Is West Trash (so far)?

[likashing]

I would 10x10 times take Speights over him though, mainly because Speights is extremely underrated as a big-time offensive weapon off the bench, as well as a solid rebounder. West has provided the rebounding, and extra steals, but is a ways away from Speights scoring wise. But I expect West's outlandish steal #s to drop as well, to the mean.

Speights' scoring is inefficient, inconsistent and overrated. Fans enjoy him because he would go on a hot streak once in a while. For every big shot he makes, he throws up a handful of bricks.

In addition, his body of work is negative overall due to his poor defense and overrated scoring ability. His real RPM was consistently low. His ts% is nothing to write home about either.

Speights:
14-15: rpm = -1.45 ts% .536
15-16: rpm = -1.24 ts% .504

And you mentioned about rebounding... West's defensive rebound % (drb%) is low so far right now, but when he is on-court, the team drb% is up. Like I said, he is a team player. He boxes out so the TEAM gets the rebound, it may not always be him ending up the box score rebound. His career personal drb% has been ~19% as well, about the same as Speights, so I am not too worried.

If you look at Speights' effect on drb%, we rebound worse when he's on (not to mention about giving up more points).

16-17 team drb% 74.0%
west on drb% 75.6%

15-16 team drb% 76.1%
speights on drb% 73.4%

14-15 team drb% 74.5%
speights on drb% 72.7%

**I only look at drb% because for our team, orb% is not too important because we are already #1 on offense and our team ts% is super high**

West is better than Speights now, and I believe West won't regress to be worse than Speights.

I am so glad Speights is gone and West is here.

[FNQ]

10 games.

His TS was actually .546 in 14-15, slumped last year.. and if we're using West's 10 game sample as a comparison, why not Speights' this year too? He's at .576 so far. Speights' job is to score on units that don't have primary scoring options, and as a backup spark plug, he does that well. In 10 minute bursts, he does that well. Having a rebound rate of 15-16.. that's pretty good. And West's team rebounding, while a good narrative for this year, didn't really apply last year (-1.4%) or the prior years in Indiana (-3%, -0.4%, -1.6%). And that pairs with his average 12-13 rebound rate, compared to Speights' 15-16%.

So the whole West as a team rebounder is a new narrative based on 10 games and historically has not been true. Maybe old dogs learn new tricks at 36, but everything points to looking way too hard into outliers to find the result you want. That's just what the data says.

[likashing]

We will see.

Speight's rebounding, defense, and negative RPM is a really low bar to clear though.

[jason bourne]

West was worthwhile having two years ago when he was on the Pacers, but then faded down the stretch. He's a SAS castoff and we got suckered in imho. Also, SAS took Dewayne Dedmon which made us settle for JaVale. I haven't seen SP8 this year, so will have to defer to those here who have.

[marthafokker]

Hope Kerr put McGee first before West like last game. Even Looney came in before West.

My eye test tells me West cannot play the 5 at his age. He is a perfect 9th guy right now.

[turk3d]

I totally agree that West would do a lot better playing 4 (he'd be an ideal backup for Draymond). I don't know if Kerr's tried it, but I think if he were paired with Dray from time to time, he might function a lot better (rather than pairing him with KD).

[FloydWarrior]

He's been so so...but at 36 I'm not keeping my hopes too high in terms of him getting better as the season goes on.

[cpower]

I think I will rank our big man like this:
looney, McGee/West, Zaza.
In the end , Zaza's stats will look the best because he played with starters and McGee will look the worst because he played with the 3rd strings. I think we should play other big men as starters just to see how they perform.

[Mylie10]

He's fine, I just think certain games are to fast for him, and he should never be the lone big out there. I'm going to rail on that last fact the entire year if Kerr doesn't pull his head out on that one.

[Left*My*Heart]

West chose to leave the Spurs, by declining his option. They may have been okay with him leaving, but thought I read they assumed he was staying with the team.

Not sure what exactly happened with the Warriors trying to re-sign Speights. They were supposedly interested in re-signing him, but then he took the minimum with the Clips. Might have been the front office's decision of West over Speights, but even at that, Speights would be a lot better than McAdoo off the bench.

The front office said they wanted to get tougher and West is tougher than Speights and typically plays better defense. The inability to spread the floor like Speights could, makes me prefer Speights. West should be more consistent in what he provides. I think the 5 has been a challenge for him early on.

[Phase 3]

I thought he would be more of a presence inside but he's really not at this stage of his career. But for the vet minimum, there was no risk at all in finding out if he could still play.

[and1GS]

I think he's going to be helpful in the long run. I can't imagine that Looney/McGee will be calm and composed once we hit the playoffs.

[FNQ]

We will see.

Speight's rebounding, defense, and negative RPM is a really low bar to clear though.

His RPM was worse than I thought, but in most cases that I remember, bench scorers that clearly aren't good enough to be starters usually had a negative RAPM, but when I looked half-assedly I couldn't find a reason for why that seemed to be true across the board

[SF_Warriors]

Yes and no.

For the price we got him at, cannot complain at all.

If zaza or dray is out, having a guy like west available could make a difference. West as a depth piece is more valuable than some of you may think.

I prefer them playing looney and mcgee over him, but given our lack of depth up front we need all the decent bodies we can get.
West is not a great nba center. He needs to have another big play alongside of him otherwise we are going to get killed by stronger teams.

[Splashin]

I think he'll come up big in a few key moments in the post season but he's tough to watch when I remember how good west was on the Pacers.

[and1GS]

Also keep in mind that Speights needed shots to get himself rolling offensively. With the way our team is structured, we have one of our big 3 scorers on the floor at all times. Not much flexibility to give Speights 3 straight shots on O with nobody to rebound for him. He reminded me a lot of Sasha Vujacic in LA. When he was in the game, he was getting his shots no matter what because there was an understanding his only job was to take deep J's.

I think West's ability to score down low will be big come playoff time. Also keep in mind that it took Speights about 2 years to figure out our defensive scheme due to such a low bball IQ. Here's hoping a hugely cerebral player like West shortens that learning curve significantly.

[Kuya]

I think he'll come up big in a few key moments in the post season but he's tough to watch when I remember how good west was on the Pacers.

He'll be lucky to average 2 minutes a game.

[gold0259]

Is he really playing at a discount?

[Left*My*Heart]

Yes, he declined his player option with the Spurs to sign with us for somewhat less.

I think he will be much improved come playoff time. He is adjusting to a new team, new offense and a new defense. I don't expect him to score in double digits or rebound in double digits, just provide consistent quality play when he is in the lineup. He is built for the ruggedness of the playoffs and why our front office went after him in May of this year.

[cdubbz]

Yes, he declined his player option with the Spurs to sign with us for somewhat less.

I think he will be much improved come playoff time. He is adjusting to a new team, new offense and a new defense. I don't expect him to score in double digits or rebound in double digits, just provide consistent quality play when he is in the lineup. He is built for the ruggedness of the playoffs and why our front office went after him in May of this year.

Sure. We also got him because we needed to sign any big for the veterans minimum lol. West will definitely help (i hope) when the pace is slowed down against some teams in playoffs. His ability to draw fouls in the paint during post ups will be valuable.