Moderators: bwgood77, lilfishi22, Qwigglez
Damkac wrote:What do you think of Valanciunas? Looks like he is available. Is his defense as bad? He is just 24 and signed for 3 seasons (+ player option but he won't use it likely).
Would you do Bledsoe + Chandler for Val, Patterson and "Brazilian Durant"?
carey wrote:1UPZ wrote:
But his defense, IQ, play making and facilitating is better than any of Suns guards.
Been watching him since his last year at ULL. This isn't true. At least not yet. Bledsoe is still a bit better.
1UPZ wrote:
But Payton's defense is as good as Bledsoe's IMO. He is also the better play maker and passer.
Damkac wrote:What do you think of Valanciunas? Looks like he is available. Is his defense as bad? He is just 24 and signed for 3 seasons (+ player option but he won't use it likely).
Would you do Bledsoe + Chandler for Val, Patterson and "Brazilian Durant"?
carey wrote:1UPZ wrote:
But Payton's defense is as good as Bledsoe's IMO. He is also the better play maker and passer.
Do the numbers back that up? I'm not watching a lot of Magic games this year but from what I've seen the eye test does not.
1UPZ wrote:Ryu wrote:m1chal wrote:Just to remind you, Kings have passed on Chriss in the draft and his play probably hasn't made them regret their decision. I really doubt they'd be interested now.
I'd be interested in approaching Magic with a trade centered around Bledsoe. They have picks (theirs, LAL '19), Hezonja and maybe Payton available.
We don`t need Hezonja with Booker and Warren on the wings and Payton is just awful.
1. Payton's hair is awful
2. His outside shot is awful
But his defense, IQ, play making and facilitating is better than any of Suns guards.
OrlandoDream wrote:1UPZ wrote:Ryu wrote:
We don`t need Hezonja with Booker and Warren on the wings and Payton is just awful.
1. Payton's hair is awful
2. His outside shot is awful
But his defense, IQ, play making and facilitating is better than any of Suns guards.
The Bledsoe speculation has been a big buzz lately. I am one of the biggest supporters for the deal and that's saying a lot bc Elfrid Payton is one of my most liked players on the team. The going to the bench is all about balancing the lineup, not his inability to be a starter. As weak know, shooting is his weakness. This is problematic bc teams ldont go out to guard him at the 3 every time and then they clog the paint making hard for our guys to score down there. We started the season starting both Aaron Gordon and Payton and let's just say that wasn't pretty. After a couple of disastrous games, we sent AG to the bench and started green. Then it didn't take long to see that any team that starts Jeff green is not going to win much. So finally Vogel did one more switch and sent Payton to the bench and out Aaron Gordon back at the 3 and started DJ(our only shooting PG who can start). Finally we found something that worked. A backcourt of two shooters that forces team to go out there and the frontline defensive versatility with AG/Biz/Ibaka. Then you have Payton off the bench abusing those bench PG. result? Payton has been playing the best basketball of his career and the magic went 4-1 in their 5 game road trip beating the Spurs, Pistons, and wiz(team that we have problems in the past).
Sorry for the long lost but I'm just trying to say that Payton is not a bad player. He is still young(22) with plenty to improve. The kid has a lot of pride and works his butt off. He is a hustler and a pesky defender. He just has trouble with his shot. If you are gonna have a pg like that, then the team should,be stacked with shooters....like the Suns. I personally think he would flourish in this team. He loves to run and being alongside Booker, Warren, bender, and the rest do those shooters would be fu nto watch.
I personally want him to stay bc I know he will be a great pg in the future. He improves every year. We just have inpatient and win now ownership who don't want to develop players and just get that 8th to be swept by Cavs...so stupid. That's why I think we may trade him if an opportunity for an upgrade like Bledsoe comes. I can see it happening bc magic need shooting and we have a bit of a trade history with Phoenix.
bwgood77 wrote:OrlandoDream wrote:1UPZ wrote:
1. Payton's hair is awful
2. His outside shot is awful
But his defense, IQ, play making and facilitating is better than any of Suns guards.
The Bledsoe speculation has been a big buzz lately. I am one of the biggest supporters for the deal and that's saying a lot bc Elfrid Payton is one of my most liked players on the team. The going to the bench is all about balancing the lineup, not his inability to be a starter. As weak know, shooting is his weakness. This is problematic bc teams ldont go out to guard him at the 3 every time and then they clog the paint making hard for our guys to score down there. We started the season starting both Aaron Gordon and Payton and let's just say that wasn't pretty. After a couple of disastrous games, we sent AG to the bench and started green. Then it didn't take long to see that any team that starts Jeff green is not going to win much. So finally Vogel did one more switch and sent Payton to the bench and out Aaron Gordon back at the 3 and started DJ(our only shooting PG who can start). Finally we found something that worked. A backcourt of two shooters that forces team to go out there and the frontline defensive versatility with AG/Biz/Ibaka. Then you have Payton off the bench abusing those bench PG. result? Payton has been playing the best basketball of his career and the magic went 4-1 in their 5 game road trip beating the Spurs, Pistons, and wiz(team that we have problems in the past).
Sorry for the long lost but I'm just trying to say that Payton is not a bad player. He is still young(22) with plenty to improve. The kid has a lot of pride and works his butt off. He is a hustler and a pesky defender. He just has trouble with his shot. If you are gonna have a pg like that, then the team should,be stacked with shooters....like the Suns. I personally think he would flourish in this team. He loves to run and being alongside Booker, Warren, bender, and the rest do those shooters would be fu nto watch.
I personally want him to stay bc I know he will be a great pg in the future. He improves every year. We just have inpatient and win now ownership who don't want to develop players and just get that 8th to be swept by Cavs...so stupid. That's why I think we may trade him if an opportunity for an upgrade like Bledsoe comes. I can see it happening bc magic need shooting and we have a bit of a trade history with Phoenix.
I am kind of interested in your team and think if you simply found a way to unload Vucevic and have a 4-5 rotation of Gordon/Ibaka starting and when Biyombo checks in, he works well as a 5 next to either and you can play shooters at 2/3....Fournier at one of the two, and another hopeful shooter at the other spot. In this situation, Payton would work well. I'd try and trade Vucevic for a shooter at that position. I would say Knight if we would resort to spot up, but with Vogel, maybe he can do that. Suns don't need Vucevic though, and not sure Knight is the best fit for you either. I would say pluck one of Denver's crowded wing spot shooters for Vucevic, but they don't need a center either.
Plenty of people here want to trade Bledsoe so it makes him appear available on these forums but I don't think he is. Our FO seems committed to him for now. We don't really have a capable PG outside of him. Payton would probably help our other players more by getting all of them the ball, being younger, etc, but I don't think the FO will trade him. I don't know if we would want Payton though because we don't really want a PG who can't shoot.
We seem to be in similar positions with our team at least in the disappointment department but you guys have more capable talent in the FC right now and we probably have better guys 1-3, though I do think Fournier is a player. I am just not sure we are great trade partners. I wouldn't mind a Knight for Hezonja deal but I doubt you want to give up on a high pick that soon, and if I was a Magic fan I wouldn't want Knight. So kind of a tough matchup for trade partners.
OrlandoDream wrote:Spoiler:
Yeah it would seem that a Bledsoe trade is wishful thinking. Any team with a player like that wouldn't want to trade him either. We don't look to be the best of trade partners this year unless a third is involved. And yeah, I do t think knight is the player we are looking for. Magic do need scoring but they also don't want to trade away guys in the core rotation. I see us making a low key trade but nothing major unless some big time player becomes available.
And yeah Denvers Wilson Chandler would be great for this team. Not sure how much they value him.
bwgood77 wrote:Damkac wrote:What do you think of Valanciunas? Looks like he is available. Is his defense as bad? He is just 24 and signed for 3 seasons (+ player option but he won't use it likely).
Would you do Bledsoe + Chandler for Val, Patterson and "Brazilian Durant"?
I don't know if you've been on the trade board, but there are all sorts of Raptors fans posting Valanciunas trades to us......for Bledsoe and Chandler, or Chandler and a first or whatever. I don't know enough about him other than if they all want to get rid of him it gives me pause, especially to give up much.
Kerrsed wrote:To me, Elfrid Payton reminds me a lot of a young Rajon Rondo. Now i dont think Payton has had quite the opportunity Rondo had as early in the league, but there are some striking similarities. Both are pretty bad shooters, even though they have a high FG% (Due to their work in the paint), but cant hit a jumper/3pointer/Free Throw to save their life. This forces them to become more of a pass first PG, a distributor, while also being rather good at rebounding and defense.
TL;DR - I would be fine with a trade for Payton (depending on who's all involved). A better defender/distributor might be what we really need.
Frank Lee wrote:Now is the time to get DMo. I'm betting he won't play for Houston and was matched purely as a trade chip. I hope there are no rules/Regis that prevent him from being moved Dec15
Knight for Noel for DMo
Tucker/pick for the madskilled bigman.
There is a deal somewhere. And this guy is exactly what we could use. A real PF/C who knows how to play the game.
He is a bargain right now, if healthy.