Milwaukee early offseason in review (HW/bondom34/dbrandon/Slava)

[DrWood]

Similarly, I agree that he shouldn't have been re-signed and Milwaukee should have gone for a better younger difference maker at pg, or kept the flexibility to do so going forward (unfortunately they didn't). However, he was a key contributor; 6th in minutes, 6th in points, 6th in BPM. Bayless added a lot to the Bucks last season and it is production that needs to be replaced.

Those are just "filling the box score" things. Let me make this simple: THE BUCKS WERE WORSE WHEN HE WAS ON THE FLOOR. That statement is validated by +/- stats. Delly and Telly will pick up the slack at 3pt shooting. Losing Bayless is addition by subtraction.

[HartfordWhalers]

Similarly, I agree that he shouldn't have been re-signed and Milwaukee should have gone for a better younger difference maker at pg, or kept the flexibility to do so going forward (unfortunately they didn't). However, he was a key contributor; 6th in minutes, 6th in points, 6th in BPM. Bayless added a lot to the Bucks last season and it is production that needs to be replaced.

Those are just "filling the box score" things. Let me make this simple: THE BUCKS WERE WORSE WHEN HE WAS ON THE FLOOR. That statement is validated by +/- stats. Delly and Telly will pick up the slack at 3pt shooting. Losing Bayless is addition by subtraction.

Bucks were worse with Jabari on the floor. Would he not be a key loss? And the Bucks were better by more with OJ Mayo on the court than they were worse with Bayless, so then Mayo is a key loss?

I guess I don't subscribe to the belief that straight on off rely determines if someone is a key loss. Then again, I find this whole insistence that it wasn't a loss of some significance absurd. He was a guy who did a lot, although the team was right to let him go. If you want to label that not a key loss, write up a review. At some point its semantics being debated.

Spoiler:

(And yes, I'm going to cite my all caps randomly mid sentence rule)

[DrWood]

Similarly, I agree that he shouldn't have been re-signed and Milwaukee should have gone for a better younger difference maker at pg, or kept the flexibility to do so going forward (unfortunately they didn't). However, he was a key contributor; 6th in minutes, 6th in points, 6th in BPM. Bayless added a lot to the Bucks last season and it is production that needs to be replaced.

Those are just "filling the box score" things. Let me make this simple: THE BUCKS WERE WORSE WHEN HE WAS ON THE FLOOR. That statement is validated by +/- stats. Delly and Telly will pick up the slack at 3pt shooting. Losing Bayless is addition by subtraction.

Bucks were worse with Jabari on the floor. Would he not be a key loss? And the Bucks were better by more with OJ Mayo on the court than they were worse with Bayless, so then Mayo is a key loss?

I guess I don't subscribe to the belief that straight on off rely determines if someone is a key loss. Then again, I find this whole insistence that it wasn't a loss of some significance absurd. He was a guy who did a lot, although the team was right to let him go. If you want to label that not a key loss, write up a review. At some point its semantics being debated.

Spoiler:

(And yes, I'm going to cite my all caps randomly mid sentence rule)

It's not semantics, it's not knowing the team dynamics.
Jabari is an interesting case. 1) He really sucked in the first half; 2) At his age, he has a good chance to improve, unlike Bayless. So, if I was idiotic enough to think his first half performance was indicative of the rest of his career, I'd trade him for a second round pick.
What you seem to be unable to understand is that filling in some parts of a box score means nothing if you make your team worse, and and it's doubly ludicrous when the player has been replaced with a better player.

[HartfordWhalers]

Those are just "filling the box score" things. Let me make this simple: THE BUCKS WERE WORSE WHEN HE WAS ON THE FLOOR. That statement is validated by +/- stats. Delly and Telly will pick up the slack at 3pt shooting. Losing Bayless is addition by subtraction.

Bucks were worse with Jabari on the floor. Would he not be a key loss? And the Bucks were better by more with OJ Mayo on the court than they were worse with Bayless, so then Mayo is a key loss?

I guess I don't subscribe to the belief that straight on off rely determines if someone is a key loss. Then again, I find this whole insistence that it wasn't a loss of some significance absurd. He was a guy who did a lot, although the team was right to let him go. If you want to label that not a key loss, write up a review. At some point its semantics being debated.

Spoiler:

(And yes, I'm going to cite my all caps randomly mid sentence rule)

It's not semantics, it's not knowing the team dynamics.
Jabari is an interesting case. 1) He really sucked in the first half; 2) At his age, he has a good chance to improve, unlike Bayless. So, if I was idiotic enough to think his first half performance was indicative of the rest of his career, I'd trade him for a second round pick.
What you seem to be unable to understand is that filling in some parts of a box score means nothing if you make your team worse, and and it's doubly ludicrous when the player has been replaced with a better player.

Somehow you ignored that the team was 3 points better with Mayo than without, making him apparently a significant loss.

As for the gap between Bayless and Dellavedova:
Dellavedova -1.4 BPM, 52.7% TS%
Bayless -1.0 BPM, 56.8% TS%52.7% TS%

If one is a key signing, I have a hard time not seeing the other a key loss. Again, a guy who was 6th in minutes, 6th in points, 6th in BPM is the type of loss I will flag as key, even if it was time for the team to move on.

[AussieBuck]

Mayo actually makes a good case for how good Delly is going to be for the team. Despite his game and seemingly his life going into the toilet, Mayo's last season he really became a great vet. He was the one vet who went out of his way to defer and make things easier for the young guys to succeed. Bayless was a turd who hit a good amount of threes.

[DrWood]

Bucks were worse with Jabari on the floor. Would he not be a key loss? And the Bucks were better by more with OJ Mayo on the court than they were worse with Bayless, so then Mayo is a key loss?

I guess I don't subscribe to the belief that straight on off rely determines if someone is a key loss. Then again, I find this whole insistence that it wasn't a loss of some significance absurd. He was a guy who did a lot, although the team was right to let him go. If you want to label that not a key loss, write up a review. At some point its semantics being debated.

Spoiler:

(And yes, I'm going to cite my all caps randomly mid sentence rule)

It's not semantics, it's not knowing the team dynamics.
Jabari is an interesting case. 1) He really sucked in the first half; 2) At his age, he has a good chance to improve, unlike Bayless. So, if I was idiotic enough to think his first half performance was indicative of the rest of his career, I'd trade him for a second round pick.
What you seem to be unable to understand is that filling in some parts of a box score means nothing if you make your team worse, and and it's doubly ludicrous when the player has been replaced with a better player.

Somehow you ignored that the team was 3 points better with Mayo than without, making him apparently a significant loss.

As for the gap between Bayless and Dellavedova:
Dellavedova -1.4 BPM, 52.7% TS%
Bayless -1.0 BPM, 56.8% TS%52.7% TS%

If one is a key signing, I have a hard time not seeing the other a key loss. Again, a guy who was 6th in minutes, 6th in points, 6th in BPM is the type of loss I will flag as key, even if it was time for the team to move on.

Maybe you should watch some games next year? Bayless failed the eye-test to basically every buck fan, which further substantiates his +/-.

And Mayo? His simple rating is -4.4, one of the worst on the team among people who played significant minutes.

[RexRyan]

Delly and Telly helps the spacing big time. I still think it's a strange roster, and certainly not a finished product. B

[Andre Roberstan]

On my crummy phone, so I can't link, but Charania just reported Middleton tore his hamstring. Wing situation just went from dire to panic mode.

[Texas Chuck]

On my crummy phone, so I can't link, but Charania just reported Middleton tore his hamstring. Wing situation just went from die to panic mode.

yeah this is a major bummer for them. Time to trade Monroe for a wing for sure.

[yosemiteben]

Rudy Gay - Monroe swap? Clunky fit though.

[Andre Roberstan]

DIRE. Stupid phone.

I don't see anything around Gay. Kings are set at C.

[KqWIN]

Terrible new for Middleton and Milwaukee. It would be completely understandable to make a panic move here, but they might have to bite the bullet this year and punt. He is not a player you can replace easily and the timing of the injury makes it even worse.

[HartfordWhalers]

DIRE. Stupid phone.

I don't see anything around Gay. Kings are set at C.

Monroe to Charlotte (or NOP), Gay to Milwaukee, And Lamb/Filler/incentive (Tyreke/ Filler/incentive) to Sac.

[Texas Chuck]

Terrible new for Middleton and Milwaukee. It would be completely understandable to make a panic move here, but they might have to bite the bullet this year and punt. He is not a player you can replace easily and the timing of the injury makes it even worse.

They can't replace everything he is but the Bucks already needed another wing. They really have to do something if they want to salvage this season.

[Mystical Apples]

Damn his value to MIL isn't replaceable.

Lamb and Hawes suddenly works for them.

[HartfordWhalers]

Terrible new for Middleton and Milwaukee. It would be completely understandable to make a panic move here, but they might have to bite the bullet this year and punt. He is not a player you can replace easily and the timing of the injury makes it even worse.

They can't replace everything he is but the Bucks already needed another wing. They really have to do something if they want to salvage this season.

I had the season at 35 wins and not going anywhere already. Dropping from 35 wins to 28 and sneaking up in the lotto for a stud pg is the best long term thing I can think of actually.

[KqWIN]

Terrible new for Middleton and Milwaukee. It would be completely understandable to make a panic move here, but they might have to bite the bullet this year and punt. He is not a player you can replace easily and the timing of the injury makes it even worse.

They can't replace everything he is but the Bucks already needed another wing. They really have to do something if they want to salvage this season.

That's true, and the same could be said for trading Monroe. It should be something they should have already been thinking that. With that said, I don't think they should do anything rash in order to salvage this season. No Bucks fan probably wants to hear this, but I think their best move from here is to own the future and take a detour. I'd still try to move Monroe for a wing, but I'd prioritize upside and potential over immediate impact.

[Trader_Joe]

I like that in the meanwhile the Bucks can go big with...

Giannis l MCW
Delly l MCW
Parker l GA
Teletovic l Henson
Plumlee l Monroe

Still thin tho...

[tmorgan]

But how does Beas factor in?

lolz. Hammond is insane.

[Prez]

I'm gonna cry like a bitch when Giannis leaves after his contract.