Gay, McLemore, Koufos Available...Trade for Tobias and Baynes?

[coordinator0]

Yeah, Memphis got better after they traded Rudy and so did Toronto. Sometimes it's a coincidence but I don't think so in this case. I would much rather have Harris going forward. Better player, better contract, as well as younger and still improving.

[dVs33]

Not seeing any positives in trading tobias for gay. Just doesn't fit with what SVG is doing. Harris is far more versatile than gay because he's better at playing both forward spots.
I really like our forward rotation now and have no interest in messing with it. Harris and Morris are so versatile, Ellenson and leuer give us good size and shooting, Stanley is a hungry beast and bullock showed flashes of being a solid 3 and d guy. It's so well rounded.

[ImHeisenberg]

Nah. None of those Kings players have ever proven to be a winning player.

[Manocad]

Hell to the fawk no

[Alexander]

I'd consider it. You're not moving any of my top 4 assets (Drummond, Jackson, KCP, Johnson). Morris' and Harris' values are strange; they're better than the sum of their parts, but they both make each other expendable. I'm not sure who is more valuable to the team, so I always resort to age when ranking them.
I was so high on McLemore coming out of the draft that he was #2 on my draft board. /ducks He's been a disappointment, but he hasn't had a stable organization.
I consider Baynes to be nothing more than a trading chip at this point. We already have his replacement and SVG seems to consider Detroit a temporary spot for him.

Jackson/Smith
KCP/McLemore
Gay/Johnson
Morris/Leuer/Ellenson
Drummond/Boban or Koufos

It doesn't really change much! Koufos instead of Baynes? McLemore over Bullock/Hillard? Morris full-time PF instead of near full-time SF (as it appears this season brings). Is Gay that much better than Harris, if at all?
I'd consider it, but it is probably just a lateral move with potential for worse. There'd be a lot of pressure on McLemore to outweigh the disruption in chemistry and continuity.

[Eoghan]

Koufos is pretty terrible, I wouldn't touch him with a ten foot pole. McLemore is a reclamation project and I'd be all in if he could be had for cheap. The Kings are awful at developing players. Gay is a basketball blockhead but he does have dynamic scoring ability and tempting to add.

I say no to trading Harris for them.

[Pugz]

bmack isnt worth squat. this trade is terrible for us. let our core grow together.

[epheisey]

I guess I'm in the minority here. I don't like Harris. While he might be decent in the starting lineup right now, within the next year and a half, I see him becoming the weakest link in the starting 5 once Stanley takes over at the 3. Harris is extremely weak defensively as a 4 and while his offense is solid, it's not enough to carry the offense. We need a second player who can carry the team when Reggie isn't on his game, or is getting shut down (Cavs series), and I don't see Harris being the answer.

Your over thinking it. If harris, whos true position is sf anyway, is struggling at starting pf, you simply move him to the bench as the 6th 7th man and off the bench he can play sf or play pf due to my belief that harris can/should be able to do his thing against other teams fowards that come off the bench. Dont trade him though. He had his 1st playoff experience after getting traded at the deadline. Just like how Reggie got a full year under his belt in detroit this past season, i say we give harris the same patience. Im still mad about his postseason play against Cleveland but im looking at the bigger picture.

As far as i see it right now, i feel as though we're stacked, to a certain degree. We have small ball lineups, big lineups, defensive lineups. Got rid of some weak links from last year (meeks, blake, tolliver) and replaced them with good players for our system. They just have to gell and develop chemistry but i dont think we should have matchup problems from any team this season based on size. I think starting ellenson with drummond is the way to go right now. Ellensons iq is great and with his skill set + consistency we can possibly see an improved starting lineup. Plus adding harris to the bench automatically makes our bench that much more stronger.

The problem is our bench is already a huge strength at SF. There's only so many minutes to be played. And banking on Ellenson is a real gamble. If he even becomes a contributor off the bench, that would be considered a success. Gay might not be the answer, but we need stronger starters, not a more balanced team from top to bottom. One of Morris, Harris, and Stanley will have to go if they're all expected to play SF, and I'd move Harris first. Gay seems like a decent option because he only has one year left before a PO. That'd let him keep the position warm for Stanley for a season, and then give us some options to go after a PF next year. Morris or Leuer could hold down the PF spot for a year, and then when we're actually ready to start contending we'd be better prepared.

[coordinator0]

The problem is our bench is already a huge strength at SF. There's only so many minutes to be played. And banking on Ellenson is a real gamble. If he even becomes a contributor off the bench, that would be considered a success. Gay might not be the answer, but we need stronger starters, not a more balanced team from top to bottom. One of Morris, Harris, and Stanley will have to go if they're all expected to play SF, and I'd move Harris first. Gay seems like a decent option because he only has one year left before a PO. That'd let him keep the position warm for Stanley for a season, and then give us some options to go after a PF next year. Morris or Leuer could hold down the PF spot for a year, and then when we're actually ready to start contending we'd be better prepared.

It doesn't really though. Even if you just do a deal of Harris for Gay the Pistons would still have around $91 million in contracts and the cap holds for Caldwell-Pope's and a rough estimate of Detroit's 2017 first round pick(while disregarding the other cap holds) on the books next season even if Rudy opted out. With a projected $102 million cap that leaves about $11 million, which isn't even close to getting a quality power forward in free agency with the new salaries being handed out (or trade because guys under the old cap contracts are that much more valuable).

The premise of just dumping Harris for Gay with no assets coming back is laughable anyways though. Nobody wants to be on Orlando's recent end of the spectrum in trades. And no, McLemore and Koufos don't count as assets. Kosta might in the right situation but that's not Detroit. Tobias is much more valuable given his contract, age, and really nice numbers/production in Detroit the last third of the season. Every team that has gotten rid of Rudy has been better off for it. He's awful, and neither Van Gundy or Gores would make a move to set the team back like that anyways. Winning is the mantra.

And it's not like Johnson, Harris, and Morris are all pure small forwards. The latter two are completely interchangeable between the three and the four, and it works. That's the way to go in the NBA these days unless you have a couple of starting bigs that can both get out and switch on the perimeter (disregarding any ability to defend at the rim, which is vital as well). Stanley will get minutes at the two and the three even if he's starting at small forward. His versatility will be utilized against different matchups. It's not like it was even just a few years ago where guys were locked into one position and tweeners were frowned upon.

If you don't like Harris as a player that's one thing, but even in that case dumping him outright doesn't make much sense. If the team wants to replace him then he has to be traded for the guy they actually want to replace him with.

[epheisey]

The problem is our bench is already a huge strength at SF. There's only so many minutes to be played. And banking on Ellenson is a real gamble. If he even becomes a contributor off the bench, that would be considered a success. Gay might not be the answer, but we need stronger starters, not a more balanced team from top to bottom. One of Morris, Harris, and Stanley will have to go if they're all expected to play SF, and I'd move Harris first. Gay seems like a decent option because he only has one year left before a PO. That'd let him keep the position warm for Stanley for a season, and then give us some options to go after a PF next year. Morris or Leuer could hold down the PF spot for a year, and then when we're actually ready to start contending we'd be better prepared.

It doesn't really though. Even if you just do a deal of Harris for Gay the Pistons would still have around $91 million in contracts and the cap holds for Caldwell-Pope's and a rough estimate of Detroit's 2017 first round pick(while disregarding the other cap holds) on the books next season even if Rudy opted out. With a projected $102 million cap that leaves about $11 million, which isn't even close to getting a quality power forward in free agency with the new salaries being handed out (or trade because guys under the old cap contracts are that much more valuable).

The premise of just dumping Harris for Gay with no assets coming back is laughable anyways though. Nobody wants to be on Orlando's recent end of the spectrum in trades. And no, McLemore and Koufos don't count as assets. Kosta might in the right situation but that's not Detroit. Tobias is much more valuable given his contract, age, and really nice numbers/production in Detroit the last third of the season. Every team that has gotten rid of Rudy has been better off for it. He's awful, and neither Van Gundy or Gores would make a move to set the team back like that anyways. Winning is the mantra.

And it's not like Johnson, Harris, and Morris are all pure small forwards. The latter two are completely interchangeable between the three and the four, and it works. That's the way to go in the NBA these days unless you have a couple of starting bigs that can both get out and switch on the perimeter (disregarding any ability to defend at the rim, which is vital as well). Stanley will get minutes at the two and the three even if he's starting at small forward. His versatility will be utilized against different matchups. It's not like it was even just a few years ago where guys were locked into one position and tweeners were frowned upon.

If you don't like Harris as a player that's one thing, but even in that case dumping him outright doesn't make much sense. If the team wants to replace him then he has to be traded for the guy they actually want to replace him with.

I just don't like him as a starting PF. I think he's a solid SF, but that's not what he's here for. Perhaps this deal isn't the right one, but I think the only way this team succeeds is with a better option at PF, and dealing Harris is probably the best way to facilitate that.

[russkopp]

Gotta keep a new playoff core together. Especially now that we've added nice bench pieces. You break the core up when a legit superstar is out there, not Rudy "I'm good but could be way better but I'm 30 now so who cares" Gay.

[coordinator0]

I just don't like him as a starting PF. I think he's a solid SF, but that's not what he's here for. Perhaps this deal isn't the right one, but I think the only way this team succeeds is with a better option at PF, and dealing Harris is probably the best way to facilitate that.

I actually think that is what he's here for. At least in a combo role to pair with Morris (or Johnson) next to a dominating rebounder at center who has at least some value protecting the rim. The traditional power forward role is going extinct except in very specific matchups. Even pure stretch guys aren't really all that valuable with the way lineups are being utilized. It's all about the versatility.

Looks like we're going to have to agree to disagree though.

[RexRyan]

Say No To Trades!

[DBC10]

No thanks.

Harris is arguably just as good as anyone on the trade block if not slightly better but due to age.