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Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns

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Re: Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns 

Post#221 » by TeamTragic » Sun Nov 27, 2016 11:42 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
batsmasher wrote:Guys I think there must be an error in the stats. Bender played 14 minutes and was a -10. Something must be wrong.


He came in with the starters early when Chriss got into foul trouble, when we were down big, and we quickly went on a run and he was the only guy with a +, at +7, but then when Knight, Len and Barbosa joined him, they collectively played so terribly that it ended up poorly reflecting on him. He's better when he plays with a good vet like Dudley, or with the starters. He should start instead of Chriss, but missing Dudley and Warren really hurt us in the game, as well as playing Knight.


Just for that post you are going on my friends list :D
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Re: Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns 

Post#222 » by Frank Lee » Mon Nov 28, 2016 12:01 am

Business as usual.
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Re: Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns 

Post#223 » by NavLDO » Mon Nov 28, 2016 4:23 am

Jdiddy701 wrote:Eric Bledsoe might be the best trade asset we have. He's been very good.


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So Len's having the best year of his career, and you've been on a kick on how much he sucks, and Bledsoe is shooting 27% from 3, which after this game, will move to 31%, but anyway, is averaging .7 fewer assts/gm than the past 2 seasons, and you say he's been very good? If you say so, man...
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Re: Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns 

Post#224 » by Jdiddy701 » Mon Nov 28, 2016 4:30 am

NavLDO wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:Eric Bledsoe might be the best trade asset we have. He's been very good.


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So Len's having the best year of his career, and you've been on a kick on how much he sucks, and Bledsoe is shooting 27% from 3, which after this game, will move to 31%, but anyway, is averaging .7 fewer assts/gm than the past 2 seasons, and you say he's been very good? If you say so, man...


Best year of his career? I don't know about that. I don't think he's had a good year to begin with so if this is his best, then whatever. He still plays like a rookie to me. He has a long way to go.

Eric Bledsoe has been good, as of late. I should have been clear with that. He clearly is the best asset the Suns have, not including the young guns.


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Re: Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns 

Post#225 » by NavLDO » Mon Nov 28, 2016 4:51 am

Jdiddy701 wrote:
NavLDO wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:Eric Bledsoe might be the best trade asset we have. He's been very good.


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So Len's having the best year of his career, and you've been on a kick on how much he sucks, and Bledsoe is shooting 27% from 3, which after this game, will move to 31%, but anyway, is averaging .7 fewer assts/gm than the past 2 seasons, and you say he's been very good? If you say so, man...


Best year of his career? I don't know about that. I don't think he's had a good year to begin with so if this is his best, then whatever. He still plays like a rookie to me. He has a long way to go.

Eric Bledsoe has been good, as of late. I should have been clear with that. He clearly is the best asset the Suns have, not including the young guns.


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Len's averaging almost 2 Rebs/gm, .1 Stl/gm, and .1 Blk/gm more than any other season. And that's WITH his terrible 4 games in Oct. If you forget about him being an Offensive weapon, and just look what he does for us on the boards and Blks, you'd see how beneficial he is to us on D. I wouldn't call 16 Blks and 60 TRBs in the last 6 games "playing like a rookie", and I doubt anyone else would, either.

But yes, Bledsoe IS the best 'asset' we have, and would love to trade him to get Ulis more minutes, or for a more Asst-generating, young PG out there, because we don't need Bledsoe to be the 'hero-ball' leader--we have Booker, Warren, and hopefully soon Bender and Chriss to shoot the ball; we need a PG who will get the ball to them.
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Re: Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns 

Post#226 » by Jdiddy701 » Mon Nov 28, 2016 4:56 am

NavLDO - I'm hard on Len because I know the money that's going to come at him this offseason. I don't always see the effort in his play. What do you think he's worth? That's what worries me, the suns being stuck with Alex Len with a "max" 5-year contract.


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Re: Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns 

Post#227 » by NavLDO » Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:09 am

Jdiddy701 wrote:NavLDO - I'm hard on Len because I know the money that's going to come at him this offseason. I don't always see the effort in his play. What do you think he's worth? That's what worries me, the suns being stuck with Alex Len with a "max" 5-year contract.


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Well, considering what I posted earlier today about Mahinmi's and Mozgov's contracts, and how he wipes the floor with what they've ever provided in a season, and they just got $16M, I'd say upwards of $20M.

Now, I know that sounds crazy, but it's the going rate for 'bigs'...heck, for anyone in the NBA. But that $20M is worth about $12M 2 years ago, so you have to look at it in those $...you can't look at it in the same way of Chandler's Contract. He would've gotten $20M this summer, had we signed him in the exact same scenario as we did a year and a half ago.

So, that's what I would expect...and IMO, I wouldn't worry about how uncoordinated Len looks out there; worry about the fact that he's getting it done defensively. If he starts to regress to his Oct numbers, then I'd wholeheartedly...and did, just ask BW...agree with you.
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Re: Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns 

Post#228 » by bwgood77 » Mon Nov 28, 2016 5:19 am

NavLDO wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:NavLDO - I'm hard on Len because I know the money that's going to come at him this offseason. I don't always see the effort in his play. What do you think he's worth? That's what worries me, the suns being stuck with Alex Len with a "max" 5-year contract.


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Well, considering what I posted earlier today about Mahinmi's and Mozgov's contracts, and how he wipes the floor with what they've ever provided in a season, and they just got $16M, I'd say upwards of $20M.

Now, I know that sounds crazy, but it's the going rate for 'bigs'...heck, for anyone in the NBA. But that $20M is worth about $12M 2 years ago, so you have to look at it in those $...you can't look at it in the same way of Chandler's Contract. He would've gotten $20M this summer, had we signed him in the exact same scenario as we did a year and a half ago.

So, that's what I would expect...and IMO, I wouldn't worry about how uncoordinated Len looks out there; worry about the fact that he's getting it done defensively. If he starts to regress to his Oct numbers, then I'd wholeheartedly...and did, just ask BW...agree with you.


I'm not that worried about what Len gets because our cap situation is really good. I don't think we are going to find a major difference maker in FA and I think we deal Knight and Bledsoe's contract will end around the time we need to pay Warren and Booker. We are in a good situation cap wise. I think too many people focus on dollars, like 3-5 million difference is that big of a deal when otherwise you lose a guy for nothing. If we can use him in a major trade to land a serious difference maker, fine. But if not, why let him walk? He rebounds at a rate that is as good as anyone else does any particular stat relatively other than maybe Chandler's rebounding and Warren's steal rate. That alone is worth it to me, because we out rebound people which we need.
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Re: Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns 

Post#229 » by Qwigglez » Mon Nov 28, 2016 10:51 am

Just finished watching the game. Didn't like our starting unit, and I think those guys are rusty (Tucker/Chandler) which is why we got off to a cold start. Booker hasn't come into the game ultra-aggressive for a while now and that hurts our starters too especially since Warren is out.
I really wasn't being super analytical so I don't have much else to say. Felt like we make good effort during stretches of the game but then we take defensive plays off. It's one step forward two steps back kind of thing with us.
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Re: Game 18: Nuggets @ Suns 

Post#230 » by NavLDO » Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:15 pm

bwgood77 wrote:
NavLDO wrote:
Jdiddy701 wrote:NavLDO - I'm hard on Len because I know the money that's going to come at him this offseason. I don't always see the effort in his play. What do you think he's worth? That's what worries me, the suns being stuck with Alex Len with a "max" 5-year contract.


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Well, considering what I posted earlier today about Mahinmi's and Mozgov's contracts, and how he wipes the floor with what they've ever provided in a season, and they just got $16M, I'd say upwards of $20M.

Now, I know that sounds crazy, but it's the going rate for 'bigs'...heck, for anyone in the NBA. But that $20M is worth about $12M 2 years ago, so you have to look at it in those $...you can't look at it in the same way of Chandler's Contract. He would've gotten $20M this summer, had we signed him in the exact same scenario as we did a year and a half ago.

So, that's what I would expect...and IMO, I wouldn't worry about how uncoordinated Len looks out there; worry about the fact that he's getting it done defensively. If he starts to regress to his Oct numbers, then I'd wholeheartedly...and did, just ask BW...agree with you.


I'm not that worried about what Len gets because our cap situation is really good. I don't think we are going to find a major difference maker in FA and I think we deal Knight and Bledsoe's contract will end around the time we need to pay Warren and Booker. We are in a good situation cap wise. I think too many people focus on dollars, like 3-5 million difference is that big of a deal when otherwise you lose a guy for nothing. If we can use him in a major trade to land a serious difference maker, fine. But if not, why let him walk? He rebounds at a rate that is as good as anyone else does any particular stat relatively other than maybe Chandler's rebounding and Warren's steal rate. That alone is worth it to me, because we out rebound people which we need.

And I just watched some of the game, and something I'm seeing from Len now that I'm able to watch more of the game than just highlights, and that is, that when the Suns are on Offense, Len is very active doing what he can do, to set screens to get our Guards/SFs better looks from outside. So no, he's not banging down low on offense a lot, which probably accounts for the fact that he doesn't get as many ORebs in relation to DRebs, but I like the fact that he uses his athleticism to put himself in good positions to help the team offensively. So that fact, ALSO, disputes the claims that he looks like a rookie. A rookie wouldn't know how/where/when to set those screens the way he does, and be as active as he is offensively, rather than just sit around down low waiting for a shot to come, or a pass to come to shoot a hook, lay-up, or back-down an opponent to the basket.

Anyway, I'm not worried about how much we pay Len either; to me, he's worth a solid contract, so long as he remains as constructive as he's been in November on Defense, and on Offense doing the little things that aren't measured in stats.

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