Wild Card Game: Baltimore (Tillman) @ Toronto (Stroman) | Tuesday, October 4 | 8PM EST

[I_Like_Dirt]

Remember when two white sox fans jumped on the field and attacked an umpire?

Remember when Cubs fans threw all kinds of **** at Steve Bartman?

Remember when Cardinals fans called Jason Heyward the n word?

Remember when Baltimore had to play a home game without any fans for safety reasons?

**** you and your disco!!!!

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[LLJ]

They're both solid pitchers at the end of the day, and both are lefties.

Bruh...

Brainfart my bad dunno what I was smoking

[tecumseh18]

Okay, now it gets even more inexplicable. I had forgotten about it, but a couple months ago, we faced the Orioles in Toronto. It was tied 2-2 going to the bottom of the 9th. Buck Showalter brought in...Zach Britton, for two innings. He held us scoreless, and the Orioles won in extras.

Now, in a single-game elimination, with literally the same scoreline and situation, he opts to leave Britton unused, and they lose.

Indeed, and there is also this. Jimenez pitches to Edwin, rather than walking him intentionally. Jose is next and he's 3-38 against Ubaldo. Since only the runner on third matters, there would have been no harm in walking Edwin

Ubaldo has command issues and Jose has an incredible eye. If you walk him, it's game over. If you get behind, you need to give a fastball to avoid walking him, and that's a recipe for disaster. There's is definitely potential harm. Jose is much more likely to GIDP than Edwin, though. If only they had a pitcher that was familiar with pitching in relief and also had an elite ground ball rate. Hmmm.

Here's a theory that just sprang to mind. Liriano was just mowing down the O's last night (as he did last week). What if Buck thought: "We're not going to hit this guy. I'm just going to try to ride it out until Liriano gets tired/comes out. When we get a run, I'll seal the win with Britton".

Of course, he couldn't say that in PG interviews.

[Skin Blues]

Indeed, and there is also this. Jimenez pitches to Edwin, rather than walking him intentionally. Jose is next and he's 3-38 against Ubaldo. Since only the runner on third matters, there would have been no harm in walking Edwin

Ubaldo has command issues and Jose has an incredible eye. If you walk him, it's game over. If you get behind, you need to give a fastball to avoid walking him, and that's a recipe for disaster. There's is definitely potential harm. Jose is much more likely to GIDP than Edwin, though. If only they had a pitcher that was familiar with pitching in relief and also had an elite ground ball rate. Hmmm.

Here's a theory that just sprang to mind. Liriano was just mowing down the O's last night (as he did last week). What if Buck thought: "We're not going to hit this guy. I'm just going to try to ride it out until Liriano gets tired/comes out. When we get a run, I'll seal with win with Britton"?

I'm sure that's roughly what he was thinking. The problem is... if you use Britton for 2 innings earlier in the game, and bump all your other relievers back 2 innings, you don't get to Ubaldo until the 13th inning. Now, Liriano was throwing well, but you have to think it's possible that the O's score a single run against him in those 2 extra innings you buy yourself. And if they score after the first inning Britton throws, then he's available for what is essentially a save opportunity. And if it's not a save opportunity, it will be a tie game in extra innings which is about as high leverage as you can get.

Looking at it in financial terms, he had a 100% chance of winning $500, but traded that for a 50% chance of winning $600 and a 50% chance of winning $0.

[Raps in 4]

Indeed, and there is also this. Jimenez pitches to Edwin, rather than walking him intentionally. Jose is next and he's 3-38 against Ubaldo. Since only the runner on third matters, there would have been no harm in walking Edwin

Ubaldo has command issues and Jose has an incredible eye. If you walk him, it's game over. If you get behind, you need to give a fastball to avoid walking him, and that's a recipe for disaster. There's is definitely potential harm. Jose is much more likely to GIDP than Edwin, though. If only they had a pitcher that was familiar with pitching in relief and also had an elite ground ball rate. Hmmm.

Here's a theory that just sprang to mind. Liriano was just mowing down the O's last night (as he did last week). What if Buck thought: "We're not going to hit this guy. I'm just going to try to ride it out until Liriano gets tired/comes out. When we get a run, I'll seal the win with Britton".

Of course, he couldn't say that in PG interviews.

That's kind of what he said though.

"I thought the game would last another few innings" or something along those lines.

[I_Like_Dirt]

Here's a theory that just sprang to mind. Liriano was just mowing down the O's last night (as he did last week). What if Buck thought: "We're not going to hit this guy. I'm just going to try to ride it out until Liriano gets tired/comes out. When we get a run, I'll seal the win with Britton".

Of course, he couldn't say that in PG interviews.

This wouldn't surprise me if it was the case. Honestly, it surprised me a bit to see how many people were agonizing over the Stroman/Liriano decision before the game. The Os went with Tillman, one of their top 2 starters, and their SPs get markedly worse after the top 2 - Jiminez is probably their 3rd best starter. Meanwhile, the Jays were debating between two guys who had been their 4th and 5th best starters on the year, saving their top 3 guys for the ALDS, and yet both Liriano and Stroman are roughly the same quality as Tillman, if not better.

Heck, even the talk around not using Britton, I get it, but the Os still threw the best pitchers they possibly could out there and they were basically running out, and the Jays weren't at that point yet, and they had just put Liriano out there who was probably good for a few innings. Having Liriano in the pen was a great way to neutralize Britton, because the second the Os thought about putting Britton in, the Jays could put Liriano in and try to wait them out. The Os' pitching isn't nearly as good or as deep as the Jays' and it showed. It was just a matter of the Jays bats eventually waking up to take advantage of that fact. They're going to have that same pitching advantage against the Rangers in the ALDS. Hopefully the bats wake up enough to take advantage of it.

[ruckus]

I watch 1 baseball game all season and it was a doozy!

[JN]

I wasn't watching this thread most of last night.

I assumed the fans here went crazy when Saunders only advanced one base on the double. Terrible baserunning that thankfully did not cost the Jays.

[Rapcity_11]

That pitch to Trumbo though...yikes. Am not sure why they decide to give someone that hit 47 home runs pitch like that to hit. Please throw it outside or in off the plate to other teams cleanup hitters.

The pitch was right on the inside corner. "Yikes" is a bit much.

[King of Canada]

What a game. Literally could not have been a more entertaining game. Woke the kids up when I was jumping up and down in my living room at almost 1 in the morning.

Anybody figure out who threw that beer can? We should sacrifice him.

[IMAN5]

I wasn't watching this thread most of last night.

I assumed the fans here went crazy when Saunders only advanced one base on the double. Terrible baserunning that thankfully did not cost the Jays.

I lost my mind. but I understand because 9/10 that catch is made. even if he's agressive and leaking out a bit farther off I don't know if Saunders is fast or athletic enough to make it home safely.

[Hoopstarr]

Indeed, and there is also this. Jimenez pitches to Edwin, rather than walking him intentionally. Jose is next and he's 3-38 against Ubaldo. Since only the runner on third matters, there would have been no harm in walking Edwin

Ubaldo has command issues and Jose has an incredible eye. If you walk him, it's game over. If you get behind, you need to give a fastball to avoid walking him, and that's a recipe for disaster. There's is definitely potential harm. Jose is much more likely to GIDP than Edwin, though. If only they had a pitcher that was familiar with pitching in relief and also had an elite ground ball rate. Hmmm.

Here's a theory that just sprang to mind. Liriano was just mowing down the O's last night (as he did last week). What if Buck thought: "We're not going to hit this guy. I'm just going to try to ride it out until Liriano gets tired/comes out. When we get a run, I'll seal the win with Britton".

Of course, he couldn't say that in PG interviews.

I don't get this. It assumes that Liriano would do that, which is hardly a great assumption with his walk rate, and it assumes we'd never come close to scoring and thus ending the game because we're batting second. We kept grounding into DPs. Did he think that would keep happening?

[BigLeagueChew]

The pitch was right on the inside corner. "Yikes" is a bit much.

Make it off the plate next time inside , or a pitch on the outside corner away from his power. It didn't look like one of the many breaking pitches he was throwing all night and it looked like he picked an odd time to throw a fastball inside. He pitched a great game except for one pitch.

[Fairview4Life]

Remember when two white sox fans jumped on the field and attacked an umpire?

Remember when Cubs fans threw all kinds of **** at Steve Bartman?

Remember when Cardinals fans called Jason Heyward the n word?

According to Jones fans were yelling racial slurs at him and Kim last night too though obviously one fan should never define a fan base.

He didn't really say that, although reports from an Orioles fan said that someone told Kim to go back to his country, which is not a good thing to do.

Also, remember when Detroit fans burned down a historic home on opening day?

[Rapcity_11]

The pitch was right on the inside corner. "Yikes" is a bit much.

Make it off the plate next time inside , or a pitch on the outside corner away from his power. It didn't look like one of the many breaking pitches he was throwing all night and it looked like he picked an odd time to throw a fastball inside. He piched a great game except for one pitch.

You wouldn't be saying that if Trumbo fouled it off or whatever. It wasn't a great pitch, it also wasn't terrible.

[NinjaBro]

I'm still all jacked up from last night.

[LLJ]

Remember when two white sox fans jumped on the field and attacked an umpire?

Remember when Cubs fans threw all kinds of **** at Steve Bartman?

Remember when Cardinals fans called Jason Heyward the n word?

According to Jones fans were yelling racial slurs at him and Kim last night too though obviously one fan should never define a fan base.

Jays do tend to attract more of a certain kind of fan more than the Raps and Leafs do though. (Although TFC also has some pretty bad fans) I mean last night was pretty much fairly pedestrian "bad" behaviour from what I've seen, so I don't think it's a big deal, but coupled with last year's debacle in Game 5 of the ALDS, it does seem we're building a certain negative rep.

All that said, I don't really care what people think of our fanbase. Lots of fanbases are hated. Are there actually any sports fanbases people like?

[Shimso]

Remember when two white sox fans jumped on the field and attacked an umpire?

Remember when Cubs fans threw all kinds of **** at Steve Bartman?

Remember when Cardinals fans called Jason Heyward the n word?

Remember when Baltimore had to play a home game without any fans for safety reasons?

or when they were locked in for their own safety:
http://deadspin.com/orioles-fans-stuck-in-stadium-after-mayor-cops-ask-th-1700219246

[PaulieWal]

Remember when Cardinals fans called Jason Heyward the n word?

According to Jones fans were yelling racial slurs at him and Kim last night too though obviously one fan should never define a fan base.

He didn't really say that, although reports from an Orioles fan said that someone told Kim to go back to his country, which is not a good thing to do.

Also, remember when Detroit fans burned down a historic home on opening day?

Not sure then although this article says Jones said people were yelling racial slurs at them.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/baseball/blue-jays-fans-beer-can-throwing-racial-slur-adam-jones-toronto-rogers-centre-orioles/article32254718/

Better if no one was yelling racial stuff, so hopefully you are right.....

[BigLeagueChew]

You wouldn't be saying that if Trumbo fouled it off or whatever. It wasn't a great pitch, it also wasn't terrible.

I would be.I am saying it because he threw mostly breaking pitches all to that point and decided to throw a fastball to their cleanup hitter. Their is literally nothing wrong with bringing it up, commenting about it or preferring another pitch in that situation but the point of my post wasn't even about the Trumbo pitch.

Trumbo would have likely fouled it off if it wasn't such a terrible pitch. Most of the home runs the Jays have given up lately were bad pitch calls and location but am not really leaning toward Trumbo being a good hitter as the reason for his home run, or that he put a good swing on it. Just like the pitch from Ubaldo to Edwin was also terrible.