee the draft. Make the press wait. I'm sure they don't care. They should expect it.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#179 » by JGib23 » Sat Jun 25, 2016 3:39 am

BlackOutBuzz wrote:[tweet]https://twitter.com/PeteGuelli/status/746412860251594752[/tweet]

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That's me going back and forth with Pete... I'm going to chill until the other shoe drops.. Im confident that there is a secondary deal that they can't discuss yet.
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Re: Hornets Trade #22 for Marco Belinelli 

Post#180 » by Mystical Apples » Sat Jun 25, 2016 4:07 am

Cho traded away his 1st, didn't acquire a 2nd, and made 0 moves to sign a legit UDFA for that LOL looking SL team. Oh, and 8 roster spots open and a D-League team coming on line.

So I think it's pretty clear he has a deal(s) in place with another team(s) which will include at minimum a rotation veteran and at least 1-2 developmental players.
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