2016 Official Speculation Thread: Episode V - The Preseason Strikes Back

[tiderulz]

Gordon is str8 oozing with potential. The thing that separates him from many is his desire to be better than everyone else as well. That actually also goes for Mario as well. For me... those two will be our top player in the next 2 years and hopefully be our pillars for years to come.

I think everyone is mainly sour about the oladipo trade because they saw him trending upwards.... and by "his stats" Ibaka was trending downwards. I'm not going to judge Ibaka by last years stats.... just going to see a 26 yo who is still coming into his own and trying to make a leap that he's wanted to do in previous years. Same goes for payton, Gordon and Hezonja. They have yet been unleashed and I can't judge someone's ability to "run" if they've been put in a cage the entire time.

From the interviews which Vogel have had.... unlike skiles.... Vogel has pretty much reiterrated that he was going to pull out every ounce of talent that he sees in these guys and give them the chance to flourish as he has done with other in Indiana. That alone should give enough hope as to temper our knee jerk reactions till at least until midseason.

And yes....lower players in the NBA do ball out in Pro-am..... but so do the elites.... now that Gordon will be depended on to shine and not just be a defender and low usage guy..... we will see which category he fits in.

sorry man, i gotta call BS on this. 90% of every player out there wants to be better than everyone else

[rcklsscognition]

Gordon has one of the highest probabilities on the team to be a 20PPG scorer which makes it hard for me to believe he's as inept on that end as many make him out to be. I don't think it's necessary for Gordon to be a "good" 3 point shooter for this to work either. The issue, is finding a spot for him on the team and running and offense he can shine in. Aaron "Pro-Am" Gordon is living and breathing inside this kid waiting to come out and this may be the season it happens.

sorry, Vuc has the highest probability followed by Fournier.

There are various ways to project but the three of them do come out on top, although I have not done any looking into Ibaka.

[yoyojw17]

Gordon is str8 oozing with potential. The thing that separates him from many is his desire to be better than everyone else as well. That actually also goes for Mario as well. For me... those two will be our top player in the next 2 years and hopefully be our pillars for years to come.

I think everyone is mainly sour about the oladipo trade because they saw him trending upwards.... and by "his stats" Ibaka was trending downwards. I'm not going to judge Ibaka by last years stats.... just going to see a 26 yo who is still coming into his own and trying to make a leap that he's wanted to do in previous years. Same goes for payton, Gordon and Hezonja. They have yet been unleashed and I can't judge someone's ability to "run" if they've been put in a cage the entire time.

From the interviews which Vogel have had.... unlike skiles.... Vogel has pretty much reiterrated that he was going to pull out every ounce of talent that he sees in these guys and give them the chance to flourish as he has done with other in Indiana. That alone should give enough hope as to temper our knee jerk reactions till at least until midseason.

And yes....lower players in the NBA do ball out in Pro-am..... but so do the elites.... now that Gordon will be depended on to shine and not just be a defender and low usage guy..... we will see which category he fits in.

sorry man, i gotta call BS on this. 90% of every player out there wants to be better than everyone else

Maybe it wasn't worded correctly.... but the interview that i read about how he felt anxious sitting on the bench during the beginning of training camp with a bummed ankle after putting in all the work he has over the summer to prepare.... and getting emotional about it.... that to me tells a lot about the trajectory he has.

Obviously i'm not saying he is one of the few individual that are trying to be better.... there are many... but there are those that content with the game, there are those that have the desire and lacking maybe the physical attributes to break that next barrier... there are those that are gifted but put in as much effort to get that next paycheck, and the list goes on and on and on. I just see the brightness in AG's future (amongst others) who has all the physical tool, and has shown the skills to excel in many ways on the court.... top that with a constant hunger.... I can see why there are so many (including the coaching staff and organization) that are so high on him. That's all i was getting at. He has the ingredients... now it's time to mix it all together.

[Orlwillbeback]

Gordon has one of the highest probabilities on the team to be a 20PPG scorer which makes it hard for me to believe he's as inept on that end as many make him out to be. I don't think it's necessary for Gordon to be a "good" 3 point shooter for this to work either. The issue, is finding a spot for him on the team and running and offense he can shine in. Aaron "Pro-Am" Gordon is living and breathing inside this kid waiting to come out and this may be the season it happens.

sorry, Vuc has the highest probability followed by Fournier.

He never said Gordon had THE highest, but one of the highest.

[tiderulz]

Gordon has one of the highest probabilities on the team to be a 20PPG scorer which makes it hard for me to believe he's as inept on that end as many make him out to be. I don't think it's necessary for Gordon to be a "good" 3 point shooter for this to work either. The issue, is finding a spot for him on the team and running and offense he can shine in. Aaron "Pro-Am" Gordon is living and breathing inside this kid waiting to come out and this may be the season it happens.

sorry, Vuc has the highest probability followed by Fournier.

He never said Gordon had THE highest, but one of the highest.

so 3rd out of 5. eh, okay i guess

[Orlwillbeback]

I misread what's happening to the Magic on the Realgm board? No man, to me it was pretty obvious that the Magic are trying to build around Vuc even though he is an odd player to do that for.

If you guys truly think AG is gonna become a star you got another thing conin'. He doesn't have the skillset nor the disposition of an alphadog.

I don't believe the next franchise talent for Orlando currently sits on our roster.

That doesn't mean we can't make the scene here more attractive for such a player to want to come some time soon.

That's weird. You don't trust Vogel's assessment in molding Aaron Gordon to be our Paul George? If he believes in AG, why shouldn't we?

Did you actually believe that he thought so? It sounds like he is just hyping up the team to me. Gordon really plays nothing like George. George is basically a 6'10 Kyrie Irving. Gordon is like a mix of Draymond and Faried.

[EAS Law]

I don't believe the next franchise talent for Orlando currently sits on our roster.

That doesn't mean we can't make the scene here more attractive for such a player to want to come some time soon.

That's weird. You don't trust Vogel's assessment in molding Aaron Gordon to be our Paul George? If he believes in AG, why shouldn't we?

Did you actually believe that he thought so? It sounds like he is just hyping up the team to me. Gordon really plays nothing like George. George is basically a 6'10 Kyrie Irving. Gordon is like a mix of Draymond and Faried.

Of any comparison I've ever seen, this one is probably the best. Not a bad place to be honest. Long forgotten, but Faried was a super effective player for a while. I see AG as having potential as a Draymond type of guy albeit more athletic and able to guard more positions.

[Rick Rolled]

"I wasn't surprised, when I was in Charlotte they were trying to trade for me".

- Biyombo on the Magic's aggressive pursuit of him this offseason.

[Rick Rolled]

Good god, someone mentioned it the other day, but Denton asks a question, answers it himself, and then says "right?" and sticks the mic in the interviewee's face.

Cut that **** out.

[OrlandoDream]

Gordon has one of the highest probabilities on the team to be a 20PPG scorer which makes it hard for me to believe he's as inept on that end as many make him out to be. I don't think it's necessary for Gordon to be a "good" 3 point shooter for this to work either. The issue, is finding a spot for him on the team and running and offense he can shine in. Aaron "Pro-Am" Gordon is living and breathing inside this kid waiting to come out and this may be the season it happens.

sorry, Vuc has the highest probability followed by Fournier.

There are various ways to project but the three of them do come out on top, although I have not done any looking into Ibaka.

Aaron Gordon will be better next year but if people are expecting 20ppg, they will be disappointed. Remember its a new coach, new system, new role and he is missing the first couple of days of training camp.....again. I see Evan or Vuc being the closest two to putting up 20ppg this year. I see AG having his best year as long as he stays healthy but he is long way from 20ppg.

[JF5]

Sure, but citing the General Board as a bastion of insight and solid opinions isn't really an effective way to drive home any statement.

AG put up really, really good advanced stats for a 20 year old and is a higher commodity for our team, and most other teams in the league. It's hard to compare them since they have entirely different games, but let's not pretend like Oladipo was anything more than an average SG for us during his time here (and I'm not trying to put him down, he was well worth being invested in). He had some games where he played extremely above average, and others where he was very below average.

Also disagree with whoever said Gordon doesn't have an alpha mentality. The dude is dripping in confidence and I see him developing into a team captain soon. Nobody walks in the NBA and demands that kind of respect aside from legends like Jordan or Magic.

I'm citing the General Board because its an unbiased arena. You come here or anywhere as a matter of fact and you'll see a group of people hype up their young guys as the next big stars. I believe some of it is warranted with some evidence (as it is my opinion). But with a player like Gordon who isn't really offensively inclined and will most likely never be. Its hard to take these Paul George/Jimmy Butler comparisons with a grain of salt. Because those guys at least coming in could shoot the ball/get their own shot. Gordon his first few years hasn't shown much in terms of shot creation/shooting/1 on 1 isolations against other wing players. At least with Oladipo you've seen games where his offensive game looked star like... 2 years in with AG we haven't even seen a game where he looked close to dominate with his scoring.

[Def Swami]

Jimmy Butler could not shoot coming out of college. He even admits that himself.

Butler and Gordon's games during both their first 2 years were pretty similar as defense and hustle guys.

Interestingly, Oladipo was the same way during his first 2 years at IU and made a huge leap in shooting his 3rd year.

Let's at least see what Gordon can do before writing him off.

[PennytoShaq]

Aaron Gordon is offensively inclined. The guy gets to the line quite well. He creates baskets.

He has looked close to dominate with his scoring, but it was in small sample sizes. He came out and put up 12 points in one quarter, which is very impressive.

My point is that it's too early to assume we know the ceiling on what Gordon is capable of doing.

20 PPG is a leap for sure, but 16-18 would not surprise me.

[EAS Law]

Sure, but citing the General Board as a bastion of insight and solid opinions isn't really an effective way to drive home any statement.

AG put up really, really good advanced stats for a 20 year old and is a higher commodity for our team, and most other teams in the league. It's hard to compare them since they have entirely different games, but let's not pretend like Oladipo was anything more than an average SG for us during his time here (and I'm not trying to put him down, he was well worth being invested in). He had some games where he played extremely above average, and others where he was very below average.

Also disagree with whoever said Gordon doesn't have an alpha mentality. The dude is dripping in confidence and I see him developing into a team captain soon. Nobody walks in the NBA and demands that kind of respect aside from legends like Jordan or Magic.

I'm citing the General Board because its an unbiased arena. You come here or anywhere as a matter of fact and you'll see a group of people hype up their young guys as the next big stars. I believe some of it is warranted with some evidence (as it is my opinion). But with a player like Gordon who isn't really offensively inclined and will most likely never be. Its hard to take these Paul George/Jimmy Butler comparisons with a grain of salt. Because those guys at least coming in could shoot the ball/get their own shot. Gordon his first few years hasn't shown much in terms of shot creation/shooting/1 on 1 isolations against other wing players. At least with Oladipo you've seen games where his offensive game looked star like... 2 years in with AG we haven't even seen a game where he looked close to dominate with his scoring.

I don't want to start a fight, but FWIW, bias towards teams that are not the Orlando Magic do not equate to objectivity. There are tons and I mean TONS of posters on the GB that are fans of teams in similar situations to ours that would love for everyone on our squad to fail, and therefore, usually offer opinions that are inherently biased toward their team and the interests of their team, as well as under-informed or I'll-informed as it pertains to any of our guys.

Jimmy butler may be a fair comparison in some respects, except he's a 2/3 guy and not a 3/4 guy. JB is not a very good shooter either, and I think the message is more that AG COULD become a PG type of guy. It doesn't really matter how he does it, just that he gets his ppg to a comparable level, and continues to excel defensively.

A big problem on our board is the impatience of our fans and the inability to see guys like Gordon, Vuc, and Payton as VERY young players with a ton of room to develop still. We just don't know what we have yet.

[tiderulz]

Aaron Gordon is offensively inclined. The guy gets to the line quite well. He creates baskets.

He has looked close to dominate with his scoring, but it was in small sample sizes. He came out and put up 12 points in one quarter, which is very impressive.

My point is that it's too early to assume we know the ceiling on what Gordon is capable of doing.

20 PPG is a leap for sure, but 16-18 would not surprise me.

how many times did he come out and put up 12 pts in a quarter? once? i have yet to see him look dominating with his scoring

[SOUL]

ehh, i disagree on that. Many people here and non-MAgic fans saw him as a top-10, top-5ish SG in the league. i dont consider that average. I believe Fournier is a much better fit and has more offensive game that flows more naturally, but Dipo was good.

He had (and has) the potential to be, and looked it at times, and was it at times, I'm just trying to look at it without bias and factor in his efficiency and how we played with him here, he had a very average three years in general. Which, again, is better than we've had in a while in that spot, but not a level that Gordon can't reach this year with a bigger role (in my eyes).

[SOUL]

The quickest way to become disappointed in Aaron Gordon is to think he'll turn into Paul George this year though. Let him become the player he's destined to be and I think a lot of us will be very happy.

[thelead]

I'm hoping for 14/7/3/2/1 (high efficiency) with elite defense. Don't let me down AG!

[Orlwillbeback]

Sure, but citing the General Board as a bastion of insight and solid opinions isn't really an effective way to drive home any statement.

AG put up really, really good advanced stats for a 20 year old and is a higher commodity for our team, and most other teams in the league. It's hard to compare them since they have entirely different games, but let's not pretend like Oladipo was anything more than an average SG for us during his time here (and I'm not trying to put him down, he was well worth being invested in). He had some games where he played extremely above average, and others where he was very below average.

Also disagree with whoever said Gordon doesn't have an alpha mentality. The dude is dripping in confidence and I see him developing into a team captain soon. Nobody walks in the NBA and demands that kind of respect aside from legends like Jordan or Magic.

I'm citing the General Board because its an unbiased arena. You come here or anywhere as a matter of fact and you'll see a group of people hype up their young guys as the next big stars. I believe some of it is warranted with some evidence (as it is my opinion). But with a player like Gordon who isn't really offensively inclined and will most likely never be. Its hard to take these Paul George/Jimmy Butler comparisons with a grain of salt. Because those guys at least coming in could shoot the ball/get their own shot. Gordon his first few years hasn't shown much in terms of shot creation/shooting/1 on 1 isolations against other wing players. At least with Oladipo you've seen games where his offensive game looked star like... 2 years in with AG we haven't even seen a game where he looked close to dominate with his scoring.

We just don't know what we have yet.

How long have we been saying this?

[Magic_Kingdom]

Maybe Vogel saying he sees AG being like PG was just his way of saying that he sees AG as the star of this team. Maybe he didn't mean it as literally as he said it. Like maybe it was his way of saying to us, but more to AG, "You're my Paul George on this team. You're the man."

I see AG as a Scottie Pippen type. And if he could reach that level, that would be awesome.