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What fixes the Packers?

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Re: What fixes the Packers? 

Post#21 » by ReasonablySober » Tue Oct 18, 2016 10:39 pm

GBPackers47 wrote:There's a lot of "Fire McCarthy" talk on this thread (myself included), but as someone who doesn't follow other coaches and schemes too closely, who are some top HCs and OCs that would be a good fit here should McCarthy get canned? My initial thoughts are someone like Tom Coughlin, whose no-nonsense mentality might make this team play with a little more fire or someone like Josh McDaniels whose been under Belicheck for a while now.

Those two suggestions aren't based on play calling and scheme at all because I don't know too much about them in that regard, but what do other people think?


Jim Bob Cooter will be at or near the top of any coaching search. Kevin Sumlin and Tom Herman will be hot names from the college ranks.
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Re: What fixes the Packers? 

Post#22 » by El Duderino » Tue Oct 18, 2016 10:49 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
GBPackers47 wrote:There's a lot of "Fire McCarthy" talk on this thread (myself included), but as someone who doesn't follow other coaches and schemes too closely, who are some top HCs and OCs that would be a good fit here should McCarthy get canned? My initial thoughts are someone like Tom Coughlin, whose no-nonsense mentality might make this team play with a little more fire or someone like Josh McDaniels whose been under Belicheck for a while now.

Those two suggestions aren't based on play calling and scheme at all because I don't know too much about them in that regard, but what do other people think?


Jim Bob Cooter will be at or near the top of any coaching search. Kevin Sumlin and Tom Herman will be hot names from the college ranks.


No chance would Ted hire a college coach unless Sabean was leaving Alabama. I wouldn't either.

Josh McDaniels is going to get a head coaching job from somebody, not sure if Ted would go after him. I would put the odds very high though that if Ted does make a change, the next head coach would be from the offensive side of the ball.
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Re: What fixes the Packers? 

Post#23 » by FAH1223 » Wed Oct 19, 2016 3:33 pm

Watch tape of our offense from 2011-2014

Or from 2007-2010

Isn't it amazing we still moved the ball in 2013 with Tolzien and Flynn at QB? Our issue with Tolzien was turnovers and with Flynn - his noodle arm.
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Re: What fixes the Packers? 

Post#24 » by ReddRum » Wed Oct 19, 2016 4:47 pm

CLEANING HOUSE!! TT, McCarthy, medical staff, Dom Capers - everyone gone. I'm on my last nerve with this team. Its becoming unbearable watching them lose in the playoffs every year because of the incompetence of everyone besides the players.
#DrainTheSwamp
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Re: What fixes the Packers? 

Post#25 » by GBPackers47 » Wed Oct 19, 2016 6:11 pm

ReddRum wrote:CLEANING HOUSE!! TT, McCarthy, medical staff, Dom Capers - everyone gone. I'm on my last nerve with this team. Its becoming unbearable watching them lose in the playoffs every year because of the incompetence of everyone besides the players.


If this team doesn't win the Super Bowl this year, some of these people better lose their jobs. If we were historically bad for a while, then I would be cool with just making the playoffs each year, but that's not the case. We went from winning the Super Bowl to having a 3-5 record in the playoffs since. Just making it isn't good enough anymore.
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Re: What fixes the Packers? 

Post#26 » by thomchatt3rton » Sun Oct 23, 2016 4:44 pm



An interesting read, but any premise that rests on the idea that MM went from being an universally acknowledged passing innovator/QBs guru to "stuck in a 1973" in just a few short years is suspect to me. This is a coach who designed schemes that the whole NFL copied just a few years ago- now the problem with him is that he's a dinosaur from the 70s? Hmm...

It's fair to criticize MM's scheme, but any criticism that doesn't start with our lack of proper personnel in the WR/TE corps cannot properly diagnose the problem.
The culmination of inexperience, injuries and lack of talented depth across the board at the WR/TE spots the last year and a half has to be the primary acknowledgement of any accurate assessment of the problem. This is a problem that was bad enough that even TT came out of his cave to use FAgency to address it (Cook this summer, JJ last summer).

It's personnel issues that have undermined MM's scheme. This is the primary assumption, imo. Then you move on to scheme from there.

This understanding makes the criticism of MM's schemes fundamentally different, because it then becomes "why hasn't MM adjusted his schemes to account for lack of the proper personnel?", which is very different from: "MMs scheme is essentially unsound".

This is an important distinction- and it's one that, right or wrong, accounts for MM's stubbornness in addressing the problems (it's also a distintion that, if one makes it, saves one from making shaky premises like "MM is stuck in the 1970s").
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Re: What fixes the Packers? 

Post#27 » by ReasonablySober » Sun Oct 23, 2016 5:11 pm

thomchatt3rton wrote:


An interesting read, but any premise that rests on the idea that MM went from being an universally acknowledged passing innovator/QBs guru to "stuck in a 1973" in just a few short years is suspect to me. This is a coach who designed schemes that the whole NFL copied just a few years ago- now the problem with him is that he's a dinosaur from the 70s? Hmm...


It's entirely about his failure to change and adapt. That's MM's problem.
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Re: What fixes the Packers? 

Post#28 » by thomchatt3rton » Sun Oct 23, 2016 5:41 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
thomchatt3rton wrote:


An interesting read, but any premise that rests on the idea that MM went from being an universally acknowledged passing innovator/QBs guru to "stuck in a 1973" in just a few short years is suspect to me. This is a coach who designed schemes that the whole NFL copied just a few years ago- now the problem with him is that he's a dinosaur from the 70s? Hmm...


It's entirely about his failure to change and adapt. That's MM's problem.


Failure to change and adapt to what though? Inadequacies in personnel since 2015? Or to "modern" NFL defenses?

I know the NFL is evolve-or-die, but the idea that MM went from master offensive innovator to obsolete dinosaur in 3 or 4 seasons is pretty hard to swallow for me. Especially when you have a more direct answer (dearth of talent catching the ball) staring you right in the face.
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Re: What fixes the Packers? 

Post#29 » by Ron Swanson » Sun Oct 23, 2016 8:13 pm

I don't see how the talent at WR is an issue. Adams always had the talent but it hasn't been until recently (since the WAS playoff game) we're he's seemed to put it all together, and Aaron still needs to get better with his accuracy. Montgomery and Cobb out of the backfield and in the slot respectively is utilizing their talents to their proper roles.

I'll be in the stands at the Atlanta game. If Rodgers looks competent enough like he did Thursday and we don't utilize a similar game plan to attack their subpar secondary, I'm ready to put this on McCarthy.
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Re: What fixes the Packers? 

Post#30 » by thomchatt3rton » Sun Oct 23, 2016 8:54 pm

Ron Swanson wrote:I don't see how the talent at WR is an issue. Adams always had the talent but it hasn't been until recently (since the WAS playoff game) we're he's seemed to put it all together, and Aaron still needs to get better with his accuracy. Montgomery and Cobb out of the backfield and in the slot respectively is utilizing their talents to their proper roles.

I'll be in the stands at the Atlanta game. If Rodgers looks competent enough like he did Thursday and we don't utilize a similar game plan to attack their subpar secondary, I'm ready to put this on McCarthy.


As you say yourself, Adams is just now (maybe) coming into his own. Maybe Ty is just now doing the same. Cook got hurt just as he was starting to figure in the O. Jordy does NOT look 100% to me. RRodgers isnt much. Janis and Abby cant get on the field.

That leaves Cobb.

So if we're running an O based on timing and consistently being in-sync, Rodgers hasnt had much in terms of consistent, quality targets the last season and a half (roughly).

If Ty and Adams are emerging

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