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Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy

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Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#1 » by Cosmic_Backlash » Wed Jun 29, 2016 3:08 am

I think most people see the Ibaka trade as a loss. We lose our first rebuilding piece and a draft pick for a player that might be past his peak. In addition to that we run the risk of Ibaka leaving next summer and we come away from this with a pretty big net loss.

The more I think about it though, the more I like this trade and here's why

The Payton / Oladipo Experiment Failed

The last 2 years have been a pretty large failure for these two. Neither are elite shooters, both ball dominant, and neither could figure out how to exist with the other. There was no long term solution for these 2 playing together so Hennigan pulled the trigger and ended the marriage early.

Our backcourt was one of the worse in the league statistically. We had a -2.3 EFF differential here, while our frontcourt actually had a +0.4 EFF differential. (I know no stat is perfect, but I think this tells a directional story). Seems pretty clear change had to happen.

The Frye Effect and Serge

As much as everyone hated Channing Frye for his lack of defense, all advanced metrics point to him being the most valuable Magic player on the court this year. He had the best +/- stats and adjusted +/- stats while he was with Orlando. I don't think it was a coincidence when he brought an extremely valuable 3PT shoot trait to the Magic. Orlando's record fell apart with the departure of Frye as well.

With Serge coming in he brings that trait back, but also with that his unicorn skill set of being an elite interior defender. His ability to open the floor is going to open up the offensive end and he's going to elevate the entire team on the defensive end.

5 Man Unit Performance
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http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/paytoel01/lineups/2016/#lineups-5-man::none

Last year the 5 man lineup of Elf, Fournier, Harris, Frye, Vuc had a whopping +7 PPG differential per 100 possessions. It also was Elf's most played 5 man unit with over 330 total minutes, indicating this was not a fluke. Elf's next 4 most played 5 man units were with Oladipo. Every single one of them was at least -4.6 PPG differential or more. None of these units contained Frye.

These reasons lead me to believe that Elf has some serious positive and negative synergies built into his game with other players.

Rob's Big Bet

Taking into consideration everything above I think this is Rob's make or break summer as an ORL GM. Instead of dumping Elf because of his deficiencies with some players he's going all in on the Elf. He dumped his worst pairing in the backcourt and went all in replacing Frye with Ibaka, a PF who brings a rare and unique skillset who in theory should compliment Elf.

I think overall the trade is lateral in terms of talent, negative in terms of value, but could bring so much team synergy it was a risk he had to take. I don't think this is the summer deal anyone really thought of or wanted, but it might be what's best for the team in the end.
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#2 » by SOUL » Wed Jun 29, 2016 5:09 am

Great post.
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#3 » by drsd » Wed Jun 29, 2016 6:07 am

In the modern NBA, the PF has developed into a key position. As Orlando's highest paid player, Ibaka will be motivated to be Orlando's best player. Here's hoping that comes to fruition.
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#4 » by bigdogdylan5 » Wed Jun 29, 2016 7:10 am

Too many facts must continue to hate! Must stay strong!
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#5 » by Hilltop » Wed Jun 29, 2016 1:47 pm

Love the analysis!
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#6 » by ChosenSavior » Wed Jun 29, 2016 2:16 pm

Beautiful analysis OP. Broken down simple enough for casuals to understand and yet had deep meaning with the team synergy aspect that was looked over when this trade initially happened (I was victim to this when the trade immediately happened).
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#7 » by seeingstars » Wed Jun 29, 2016 2:18 pm

Ive always liked Elf more than Oladipo, glad we chose to keep the former
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#8 » by mhectorgato » Wed Jun 29, 2016 2:24 pm

Stat-a-holic legacy continues!

Nice analysis.
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#9 » by OrlandO » Wed Jun 29, 2016 2:56 pm

Good post. With the concerns of Elf's shot, it is good to see he might play better with fournier.
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#10 » by tf407 » Wed Jun 29, 2016 2:59 pm

Great analysis, thank you.

Only thing I don't agree with is the thought of rob loving payton.

I don't think he's necessarily going "all in" on elfrid payton. Oladipo just had much more trade value and it landed us serge. You're right, they didn't play well together and trading payton wouldn't have netted us squat so getting rid of oladipo landed us a big time defensive presence in the low post.

There's no indication that we're not going to try to get conley in free agency or trade for a pg at some point down the line to replace elfrid. I think getting serge outweighed who he believed in most between oladipo or payton
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#11 » by drsd » Wed Jun 29, 2016 3:29 pm

Cosmic_Backlash wrote:Last year the 5 man lineup of Elf, Fournier, Harris, Frye, Vuc had a whopping +7 PPG differential per 100 possessions. It also was Elf's most played 5 man unit with over 330 total minutes, indicating this was not a fluke. Elf's next 4 most played 5 man units were with Oladipo. Every single one of them was at least -4.6 PPG differential or more. None of these units contained Frye.


We can all agree that Ibaka is unarguably a better rim defender than Frye, and is probably a better team defender within Orlando's concept. He is aa least as good a scorer. And as he will be perfecting his game all season, Ibaka should be a 36% three-ball shooter, or better.

But what I see in that starting five is Harris. My question: is Gordon a better SF than Harris? If yes, coupled to the relative that Payton, Fournier, and Vučević should individually improve, the Magic could be much, much, much better than the +7 PPG differential per 100 possessions you note.

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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#12 » by Hilltop » Wed Jun 29, 2016 4:03 pm

tf407 wrote:I don't think he's necessarily going "all in" on elfrid payton. Oladipo just had much more trade value and it landed us serge. You're right, they didn't play well together and trading payton wouldn't have netted us squat so getting rid of oladipo landed us a big time defensive presence in the low post.

There's no indication that we're not going to try to get conley in free agency or trade for a pg at some point down the line to replace elfrid. I think getting serge outweighed who he believed in most between oladipo or payton

Yeah, I don't think this secures Payton's spot as the starting PG either.

We gave up Oladipo and a lottery pick. That's a steep price to pay to sample Serge Ibaka for a year. I'm inclined to believe that Rob would want to protect his investment and it would likely take more than the possibility of achieving synergy with EP to get Ibaka to ink a long-term deal next summer.

With the Magic looking to develop Gordon and bring back Fournier, Conley seems to be the most logical move for us. He supposedly favours Dallas and San Antonio but we'll see.
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#13 » by mhectorgato » Wed Jun 29, 2016 7:52 pm

tf407 wrote:Great analysis, thank you.

Only thing I don't agree with is the thought of rob loving payton.

I don't think he's necessarily going "all in" on elfrid payton. Oladipo just had much more trade value and it landed us serge. You're right, they didn't play well together and trading payton wouldn't have netted us squat so getting rid of oladipo landed us a big time defensive presence in the low post.

There's no indication that we're not going to try to get conley in free agency or trade for a pg at some point down the line to replace elfrid. I think getting serge outweighed who he believed in most between oladipo or payton


What about the mumblings that Skiles wanted to trade EP and Henny ixnaying it (thus speeding up of the inevitable, given Skiles' history)?
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#14 » by Blue_and_Whte » Wed Jun 29, 2016 8:11 pm

Once more.... Only if he doesn't re-sign here
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#15 » by arsenal6106 » Wed Jun 29, 2016 8:26 pm

Good stuff man!
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#16 » by Nemesis21 » Wed Jun 29, 2016 9:34 pm

Great post! Thanks for sharing!
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Re: Serge Ibaka & ORL Team Synergy 

Post#17 » by Bensational » Wed Jun 29, 2016 11:14 pm

How's that Vuc/Gordon/Hezonja/Oladipo/Payton lineup?! +25 points!

Great analysis. That will definitely be an interesting lineup to watch.

It'll also be interesting to see the numbers on a lineup of Ibaka/Gordon/Hezonja/Fournier/Payton once the season gets under way.

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