Dragan Bender News, Discussion and Highlights

[bwgood77]

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[bwgood77]

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[Veggamattic]

I was thinking that Bender would be a more likely player to get minutes but I am disappointed by what I've seen from him in summer league and pre-season. Chriss looks raw but I see tons of potential. Bender has just looked really bad. He makes bad play after bad play and hasn't even really had a decent game yet unless it was one not televised.

[MrMiyagi]

I was thinking that Bender would be a more likely player to get minutes but I am disappointed by what I've seen from him in summer league and pre-season. Chriss looks raw but I see tons of potential. Bender has just looked really bad. He makes bad play after bad play and hasn't even really had a decent game yet unless it was one not televised.

He's 18. Everyone kept saying "He competed against grown men! Much more prepared than college prospects!" but he's young and he's thin. He'll get there eventually. He's got great tools and we're not looking to rush him. So, how about not rushing judgment?

[Zelaznyrules]

I was thinking that Bender would be a more likely player to get minutes but I am disappointed by what I've seen from him in summer league and pre-season. Chriss looks raw but I see tons of potential. Bender has just looked really bad. He makes bad play after bad play and hasn't even really had a decent game yet unless it was one not televised.

I would have said almost the exact opposite. I knew he was young, undeveloped, inexperienced, coming to a new country, playing in a very different game etc. and so I expected it to take quite awhile for him to adjust. But that's not what happened. He's made mistakes and he's clearly not ready to play a major role but if you've seen nothing but bad play after bad play, I have no idea how to respond to that. He's not played great but he has done great things out there. He's made some great passes, some great blocks, put up some nice shots, blocked out, filled the lane on the break and so on.

[KPCB34]

Admittedly I haven't been able to watch full games yet but I am impressed by his defense, by no stretch am I saying he is great defensively but I must admit I just assumed he would have no idea on defense. He has made some impressive blocks and has handled himself better than I expected on the perimeter

He definitely hasn't looked all that good offensively but he has made some nice passes, I think he will come into his own eventually and be a quality player for us but will be a slower process than what we have seen with Chriss.

[batsmasher]

Marquese is productive and raw. Dragan is unproductive and raw.

Dragan's fundamentally (at least defensively) better than Chriss, and productivity is something which will come with a higher usage rate once he gets more comfortable. I just hope Dragan doesn't have similar mental issues as Len, as we are expecting a similar player development profile as Len.

[Thespianoid]

Bender won't be productive offensively until the Suns stop parking him in the corner and forgetting he exists - the ball rarely swings his way. Not sure how any player would be productive in that role, especially a guy that's not a shooter at this stage of his development.

Imagine if the Magic parked Aaron Gordon in the corner, or the Sixers did to Ben Simmons, and they rarely if ever touched the ball on the offensive end. Probably wouldn't perform. Probably wouldn't get to see their playmaking ability and instead would just see their poor outside shooting. And come to a conclusion that they weren't ready to play.

[Veggamattic]

I was thinking that Bender would be a more likely player to get minutes but I am disappointed by what I've seen from him in summer league and pre-season. Chriss looks raw but I see tons of potential. Bender has just looked really bad. He makes bad play after bad play and hasn't even really had a decent game yet unless it was one not televised.

He's 18. Everyone kept saying "He competed against grown men! Much more prepared than college prospects!" but he's young and he's thin. He'll get there eventually. He's got great tools and we're not looking to rush him. So, how about not rushing judgment?

I think watching him play big minutes in 7-8 games is no rush. I try and keep a running tally in my head of all the good things players do and all the bad things and the scale has been painfully lopsided. I know fan boys don't like to think this way and always try and stay positive in a mist of cognitive dissonance but I am a realist, even though I would be surprised if I haven't been a fan longer than most people on this forum. So far he stinks. He never looks ready when the ball comes to him. He commits bad turnovers and stupid fouls and his shooting has been terrible. He might eventually mature into something great but right now he has disappointed me.

[bwgood77]

Bender won't be productive offensively until the Suns stop parking him in the corner and forgetting he exists.

I think that is product of two things. The other young guys we have on the roster who we are trying to get a gauge on, and possibly fo his own sake so he doesn't take too much on too quick after a major change. You know better than I do, but putting the focus at this point on getting used to the 3 pt line isn't necessarily a bad thing. At this point he might get a little manhandled in the middle, especially in the regular season, so to put him there in preseason might be premature. Not sure though..they are bringing him along as they see fit obviously.

[bwgood77]

Bender won't be productive offensively until the Suns stop parking him in the corner and forgetting he exists - the ball rarely swings his way. Not sure how any player would be productive in that role, especially a guy that's not a shooter at this stage of his development.

Imagine if the Magic parked Aaron Gordon in the corner, or the Sixers did to Ben Simmons, and they rarely if ever touched the ball on the offensive end. Probably wouldn't perform. Probably wouldn't get to see their playmaking ability and instead would just see their poor outside shooting. And come to a conclusion that they weren't ready to play.

Well now that you edited your post after I quoted and typed up a reply, I agree, he has fantastic playmaking ability. They know it, and they will see it. It's a little tougher since they also drafted Chriss and are STILL trying to figure out what they have with Len. I think, had they not drafted Chriss, Bender would look a lot better now and be in a different role. I think they will eventually be a nice pair together and a good future frontcourt because they both can stretch but also have a few different strengths.

[Thespianoid]

Bender won't be productive offensively until the Suns stop parking him in the corner and forgetting he exists.

I think that is product of two things. The other young guys we have on the roster who we are trying to get a gauge on, and possibly fo his own sake so he doesn't take too much on too quick after a major change. You know better than I do, but putting the focus at this point on getting used to the 3 pt line isn't necessarily a bad thing. At this point he might get a little manhandled in the middle, especially in the regular season, so to put him there in preseason might be premature. Not sure though..they are bringing him along as they see fit obviously.

You may be right that the Suns are trying to limit his exposure in the paint, but I disagree with that approach mainly because 4's these days aren't going to be jostling for position and battling that much under the boards. They mostly fly in from the perimeter/midrange to collect rebounds. And if they're concerned about post defense, well, we saw what Vonleh did to Chriss, and the Suns aren't trying to protect him from that.

Offensively, there are simply better ways to get a young playmaking/faceup 4 learning reps than how the Suns are doing it. Getting him used to the 3PT line is one thing - parking him in the corner, out of his natural comfort zone, and barely having him touch the ball, that's another. I've already probably talked about this way too much but they really should be putting him in elbow DHO, double high PnR (he pops and receives the ball looking for the diving big), running an occasional side PnR with the 5, or even just letting him run the break/use transition drag screens after a defensive rebound. You'll see production and he gets to get used to the 3PT line.

[bwgood77]

I was thinking that Bender would be a more likely player to get minutes but I am disappointed by what I've seen from him in summer league and pre-season. Chriss looks raw but I see tons of potential. Bender has just looked really bad. He makes bad play after bad play and hasn't even really had a decent game yet unless it was one not televised.

He's 18. Everyone kept saying "He competed against grown men! Much more prepared than college prospects!" but he's young and he's thin. He'll get there eventually. He's got great tools and we're not looking to rush him. So, how about not rushing judgment?

I think watching him play big minutes in 7-8 games is no rush. I try and keep a running tally in my head of all the good things players do and all the bad things and the scale has been painfully lopsided. I know fan boys don't like to think this way and always try and stay positive in a mist of cognitive dissonance but I am a realist, even though I would be surprised if I haven't been a fan longer than most people on this forum. So far he stinks. He never looks ready when the ball comes to him. He commits bad turnovers and stupid fouls and his shooting has been terrible. He might eventually mature into something great but right now he has disappointed me.

Most of us knew he wasn't going to be great immediately and being the youngest guy in the league, adapting to a game with new rules, court, 3 pt line, etc, would take time. We are patient with him. At least most of us.

I'm not sure what your interest is in this or if you are just stopping by to say he sucks or what. We all realized Bender and Chriss both were boom/bust picks and both, to me, have impressed me more than I expected.

If you are just going to keep posting telling us how terrible he is at 18, then there probably isn't any reason for you to post here.

[MrMiyagi]

I was thinking that Bender would be a more likely player to get minutes but I am disappointed by what I've seen from him in summer league and pre-season. Chriss looks raw but I see tons of potential. Bender has just looked really bad. He makes bad play after bad play and hasn't even really had a decent game yet unless it was one not televised.

He's 18. Everyone kept saying "He competed against grown men! Much more prepared than college prospects!" but he's young and he's thin. He'll get there eventually. He's got great tools and we're not looking to rush him. So, how about not rushing judgment?

I think watching him play big minutes in 7-8 games is no rush. I try and keep a running tally in my head of all the good things players do and all the bad things and the scale has been painfully lopsided. I know fan boys don't like to think this way and always try and stay positive in a mist of cognitive dissonance but I am a realist, even though I would be surprised if I haven't been a fan longer than most people on this forum. So far he stinks. He never looks ready when the ball comes to him. He commits bad turnovers and stupid fouls and his shooting has been terrible. He might eventually mature into something great but right now he has disappointed me.

[bwgood77]

Bender won't be productive offensively until the Suns stop parking him in the corner and forgetting he exists.

I think that is product of two things. The other young guys we have on the roster who we are trying to get a gauge on, and possibly fo his own sake so he doesn't take too much on too quick after a major change. You know better than I do, but putting the focus at this point on getting used to the 3 pt line isn't necessarily a bad thing. At this point he might get a little manhandled in the middle, especially in the regular season, so to put him there in preseason might be premature. Not sure though..they are bringing him along as they see fit obviously.

You may be right that the Suns are trying to limit his exposure in the paint, but I disagree with that approach mainly because 4's these days aren't going to be jostling for position and battling that much under the boards. They mostly fly in from the perimeter/midrange to collect rebounds. And if they're concerned about post defense, well, we saw what Vonleh did to Chriss, and the Suns aren't trying to protect him from that.

Offensively, there are simply better ways to get a young playmaking/faceup 4 involved than how the Suns are doing it. Getting him used to the 3PT line is one thing - parking him in the corner, out of his natural comfort zone, and barely having him touch the ball, that's another. I've already probably talked about this way too much but they really should be putting him in elbow DHO, double high PnR (he pops and receives the ball looking for the diving big), running an occasional side PnR with the 5, or even just letting him run the break/use transition drag screens after a defensive rebound. You'll see production and he gets to get used to the 3PT line.

You sound like you know his game well, and I'm sure you do, and if you are knowledgeable about such things, as you seem to be, I am sure they have to realize that too and will put him in that position to succeed at some point.

[Thespianoid]

He's 18. Everyone kept saying "He competed against grown men! Much more prepared than college prospects!" but he's young and he's thin. He'll get there eventually. He's got great tools and we're not looking to rush him. So, how about not rushing judgment?

I think watching him play big minutes in 7-8 games is no rush. I try and keep a running tally in my head of all the good things players do and all the bad things and the scale has been painfully lopsided. I know fan boys don't like to think this way and always try and stay positive in a mist of cognitive dissonance but I am a realist, even though I would be surprised if I haven't been a fan longer than most people on this forum. So far he stinks. He never looks ready when the ball comes to him. He commits bad turnovers and stupid fouls and his shooting has been terrible. He might eventually mature into something great but right now he has disappointed me.

yeah pretty much once somebody brings the term "fan boy" into a discussion, they've lost.

[Thespianoid]

I think that is product of two things. The other young guys we have on the roster who we are trying to get a gauge on, and possibly fo his own sake so he doesn't take too much on too quick after a major change. You know better than I do, but putting the focus at this point on getting used to the 3 pt line isn't necessarily a bad thing. At this point he might get a little manhandled in the middle, especially in the regular season, so to put him there in preseason might be premature. Not sure though..they are bringing him along as they see fit obviously.

You may be right that the Suns are trying to limit his exposure in the paint, but I disagree with that approach mainly because 4's these days aren't going to be jostling for position and battling that much under the boards. They mostly fly in from the perimeter/midrange to collect rebounds. And if they're concerned about post defense, well, we saw what Vonleh did to Chriss, and the Suns aren't trying to protect him from that.

Offensively, there are simply better ways to get a young playmaking/faceup 4 involved than how the Suns are doing it. Getting him used to the 3PT line is one thing - parking him in the corner, out of his natural comfort zone, and barely having him touch the ball, that's another. I've already probably talked about this way too much but they really should be putting him in elbow DHO, double high PnR (he pops and receives the ball looking for the diving big), running an occasional side PnR with the 5, or even just letting him run the break/use transition drag screens after a defensive rebound. You'll see production and he gets to get used to the 3PT line.

You sound like you know his game well, and I'm sure you do, and if you are knowledgeable about such things, as you seem to be, I am sure they have to realize that too and will put him in that position to succeed at some point.

Yeah I hope so. Maybe they will do that eventually, I guess I would just be doing it earlier

[Zelaznyrules]

Yeah I hope so. Maybe they will do that eventually, I guess I would just be doing it earlier

Did you miss his first few games? I ask because they weren't just parking him in the corner originally. I think it was clear the game was a little too fast and a little too physical for him initially and when the shots didn't fall he lost his confidence pretty quickly. I'm sure they'll expand his role as time goes on but this isn't just about developing Bender, it's about developing a team too. He's not the only raw player on this squad, unfortunately. And even some of our more experienced players such as Bledsoe and Knight still have a lot of learning to do.

[MrMiyagi]

yeah pretty much once somebody brings the term "fan boy" into a discussion, they've lost.

I mean, it's not like we're saying outlandish things like Bender is better than Simmons and will make Porzingis look like the "lite" version instead of the original. We are just patient with our 18 year old rookie. It's his own fault his ridiculous expectations weren't met. It's not like Bender got huge minutes overseas, why would you expect him to get big minutes in the NBA - the best league in the world?

I'm just happy that he moves well on defense and has a nice looking stroke from 3. He'd be worth the selection if he becomes a 7-foot 3nD guy, IMO. If his ball-handling and passing come along like most people think, that's gravy.

Honestly, if you look at my sig and some others, we didn't have many delusions of Bender and Chriss being instant impacts (or maybe many did have delusions and some of us are hoping to combat them). Chriss has been a wonderful surprise and we hope he continues to do well, but his success in the wake of Bender's struggles doesn't mean Bender is a lost cause or a mistake of a pick. Bender looks like an 18 year old rookie. And that's fine. Even if we picked him 4th overall. When you see him move on the court, especially on defense, you can see why we chose him.