The Kevin Durant Thread (2016 - 17 Pt. 1)

[te887848]

Wishing injury on a player because he left a basketball team is **** pathetic.

Bandwagoning to the Warriors after calling yourself a Thunder fan is what I call pathetic.

Not really. You only live once. Why waste your life on a mediocre team that will never win anything (Thunder) instead of watching possibly the greatest show in team sports that will quite easily win several titles in the years to come (Warriors)?

[te887848]

I lost some respect for KD after he started talking trash to the OKC bench tonight. It's great that you played well and your team is destroying, but talking trash when you jumped ship to a powerhouse team and winning isn't something to be proud of.

I don't like Lebron at all, but at least he wasn't talking trash to the Cavs when he was destroying them with Wade and Bosh the year he left.

He himself was the reason GSW was a powerhouse last night and destroyed OKC, so he earned the right to mock OKC.

[Bergmaniac]

Wishing injury on a player because he left a basketball team is **** pathetic.

Bandwagoning to the Warriors after calling yourself a Thunder fan is what I call pathetic.

Not really. You only live once. Why waste your life on a mediocre team that will never win anything (Thunder) instead of watching possibly the greatest show in team sports that will quite easily win several titles in the years to come (Warriors)?

What is stopping him from watching the Warriors without being a fan of them?

[te887848]

Bandwagoning to the Warriors after calling yourself a Thunder fan is what I call pathetic.

Not really. You only live once. Why waste your life on a mediocre team that will never win anything (Thunder) instead of watching possibly the greatest show in team sports that will quite easily win several titles in the years to come (Warriors)?

What is stopping him from watching the Warriors without being a fan of them?

He is a fan of Durant. Durant plays for the Warriors. Therefore it would seem to follow that he should be a fan of the Warriors. What's the issue here???

[tsherkin]

Yeah, I mean, it's all hypocrisy, the hate. And the gymnastics done to separate this from what Lebron did are remarkable.

Lebron went to a team and turned them into a contender, Kd went to a team that was already a serious contender. That's the difference. Also it's pretty clear that Curry, Green and Klay>>Wade and Bosh.

It's wasn't the same thing, and people need to stop saying it was.

I struggle with how this isn't understood.

This isn't a meaningful separation. He went to a team with a scoring title winner who'd finished 3rd in the MVP race, while adding an All-NBA 2nd Team 24/9 power forward. That they weren't directly proven from having already playing together is mostly immaterial. And again, that Curry and everyone already on the Warriors appear greater than Bosh and Wade is also immaterial. The root concept is the same: acquiring a superior situation through moving to another team instead of relying on management to do it for you.

There's nothing significantly different about these two situations. KD went to a better situation, but he didn't go about it in any meaningfully different way. It's just an artificial barrier put up so they don't have to like a player. It's fine not to like a player, but these are expressions of artifice, not anything consequential beyond the subjective.

[bondom34]

Lebron went to a team and turned them into a contender, Kd went to a team that was already a serious contender. That's the difference. Also it's pretty clear that Curry, Green and Klay>>Wade and Bosh.

It's wasn't the same thing, and people need to stop saying it was.

I struggle with how this isn't understood.

This isn't a meaningful separation. He went to a team with a scoring title winner who'd finished 3rd in the MVP race, while adding an All-NBA 2nd Team 24/9 power forward. That they weren't directly proven from having already playing together is mostly immaterial. And again, that Curry and everyone already on the Warriors appear greater than Bosh and Wade is also immaterial. The root concept is the same: acquiring a superior situation through moving to another team instead of relying on management to do it for you.

There's nothing significantly different about these two situations. KD went to a better situation, but he didn't go about it in any meaningfully different way. It's just an artificial barrier put up so they don't have to like a player. It's fine not to like a player, but these are expressions of artifice, not anything consequential beyond the subjective.

No, there's a consequential difference between a 73 win and a 47 win team. Actually quite a large gap.

[tsherkin]

No, there's a consequential difference between a 73 win and a 47 win team. Actually quite a large gap.

There's certainly a difference between the two teams. It isn't relevant to this discussion, though, because the 47-win team wasn't the team to which Lebron went anyhow. It'd be an error to suggest otherwise, since the 47-win 2010 Heat team did not include Chris Bosh. That alone invalidates this argument.

[bondom34]

No, there's a consequential difference between a 73 win and a 47 win team. Actually quite a large gap.

There's certainly a difference between the two teams. It isn't relevant to this discussion, though, because the 47-win team wasn't the team to which Lebron went anyhow. It'd be an error to suggest otherwise, since the 47-win 2010 Heat team did not include Chris Bosh. That alone invalidates this argument.

Except again, it was still a 47 win team. To add, Lebron went to a team where he was the best talent, coming off his own MVP instead of joining the reigning 2 time MVP. To add to that, that Miami team never had any interaction with the Cavs in the post season. To add to that, even if you want to assume Bosh were on Miami that is still not a 73 win team. To add to THAT that Miami team didn't have as good a roster outside those big 3. To add to THAT the Cavs team Lebron left was worse than this OKC team. To add to THAT that Miami team hadn't won recent titles, hence the idea of riding along for rings.

I mean, the differences aren't just minor quibbles. They're gaping chasms. To ignore them is fine, but realize they're there to the vast majority of people.

[RSCD3_]

More than anything I find it annoying if Kevin Durant wanted to talk a bunch of BS during games and play a "who me, why I would never..."? Innocent type of role. Like he acts like a heel during a game and then tries to act like the media is causing all of the drama when he indulges in it himself.

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[tsherkin]

Except again, it was still a 47 win team.

This is patently irrelevant, and repeating it isn't going to matter. He added a multiple-repeat All-Star who was a hyper-efficient 20/9 player with range that wasn't on the team the previous year. That renders the record of the team in the previous season completely irrelevant to this conversation. Further, the fact that the end result of Miami's collection of stars was different than the Warriors is also not terribly salient to the idea that these moves were basically the same thing, save for a matter of degrees, and hardly sufficient in their differences to merit the wide swing in characterization we've seen. People are happy with Lebron NOW, but they were irate at the time, for all the same nonsense reasons.

I mean, the differences aren't just minor quibbles. They're gaping chasms. To ignore them is fine, but realize they're there to the vast majority of people.

Right, but you're missing the point in your zeal to harp on this aspect. It doesn't matter if they're a 70-win team or a 30-win team. The root concept is the same: they moved to a different situation with better talent for the purposes of upgrading their chances to win titles. Lebron went to join two other high-end All-Stars in Miami to create a team more favorable than the situation he had in Cleveland. Durant did the same.

[Bergmaniac]

No, there's a consequential difference between a 73 win and a 47 win team. Actually quite a large gap.

Not a fair comparison. The Warriors would never have won 73 games if they didn't have Bogut, Barnes, Barbosa and Ezeli, and the Heat would have won more if they had Bosh. The Warriors still would have won more games, sure, but the gap is not that big as that.

[bondom34]

Right, but you're missing the point in your zeal to harp on this aspect. It doesn't matter if they're a 70-win team or a 30-win team. The root concept is the same: they moved to a different situation with better talent for the purposes of upgrading their chances to win titles. Lebron went to join two other high-end All-Stars in Miami to create a team more favorable than the situation he had in Cleveland. Durant did the same.

So in that sense, he's the same as Al Horford?

Yeah, not buying that. You can claim it, but the heart of the matter is it isn't the same.

[bondom34]

Not a fair comparison. The Warriors would never have won 73 games if they didn't have Bogut, Barnes, Barbosa and Ezeli, and the Heat would have won more if they had Bosh. The Warriors still would have won more games, sure, but the gap is not that big as that.

And Lebron sould still have been the best Heat player for the prior seasons. Curry is the MVP.

[te887848]

Not a fair comparison. The Warriors would never have won 73 games if they didn't have Bogut, Barnes, Barbosa and Ezeli, and the Heat would have won more if they had Bosh. The Warriors still would have won more games, sure, but the gap is not that big as that.

And Lebron sould still have been the best Heat player for the prior seasons. Curry is the MVP.

That is true but Durant has taken over as the best player on the Warriors now, possibly the entire league. It's his team now.

[bondom34]

Not a fair comparison. The Warriors would never have won 73 games if they didn't have Bogut, Barnes, Barbosa and Ezeli, and the Heat would have won more if they had Bosh. The Warriors still would have won more games, sure, but the gap is not that big as that.

And Lebron sould still have been the best Heat player for the prior seasons. Curry is the MVP.

That is true but Durant has taken over as the best player on the Warriors now, possibly the entire league. It's his team now.

I'd tell Curry that.

[mischievous]

Are we really bringing up Chris Bosh when in comparison to a 73 win supporting cast? That's really grasping at straws now. And then someone bringing up how the Warriors role players contributed to 73 wins is beyond irrelevant, since the 2011 Heat had some of the very worst role players in the league.

KD going to the Warriors would've been like if Lebron joined the Celtics after losing to them in 2010. And then people would bring up, and they'd lose role players like Tony Allen or Rasheed Wallace so it doesn't matter.

[Bergmaniac]

LeBron picked the option which gave him the best teammates out of all possibilities which didn't require him to sign for a salary way below the market value. He couldn't have joined Boston or Lakers since these teams didn't have cap space.

Durant did the same. He was just lucky his free agency came when the cap rose so much which allowed a stacked team to sign him without having to trade away one of its stars.

[mischievous]

LeBron picked the option which gave him the best teammates out of all possibilities which didn't require him to sign for a salary way below the market value. He couldn't have joined Boston or Lakers since these teams didn't have cap space.

Durant did the same. He was just lucky his free agency came when the cap rose so much which allowed a stacked team to sign him without having to trade away one of its stars.

I think what myself and others are arguing is, not that both didn't pick good teammates or a great situation but just the vast difference in actual supporting cast that each went to. That's all. Also fwiw, given the way Wade broke down after 2011 Lebron ended up having to more than most would've imagined i think. I don't see Curry breaking down that way.

[StepBackCrack]

LeBron went to the best situation available at that time WITHOUT sacrificing salary. He couldn't go to Boston and expecting a high salary. Durant did the same thing but yeah the team he went to happens to be a better team (thanks to the CBA rising). He got lucky in that aspect. However people really underestimate the value of the players GS gave up for him. Without Bogut, they would never be close to 73 wins. He was extremely valuable to the team. Plus awesome bench players like Barbosa. This current team won't win the title without Durant. If he gets injured they are in huge huge trouble. They need him and that alone makes him deserving of getting credit if they end up winning the title. And it's not like he is playing 2nd fiddle to Steph on the team. As I said before, at WORST, Durant will be treated equal to Curry on this team since both are extremely talented hardworking superstars. At best, he has an argument for the being the best player on the team of course and so far in the season he played like it. You know what tho, the great thing is that both Curry and Durant don't give a crap about "who is the man?!" of the team. Both are unselfish superstars who are down to earth. Klay already said that's its great seeing how Durant isn't arrogant at all despite being so successful. If Durant had a big ego or felt the need to be "alpha" of the team, he would ruin this team for sure but he doesn't (thank God). He is a great teammate according to the players that play with him atm. The players that know him better than any of us.

[Bergmaniac]

You know what tho, the great thing is that both Curry and Durant don't give a crap about "who is the man?!" of the team. Both are unselfish superstars who are down to earth. Klay already said that's its great seeing how Durant isn't arrogant at all despite being so successful. If Durant had a big ego or felt the need to be "alpha" of the team, he would ruin this team for sure but he doesn't (thank God). He is a great teammate according to the players that play with him atm. The players that know him better than any of us.

That's what the teammates of all stars say while they are on the same team almost every time. It's basic PR and it's often a lie. It's probably true in this case, but far from certain.