Knicks not ruling out DRose extension later in the season

[misterfrazier10]

So, now Hinrich and Noah "ran Chicago's offenses"?

That's extremely funny especially considering the fact that....

Rose had a usage rate of 28.1 while with Chicago when compared to Hinrich who had a usage rate of (only) 16% during his years with Rose and Noah who had a usage rate of 16%.

I mean, you could even combine the usage rates of Kirk & Noah and it'll come up to only 32% when compared to the usage rate of Rose alone (28.1%) but yet now Noah & Kirk "ran those Chicago offenses" and Rose didn't?

Laughable.

are you equating usage with running an offense?

[KnicksFury]

What's the max the Knicks can offer to Jrue?

[kane2021]

So, now Hinrich and Noah "ran Chicago's offenses"?

That's extremely funny especially considering the fact that....

Rose had a usage rate of 28.1 while with Chicago when compared to Hinrich who had a usage rate of (only) 16% during his years with Rose and Noah who had a usage rate of 16%.

I mean, you could even combine the usage rates of Kirk & Noah and it'll come up to only 32% when compared to the usage rate of Rose alone (28.1%) but yet now Noah & Kirk "ran those Chicago offenses" and Rose didn't?

Laughable.

Yea that's just not true, in Chicago the issue was that derrick was the only one creating offense. The year he won MVP, Joakim missed 30+ games. The starters were Rose-Bogans-Luol-Boozer-Kurt Thomas. He was the offense and created everything for himself and others.

The offense didn't run through Noah until the 13-14 season where Rose missed all but 10 games.

I get it's cool to not like Rose and say he's not a PG but at least be accurate in your slander.

Thank you for this post above and exactly. Dude has such a driven agenda against Rose, to the point where he's began to create bold face lies.

Rose didn't run his Chicago offenses? That's not only a lie; it's a load of crap.

You realize you're also doing exactly what you're accusing him of right? Only from a pro point of view.


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[br7knicks]

For the max, why not?

The max discount


Why not wait to see what else is out there?

[2Chainz]

Yea that's just not true, in Chicago the issue was that derrick was the only one creating offense. The year he won MVP, Joakim missed 30+ games. The starters were Rose-Bogans-Luol-Boozer-Kurt Thomas. He was the offense and created everything for himself and others.

The offense didn't run through Noah until the 13-14 season where Rose missed all but 10 games.

I get it's cool to not like Rose and say he's not a PG but at least be accurate in your slander.

Thank you for this post above and exactly. Dude has such a driven agenda against Rose, to the point where he's began to create bold face lies.

Rose didn't run his Chicago offenses? That's not only a lie; it's a load of crap.

You realize you're also doing exactly what you're accusing him of right? Only from a pro point of view.


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How? The Bulls offense was centered around Derrick's scoring and ability to break down a defense and create for others he literally was the offense to say he didn't run it in his best years is not true.

[kane2021]

Thank you for this post above and exactly. Dude has such a driven agenda against Rose, to the point where he's began to create bold face lies.

Rose didn't run his Chicago offenses? That's not only a lie; it's a load of crap.

You realize you're also doing exactly what you're accusing him of right? Only from a pro point of view.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

How? The Bulls offense was centered around Derrick's scoring and ability to break down a defense and create for others he literally was the offense to say he didn't run it in his best years is not true.

I'm talking about calling people having an agenda etc etc.


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[Thugger HBC]

Just my opinion and of course I didn't watch all 82, but the Bulls offense in Rose MVP year was predicated off their defense.

Their offense actually wasn't good at all, so defending Rose as being the creator of their offense actually doesn't do him or anyone claiming such any justice.

That's why when LeBron had enough, he shut down Rose...and that shut down the Bulls, because Rose WAS their offense.

They quite honestly didn't have an offense other than let Rose run, run run.

[blueNorange]

So, now Hinrich and Noah "ran Chicago's offenses"?

That's extremely funny especially considering the fact that....

Rose had a usage rate of 28.1 while with Chicago when compared to Hinrich who had a usage rate of (only) 16% during his years with Rose and Noah who had a usage rate of 16%.

I mean, you could even combine the usage rates of Kirk & Noah and it'll come up to only 32% when compared to the usage rate of Rose alone (28.1%) but yet now Noah & Kirk "ran those Chicago offenses" and Rose didn't?

Laughable.

are you equating usage with running an offense?

yes he is.

he doesn't understand and honestly it's okay.

[NYKMentality85]

So, now Hinrich and Noah "ran Chicago's offenses"?

That's extremely funny especially considering the fact that....

Rose had a usage rate of 28.1 while with Chicago when compared to Hinrich who had a usage rate of (only) 16% during his years with Rose and Noah who had a usage rate of 16%.

I mean, you could even combine the usage rates of Kirk & Noah and it'll come up to only 32% when compared to the usage rate of Rose alone (28.1%) but yet now Noah & Kirk "ran those Chicago offenses" and Rose didn't?

Laughable.

are you equating usage with running an offense?

Nope. We were talking about Rose (pre injury) and i was simply using it as a prime example.

Anyone who has a clue about Chicago Bulls basketball not only knows but also understands that Derrick Rose ran those Chicago offenses (with little to no offensive help).

I shouldn't even have to post these statistics (below).

2008-2009 (rookie) Rose ranked 2nd on the team in shot attempts per game, 1st in assists per game, 3rd in points per game, 2nd in assist %, 4th in usage rate, 3rd in offensive win share & 4th in Player Efficiency Rating.

2009-2010 (2nd) Rose ranked 1st on the team in shot attempts per game, 1st in assists per game, 1st in points per game, 1st in assist %, 1st in usage rate, 1st in offensive win share & 1st in Player Efficiency Rating.

2010-2011 (3rd) Rose ranked 1st on the team in shot attempts per game, 1st in assists per game, 1st in points per game, 1st in assist %, 1st in usage rate, 1st in offensive win share & 1st in Player Efficiency Rating.

2011-2012 (4th) Rose ranked 1st on the team in shot attempts per game, 1st in assists per game, 1st in points per game, 1st in assist %, 1st in usage rate, 2nd in offensive win share & 1st in Player Efficiency Rating.

If Rose wasn't the one leading those Chicago offenses (from the PG position), then who the heck was? Because according to blueNorange the likes of "Kirk" and "Noah" quote/unquote "ran Chicago's offenses" and/or "Rose didn't". It's laughable.

My question for you is: before you quoted me in regards to Rose running Chicago offenses, were you assuming that Rose (in fact) didn't run those Chicago offenses? Hopefully not.

[HEZI]

Just my opinion and of course I didn't watch all 82, but the Bulls offense in Rose MVP year was predicated off their defense.

Their offense actually wasn't good at all, so defending Rose as being the creator of their offense actually doesn't do him or anyone claiming such any justice.

That's why when LeBron had enough, he shut down Rose...and that shut down the Bulls, because Rose WAS their offense.

They quite honestly didn't have an offense other than let Rose run, run run.

Yeah pretty much

Thibs gave Rose freedom to basically do whatever he wanted but he encouraged him to always stay in attack mode. Rose was in a very similar situation as Westbrook, except Westbrook has better complimentary pieces around him, but the "system" is pretty much the same. Rose, like Westbrook, did what he wanted and there really was no structured offense, it was just put the ball in his hands and let him create everything and he did. He didn't win 60+ games by only looking for his and not creating for others, he still created a lot of looks for his teammates and that was on natural instinct and not on system play

[blueNorange]

man if rose plays the pg position and has the highest usage rate, he better lead the team in assists.

[Wharton Alum 08]

Just my opinion and of course I didn't watch all 82, but the Bulls offense in Rose MVP year was predicated off their defense.

Their offense actually wasn't good at all, so defending Rose as being the creator of their offense actually doesn't do him or anyone claiming such any justice.

That's why when LeBron had enough, he shut down Rose...and that shut down the Bulls, because Rose WAS their offense.

They quite honestly didn't have an offense other than let Rose run, run run.

They were a top 15 offense with only one creator and with Noah and Boozer missing 30 games. Yes Rose was the offense and created everything for everyone. In the following season Rose began becoming an even better playmaker and the team was 7th in o-rating. So saying Rose couldn't and didn't run the bulls offense is kind of ridiculous when everything was on his shoulders and saying their offense was poor is wrong too. And it wasn't really run,run they were 22nd in pace.

[Flopper]

So, now Hinrich and Noah "ran Chicago's offenses"?

That's extremely funny especially considering the fact that....

Rose had a usage rate of 28.1 while with Chicago when compared to Hinrich who had a usage rate of (only) 16% during his years with Rose and Noah who had a usage rate of 16%.

I mean, you could even combine the usage rates of Kirk & Noah and it'll come up to only 32% when compared to the usage rate of Rose alone (28.1%) but yet now Noah & Kirk "ran those Chicago offenses" and Rose didn't?

Laughable.

are you equating usage with running an offense?

yes he is.

he doesn't understand and honestly it's okay.

The only time Noah ran the offense was in 2013 when Thibs had no other choice but to feature him due to injury and lack of talent. It was a junk offense what was pretty much destroyed in the playoffs by master tactician Randy Wittman. And Kirk Hinrich wasn't even on the team during Derrick's career years in 10-11 and 11-12.

Outside of the obvious differences in basketball acumen and stature, pre-ACL Rose was similar to young Lebron in that he was at his best when the ball went through him on every possession running high PnR with as many shooters as possible around him. No one needed to run the offense for him since he was one of the league's most efficient high volume iso scorers and created open looks all over the floor just because he drew so much attention.

You seem to have a knack for forming hard opinions on things you know very little about.

[blueNorange]

are you equating usage with running an offense?

yes he is.

he doesn't understand and honestly it's okay.

The only time Noah ran the offense was in 2013 when Thibs had no other choice but to feature him due to injury and lack of talent. It was a junk offense what was pretty much destroyed in the playoffs by master tactician Randy Wittman. And Kirk Hinrich wasn't even on the team during Derrick's career years in 10-11 and 11-12.

Outside of the obvious differences in basketball acumen and stature, pre-ACL Rose was similar to young Lebron in that he was at his best when the ball went through him on every possession running high PnR with as many shooters as possible around him. No one needed to run the offense for him since he was one of the league's most efficient high volume iso scorers and created open looks all over the floor just because he drew so much attention.

You seem to have a knack for forming hard opinions on things you know very little about.

oh, a bulls poster keeping tabs on derrick rose.

let me guess, you loved(and still do) the home town kid.

[NYKMentality85]

yes he is.

he doesn't understand and honestly it's okay.

The only time Noah ran the offense was in 2013 when Thibs had no other choice but to feature him due to injury and lack of talent. It was a junk offense what was pretty much destroyed in the playoffs by master tactician Randy Wittman. And Kirk Hinrich wasn't even on the team during Derrick's career years in 10-11 and 11-12.

Outside of the obvious differences in basketball acumen and stature, pre-ACL Rose was similar to young Lebron in that he was at his best when the ball went through him on every possession running high PnR with as many shooters as possible around him. No one needed to run the offense for him since he was one of the league's most efficient high volume iso scorers and created open looks all over the floor just because he drew so much attention.

You seem to have a knack for forming hard opinions on things you know very little about.

oh, a bulls poster keeping tabs on derrick rose.

let me guess, you loved(and still do) the home town kid.

Nope. He's just a Chicago fan calling you out on your lack of knowledge/insight in regards to Derrick Rose of his Chicago years.

Stated that Chicago's offenses "went through Noah & Kirk". Couldn't have been more wrong with that remark. As proven, the offenses went through Rose and Kirk wasn't even on the team during the two career years of Rose.

[WesleyExChiFan]

Rose ran the Chicago offense. Anyone who says he didn't doesn't know what they're talking about.

How well he ran it at various points in his career is a perfectly acceptable debate topic. But by and large Rose WAS the damn offense.

Noah played point center for a couple years. Kirk and Nate/DJ were the other creators. Those were DEFENSIVE teams first and foremost. Offense shouldn't even be brought up with them. Most of the time it was an eyesore tbh.

[blueNorange]

other creators because rose isn't good at creating for others.

[Knicks_Fan2]

other creators because rose isn't good at creating for others.

Trending in the right direction on that front. Let's see if it sustains.

[2Chainz]

other creators because rose isn't good at creating for others.

Most teams have more than one guy who can create offense. In any case Rose didn't even play with Augustin or Nate they more so replaced him when he was hurt. In 2011-12 the Bulls were 7th in offense with Rose as the primary creator. If you call Holiday, Dragic, Tony Parker point guards then Rose is too.

[misterfrazier10]

So, now Hinrich and Noah "ran Chicago's offenses"?

That's extremely funny especially considering the fact that....

Rose had a usage rate of 28.1 while with Chicago when compared to Hinrich who had a usage rate of (only) 16% during his years with Rose and Noah who had a usage rate of 16%.

I mean, you could even combine the usage rates of Kirk & Noah and it'll come up to only 32% when compared to the usage rate of Rose alone (28.1%) but yet now Noah & Kirk "ran those Chicago offenses" and Rose didn't?

Laughable.

are you equating usage with running an offense?

Nope. We were talking about Rose (pre injury) and i was simply using it as a prime example.

Anyone who has a clue about Chicago Bulls basketball not only knows but also understands that Derrick Rose ran those Chicago offenses (with little to no offensive help).

I shouldn't even have to post these statistics (below).

2008-2009 (rookie) Rose ranked 2nd on the team in shot attempts per game, 1st in assists per game, 3rd in points per game, 2nd in assist %, 4th in usage rate, 3rd in offensive win share & 4th in Player Efficiency Rating.

2009-2010 (2nd) Rose ranked 1st on the team in shot attempts per game, 1st in assists per game, 1st in points per game, 1st in assist %, 1st in usage rate, 1st in offensive win share & 1st in Player Efficiency Rating.

2010-2011 (3rd) Rose ranked 1st on the team in shot attempts per game, 1st in assists per game, 1st in points per game, 1st in assist %, 1st in usage rate, 1st in offensive win share & 1st in Player Efficiency Rating.

2011-2012 (4th) Rose ranked 1st on the team in shot attempts per game, 1st in assists per game, 1st in points per game, 1st in assist %, 1st in usage rate, 2nd in offensive win share & 1st in Player Efficiency Rating.

If Rose wasn't the one leading those Chicago offenses (from the PG position), then who the heck was? Because according to blueNorange the likes of "Kirk" and "Noah" quote/unquote "ran Chicago's offenses" and/or "Rose didn't". It's laughable.

My question for you is: before you quoted me in regards to Rose running Chicago offenses, were you assuming that Rose (in fact) didn't run those Chicago offenses? Hopefully not.

i'm trying to understand what you mean when you say "run the offense." i don't think you mean "orchestrate" like chris paul and steve nash and john stockton. much of their orchestrating was connected with being great pick and roll playmakers and the ability to probe defenses and maintain their dribble, resetting the offense when necessary.

rose has been a markedly different type of guard, and to his credit he has said that in new york this season he wants to call his own number less, because he has better offensive players to work with. there's already been an article suggesting a close correlation between winning and rose taking fewer shots and having a lower usage rate:

http://www.espn.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/18186804/is-derrick-rose-helping-kristaps-porzingis-new-york-knicks-nba?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter