Preseason Game 2 - Utah Jazz at Phoenix Suns

[RunDogGun]

Holy **** these refs need to die or be fired.

Did RunDogGun steal your realgm account?

I've never said that a ref should die. I just want fair games to be called. I don't understand why many games just aren't called equally. But as you can see, I didn't say a word about the refs in any of my comments on this game. I just said we missed free throws, which is all on us.

[RunDogGun]

Yeah
Let's hope someone will try to overpay for Len.

Hopefully another team hires NavLDo as a scout.

What is up with calling out posters?

[bwgood77]

Yeah
Let's hope someone will try to overpay for Len.

Hopefully another team hires NavLDo as a scout.

What is up with calling out posters?

We can all joke. It's allowed.

[RunDogGun]

Hopefully another team hires NavLDo as a scout.

What is up with calling out posters?

We can all joke. It's allowed.

Hence my at the end. We lost that game from terrible passes and losing our man on defense. Plus we still don't seem to have any set plays or go to plays. I think we should have both Chriss and TJ crashing the offensive boards all game long. When we get Tucker back, I'd rather see him and Chriss start at the forward spots.

[bwgood77]

What is up with calling out posters?

We can all joke. It's allowed.

Hence my at the end. We lost that game from terrible passes and losing our man on defense. Plus we still don't seem to have any set plays or go to plays. I think we should have both Chriss and TJ crashing the offensive boards all game long. When we get Tucker back, I'd rather see him and Chriss start at the forward spots.

Watson already named Warren the starter for the season.

Some passes looked bad, but were errant because a rookie wasn't paying attention. I noticed early someone made a pass to Chriss but he didn't even see it, stepped forward, and it went behind his back and across the court and out of bounds I believe. That looked like a bad pass, but was likely more of a rookie mistake. I think we will see quite a bit of this as guys learn to play together and the rookies have a big learning curve ahead of them.

[bwgood77]

Watson said Knight could become one of the greatest sixth men to ever play. How is that possible when he is not even one of the best players on his own team? He seriously is the worst ball handling point guard I have ever seen. His iq is non-existant. He constantly dribbles the ball away and/or falls down. He has 17 points but he has taken 17 shots. He has 2 assists and 2 turnovers. I would rather Dudley or Tucker bring the ball up the court instead of him. There is absolutely no reason to keep Knight.

And Booker shooting an even worse percentage. We just need better players don't we?

There is no point in responding to this but I am going to because you probably think I just read the box score instead of watching the game and I watched the whole game. Anybody that understands basketball. Anybody that knows what it takes to win. Anybody that saw what Knight did tonight can see that Knight is pathetic. The guy flat out does not get it. He is completely out of control. He makes terrible plays. Even when he scores he is out of control. He does one thing well and that is make open shots. He is literally the complete opposite of a guy like Steve Nash when it comes to his approach. Nash with his unbelievable ball handling, court vision, and consistent shooting. Knight with is awful ball handling, tunnel vision, and inconsistent shooting. I am so tired of watching him play. It is like a circus act. Get rid of him already and let Ulis play backup point guard.

A Utah fan that watched felt differently...

Does Vegas have sixth man of the year awards I can gamble on? Cause Knight has a serious chance at winning.

viewtopic.php?f=33&t=1480066&start=120#p49362072

[darealjuice]

A lot of people here just don't like the way Knight looks when he plays because he's so jerky and not a pure point guard, regardless of if he can produce or not. I'm fine with him being extremely aggressive going to the basket/scoring as the 6th man, he's probably going to have a guard matched up on him from the 2nd unit that isn't nearly as skilled or athletic as he is, so let him go to work. People were complaining about how he was playing in this thread last night because the ball wasn't moving enough on offense or whatever, but who cares if the ball isn't moving prettily if he's getting to the hole every time and scoring on his own like he was in the first half? Not to say there wasn't a drop off in the second half or that he shouldn't look to move it more if he's cold, because he got out of control in transition once or twice and wasn't quite hitting his jumper, but his role as 6th man is going to be to put points on the board, not facilitate the offense as much. I also feel like his defense last night was a lot better than I remember it being, he was trying to get in the dribbler's shorts all night.

[Jarlaxle0204]

watched the game this morning.

Len looked bad, yes, but against Gobert there is only so much you can do. His shot looks nice, and on defense he was mostly left alone to cover whoever got freed up after a PnR, leaving Gobert open for several dunks. Not fully his fault. It´s ok. The bad part is he is still trying too much, forcing bad possessions in the post instead of kicking the ball out.

Warren, Chriss and Bender looked fine. The last two still obviously need to get used to the whole NBA thing. I particularly liked Benders defense in the post and how he cuts to the rim for easy buckets and tip-ins.

I loved Knight. That´s exactly what he needs to do, to dominate the second unit.

I feel pretty much the same as this post. Len played terribly against Gobert last year as well. I might be the only one still high on Len but I really do think he'll have a good year and I for one wish they would offer him an extension at something like $13 million per year before the season starts. He's still very young and a very good rebounder.

I thought Knight was perfect as a sixth man. I have no problem with him dominating the ball in the second unit. He's the perfect microwave scorer. I'm pretty happy and hopeful for both Chriss and Bender. Yeah, they're going to take awhile but I think both will be good and you can see flashes of that already in both of them.

It's ok to wait it out. This team isn't winning the championship any time soon. We've got time.

[bwgood77]

watched the game this morning.

Len looked bad, yes, but against Gobert there is only so much you can do. His shot looks nice, and on defense he was mostly left alone to cover whoever got freed up after a PnR, leaving Gobert open for several dunks. Not fully his fault. It´s ok. The bad part is he is still trying too much, forcing bad possessions in the post instead of kicking the ball out.

Warren, Chriss and Bender looked fine. The last two still obviously need to get used to the whole NBA thing. I particularly liked Benders defense in the post and how he cuts to the rim for easy buckets and tip-ins.

I loved Knight. That´s exactly what he needs to do, to dominate the second unit.

I feel pretty much the same as this post. Len played terribly against Gobert last year as well. I might be the only one still high on Len but I really do think he'll have a good year and I for one wish they would offer him an extension at something like $13 million per year before the season starts. He's still very young and a very good rebounder.

I thought Knight was perfect as a sixth man. I have no problem with him dominating the ball in the second unit. He's the perfect microwave scorer. I'm pretty happy and hopeful for both Chriss and Bender. Yeah, they're going to take awhile but I think both will be good and you can see flashes of that already in both of them.

It's ok to wait it out. This team isn't winning the championship any time soon. We've got time.

I'm not a Knight fan but he is in a good role. I would prefer he play with other guys who don't really need to score, but provide other things, such at PJ Tucker and Tyson Chandler (hopefully Len starts at some point if he can play under more control). But Len is good at doing little things too if he doesn't try to do too much. He rebounds well and did hustle, though it was erratic at times.

Let him play with Barbosa who can help him out and maybe throw in Bender who is fine defending and passing, or Alan Williams at C.

So Knight's ideal lineup where he can thrive is...

Knight/Barbosa/Tucker/Bender/Chandler or Williams

No one else NEEDS to shoot and they all play defense, but three can somewhat spread the floor. It's a fairly physical lineup as well.

Perhaps throw in Ulis as well since he loves to pass and can play good D as well.

Or even play Dudley in that unit.

I think Chriss will benefit the more he plays with Bled and Book, though he is not ready to start, but when he plays it might be good with those guys because they are the best lob passers...

Although Ulis probably is as well...maybe the best for all I know.

[theSUNalsoRISES]

u r all kidding urself if you think Len is leaving via free agency. Mcd's first pick. In this market a promising 7 footer gets paid.Mcd will ensure he stays here. Lets not forget Len is the definition of inconsistent. He'll probably put up a double-double next game.

I think the biggest take away from this game and preseason as a whole is our rookies look decent. In summer league and now preseason the rooks haven't been out of their depth which is pretty good for our rebuild.

Imagine if all 3 rookies live upto their hype and booker and T.J. continue developing...we could be a monster **** team in a few years.

N to think the Jazz let Booker slide....Hayward and Booker on the wing..Gobert/favours..Exum at point thats a deadly team.

[MathiasPW]

Jazz have Hood who is also pretty amazing. And their pick Lyles looks great as well. They are gonna cause trouble sooner than later

[Years90Suns]

There are two kinds of PGs. The ones that try to make their teammates better and control the tempo, and the ones who just care about shooting and dribbling. Second ones usually do not bring wins to the table and are boring to watch. Knight shot 16 times yesterday, more than any other player. For God's sake he is not a starter. He would ruin all our offense and flow, or the little of it we have now.

I believe Len, or I want to believe Len, will get in shape as the days go by. I think big men need more time to get into shape, as it is usually harder for them to play during the summer. Even in pick up games they are left with no touches.

I do not understand the idea of trading Tucker. Or Dudley. Nobody is going to give us crap for them, and they have a great importance for us, as they add leadership and are our veterans. Chandler, Barbosa, Tucker and Dudley are here to lead all the bunch of young guys. Remember we have Knight, Booker, Len (still young), Chriss, Bender, Warren, Williams and Goodwin. They need guidance and somebody to shout at them when they are playing lazy or doing stupid things on the court repeatedly or when they are not showing up on time, or training hard, etc. I believe we have the perfect mix of youth and veterans. A different thing is the quality of the roster, but I BELIEVE in this team and I like what we have, but may be we are some months away of getting something important out of them.
Let's just wait until Bledsoe gets down to work and everything comes together a couple of months into the RS at least.

[theSUNalsoRISES]

Jazz have Hood who is also pretty amazing. And their pick Lyles looks great as well. They are gonna cause trouble sooner than later

I don't mind those players..i just think booker > lyles and hood. By a long way too. Imagine someone proposed that trade..would you accept?.. I wouldn't. N personally I love the idea of having 2 elite wing players on the same team. doesn't happen often but its enjoyable to watch when it does.

[RunDogGun]

We can all joke. It's allowed.

Hence my at the end. We lost that game from terrible passes and losing our man on defense. Plus we still don't seem to have any set plays or go to plays. I think we should have both Chriss and TJ crashing the offensive boards all game long. When we get Tucker back, I'd rather see him and Chriss start at the forward spots.

Watson already named Warren the starter for the season.

Some passes looked bad, but were errant because a rookie wasn't paying attention. I noticed early someone made a pass to Chriss but he didn't even see it, stepped forward, and it went behind his back and across the court and out of bounds I believe. That looked like a bad pass, but was likely more of a rookie mistake. I think we will see quite a bit of this as guys learn to play together and the rookies have a big learning curve ahead of them.

I'm sure Watson will change his mind. TJ seems to do better later in the game. I'd still start Tucker when he is ready (if he is 100%). I think we should have all our initial focus trying to get Booker's shot going, then work on pick and rolls from there. Sort of like Nash would try and get Raja going early in the game, then work good pick and rolls with Amare. Tucker is the better defender, and three point shooter compared to TJ. If Booker isn't working out, then sub in TJ quickly looking for his instant offense.

I'd start pairing forwards PJ/Chriss and TJ/Dudley, bringing Bender in slowly. Guard rotation of mainly Bledsoe, Booker, and Knight, with some minutes to Ulis and maybe LB. If LB gets hot, ride him until he is not.

Overall, with only a couple preseason games in and missing rotational players, I'm open to see where we go. The passing was terrible in the first half, and not just by the rookies.

[NTB]

Watch on YouTube

[MathiasPW]

Jazz have Hood who is also pretty amazing. And their pick Lyles looks great as well. They are gonna cause trouble sooner than later

I don't mind those players..i just think booker > lyles and hood. By a long way too. Imagine someone proposed that trade..would you accept?.. I wouldn't. N personally I love the idea of having 2 elite wing players on the same team. doesn't happen often but its enjoyable to watch when it does.

I dont think I would because Booker has Superstar potential and we desperately need one.

But I´m trying to point out how it´s hard to blame Utah for picking Lyles ahead of Booker.

[Jarlaxle0204]

There are two kinds of PGs. The ones that try to make their teammates better and control the tempo, and the ones who just care about shooting and dribbling. Second ones usually do not bring wins to the table and are boring to watch. Knight shot 16 times yesterday, more than any other player. For God's sake he is not a starter. He would ruin all our offense and flow, or the little of it we have now.

He's coming off the bench though. He's not going to be a starter this year so I'm not sure what you're saying. He's going to play the Crawford role which I think fits him pretty well. Watching last night's game was pretty painful at times. It's not like Knight was taking shots away from people who were hitting them. No one could score so he started taking it upon himself with the 2nd unit.

I'm not a huge fan of Knight by any reason but I think he's better than some people on this board make him out to be and will fit into the role that we now are proposing for him.

[LukasBMW]

Missed the game. If anyone has a replay stream, please PM me.

Me too

I got it to work on Sunslive by using Google with the HOLA extension. It took 5-10 minutes of playing around with it. I had to close the browser and re-open it a few times.

OT: Can anyone explain how google HOLA works. It only gives you the option of what country you need to browse from. It does not give you an exact location. How then can Google HOLA detect that the game is available only to those in the Phoenix area and project that IP? HOLA doesn't ask for a city, only a country, so it's not like you can specify Phoenix.

[darealjuice]

Missed the game. If anyone has a replay stream, please PM me.

Me too

I got it to work on Sunslive by using Google with the HOLA extension. It took 5-10 minutes of playing around with it. I had to close the browser and re-open it a few times.

OT: Can anyone explain how google HOLA works. It only gives you the option of what country you need to browse from. It does not give you an exact location. How then can Google HOLA detect that the game is available only to those in the Phoenix area and project that IP? HOLA doesn't ask for a city, only a country, so it's not like you can specify Phoenix.

It's like a proxy, you connect to another server before going to the website that you want to so that you disguise your location/id with the location of the server. Honestly HOLA probably isn't safe to use though, I'm almost positive they track their users browsing habits when it's on.

[LukasBMW]

Perhaps I'm being Mr. Positive, but,

Before we make decisions on our players, let's wait and see what happens in the regular season. Coach is still tweaking lineups and guys who won't play much at all are still getting big minutes. Len only played 25 minutes last night.

Also, I don't think we need Len to be an allstar. Chriss and Booker are going to be our allstars. Amare with a high IQ and Harden with a better attitude.

Finally, he is going to be a restricted free agent. No need to pay him big money now. We can just match what the market gives him.

All that said, I do think he would benefit from roids. Needs more RAGE and a bit more muscle. I'm only half joking. See that Lebron Doctor in Miami Len!