Rudy Gay To The Clippers Inevitable - And Its Consequences

Wammy Giveaway · Post #1 » by **Wammy Giveaway** » Mon Sep 19, 2016 5:47 pm

You've already seen these:

Read on Twitter

And already, the rumor mill has begun:

Read on Twitter

And I'm here to tell you: not only do I believe it's gonna happen, it's gonna be painful. In three ways:

1. If Clips get Rudy via trade, Griffin is gone. I can't see Paul or Jordan traded. The bench guys are here to stay. The draft picks will most likely go, but packaged with what. Doc ain't giving up his lucky charm son OR his only-small-forward-and-best-friend-in-the-whole-world Paul Pierce. Oh yeah: Doc doesn't want anybody taking away Pierce's sacred starting small forward spot, making for an awkward welcoming pitch.

2. If Clips get Rudy via buyout, someone's getting cut. Again, Doc ain't cutting Paul Pierce.

3. Once Rudy becomes a Clipper, they are in danger of missing the playoffs.

Teams who've had Rudy all missed the playoffs save for the lockout season. Have a look:

2006-07: Draft-day trade from Rockets to Grizzlies, 15th seed, missed playoffs
2007-08: Grizzlies, 14th seed, missed playoffs
2008-09: Grizzlies, 12th seed, missed playoffs
2009-10: Grizzlies, 10th seed, missed playoffs
2010-11: Grizzlies, suffered shoulder sublaxation (out for year), 8th seed, 2nd round exit to Thunder (without Rudy)
2011-12: Grizzlies, lockout season, 4th seed, active, 1st round exit to Clippers (with Rudy)
2012-13: Grizzlies, traded to Raptors mid-season, 5th seed, conference finals loss to Spurs (without Rudy)
2012-13: Raptors, traded from Grizzlies mid-season, 10th seed, missed playoffs
2013-14: Raptors, traded to Kings near mid-season, 3rd seed, 1st round exit to Nets (without Rudy)
2013-14: Kings, traded from Raptors near mid-season, 13th seed, missed playoffs
2014-15: Kings, 13th seed, missed playoffs
2015-16: Kings, 13th seed, missed playoffs
2016-17: Kings, 12th seed, missed playoffs

Every year Rudy spent with a team, that team missed the playoffs. Grizzlies were able to make the playoffs in the lockout season due to the lesser amount of games (66 versus 82), but it also featured the season where the Clippers ushered a 27-point miracle comeback to steal Game 1, and later the series. The moment teams traded Rudy to another team, their fortunes immediately changed. Both Memphis and Toronto were rewarded with conference finals debuts after trading Rudy: while Grizzlies visit was instant, it took the Raptors two years before they had their day.

Right now the Kings have him. The moment they trade Rudy, they will become a playoff contender. If the Kings send Rudy to the Clippers, the Clip's hopes of a western conference finals berth may be in jeopardy.

But they need a good small forward. Rudy is a 2010 and 2014 FIBA gold medalist.

Would you welcome Rudy to the Clippers, even at the risk of a cursed season?

Forte IV · Post #2 » by **Forte IV** » Tue Sep 20, 2016 5:05 am

So to sum it up. You believe Rudy Gay to be cursed. And in turn, if we were to acquire him, his curse would transfer over to us, resulting in us becoming cursed, and missing the playoffs. But I am here to tell you friend. That this franchise is already cursed. And last time I checked, two negatives, equal one mighty positive. So if we add the curse of Rudy Gay, to our curse, the two curses will curse each other out or whatever and we will win the championship. That's what I took from this.

Wammy Giveaway · Post #3 » by **Wammy Giveaway** » Tue Sep 20, 2016 7:04 am

Forte IV wrote:So if we add the curse of Rudy Gay, to our curse, the two curses will curse each other out or whatever and we will win the championship.

You mean cancel each other out.

But when was the last time two wrongs made a right in the NBA? Morally, it does not compute. In real life, the common solution to a negative problem is a positive response, in which a positive and negative cancel each other out, assuming each of these values were equal.

Logically, mathematically speaking, a negative times a negative equals a positive. Doesn't matter how big or how small the said number is, as long as both of the affected values are negative so that the final solution converts into a positive. (Look at me, I'm speaking like Bill Nye.)

But the history of Rudy Gay says I can't see it happening without giving somebody up. Trading Griffin is the worst case scenario; trading Redick hurts the offense; trading Pierce and/or Austin will hurt Doc's heart deeply. Something's gotta give here.

Ranma · Post #4 » by **Ranma** » Tue Sep 20, 2016 7:31 am

I've been a proponent of getting Rudy Gay to the Clippers since the 2006 draft. In fact, I proposed trading Corey Maggette for the draft pick to acquire him at the time. I've felt for a long time that Gay had the all-around skills and even the mindset to contribute to a winning team. However, his time with the Grizzlies, particularly playing with O.J. Mayo, didn't help with his development.

At UConn, Gay had decent assists numbers (relative for college) and was a presence as a shot-blocker. Then when he went to the pros, he had to compete for shots with his own teammate Mayo instead of working together. I faulted Mayo and the Grizzlies organization more for this than Gay back then given Mayo's publicity-seeking and the Grizzlies' ill-advised choice to focus on Mayo initially.

Now Gay has come out and said that he will opt out of his deal for the following season after 2016-17, which should limit his trade value. He's 30 years old and looking for a big extension. No executive outside of Doc Rivers is going to give up much for a rental player nor will a team that has the cap space to absorb his anticipated cap hit when they can just sign him outright next offseason.

The encouraging thing is that Gay says he wants to be in a winning situation. The downside is that--like most of Doc's acquisitions--he may be a few years too late to realize the promise I once held for him. He's gotten into bad habits in settling for shots while also not rebounding or passing as well as he should given his size and skills. Would it be too late for him to change his spots despite what he says? Given his age and reputation thus far, it wouldn't be a sound gamble to pay a hefty price to find out.

Having said that, I'd still like to roll the dice on him as long as we don't give up any of the core 4 (Paul, Griffin, Jordan, or Redick). Maybe coach Dave Joerger can up his trade value by instituting more of a defensive and team concept in Sacramento, but given the trainwreck under owner Vivek Ranadive, I wouldn't count on it. I'd hope that the Kings would settle for trading Gay's expiring deal at the deadline for 2 full years remaining on Jamal Crawford's and filler. It would probably take throwing in Brice Johnson, Diamond Stone, and the rights to David Michineau. While I hate giving up prospects--even those drafted by Doc--it would make sense given our coach's reluctance to play and develop rookies and his over-reliance on washed-up vets.

We can talk about curses, but the root causes of the respective situations for both Gay and the Clippers have been organizational leadership. The Clippers with Donald Sterling, Elgin Baylor, and now Doc. Gay with the aforementioned Grizzlies' leadership and the Kings' current ownership. Gay would be a better proposition than Jeff Green or Paul Pierce when we respectively acquired them, but he's far from a homerun as a player in need of rehabilitation. Honestly, if we would just identify and develop young players better or even competently, this would not be the longstanding problem that it has been.

Forte IV · Post #5 » by **Forte IV** » Tue Sep 20, 2016 4:07 pm

All of these rumors make me wish we kinda kept on to Jeff Green and could do a simple Green for Gay trade near the trade deadline when the Kings were desperate to get anything.

Post #6 » by **Andre Roberstan** » Tue Sep 20, 2016 5:00 pm

I don't know how the Clips make it work. Kings are not going to want to trade for Rivers, and Doc won't trade Jamal even if the Kings wanted him. Redick/Johnson is the only other package that gets you close on salary, I think, and that's pretty unlikely. First pick the Clips can trade is a 2019 2nd-rounder, and I think Gay gets more than that.

Forte IV · Post #7 » by **Forte IV** » Tue Sep 20, 2016 6:42 pm

I think Doc's infatuation is overblown. He plays Jamal because he's basically forced to. It's well known he's been trying to trade him for a legit SF for a while now.

madmaxmedia · Post #8 » by **madmaxmedia** » Tue Sep 20, 2016 10:05 pm

You lost me at:

1. If Clips get Rudy via trade, Griffin is gone. I can't see Paul or Jordan traded. The bench guys are here to stay. The draft picks will most likely go, but packaged with what. Doc ain't giving up his lucky charm son OR his only-small-forward-and-best-friend-in-the-whole-world Paul Pierce. Oh yeah: Doc doesn't want anybody taking away Pierce's sacred starting small forward spot, making for an awkward welcoming pitch.

The rest of the quoted implies, what, that Rudy is traded for Griffin? Griffin leaves via FA, due to whatever we do come up with to trade for Gay? What am I missing?

Post #9 » by **og15** » Wed Sep 21, 2016 4:43 am

Don't care for Rudy Gay

illastrate · Post #10 » by **illastrate** » Thu Sep 22, 2016 7:10 am

Lol, another classic Wammy conspiracy theory post. Have at it boys and girls.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using Tapatalk

Ranma · Post #11 » by **Ranma** » Thu Nov 3, 2016 1:54 am

Gay is not only scoring and shooting well early, but he's putting up nice numbers in rebounding, assists, blocks, and steals. This is the all-around talent I envisioned when I wanted to trade for him in the 2006 draft.

Read on Twitter

Post #12 » by **og15** » Thu Nov 3, 2016 11:22 pm

I'll give it up to Rudy for doing very well to start the season

Chronz · Post #13 » by **Chronz** » Fri Nov 4, 2016 2:02 am

Forte IV wrote:So to sum it up. You believe Rudy Gay to be cursed. And in turn, if we were to acquire him, his curse would transfer over to us, resulting in us becoming cursed, and missing the playoffs. But I am here to tell you friend. That this franchise is already cursed. And last time I checked, two negatives, equal one mighty positive. So if we add the curse of Rudy Gay, to our curse, the two curses will curse each other out or whatever and we will win the championship. That's what I took from this.

Lmfao

Roscoe Sheed · Post #14 » by **Roscoe Sheed** » Fri Nov 4, 2016 4:44 am

If the Clippers could package something like Crawford and Johnson or Bass for Gay, I'd do that trade immediately. It is like watching the same movie over and over. Late in the game teams will put a long wing defender on CP3 who is nearly as quick as him and it is basically like running up hill. Blake can be a nice second option in those scenarios- maybe the first option (however, he was stinking out the arena last night), but they need somebody that can exploit mismatches at the 3 and Gay could certainly do that. If only Pierce were even 3 or 4 years younger he could have helped immensely too.

Roscoe Sheed · Post #15 » by **Roscoe Sheed** » Sun Nov 27, 2016 4:05 pm

Apparently he still wants out. Doc should call to see what they want. I feel like the clippers are still missing a piece in terms of being elite. Not sure gay is the answer, but he is a very good player

nickhx2 · Post #16 » by **nickhx2** » Sun Nov 27, 2016 4:46 pm

clips are already elite. they just need to have actual rest time and a coach who will actually call for practice more than once in the first month.

Roscoe Sheed · Post #17 » by **Roscoe Sheed** » Sun Nov 27, 2016 7:49 pm

nickhx2 wrote:clips are already elite. they just need to have actual rest time and a coach who will actually call for practice more than once in the first month.

I'm a huge Clipper fan, but I just have my doubts against teams like Cleveland and GSW. I'm just being a realist.

I'm still fearful of match up problems, particularly against GSW. Redick is too small to guard any of the following: Thompson, Durant, Iguodala, and Livingston. Luc is really the only guy that can guard those guys- perhaps Wes Johnson on a good day. Crawford is obviously not the answer on defense either. The problem is that Luc is a one-way player basically and they will just ignore him on offense. It is essentially the same problem that has persisted for the Clippers for a long time- they need a two-way small forward. Gay or Wilson Chandler would probably fit the bill.

nickhx2 · Post #18 » by **nickhx2** » Sun Nov 27, 2016 8:42 pm

doubts about matchups are fair but that doesn't disqualify the team from being elite. the team has shown it can be there on both ends of the floor and, again, the team has had no legitimate rest or practice time.

maybe clips can't beat gs/cavs, who knows. i certainly think the team can, especially with a bit of a tuneup. but being a top 3 team in the league still certainly means that they're in an elite tier.

Post #19 » by **og15** » Sun Nov 27, 2016 9:01 pm

Yea, the team is elite so far, they've shown they can be in the top on offense and defense, though of course we need to see more of that defense moving forward. Of course they still need to be aware that there are some holes and if they have any opportunities to shore up the roster, they should be willing to move on them. Whether there will actually be any opportunities to improve the team is the question.

Based on who is going out and how they could integrate him, Rudy Gay could be helpful, but it's not necessarily a given, and the players the Clippers can trade for him (Crawford, Rivers, Johnson, Bass) are not really going to get anyone trade partners excited.

LACtdom · Post #20 » by **LACtdom** » Mon Nov 28, 2016 1:12 am

I don't know if Rudy is the answer but we are still "something" off from confidently making it to the Finals.
I like Luc as our SF, and believe our bench will be our downfall as I don't think they can maintain what they have done thus far.
We still have dead weight on our roster and if we can offload some of that in the Rudy trade, I will be happy.