The Trade Thread, 2016-17 (2.0)

[SMTBSI]

Watch a week's worth of his games and it should be enough to convince you that he's not the "star" we should trade for.

Not for nothing, but I think I've watched decent portions of 3 or 4 of his games in the past week and he's averaged 35 and 13 while shooting 52% from 3. Dude's comfortably in the top 10.

His talent is undeniable. But again, it's his attitude that sucks. We can't have a trade discussion about DMC without bringing up his attitude. Trading both lottery picks for this guy, and then pissing off Brad Stevens in the process, does not sound like a good trade. 2 Nets picks would be a terrible trade. Who else is bidding for this guy that can even top the offer of just one lone Nets pick?

One of the main reasons Pierce is my all-time favorite Boston athlete is precisely because he was immature in the beginning; it was very rewarding watching him evolve from a self-appointed "classic case of a great player on a bad team", to a leader and self-sacrificing member of the ubuntu era. I doubt he'd have resonated with me as much if he'd been Mr. Perfect from day one.

So, I guess I have somewhat more tolerance for bad attitudes than most. And, I do think that our locker room has very strong, stabilizing personalities. This would not be "his team" from day one.


Besides, I've always said that you don't get a talent like him unless there's a caveat - if a guy in his tier is not a.) expiring, b.) having an injury history, c.) having attitude issues, well, then he's simply not available in the first place. You've got to roll the dice somewhere, and this is not a bad roll considering our teams integrity and attitude is one of our strengths.

[SmartWentCrazy]

I think my answer to this is no and here's why: As good as Cousins is, and even if you put aside concerns about attitude risks, I don't think he alone is enough to take this team from a early round exit to a real contender. I think you need one more impact guy but this trade removes any chance of that happening because you no longer have Jaylen Brown to develop, either BKN pick, or cap space in 2017. If we could get a similar deal but keep one of the BKN picks OR Brown, it would be a different story.

The renounce/trade/stash everyone scenario:

'17-'18 GUARANTEED
27.734405 Horford
18.063850 Cousins
8.808989 Bradley
6.796117 Crowder
6.261395 Thomas
4.538020 Smart
1.988520 Rozier

74.191296 total

102.000000 cap
122.000000 lux tax

~27.8 mil in cap space, less minimum roster holds and any youths you chose not to purge / weren't able to stash (Zizic, Jackson, Yabu, etc.). Greater than 20mil should be easily achievable. You can also hold Olynyk's rights until you have a better use for the space.

Interesting. Any thoughts on who might be available for, say, ~$25million? That's not going to be max contract money so you're basically talking about tier 3 players (since tier 1 will obviously get max contracts and tier 2 guys will get overpaid with max contract money from desperate teams).

We could easily create the necessary room for another max player with Boogie. If we show strong and take Cleveland to 7 games, we'll have our choice of the available max FA's, IMO.

[Banks2Pierce]

His talent is undeniable. But again, it's his attitude that sucks. We can't have a trade discussion about DMC without bringing up his attitude. Trading both lottery picks for this guy, and then pissing off Brad Stevens in the process, does not sound like a good trade. 2 Nets picks would be a terrible trade. Who else is bidding for this guy that can even top the offer of just one lone Nets pick?

Yeah, I agree with you that his attitude may take him off the table depending on further behind the scenes info that our FO probably knows. Just found it funny that you said the week thing and I'd oddly watched a handful of his recent games where he was absurdly dominant.

[SMTBSI]

We could easily create the necessary room for another max player with Boogie. If we show strong and take Cleveland to 7 games, we'll have our choice of the available max FA's, IMO.

Yes, if you're willing to move Bradleys and Smarts in addition to all the smaller pieces, you will be able to fit whoever you want to. If a max player wants to come here to play with IT/Horford/Cousins, we'll be able to make it happen. It's just a matter of how much contortion you need to do it.

The more important matter is simply that the '17 FA crop is fairly limited.

[Disinformation]

The renounce/trade/stash everyone scenario:

'17-'18 GUARANTEED
27.734405 Horford
18.063850 Cousins
8.808989 Bradley
6.796117 Crowder
6.261395 Thomas
4.538020 Smart
1.988520 Rozier

74.191296 total

102.000000 cap
122.000000 lux tax

~27.8 mil in cap space, less minimum roster holds and any youths you chose not to purge / weren't able to stash (Zizic, Jackson, Yabu, etc.). Greater than 20mil should be easily achievable. You can also hold Olynyk's rights until you have a better use for the space.

Interesting. Any thoughts on who might be available for, say, ~$25million? That's not going to be max contract money so you're basically talking about tier 3 players (since tier 1 will obviously get max contracts and tier 2 guys will get overpaid with max contract money from desperate teams).

Hayward.

IT-BRADLEY-HAYWARD-HORFORD-COUSINS
Rozier-Smart-Crowder-KO
Yabusele, Zizic, Jackson

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Dream on, man. Hayward's getting maxed.

[CeltsfanSinceBirth]

His talent is undeniable. But again, it's his attitude that sucks. We can't have a trade discussion about DMC without bringing up his attitude. Trading both lottery picks for this guy, and then pissing off Brad Stevens in the process, does not sound like a good trade. 2 Nets picks would be a terrible trade. Who else is bidding for this guy that can even top the offer of just one lone Nets pick?

Yeah, I agree with you that his attitude may take him off the table depending on further behind the scenes info that our FO probably knows. Just found it funny that you said the week thing and I'd oddly watched a handful of his recent games where he was absurdly dominant.

He's good, but it's all the pouting and whining. It's the half-assed effort on defense. It's the terrible body language, where the team can be up by 2 points, while DMC looks like they're getting killed by 30.

[OFWGKTA]

I was gonna say sub Rozier for Brown add w/e picks

[Bohemian]

Bill Simmons discusses about Boogie to Boston trade idea

https://soundcloud.com/the-bill-simmons-podcast/ep-147-nba-power-rankings-with-kevin-oconnor

[BakersDozen]

If you can get Cousins by only trading picks Rozier and basically just salary filler its a no brainer


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[Celts17Pride]

No one knows if Cousins can sacrifice for the good of the team because that's what's best to win. Is winning important to Cousins?

Is he a Lebron or a Melo?

Talent is there but no one knows the answer to these questions. Cousins doesn't seem to be too bothered with losing in Sacramento.

[GoCeltics123]

Bill Simmons discusses about Boogie to Boston trade idea

https://soundcloud.com/the-bill-simmons-podcast/ep-147-nba-power-rankings-with-kevin-oconnor

He thinks they aren't giving up two Brooklyn picks for him is what it sounded like

[claycarver]

Doesn't it make more sense to sign a max player like Heyward in the off season and then trade for a player like Cousins after that? Then we're not running up against the cap trying to fit Heyward and Cousins both.

[SMTBSI]

Doesn't it make more sense to sign a max player like Heyward in the off season and then trade for a player like Cousins after that? Then we're not running up against the cap trying to fit Heyward and Cousins both.

Yes, but there's risk/cost either way.

Move on Cousins now and it's much harder to fit a guy like Hayward.
Wait to move on Cousins and a.) the Kings may trade him to someone else in the meantime, and b.) we may not show well enough to attract that FA in the first place.

Balancing those risks requires behind-the-scenes information we don't have, such as how heavily other teams are courting Sacramento now, and Hayward's or whoever's present attitude towards his team and ours. Whatever moves our FO does or doesn't wind up making, we'll just have to trust that they did the best they could with the information they had.

[ConstableGeneva]

Doesn't it make more sense to sign a max player like Heyward in the off season and then trade for a player like Cousins after that? Then we're not running up against the cap trying to fit Heyward and Cousins both.

Maybe one of the reasons why Mike Zarren was suggesting to have the draft after FA period started. (Not particular to Hayward-Boogie). It's better to trade for another star after you've used up cap space. But it's harder to trade once the picks become actual players.

[Ed Pinkney]

[fallguy]

I love Brad Stevens. But this thing where we assume he's some diva who is always flirting with a return to college and won't coach a tough player is ridiculous to me. If any of these things are actually true, then go get the talent and call Jeff Van Gundy.

[rmal8852]

Watch a week's worth of his games and it should be enough to convince you that he's not the "star" we should trade for.

Not for nothing, but I think I've watched decent portions of 3 or 4 of his games in the past week and he's averaged 35 and 13 while shooting 52% from 3. Dude's comfortably in the top 10.

His talent is undeniable. But again, it's his attitude that sucks. We can't have a trade discussion about DMC without bringing up his attitude. Trading both lottery picks for this guy, and then pissing off Brad Stevens in the process, does not sound like a good trade. 2 Nets picks would be a terrible trade. Who else is bidding for this guy that can even top the offer of just one lone Nets pick?

Miami.....Whiteside/Winslow

Fakers....Russell, Randle, Clarkson, Ingram, Nance, Zubac (some combo)

Phoenix....Booker, Len, Bender, , knight, Chris's, warren picks (some combo)

Minny....Levine, Wiggins, Rubio, Dieng, picks (some combo)

Philly.....Noel, Okafor, Saric, Simmons, picks (some combo)

Milwaukee....Parker, Monroe, Henson, Middleton, Plumlee, Teletovitch (some combo)

Orlando......vucevic, Gordon, picks

Toronto.....DeRozan, Valuncianis

To me, most of these best our '17 Brooklyn pick.

There will be some serious bidding if cousins become available!

[Jkam31]

Cousins, Butler, Griffin, and Klay Thompson that's a list of players you guys wouldn't trade for. Listen to how ridiculous that sounds


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And anyone that thinks Ainge won't trade Brown/Roizer/the nets picks is clueless

[Marvel]

I love Brad Stevens. But this thing where we assume he's some diva who is always flirting with a return to college and won't coach a tough player is ridiculous to me. If any of these things are actually true, then go get the talent and call Jeff Van Gundy.

We in the "Cupcake Era" man.

[Marvel]

Cousins, Butler, Griffin, and Klay Thompson that's a list of players you guys wouldn't trade for. Listen to how ridiculous that sounds


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And anyone that thinks Ainge won't trade Brown/Roizer/the nets picks is clueless

DeAndre Jordan can be added to that list. Fricken ridiculous, Danny gets all the assets to trade for a star/superstar and all of a sudden no one wants to actually you know...use them.