Hansari wrote:DusterBuster wrote:Rapcity_11 wrote:
The debate. I think it's clear JV has more value than Vuc. But overall, don't think he has much value.
Be nice if you could more accurately prove why when nothing seems to justify why this is "clear". I agree with you that I don't think either has a ton of value, but as for JV vs NV, I'd say the numbers, age and contracts seem to indicate that they'd overall probably have roughly similar value. Again, you have to account for the team trading for the player as some certainly may find one guy to be a better fit than the other based on the style of play they implement. But in terms of a major value difference, I'm not seeing anything to prove why one guy should be "clearly" higher than the other, outside of it just being your own personal opinion.
After reading through your dialogue I'm tempted to respond; hopefully this puts the argument to an end.
Valanciunas was a top 5 pick for good reason. Length, agility and skillset are all selling points. 7ft with a 7-6 wingspan, agile, soft touch around the basket, natural rebounding instincts, high efficiency pnr, and his ft conversion rate all add to his value.
Valanciunas by no means is a complete player, he leaves you wanting on the defensive end, he does not anchor the defense as you'd like your big to. He lacks composure at times when trusted with the ball, with all that said he's only 4 seasons into the NBA and is still fairly young wrt to bigs, and far from a finished product. Val was very raw coming into the NBA, and has consistently improved every season despite being on a short leash and playing under a coach that's imported a system from his championship run with the MAVS. Casey views bigs as defensive anchors/garbagemen, Tyson Chandler, hasn't left his system.
Vucevic on the other hand spent 3 years in college before entering the NBA, he wasn't 'raw' coming in, he's had free reign to develop and to some extent pad his stats out in post-SVG disney.
He's capped off and hasn't added much to his game, Magic have seemingly limited his own contributions to the team and he's averaging career lows in minutes (apart from his rookie year). Valanciunas has consistently maintained a higher PER over him.
All else set aside, Val hasn't broken the 30mpg barrier despite being the primary C on his team, he's been playing on a top tier team and in my pov will at some point in his career average 20 & 12+ given the right situation. If I was starting a team I'd much rather have him as part of my core and build around him, Vucevic wouldn't even be on my radar. What we have to be clear about is that JV plays for an extremely defense-oriented coach. Every damn decision he makes is based on his strength, defense. JV is average on that end. Jakob Poeltl, another big who has been losing out due to coach's mindset, Pascal Siakam (projected 2nd rnd pick) has been starting on our team while our lottery pick rots on the bench. Why? Defensive-minded bigs are favoured. Biyombo - Valanciunas, same deal.
In the playoffs last year before getting injured, he was averaging 15, 13, 1.5 in 28mpg.
This includes the 3 games against Miami, matched up directly against Hassan Whiteside where he averaged 18, 13, 2 in 30mpg and was clearly the most dominant big on the court.
By no means am I trying to paint a rosy image of the player, he leaves much to be desired, but pegging his value to a run of the mill 26yr old C on an abysmal team is asinine.
Cheers.
